http://img89.imageshack.us/my.php?image=monkbotsuy5.png
Sit in Elona's reach with a piece of paper and a pen.
Write down the name of every single Mo/W that turns up.
BING. You've listed hundreds upon hundreds of chinese bot farmer accounts within the space of a few hours.
Monitor the behaviour of all Mo/W's that turn up this area - 98% of them will be botters. The innocent 2% will respond to tells - not with a bot response, but a human response.
How about it Arena Net?
PS - They're all 55 monks. Considered nerfing this bot friendly build yet?
How to stop hundreds of bot farmers in no time.
KurtBatz
Arkantos
How can you prove every Mo/W there are bots? Sure, most of them probably are, but since some arent you'll be accusing the wrong people.
Kaguya
Well they could toss the person a whisper first, wait for a reply, if nothing, ban them. They can always plead "I was AFK" to the support later to have their accounts banned. But pretty sure that majority of those Mo/W's there are bots, as proven by their wallhugging (and how they walk in teams one after another at times).
ANet shouldn't have any problems with banning people accidentally, it's not very long since ANet did the mass banning operation.
What it comes to "nerfing 55's", how people suggest that do be done? The skills involved work perfectly in the "indended" uses.
ANet shouldn't have any problems with banning people accidentally, it's not very long since ANet did the mass banning operation.
What it comes to "nerfing 55's", how people suggest that do be done? The skills involved work perfectly in the "indended" uses.
KurtBatz
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Kaguya
Well they could toss the person a whisper first, wait for a reply, if nothing, ban them. They can always plead "I was AFK" to the support later to have their accounts banned. But pretty sure that majority of those Mo/W's there are bots, as proven by their wallhugging (and how they walk in teams one after another at times).
ANet shouldn't have any problems with banning people accidentally, it's not very long since ANet did the mass banning operation. What it comes to "nerfing 55's", how people suggest that do be done? The skills involved work perfectly in the "indended" uses. |
I swear, every botter in this game is a Mo/W
KurtBatz
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Arkantos
How can you prove every Mo/W there are bots? Sure, most of them probably are, but since some arent you'll be accusing the wrong people.
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There's bound to be a few innocent Mo/W there - but sadly, they are completely in the minority for that area.
shardfenix
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Arkantos
How can you prove every Mo/W there are bots? Sure, most of them probably are, but since some arent you'll be accusing the wrong people.
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Rule number 1 of criticism: know what youre talking about before you make yourself sound stupid.
Arkantos
Quote:
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Originally Posted by shardfenix
A trained lemming could tell the difference between a bot and a real person by watching movements.
Rule number 1 of criticism: know what youre talking about before you make yourself sound stupid. |
KurtBatz
I thought that other guys response was overly harsh, so here's one of my own.
It's easy to tell if they're a bot. If you message them, they have scripted responses like 'hi' and little else. They have 55hp monks that log into an area, go straight into the mission, farm, log off to stop anti-farming code, log next monk on that account on. That's why in areas like Elona, as per the screenshot, about 80 monks all pop up at once then disappear.
If you see a 55hp monk/warrior pop up in the area then disappear immediately without a word spoken, you know it's most likely a bot. All Arena Net need to do is sit there, write down the names and monitor that player.
They're not even that bright about it. Most of the names I see are asian to begin with to make it even more obvious they're chinese farmers. Up a name pops, second later it's gone. Over and over. I swear Arena Net aren't doing enough about it. Last night over the period of half an hour, I lost count of how many I saw - never less than thirty or so in a single town.
Thirty M/W's in a single town...... now have YOU ever found it that easy to find a monk for your team?
It's glaringly, shockingly obvious who the bots are.
It's easy to tell if they're a bot. If you message them, they have scripted responses like 'hi' and little else. They have 55hp monks that log into an area, go straight into the mission, farm, log off to stop anti-farming code, log next monk on that account on. That's why in areas like Elona, as per the screenshot, about 80 monks all pop up at once then disappear.
If you see a 55hp monk/warrior pop up in the area then disappear immediately without a word spoken, you know it's most likely a bot. All Arena Net need to do is sit there, write down the names and monitor that player.
They're not even that bright about it. Most of the names I see are asian to begin with to make it even more obvious they're chinese farmers. Up a name pops, second later it's gone. Over and over. I swear Arena Net aren't doing enough about it. Last night over the period of half an hour, I lost count of how many I saw - never less than thirty or so in a single town.
