Nightfall storyline. What we should expect and gaps to fill before Oct 27th

Cynn Evennia

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jul 2006

E/Mo

First of all i want to point out that especulation is one of the main motivations of any thread, this one in particular. In that spirit please feel free to especulate at will.

ATTENTION SPOIL WARNING

I want to know your opinions on what do you expect about Nightfall in terms of its storyline. Since it has been anounced as a PvE chapter this feature is very important.

Personally id love a nonlinear storyline like Prophecies, with surprising twists, betrayals, trips to new lands and a slow development of the story... suspense so to speak. Id hate an "all vs the bad guy" story like in Factions. Nevertheless Factions at the ending closes all NPC's personal stories; that is totally non-existent in Prophecies, and these loose ends gave me the feeling of "oh thats it? wow... ok then". So a nonlinear story thats ties up the loose ends is my minimal request.

I know that the storyline will continue, with the very same NPC characters and others that will show up in due time. Since i find several gaps and inconsistencies on the storyline so far let me present you some of the unsolved mysteries i have gathered. Maybe you will have a better idea and will help me understand the bizarre and hidden logic.

Prophecies

1. What happens with Ascalon, Shiverpeaks and Kryta after the Lich and his Titans are destroyed ? What news of the Charr and the White Mantles?
2. What are the Mursaats? Aliens? Gods? Where do they came from?
3. What is the real meaning of Ascension? Because the only thing that matters vs the "Unseen gods" (Mursaats) is infusion, and you dont need to be ascended for that.

Factions

1. Why Shiro wants to become human again? Man, you made all become jade and stone just yelling, you are unseen and untouchable as an envoy, you corrupt flesh and soul, you have hordes of afflicted, you almost killed Kuunavang... so why you choose to become mortal?
2. What was the business between Mhenlo and the Kurzicks? They revere him and think he was dead, but why?
3. Was the former emperor going to kill Shiro? Why Shiro just followed the foreteller's advice? was she a devil or something?
4. In the Factions cinematic Shiro has an evil aura after hit by Vizu, but it does not correspond with the hesitating Shiro in the cinematic of Harvest temple.

Nightfall

1. What is the emperor doing in Elona? Thats gives me the creeps, fearing of a chimera. I know theres is a thread about it, im just pointing it out again for the sake of completeness.
2. The main NPC character in Factions (after Mhenlo) is Togo, a ritualist. What will be the main NPC in Elona, dervish or paragon? My guess is paragon.

Ok, thats all from my part. Any feedback and/or answer is welcome.

Ezekial Bain

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Apr 2006

Knights of the Sacred Light

E/Mo

While it's a long (long) way from perfect I did like the fact that the Factions storyline was a *LOT* tighter than the Prophecies one. Prophecies certainly conjured up a grander sense of epic scale but it kinda jumped all over the place and deffinetly felt like several differant storys patched together (eg. in a way the MAIN story doesn't start at all until you hit Lions Arch), and many of the storylines are left without being resolved (unlike Factions which, love it or hate it did a good job of wrapping everything up).

I agree that it'd be nice to learn exactly WHAT Shiro was thinking and the odd change from conflicted/manipulated (?) character 200 years ago to manical cackling bad guy in the present that our heroes fight.

Besides that though Factions is basically wrapped up. Yes the Luxons and Kurzicks look like they're gonna start fighting again but oh well.

Prophecies did need more closure on issues though. I guess a few things are implied; I always saw Sorrows Furnace as the "last retreat" of the Stone Summit after Dagnar dies in Thunderhead Keep but that's not made explicit. Also, while you could think the Charr retreated after the deatruction of the Titans that again is not made explicit. And a small quest in Kryta about restoring the monarchy doesn't exactly explain what's going to happen to Tyria's only remaining beautiful country.

So yes... more resolution in Nightfall please!

Knightsaber Sith

Knightsaber Sith

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Aug 2006

Few Fallen Heroes [FFH]

W/E

Prohecies
2. It's already been revealed that the mursaat were the guardians of Orr.

Paperfly

Paperfly

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jun 2006

Er, what's non-linear about Prophecies' storyline? The ability to get a Droks run is about all I can think of.
Quote:
3. What is the real meaning of Ascension? Because the only thing that matters vs the "Unseen gods" (Mursaats) is infusion, and you dont need to be ascended for that.
Ascension allows you to see the Mursaat, that's why they're referred to as the Mantle's "unseen gods"! Though, to be honest, I find the build-up to them is quite hard to follow through the plotline unless you scrutinise every cutscene.

