Yukito Kunisaki
Repeats are allowed and encouraged ^_^
mathijn
QuixotesGhost
Skuld
fallot
A Leprechaun
DeanBB
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"shields Up" is a very nice team shout to
WY + SU seem to be about it from warrior's skills. I suppose you could add knock downs to the list as an enemy on the ground is good for everyone. You could of course use wards, wells or other such team benefitting skills, at least in theory. I guess in some twisted sadistic way, IWAY is a good team skill. Shadow-Hunter
Echo
Arcane Echo Mending
DeanBB
Hopefully Chapter 3, 4 and 5 will have duplicate Mending Skills FTW!
Mending Jamei's Mending Karei's Mending Kirin's Mending Woot!
Gigashadow
Quote:
Originally Posted by fallot
I would help the team by not wasting more than one slot on "tanking". Which would probably be "Watch Yourself!".
^^^ A man who understands how to play warrior.
Skuld
The thread is which 3 you would take :/ normally I just healing signet :|
SnipiousMax
Favorite tank skills?
I really like the ones that kill things. kazjun
In team? WY and maybe shields up.
Solo? WY and Dolyaks. And the ripostes and DR.
Xaero Gouki Kriegor
Flurry
Tiger Stance Rez Signet
Yukito Kunisaki
Wow, you must have some REALLY good teammates for PvE if all you need is Watch Yourself!!
Obviously your team is always always in the backline and the monk is busy doing their job and no enemy warrior EVER runs past ya... sure...  I'm jealous, I wish I had perfect teammates like that all the time in PUGs...All sarcasm aside, I've noticed that in PvE, if you bring less than 2 tanking skills as a warrior, you'll die if you're in a place worth any exp or items... I don't care what team/guild you're in, you need to show me this Utopia of 'I only need ONE tanking skill to be useful to my team...' I don't see it in this game... Healing Sig takes some pressure off the monk and a Warrior still standing is still doing his job. Combining that with Dolyak and bonetti's / WY makes the -40 AL a moot point. Hence why I say 3 skills. That means 1 skill is a res sig [or if the team is very good, plague touch for me] and then 4 skills left for doing your thing, killing enemies... If you need more than half your skill bar for attack skills to kill foes, you're obviously bringing weak piddly ones that don't do the job correctly... 
Rera
@Yukito: You don't need tanking skills for any mission or quest in the game (proph+factions), so I'd say this elusive Utopia is um ... everywhere. I take Endure Pain for Raisu Palace for boss Sliver Armor, and Protector's Defense if I'm henching Imperial Sanctum, but you won't need those if you're with a good guild group.
Healing Sig is a 2s skill that heals for ~100+ (assuming reasonable tactics). That's 2s you're standing there not killing something. A monk with WoH gets you for 190+divine favor in 3/4s for 5e, or 300+ for 7e with boon. Explain to me what the point of healsig is again?
Tingi
Heal sig is all you need really, but I like also taking "Watch Yourself" in PvE. And then I stock up on dmg dealing skills oh yea!
Burakus Lightwing
Watch Yourself
Shields Up That is usually all I need to help the "team". After that I'm more efficient dealing damage. kanuks
When im doing pve with a team, either henchies or humans players, i almost always use the same kind of build : Watch yourself, vigorous spirit (lvl 10 healing prayers), flurry and 5 attack skills of choice. Vigorous spirit is simply awesome in pve. At 15 life every hits, with flurry on, thats around 160 life healed every 10 seconds. Thats like a big healing signet every 10 seconds, without a 2 seconds casting delay. U can keep hitting foes non stop. The monks barely have to heal you which is real good for them to heal weaker targets.