Thirty M/W's in a single town...... now have YOU ever found it that easy to find a monk for your team?
It's glaringly, shockingly obvious who the bots are.
Avair Strabain
making prot spirit a cast on target other ally would fix it
lyra_song
While i do agree that shutting down bots is on the list of Anet's things to do, i dont think a single person sitting there monitoring activity is the most efficient way to do things. That person could be devoted to actually helping people with direct problems.
I really think bot catching needs to be automated for efficiency. A bot should flag the accounts for a human to check their activity history later on.
Right now one of the best ways to stop a script is to use non-OCR confirmation systems. Sign up to a forum and you'll see what i mean. Its a box of text and numbers thats distorted so OCR software cant read it.
I posted the idea of something like that being implemented in game. Like a security thing before you can sell to a merch...or access storage.
Annoying. VERY. Stops bots? Maybe. Pisses off real players. Im sure it would.
Botting is effective because it is EFFICIENT. Time spent in town is not time spent farming. The more it forces a human touch to farm, the harder it will be for botters. If they cant be efficient, they cant make money. If they can't make money, they have to stop.
Edit:
Then this would promote 2-man bot farmers. And seriously nerf the skill.
I really think bot catching needs to be automated for efficiency. A bot should flag the accounts for a human to check their activity history later on.
Right now one of the best ways to stop a script is to use non-OCR confirmation systems. Sign up to a forum and you'll see what i mean. Its a box of text and numbers thats distorted so OCR software cant read it.
I posted the idea of something like that being implemented in game. Like a security thing before you can sell to a merch...or access storage.
Annoying. VERY. Stops bots? Maybe. Pisses off real players. Im sure it would.
Botting is effective because it is EFFICIENT. Time spent in town is not time spent farming. The more it forces a human touch to farm, the harder it will be for botters. If they cant be efficient, they cant make money. If they can't make money, they have to stop.
Edit:
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Avair Strabain
making prot spirit a cast on target other ally would fix it
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logan90
Quote:
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Originally Posted by KurtBatz
PS - They're all 55 monks. Considered nerfing this bot friendly build yet?
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Avair Strabain
making prot spirit a cast on target other ally would fix it
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ischuros
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Avair Strabain
making prot spirit a cast on target other ally would fix it
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Well then all you do is bring two 55 monks.
Drithlan
SOLUTION to 55ers remove all -hp off hands they will nolonger be a "55" monk
Guitary Boy
Woah, that is one hell of a botting area, but i've farmed there with my 55 as a mo/w, yet does that mean im going to be banned. I have only farmed there about 2 times because it is a crappy place, but not every monk you see is a bot although im sure looking at that 99% of them are all bots, and if a-net did find a good way to nerf 55's without destroying a bunch of skills, its going to kill off one hell of a lot of thier players.
KurtBatz
Quote:
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Originally Posted by logan90
And no, not every Mo/W in Elona is a bot.
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If they turn up then disappear immediately, they're a bot. Come on, let's not beat around the bush here and try and cloud the facts. These people ARE bots, in their droves. There's hundreds of them.
Again, I refer to the above screenshot.
I haven't seen that much overpopulation since the dragon mask event.Any time you want to hang out with me in Elona's Reach for ten minutes and have me prove the point, I'm more than willing
KurtBatz
I've just had a GREAT idea.
Well, great by my standards ^_^
People love titles.....
So have a 'fair play' title. For every ten botters reported and subsequently banned by Arena Net, you receive a title for your character.
It'll encourage people to report more botters
Well, great by my standards ^_^
People love titles.....
So have a 'fair play' title. For every ten botters reported and subsequently banned by Arena Net, you receive a title for your character.
It'll encourage people to report more botters
Clone
Horrible idea. I have a monk that runs a 55 build. I'm not a bot. I also have seen numerous posts of bannings of players who show botlike behavior (many hours played, same mission entered many times). But, bots and non bots alike do this because its profitable.
So, the main problem I see with arenanets bot detection is they're not actually looking for bots, they're looking for bot-like behavior that many non-bots also use. My suggestion would be to sign up with someone like punkbuster and look for code running at lower levels.
As for suggestions on trying to make it unprofitable to bot, this can cause some serious problems. Bots will have an advantage over normal players simply due to more hours put in, so we can expet them to have more cash. Lowering drop rates enough to make them more poor could severely cut into normal players cashflow. Keeping normal players poor is the biggest reason why there's a market for ebay gold farmed from bots.