...Of course, the Droks run breaks this as it allows people to get to the Southern Shiverpeaks missions sans Ascension.

Shoitaan

Shoitaan

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Mar 2006

Australia

Tuskforce Supremacy [Tusk]

Me/N

Quote:
Originally Posted by Knightsaber Sith
Prohecies
2. It's already been revealed that the mursaat were the guardians of Orr.

NO, what the hell? Where did you get that?

The lich/vizier is linked to Orr, Mursaat have nothing to do with Orr.

Cynn Evennia

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jul 2006

E/Mo

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paperfly
Er, what's non-linear about Prophecies' storyline? The ability to get a Droks run is about all I can think of.
I used nonlinear to indicate the twists on the story and the slow unveil of the Prophecies. I used it in opposition to the linear Factions story where "the good guys are always good and the bad are always bad" along with the "all vs Shiro". Sorry if that use of linear and nonlinear was not very accurate.

I never meant to talk about the gameplay, which is indeed kinda linear with primary quests and mission to make the story advance, and it became extremely linear in Factions without the slight chance to get a run. I hope Nightfall will not be like that since it has been said that there will be choices to make, KOTOR-like my guess.

About Mursaats, well they seem to be unrelated to Orr:

http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Mursaat

That link and references therein indicate that the Mursaats were found in the Maguuma jungle and that they helped the Krytans vs the Charr invasion, but it does not answer my question about what do the Mursaats are and where do they come from. I like to know because i find them fascinating (if we were able to choose a race, Mursaat would be mine: SA LFG... jk)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paperfly
Ascension allows you to see the Mursaat, that's why they're referred to as the Mantle's "unseen gods"!
Thanks, one question answered! But now it seems natural to ask why ascension grants us this favour? What are the Mursaats exactly that just the favour of the gods allows us to see them? Indeed a fascinating race they are.

A guess: due to the "God" we will face in Nightfall, the Paragon as a Holy Warrior, the geographical position of the ruins of Orr and its "City of the Gods" Arah we will have the last loose end tied up in the very heart of Orr... maybe

http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Orr

Sir fredman

Sir fredman

Academy Page

Join Date: Nov 2005

Houston, Texas

I American Guild I [iAi]

A/

nice guesses guys by the time you know it, you'll be the first ones to know the whole truth about about Guild Wars. =)

LadyNilene

LadyNilene

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: May 2006

Silver Millenium

E/Me

What about Gwen!? lol

natuxatu

natuxatu

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Apr 2006

Wisconsin

Rt/Mo

OMG I'm so with you. For some reason like the thing I want to know the most about is Gwen hehe.. she is like the first henchie you ever come in contact with and interact with.

P.S. I liked the Prophices story better mainly for the reasons listed above.. i like how it took a little longer for it to flesh out and along with the twists in the plots and the build up ect. Factions was good too though except I also am very confused as to why he'd want to be alive and mortal in a world he pretty much messed up. Not to mention he already had way more power than he would as a mortal. So yeah that just made him look stupid lol

SirJackassIII

SirJackassIII

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Oct 2005

Belgium

none

N/E

Quote:
Prophecies

2. What are the Mursaats? Aliens? Gods? Where do they came from?
3. What is the real meaning of Ascension? Because the only thing that matters vs the "Unseen gods" (Mursaats) is infusion, and you dont need to be ascended for that.

Factions


2. What was the business between Mhenlo and the Kurzicks? They revere him and think he was dead, but why?

4. In the Factions cinematic Shiro has an evil aura after hit by Vizu, but it does not correspond with the hesitating Shiro in the cinematic of Harvest temple.

Nightfall

2. The main NPC character in Factions (after Mhenlo) is Togo, a ritualist. What will be the main NPC in Elona, dervish or paragon? My guess is paragon.
P2: The Mursaat are the Guardians of the Gate of Komalie, and went to take over Kryta to kill the Chosen (you) because the Flameseeker Prophecies say the CHosen will kill the Mursaat. It is believed the Mursaat are a race of Ancient spellcasters.
P3: Ascension makes it able to see the Mursaat (Unseen Gods before), and should give you something of a Power Boost in the form of 50k xp.

F2: The business between Mhenlo and the Kurzicks isn't quite clear, but they think he's dead after hearing stories of the Searing and the Ascension trials etc.