So, the main problem I see with arenanets bot detection is they're not actually looking for bots, they're looking for bot-like behavior that many non-bots also use. My suggestion would be to sign up with someone like punkbuster and look for code running at lower levels.
As for suggestions on trying to make it unprofitable to bot, this can cause some serious problems. Bots will have an advantage over normal players simply due to more hours put in, so we can expet them to have more cash. Lowering drop rates enough to make them more poor could severely cut into normal players cashflow. Keeping normal players poor is the biggest reason why there's a market for ebay gold farmed from bots.
KurtBatz
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Drithlan
SOLUTION to 55ers remove all -hp off hands they will nolonger be a "55" monk
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lyra_song
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Drithlan
SOLUTION to 55ers remove all -hp off hands they will nolonger be a "55" monk
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Oh and -20 health focuses drop from bad guys (i have a -20 plagueborn focus)
KurtBatz
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Clone
Horrible idea. I have a monk that runs a 55 build. I'm not a bot. I also have seen numerous posts of bannings of players who show botlike behavior (many hours played, same mission entered many times). But, bots and non bots alike do this because its profitable.
So, the main problem I see with arenanets bot detection is they're not actually looking for bots, they're looking for bot-like behavior that many non-bots also use. My suggestion would be to sign up with someone like punkbuster and look for code running at lower levels. As for suggestions on trying to make it unprofitable to bot, this can cause some serious problems. Bots will have an advantage over normal players simply due to more hours put in, so we can expet them to have more cash. Lowering drop rates enough to make them more poor could severely cut into normal players cashflow. Keeping normal players poor is the biggest reason why there's a market for ebay gold farmed from bots. |
I'm not personally taken with 55hp monks as the idea seems broken - having a practically invicible character that can only effectively be taken out with shatter hexes and blood magic doesn't sit well with me in terms of fairness, but I guess that's a matter of personal preference. I'm all for people throwing out ideas on how to stop these OBVIOUS cheaters in Elona though.
Think I'll take some screenshots of my own in that area tonight to show Arena Net how bad the problem is there.
lyra_song
Quote:
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Originally Posted by KurtBatz
What's a horrible idea? The only proposal I've made is for someone from arenanet to take names at Elona's reach of all the obvious Mo/W bots. If you're not a bot then you won't be affected.
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Stockholm
I think A-Net need to open a chines server, where the bot's can roam free, like a Bot preserve.
And then declare open hunting season on bot's everywhere else
And then declare open hunting season on bot's everywhere else
Guitary Boy
HOLY MOTHER OF GOD,THAT IS MENTAL! I thought you faked that picture some how lol, just duplicated the mo/w bit or somthing lol, but jesus that is beyond belief, you can spam you bots are going to get banned but no replys, they come in go to merchant, leave and repeat, there is 1 mo/w that is actually human and a couple of other normal players ....wow a net needs to do somthing about this...
logan90
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Drithlan
SOLUTION to 55ers remove all -hp off hands they will nolonger be a "55" monk
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Shadow-Hunter
Nerfing the -hp items wont help, cus ppl will just bot with a 600 hp monk with PS + Spirit bond.. nerfing PS wont help cus ppl can still make a good Build with Spirit bond alone, with maybe life attunement.. Wanna nerf all that? Ofc not, that will make all non botters piss angry..
And now, a bot could also be set to use a Warrior, it aint that hard. Cyclone axe + Bonettis def + some Monk enchants, a Bot can do that too.. Nerf that skills too? ofc not..
The fact that its very easy to make a build that can kill Mino's and trolls make it impossible to kill the bots by nerfing skills or items.. Banning all Mo/W's in town is gonna hurt non botters.. and very soon the botters will just change their build.. to Mo/something.. To make em harder to spot.. Anyway, if it was that easy to get the bots out of the game without making all other ppl angry, then Anet would have done it..
~Shadow
And now, a bot could also be set to use a Warrior, it aint that hard. Cyclone axe + Bonettis def + some Monk enchants, a Bot can do that too.. Nerf that skills too? ofc not..
The fact that its very easy to make a build that can kill Mino's and trolls make it impossible to kill the bots by nerfing skills or items.. Banning all Mo/W's in town is gonna hurt non botters.. and very soon the botters will just change their build.. to Mo/something.. To make em harder to spot.. Anyway, if it was that easy to get the bots out of the game without making all other ppl angry, then Anet would have done it..
~Shadow
Ventius Hozza
ANet hasn't had any problem banning people for no reason in the past... so why not now? I say ban them all.
If you're stupid enough to run around elona following the exact same route as all the other "real" bots, wearing all tats dyed blue then you deserve to get banned. Similarly, if you are stupid enough to run around Altrumm Ruins, doing 5 emotes, walking up to a lamppost and saying "i love you" (check it out, it's amazing) then, similarly, you deserve to get banned.
If you're stupid enough to run around elona following the exact same route as all the other "real" bots, wearing all tats dyed blue then you deserve to get banned. Similarly, if you are stupid enough to run around Altrumm Ruins, doing 5 emotes, walking up to a lamppost and saying "i love you" (check it out, it's amazing) then, similarly, you deserve to get banned.
Shadow of Light
Meh. Just squish all the people selling GW stuff on Ebay.
KurtBatz
I love how someone else in this thread doubted me, then managed to take a screenshot of their own of about fifty Mo/W in Elona's reach doing the botting thing by going there themselves!
This is happening NOW, btw. Every hour, every day. I have no idea why ArenaNet aren't policing that area. Blue dyed tattooed Mo/W's, every time.
I've told ArenaNet where it's happening and provided proof of it, let's see if they actually do anything about it.
This is happening NOW, btw. Every hour, every day. I have no idea why ArenaNet aren't policing that area. Blue dyed tattooed Mo/W's, every time.
I've told ArenaNet where it's happening and provided proof of it, let's see if they actually do anything about it.
Henchman
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Ventius Hozza
ANet hasn't had any problem banning people for no reason in the past... so why not now? I say ban them all.
If you're stupid enough to run around elona following the exact same route as all the other "real" bots, wearing all tats dyed blue then you deserve to get banned. Similarly, if you are stupid enough to run around Altrumm Ruins, doing 5 emotes, walking up to a lamppost and saying "i love you" (check it out, it's amazing) then, similarly, you deserve to get banned. |
Gorebrex
Ive seen them, posted a pic of it somewhere on forum. Was fairly obvious they were bots after a little observation. Cant ppl just report a name as a "Supected bot" to ANet? If they get alot of reports with the same name, theyll probably look into it.
kvndoom
Making Protective Spirit target other ally would destroy PVP because of monks' low armor level, so that's out the window.
I don't truly want to see 55 farming go away, it was very inventive, and for legitimate farmers it's a nice way to make some spare change without relying on friends or henchies to grind with you for 2 or 3 hours.
Botters will never stop botting as long as they can make money. Until Anet threatens ebay with legal recourse, or otherwise makes them stop selling gold, there is simply no way the bots will go away. They can ban accounts all day, but for every purchase of 1000 plat, they've made enough money to buy another account and a little profit on top.
I don't truly want to see 55 farming go away, it was very inventive, and for legitimate farmers it's a nice way to make some spare change without relying on friends or henchies to grind with you for 2 or 3 hours.
Botters will never stop botting as long as they can make money. Until Anet threatens ebay with legal recourse, or otherwise makes them stop selling gold, there is simply no way the bots will go away. They can ban accounts all day, but for every purchase of 1000 plat, they've made enough money to buy another account and a little profit on top.
shinrinningu
I don't think I have to say why nerfing anything won't solve the botting problem nor would it even begin to. It would be an endless cycle.
As for the original suggestion, I doubt Anet would want to spare a team to watch the many bots/players that crowd Elona nor would they want to pay a team just to watch the bots. Time is money and I'm sure they would prefer keeping the team intact to work on things of more importance.
Besides, wasn't that little mess-up a few weeks ago(?) where over 2000 accounts were banned (many being wrongly banned players) a sign that Anet is working on something? I'm sure some claimed to have been avid farmers who have spent countless hours farming the same places... oh wait, isn't that what those 55's are doing? Hmm... Still, they're working on something.
Anyway, I'm pretty sure it's not racial profiling you're suggesting but it's... *creates a new term* PLAYER PROFILING.
I don't think that would work well with the playerbase, especially since Anet already sent a bad shock into their system with the wrongful banning.
Consider this suggestion /disapproved and|or /not signed by me.