N2: (quoting myself from another forum) http://www.teeteehaa.de/~gc2006live/

Pic nr 14, Woman called Morgahn, Dervish, is on the cover of the CE, seems to be an allied NPC. Paragons seem to have pretty high ranks in the army as well, but that was kind of expected with all the "Arch Angels" and Leadership and all.
So, both are still possible.

GloryFox

GloryFox

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jan 2006

Good ol' USA, where everyone else wants to be

Now Plays World of Warcraft on Whisperwind

As I read this and study the lore of GW I think of the quest "Blood and Smoke".
Quote:
Dark Root the Druid from the Blood and Smoke quest
"Let me look into the dark... I see a great beast, a great cat... a lion. This lion hungers. He is devouring... the forest... the entire forest... Nay, the entire world! A host of gleaming angels... no not angels but birds... carrion birds... bright and terrible as the sun accompany this lion. All falls before his hunger until naught is left but bitter ashes. That is all I see."
Even though one of Evennia's men state. "This is a dire vision indeed. The lion he saw is obviously Kryta or the White Mantle but what of the carrion birds? I must consult with Evennia. Perhaps she can interpret this vision. Thank you my friend, for everything you have done for us." You can tell he was unsure and was unsure if the Lion was really Kryta. This leaves me to believe the Lion is something else more sinister like the Ancient Dhuum. It is possible the Mussat serve Dhaam. It is possible Dhaam and the Mussat are related?

This would explain the Searing, the Envoy's at war with one another, Etc (like they [Envoys] are trying to choose a side and yet keep quiet on cosmic events) Maybe there is another prophesies about the chosen destroying what Genth was unable to complete?

Overall I hope Nightfall does fill in some gaps. With each chapter of a good story Guild Wars will open new questions and grant us answers we might not want to hear.

Urban_Nomad

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: May 2006

3rd Era

R/Me

I'm pretty sure that the Seer stated that both it and the the Mursaat were from another world, they may have arrived here through the Rift or other means, but they're not from Tyria or the Door of Komalie.

Also, people always assume that power means everything, it seems. Shiro may have had other reasons for trying to become mortal. For one, I always got the impression that becoming an Envoy was a punishment. They have to lead the dead to paradise, they say, but it sure doesn't sound like they get to go to paradise themselves. And we all know that what Shiro did was really bad, to put it mildly, so becoming an Envoy sure as well shouldn't be a reward. Plus the other Envoys don't exactly look like heroes. I wouldn't want to be an envoy if that's the case, powers or not.

Also:

Dark Root the Druid from the Blood and Smoke quest
"Let me look into the dark... I see a great beast, a great cat... a lion. This lion hungers. He is devouring... the forest... the entire forest... Nay, the entire world! A host of gleaming angels... no not angels but birds... carrion birds... bright and terrible as the sun accompany this lion. All falls before his hunger until naught is left but bitter ashes. That is all I see."

I always thought the Lion was the Lich Lord, seeing as he is the one who really starts all the real destruction by using the Titans to take over Tyria. And of course, the Angel/Carrion birds are the Mursaat, who are evil but but don't do nearly as much as the Lich.


MY question is: Why did Shiro cause the Jade Wind when he died? What's so special about him? Is it just because he became an Envoy? In that case, we should have 4 other Jade Winds around the world somewhere. If not, then what the heck happened? In the manual, it says that Shiro began to drain the emperor's soul away with his "ill-gotten power." Where did Shiro get this ill-gotten power, and why was he draining the emperor's soul if that's the case? Admittedly, the game has a lot of differences from the manual, but still, why the Jade Wind?

SirJackassIII

SirJackassIII

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Oct 2005

Belgium

none

N/E

Quote:
Originally Posted by Urban_Nomad
I'm pretty sure that the Seer stated that both it and the the Mursaat were from another world, they may have arrived here through the Rift or other means, but they're not from Tyria or the Door of Komalie.

Also, people always assume that power means everything, it seems. Shiro may have had other reasons for trying to become mortal. For one, I always got the impression that becoming an Envoy was a punishment. They have to lead the dead to paradise, they say, but it sure doesn't sound like they get to go to paradise themselves. And we all know that what Shiro did was really bad, to put it mildly, so becoming an Envoy sure as well shouldn't be a reward. Plus the other Envoys don't exactly look like heroes. I wouldn't want to be an envoy if that's the case, powers or not.

Also:

Dark Root the Druid from the Blood and Smoke quest
"Let me look into the dark... I see a great beast, a great cat... a lion. This lion hungers. He is devouring... the forest... the entire forest... Nay, the entire world! A host of gleaming angels... no not angels but birds... carrion birds... bright and terrible as the sun accompany this lion. All falls before his hunger until naught is left but bitter ashes. That is all I see."

I always thought the Lion was the Lich Lord, seeing as he is the one who really starts all the real destruction by using the Titans to take over Tyria. And of course, the Angel/Carrion birds are the Mursaat, who are evil but but don't do nearly as much as the Lich.


MY question is: Why did Shiro cause the Jade Wind when he died? What's so special about him? Is it just because he became an Envoy? In that case, we should have 4 other Jade Winds around the world somewhere. If not, then what the heck happened? In the manual, it says that Shiro began to drain the emperor's soul away with his "ill-gotten power." Where did Shiro get this ill-gotten power, and why was he draining the emperor's soul if that's the case? Admittedly, the game has a lot of differences from the manual, but still, why the Jade Wind?
Lion would be the White Mantle, not the Lich, since the Mursaat don't accompagny the Lich.

The Jade Wind was caused because of Shiro killing the Emperor at a bad time to say the least. All the Emperors are Weh No Su, and during the Harvest Ceremony, they come in direct link with the Gods. When Shiro struck down the emperor, all the power of that link had to go somewhere, in this case Shiro, though he wasn't Weh No Su and couldn't connect with the gods that way, so the power stayed in Shiro. When he was killed, that power was again released along with Shiro's hatred and anger causing the Jade Wind.

Gairoh

Gairoh

Academy Page

Join Date: Aug 2006

Tsumei village,Shing Jea Island,

A/

hmmm...good point there....

Shadowfrost

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Apr 2006

Planet Earth (sometimes)

Nowhere To Run, Nowhere To [Hide]

R/

Quote:
Originally Posted by SirJackassIII
The Jade Wind was caused because of Shiro killing the Emperor at a bad time to say the least. All the Emperors are Weh No Su, and during the Harvest Ceremony, they come in direct link with the Gods. When Shiro struck down the emperor, all the power of that link had to go somewhere, in this case Shiro, though he wasn't Weh No Su and couldn't connect with the gods that way, so the power stayed in Shiro. When he was killed, that power was again released along with Shiro's hatred and anger causing the Jade Wind.
You know what? That's the first actual GOOD explanation of the Jade Wind, and why it didn't happen again when you kill him in Imperial Sanctum.

Quid Pro Quo

Quid Pro Quo

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jul 2005

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadowfrost
You know what? That's the first actual GOOD explanation of the Jade Wind, and why it didn't happen again when you kill him in Imperial Sanctum.
I agree, that was a pretty damn good explanation.

Cynn Evennia

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jul 2006

E/Mo

Quote:
Originally Posted by SirJackassIII
Lion would be the White Mantle, not the Lich, since the Mursaat don't accompagny the Lich.
I dont know because the carrion birds are the Lion's servants to my eyes, and the Mursaats clearly are not under the oders of the Mantles but vice versa. Moreover the Mantles are not trying to reduce the world to ashes.

That can be also interpreted as: The Lich and his undead, or even as Shiro and the Envoys or Shiro and the afflicted. Dark Oak is ambiguous enough to fit any plausible explanation. A point to ANET.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SirJackassIII
The Jade Wind was caused because of Shiro killing the Emperor at a bad time to say the least. All the Emperors are Weh No Su, and during the Harvest Ceremony, they come in direct link with the Gods. When Shiro struck down the emperor, all the power of that link had to go somewhere, in this case Shiro, though he wasn't Weh No Su and couldn't connect with the gods that way, so the power stayed in Shiro. When he was killed, that power was again released along with Shiro's hatred and anger causing the Jade Wind.
Excellent explanation indeed, but it raises new questions: why was Shiro granted with the ability to absorb celestial power like the emperor's soul? Only the Weh No Su can do that. And how could he release such power to turn everything in jade and stone? Certainly he is the most powerful warrior on Cantha, but it is not enough justification for the jade wind.

Personally i think Shiro was possessed or something. Remember his hesitation in the Harvest ceremony temple: it seems he was manipulated by the Fortune teller. That "possession" or "a favour from a Dark lord" could explain the dark aura and the jade wind. Many especulation has been done around this point in the threads found in the Lore section here in guru.

I have great expectations for Nightfall, and id love to have all 3 chapters related in some way. Personally i really want the "dark lord" to be the "outcast god" that we will face in Nightfall, and that the Lich and Shiro were merely his instruments.