As for the original suggestion, I doubt Anet would want to spare a team to watch the many bots/players that crowd Elona nor would they want to pay a team just to watch the bots. Time is money and I'm sure they would prefer keeping the team intact to work on things of more importance.
Besides, wasn't that little mess-up a few weeks ago(?) where over 2000 accounts were banned (many being wrongly banned players) a sign that Anet is working on something? I'm sure some claimed to have been avid farmers who have spent countless hours farming the same places... oh wait, isn't that what those 55's are doing? Hmm...
Still, they're working on something.Anyway, I'm pretty sure it's not racial profiling you're suggesting but it's... *creates a new term* PLAYER PROFILING.
I don't think that would work well with the playerbase, especially since Anet already sent a bad shock into their system with the wrongful banning.Consider this suggestion /disapproved and|or /not signed by me.
KurtBatz
I wonder how many people ANet banned, that were using the Mo/W setup, that then cried 'foul play'?
If you use a broken build that exploits the game in a way that makes farming overly simple, characters near indestructable (besides blood magic and hex removal) and allows currency to be devalued, using the favoured build of 99.9999999% of botters to farm currency- then why would you be surprised that ANet investigates your account closely and suspects you of being a botter?
If you use a broken build that exploits the game in a way that makes farming overly simple, characters near indestructable (besides blood magic and hex removal) and allows currency to be devalued, using the favoured build of 99.9999999% of botters to farm currency- then why would you be surprised that ANet investigates your account closely and suspects you of being a botter?
KurtBatz
Quote:
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Originally Posted by shinrinningu
Anyway, I'm pretty sure it's not racial profiling you're suggesting but it's... *creates a new term* PLAYER PROFILING. I don't think that would work well with the playerbase, especially since Anet already sent a bad shock into their system with the wrongful banning. |
..and I stick by my guns closely when I say most of these botters are chinese gold farmers. They even use chinese names and chinese letters in their bot names - it's a known sweatshop trade in the country and the gigantic majority of gold listings on ebay are from chinese sellers. I'm not playing the race card, I'm going by stone cold fact.
KurtBatz
Quote:
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Originally Posted by shinrinningu
As for the original suggestion, I doubt Anet would want to spare a team to watch the many bots/players that crowd Elona nor would they want to pay a team just to watch the bots. Time is money and I'm sure they would prefer keeping the team intact to work on things of more importance. |
I was sitting there for about ten, twenty minutes and I saw /dozens\ of Mo/W's botters popping up in that area. Look at the two screenshots earlier in the thread please. You could have a team member check out the known troubleshots, poke his head into the area every now and then and take stock of the names. If the area is being policied, even if it's just a brief look in every now and then, it might help to allievitate the problem.
KurtBatz
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Henchman
No, you don't. I can be as stupid as I want, farm where the bots do, and not dye my tattoos. So long as I am not a bot of course
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Xenrath
Actually, you could always prevent several identical runes being equipped at the same time.
There is no reason whatsoever to have two identical Superior runes equipped - except to deliberately lower HP to take advantage of prot spirit etc.
That would help, but it would also make the 55'ers complain, even though there is no reasonable reason whatsoever to have two identical superior runes equipped at the same time.
There is no reason whatsoever to have two identical Superior runes equipped - except to deliberately lower HP to take advantage of prot spirit etc.
That would help, but it would also make the 55'ers complain, even though there is no reasonable reason whatsoever to have two identical superior runes equipped at the same time.
Farrell-Zander
well you can just use different runes then... there are 5 monk runes so thats no problem.
Xenrath
Healing, Smiting, Divine, Protection... am I missing something? You need to use a duplicate for 55hp.
Also, adjusting the -50hp offhand item would help bring this to an end too. Will it happen though? Meh...
Also, adjusting the -50hp offhand item would help bring this to an end too. Will it happen though? Meh...
Phades
They could also just hardcap the minimum to what hp could get reduced to through dp and rune adjustment.Something in the 150-200hp range would be sufficient without totally obliterating existing balance for skills or a particular profession. Of course at certian points it would be "adventagous" under that setup to overuse superior runes at certain dp marks, but the couple bonus attribute points wouldnt make up for how vulnerable the character would be.
*This would be a rather large change to how deep wound currently functions though.
Though the bots themselves still need to be banned individually and continously until its far less prevelant than it is.
*This would be a rather large change to how deep wound currently functions though.
Though the bots themselves still need to be banned individually and continously until its far less prevelant than it is.