Mrscoombes

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Aug 2006

Crimson Skullfuks

A/R

But I can see the mursaat with my lvl 5 unascended who got a run to droks...I always thought it was just to give you something to do.

Quid Pro Quo

Quid Pro Quo

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jul 2005

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrscoombes
But I can see the mursaat with my lvl 5 unascended who got a run to droks...I always thought it was just to give you something to do.
Well your not suppose to skip through the story like that.

draxynnic

draxynnic

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Nov 2005

[CRFH]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadowfrost
You know what? That's the first actual GOOD explanation of the Jade Wind, and why it didn't happen again when you kill him in Imperial Sanctum.
Actually, my interpretation is that it DID happen when you kill him in Imperial Sanctum. However, this time the Adepts were ready for it.

When you kill him, he assumes a similar 'shouting' pose as with the original Jade Wind - however, at the time he makes the actual shout, the Adepts have hurried in to surround him and perform some kind of magic. When he screams, it's HIM that turns to jade.

My interpretation is that the Adepts are simply setting up a shield to contain the death-scream. Being so contained, the power of the death-scream focusses inwards and it's Shiro that gets turned to jade instead of the other half of Cantha.

Gairoh

Gairoh

Academy Page

Join Date: Aug 2006

Tsumei village,Shing Jea Island,

A/

i just realise tht ppl are starting to talk about Shiro again,so lets talk more about Nightfall shall we??

Cynn Evennia

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jul 2006

E/Mo

The ideas posted here about the Jade Wind are all fascinating, but i suggest to relate it to Nightfall.

I have the feeling that in Nightfall we will meet the puppet master of the Lich and Shiro. The Fortune teller is mysterious enough to make you wonder whether Shiro was being manipulated or not. And the Jade wind skill that Shiro possesses must come from somewhere and someone, but where and who? Several people has pointed out Dhuum as the puppet master, and at my ears it sounds plausible and appealing. Id love that come true, and it seems to be so:

Quote:
Originally Posted by PCFormat, Sept 2006
All the best stories come in a trilogy and now the saga which began with Guild Wars: Prophecies (the full install of which you'll find in on this month's bonus disc), and continued with Factions, comes to a close in Nightfall. That's not to say this is the last chapter of Guild Wars, just the culmination of the Titans/Shiro story arc.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wikipedia
It has been suggested in an article UK PC Format that Prophecies, Factions and Nightfall are a trilogy with Nightfall just the culmination of the Titans/Shiro story arc. The Prophecies and Factions stories are only loosly linked so it is speculated the Nightfall storyline will connect the actions of the protagonists from the previous episodes and that this outcast god may have been the one to cause the Lich Lord (Chapter 1 Antagonist) and Shiro (Chapter 2 Antagonist) to suddenly become evil and powerful. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guild_Wars_Nightfall
NOTE: quotes borrowed from the thread Rumor Mill: GW: Nightfall is the last of the series?, http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10038493

It would be fantastic for me to have answers from ANET concerning the Mursaats and what happened to all kingdoms after you beat Prophecies. I hope the total lack of information was on purpose in order to keep the door open for further expansion. Nevertheless i find the ambiguity of the ending rather disappointing.

Finally, the Mursaats and the Seer are a total mystery. My question about why Ascension grants you the chance to see the Mursaats is istill in the air; after all Ascension means being in the grace of the gods, so the Mursaats are related to the Gods, but in what manner?

I welcome all comments about this puppet master theory and your ideas of the genesis and lore of Mursaats.

pcredsox99

pcredsox99

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Jul 2006

Mostly Kryta but Fissure of Woe on the weekends

Knights of the Dragon Pyre [DRGN]

W/Mo

Quote:
Originally Posted by Urban_Nomad
MY question is: Why did Shiro cause the Jade Wind when he died? What's so special about him? Is it just because he became an Envoy? In that case, we should have 4 other Jade Winds around the world somewhere. If not, then what the heck happened? In the manual, it says that Shiro began to drain the emperor's soul away with his "ill-gotten power." Where did Shiro get this ill-gotten power, and why was he draining the emperor's soul if that's the case? Admittedly, the game has a lot of differences from the manual, but still, why the Jade Wind?
Um if u read in the guide which most have not it says that shiro prepared for the festival by entwining himself with dark magic the Jade Wind was planned incase he died. That is where they were in the 3rd mish at the library that is where he got the books from.
*And so not to be off topic yes i would like to see Nightfall tie up in the end but since the same people that made prohocies are making it i think that it might be a little more open which all in all i dont mind because we all know we like the running capabilities in proph. alot more

Mrscoombes

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Aug 2006

Crimson Skullfuks

A/R

So uh when you're in kryta, supposedly there are musaat around you all the time because you can't see them? How come they dont just kick your ass when they realise you're catching on to their plan/chosen?

Age

Age

Hall Hero

Join Date: Jul 2005

California Canada/BC

STG Administrator

Mo/

I would like to know more about Drascir and will we get to go there.The Former Capital of Ascalon.Good Thread Cynn Evennia.

Cynn Evennia

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jul 2006

E/Mo

I really want to have all loose ends tied up at Nightfall: what are really the Mursaats, the Seer and the Titans, who was controlling the Lich and Shiro, what happened to Tyria after the Titans, and what is the deal with Orr and the scepter.

Please feel free to speculate on that topics i have just mentioned. I am thinking myself on an answer that justifies the Mursaats being related to the Gods, but any idea is welcome.

One last comment. As a PvE player im expecting so much from Nightfall after the vastness of Prophecies and the fast forward pit stop we made in Factions. Please remark i am not a Factions hater, i just found Factions very limited in the PvE section: just 13 missions and an "all vs the bad guy" storyline. But i must confess i love several features of Factions: the new henchies (amazing builds, especially Erys), some of the new skills (particularly the monk elites), the missions where we are 16 vs the world, and Fort Aspenwood.

draxynnic

draxynnic

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Nov 2005

[CRFH]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrscoombes
So uh when you're in kryta, supposedly there are musaat around you all the time because you can't see them? How come they dont just kick your ass when they realise you're catching on to their plan/chosen?
Because the Mursaat didn't want to reveal their presence. Even after the PCs defect, most of Kryta still believes the Mantle are the good guys and the Shining Blade are a band of bandits. However, the Mantle would develop a more sinister side should it be seen that the Unseen Gods were acting as their own enforcers (it's one thing to have invisible angel-like beings watching over you and protecting you from the Charr, another to face the possibility that there could be one following you around waiting to execute you at the first slip of the tongue). Fear might have prevented an outright rebellion in this case, but a fearful population is still more difficult to control than a complacent one.

Why the Mursaat step in in the Shiverpeaks is less clear. It could be because they have felt it is time to step in because they somehow felt the ascension of the Chosen. It could be because they didn't want to reveal themselves to the rank-and-file Mantle, but those that entered the mountains had the required 'clearance' to know the truth (it's unclear how much the inner workings of the Mantle are hidden from the lower ranks, but when the PCs are inducted they certainly didn't receive the full disclosure, and they seem determined to hide the presence of Mesmers and Necromancers in their ranks until the proverbial gloves come off*). It could be that they wanted to make sure of the deaths of the leaders of the Blade personally, because they felt the White Mantle needed assistance against the dwarves (on both sides), or even because they simply thought the Shiverpeaks were isolated enough for them to get away with it.

*I personally think the Mantle has at least three levels of 'clearance'. The first is the 'public face' - we don't see the Ritualists or Sycophants, and it wouldn't surprise me to learn that Necromancers and Mesmers are distrusted by the average Krytan (whether this distrust is encouraged by the Mantle or simply something they have accepted and taken into account I wouldn't know). The second is when it is revealed that the Mantle does in fact contain those who use these distrusted powers, probably on a kind of 'fight fire with fire' basis. Finally is the stage at which the thoroughly indoctrinated member of the Mantle is introduced to the inner workings - the Mursaat, the sacrifices of the Chosen, and so on.

Gonzo

Gonzo

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Feb 2006

Netherlands

Defenders of the Blackblade [DotB]

W/

Isn't the point of Ascension (in prophesies) to become stronger so we can face the Mursaat? 50.000 XP (or insta-level 20 as it used to be) does help becoming stronger.

Lady Lozza

Lady Lozza

Forge Runner

Join Date: Dec 2005

Oz

Angel Sharks

Me/N

Meh, Gwen really is the loose end I want tied up. I can accept that Shiro and the Lich were acting on their own, but what the blazes happened to that evil, evil little girl?

Clord

Clord

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jul 2006

Finland

Victory Via Valour

It is likely that Fortune Teller's information was manipulated rather than Fortune Teller itself.

Shyft the Pyro

Shyft the Pyro

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Sep 2005

NYC, USA

E/Mo

Quote:
Originally Posted by Age
I would like to know more about Drascir and will we get to go there.The Former Capital of Ascalon.Good Thread Cynn Evennia.
You've already been there. Replay Ruins of Surmia and pay close attention to the cutscene where you release the last of the captive soldiers. Erol (captive soldier) tells you that more men have been captured and taken further north. Rurik replies with "Then we go to Drascir." The final part of the mission - defending Rurik as he opens the door in the obelisk chamber - is being fought in Drascir. Where else would you have a teleportation device to the Nolani Academy if not in the capital?

I've never really seen Ascension as the ability to "visually perceive" Mursaat. I always understood "Unseen Gods" as a figure of speech rather than a reference to the inability of people to see them. Remember, Saul D'Alessio - the first Krytan to ally himself with the Mursaat, the founder of the White Mantle - would have had to see them in order to bow to them, and he wasn't ascended at all.

The Mursaat are "unseen" gods as opposed to the actual gods who created Tyria and whose avatars can be regularly seen at the shrines. The Mursaat, on the other hand, never come into contact with Krytans until the missions in South Shiverpeaks, and even then only the Shining Blade get to see them (as they're dying). The general population of Kryta deals with the White Mantle and the White Mantle only, and since the White Mantle only "shows" Mursaat to the most devoted (think Scientology or the Vatican archives), to the Krytans at large Mursaat remain the unseen gods of White Mantle.

I strongly hope that Nightfall is not the last game in the "original" Guild Wars, but even one of the NPCs in Temple of Ages says something along the lines of "the gods created other worlds after their Exodus from ours." If Nightfall indeed ends up concluding the Guild Wars "trilogy," I would expect to see the following in terms of the storyline:

1) The Underworld issue resolved. Though Dhuum is referenced directly in only one Underworld quest, "clearing" the Underworld involves destroying things that are presumably there against Grenth's will. Only a rival, outcast god would have enough power to infiltrate the Underworld to the degree that his minions would spill into the Hall of Heroes as they did when the Tomb of the Primeval Kings entrance became unusable. Considering the progression of this invasion - from realms in the Rifts like Underworld and Hall of Heroes to the "real" world during the Dragon Festival - I'd say we'll be fighting these forces as part of the Nightfall storyline.

2) The "endgame" issue resolved. My guess is that ANet wasn't concerned with ending Prophecies the same way they designed Factions to "end" in Divine Path because Prophecies was conceived as a much more open game while the Factions design team was pressured into making a shorter game people could complete in the 6 months before Nightfall was released. The downside, of course, is that there's no clear way to tell when Prophecies ends as the last storyline mission simply deposits players in Droknar's Forge again - though things might have been better if players were made to spawn at Glint's statue during the Titan quests update. Titan quests were a way for the design team to revisit the old, static locations in the game and provide the players with an update, but once again they left players wondering what happened in these areas after player actions. If Nightfall ends up concluding the Guild Wars storyline, I would expect the developers to give players an "update" on the events, even if in the form of a cutscene somewhere at the end of the Nightfall storyline, so that there is a sense of a concrete ending (like in Factions) but applied to the whole storyline. Of course, Factions doesn't really need an update because it was designed as a finite game with a specific and definite ending, but I'd still expect this "update" to appear in Nightfall and apply to all three chapters rather than be introduced into old chapters as new content.

I do NOT expect that we'll learn more about Mursaat or Seers as their "alien" looks make it conceivable we'd encounter them on another world created by the 5 gods - in Chapter 4 if it chooses to focus on another world.

I do NOT expect to learn more about Shiro's "original" death and the Jade Wind as those things are supposed to have happened 200 years prior to Guild Wars events, which might be too far back for the outcast god to be strong enough to touch the actual world - though it's possible, considering the gods left Tyria 1072 years ago (1070 years before the Searing). If we do get a confirmation of the outcast god's involvement I highly doubt it will be more than an afterthought admission along the lines of "Oh yeah, and I did that too."

My guess for the Emperor's presence in Nightfall is that it relates to the way Nightfall will be linked with older chapters. Players will be able to travel directly from Factions to Nightfall without the need to go to Lion's Arch first, and a representative from each chapter in the "port city" would help players find out more about their native land and invite them if they can travel there (have a linked account).

EDIT: Totally forgot to put in my take on ascending since I don't consider it necessary to actually see the Mursaat. My answer is simple: the Flameseeker Prophecies say that the Chosen will only defeat the Mursaat after ascending. The Vizier tells PCs they need to ascend because they're the Chosen who will take down the White Mantle's unseen gods according to the Flameseeker Prophecy - which means the prophecy must be followed to the letter in order to arrive at its completion (death of the Mursaat and defeat of the White Mantle).

The Flameseeker Prophecies are very much self-fulfilling: if you want to defeat the White Mantle, you have to destroy their unseen gods; if you want to destroy their unseen gods, you have to ascend and go to the Ring of Fire and open the Door of Komalie (notice how infusion is totally absent from the prophecy).

Mezmo

Mezmo

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jan 2006

Mo/W

I wanna know what happened to the staff of orr. If i'm not mistaken in Nightfall some old "Bad" god is trying to return. Perhaps once the location of the staff of orr was discovered, this old god took advantage and stole it away when no one powerful being was using it.

Or perhaps Gwen decided to run away when the char attacked, became the ruler of(insert nightfall contenet name here) and decided to try and become a god so she stoll the staff of orr when the time was right and is even now ploting to become an evil god .

Shyft the Pyro

Shyft the Pyro

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Sep 2005

NYC, USA

E/Mo

Gwen already is an evil god. I mean, casting 200+ damage spells in town?! See any "end of beta" video to know what I mean

But yes, the Staff of Orr appears to be another loose end. It's possible to assume Glint takes it when her "vision" disappears during the last cutscene of Hell's Precipice, but the "fading out" is not simultaneous. Still, I'd think that an all-knowing prophet like Glint would anticipate the situation and grab hold of the staff so it doesn't get buried under tons of rock... unless the proximity of the Bloodstone has something to do with the staff's disappearance?

Either way, the staff seems to be something exclusive to the Prophecies storyline. We won't encounter it in Nightfall unless we see hordes of undead and titans - and I think it's more likely we'll have to fight the Underworld creatures instead.

AnnaCloud9

AnnaCloud9

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Aug 2005

Minnesota

Well if you're bored, then you're boring!

R/

Gwen is (was) the fortune teller.

As for her antics at the end of beta...purely entertainment on behalf of ANet to 'celebrate'.

This of course is only my opinion, however it would identify and tie up the loose end, of this enigma of a little girl, named Gwen.

Vermilion Okeanos

Forge Runner

Join Date: Feb 2005

Both the lich and shiro share a common bond, and that is they are both something related to life and death, or some kind of undead. With envoy connect to the worlds in between, and the lich being a thing that do not die. It is possible that both of them signed a pack with the old god of underworld, as generally underworld is a place where dead people go.

It is possible that the old god wish to posses a strong body, which both shiro and lich somewhat fit the requirement. Being a spirit generally mean that you can't touch worldly things, such as door and gate (remember how ghostly hero got the power to fight, but not opening the gate to HoH?). If you can't touch what you own, then it would be as good as not owning it.

It is also possible that the old god wish to obtain the mortal world for his/her own, while recking havoc in the spirit world especially to the 2 gods that most likely would do something to oppose him; to keep balthazar, the warrior god, and grenth, the old nemesis of dhuum busy. While I doubt Dwayna the god of kindness and freedom, and lyssa the carefree artist would do anything about the war on mortal throne immediately; while I am not sure about melandru as she seem as someone passive, but what happen if the nature are threatened?

One more thing. In the vision of the druid, those bird creature might be referring to the creatures in elona that we see in the nightfall trailer awhile ago. While mursaat seem to be a good guy turned bad, as they were willing to do anything to keep titan locked up, even when it means infinite number of innocent sacrifise. The charr might have obtain the power to destroy ascalon's wall because of dhuum, as that thing they used was really abnormal. (large meteor crystal falling from the sky?)

While I wonder about the role of glint and kunavang, as it seems glint have so much more mystical wisdom from her old age; kuunavang only got power capable of making the chosen powerful enough to take down shiro.

Lawnmower

Lawnmower

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Mar 2006

W/R

it would be amazing if nightfall closed off the trilogy and tied in all the loose ends. if thats the case, then I hope that nightfall will have a cinematic ending.


I also hope that the story will be good...



then chapter 4 and so on can focus on other events.

then when nightfall is over, the game should have radicaly changed... perhaps the war in tyria could have ended and we could return to seeing green planes as back in pre searing.

some guy

some guy

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Jul 2006

SPAWN CAMPING YOUR HOUSE

We Speed Clear H O H [ HsC]

Basically, ascension means you are worthy to be blessed by the gods of Tyria. Not sure what dose that have to do with Mursaats, but ascension dose have a clear purpose in Factions

Moiax

Moiax

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jul 2006

Pink Animal Clan

E/

Ascension is also required to be able to enter the realms of the gods btw...