I managed to beat the mission into which u need to kill kuunavang (dont remember the name of the mission.) I took only henchies but i checked on guildwiki to see which henchies had interrupts. They did a real good job. When i started the mission, i was mad cause i saw the other team had melee henchies, so i said : "Hey man next time u try this mission, try to take ranged henchmans only please." After getting no answers i realised i was dumb and that no humans players was on the other side. So it was me with 17 henchies. They did one hell of a job. When fighting kuunavang, i just attacked him with a longbow to build adrenaline and spam watch yourself (i always tried to stay in the middle of all the henchies), healing myself with vigorous spirit. I finished the mission in 11 minutes which granted me the master bonus. Vig spirit and watch yourself is so great in team games. It really helps the monks when they dont or barely needs to heal the tank.
Evilsod
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yukito Kunisaki
Obviously your team is always always in the backline and the monk is busy doing their job and no enemy warrior EVER runs past ya... sure... I'm jealous, I wish I had perfect teammates like that all the time in PUGs...All sarcasm aside, I've noticed that in PvE, if you bring less than 2 tanking skills as a warrior, you'll die if you're in a place worth any exp or items... I don't care what team/guild you're in, you need to show me this Utopia of 'I only need ONE tanking skill to be useful to my team...' I don't see it in this game... Healing Sig takes some pressure off the monk and a Warrior still standing is still doing his job. Combining that with Dolyak and bonetti's / WY makes the -40 AL a moot point. Hence why I say 3 skills. That means 1 skill is a res sig [or if the team is very good, plague touch for me] and then 4 skills left for doing your thing, killing enemies... If you need more than half your skill bar for attack skills to kill foes, you're obviously bringing weak piddly ones that don't do the job correctly... |
Have you even played PvE recently? Bringing anymore than Watch Yourself and Shields Up! to benefit YOUR TEAM is completely pointless. 9/10 times if your backline is for some reason tanking along side your frontline... the moment you activate Protectors Defence they'll run off or be taking slightly more than just physical damage. The moment the 'tanks'/warriors have to take multiple skills to keep there team alive is the moment you lose.
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Healing Sig is a 2s skill that heals for ~100+ (assuming reasonable tactics). That's 2s you're standing there not killing something. A monk with WoH gets you for 190+divine favor in 3/4s for 5e, or 300+ for 7e with boon. Explain to me what the point of healsig is again?
For a start who the hell does Boon Heal? Its the most pointless waste of energy there is. WoH is assuming your BELOW 50% health, otherwise its an 84 (?) heal for 5e. Something which the monk could've used on something else while you could healing signet off some minor degen your suffering. Or better still you could kill your target quickly and heal then
Yukito Kunisaki
Healing Sig, Watch Yourself, and Shields Up are all you need to say... Don't need a dissertation or something to explain them...
I play PvE a LOT more than pvp and trust me, you've got a perfect team going. If the monk is never out of energy and people know how to stay in the backline, etc. Most of the people I play with are quite idiots, I wrote the thread on not needing humans already... When I play with henchies only, then I bring only 2 skills, Watch Yourself and Bonetti's Defense for tanking. For some reason, henchies know what they're doing, I'm only in a non-heal sig utopia with henchies, when I run away, so do they usually, etc... Don't assume that I don't know what I'm doing when I say bring 3 tanking skills. My team doesn't know what's going on and I need to compensate for stupidity. Am I saying I'm smarter than my braindead teammates? All I can say is 90% of the time, hell yeah everyone else is stupider than me... Bad luck in PUGs? You bet... I should rename this thread to, "what would you bring to protect teammembers in stupid PUGs" but I wasn't considering that idea...
Rera
@Evilsod: if the monk brought WoH in the first place, she's not going to use it before 50% health anyway. There's no point in healing somebody that isn't in danger of dying, especially when you have that kind of spike heal on your bar. Know why so many PUG monks run themselves out of energy in 5s? Because they're spamming Breeze and Orison on everyone that isn't at full health.
@Yukito: With henchmen you shouldn't need any defensive skills or self-heals. With PUGs I can't see needing more than one defensive skill. You keep claiming that it takes a 'perfect' group for the warrior to not need defensive skill, and that simply isn't the case. None of my guildmates use defensive warriors, and some of them PUG a lot.
Yukito Kunisaki
Everyone's got different definitions of a 'defensive' warrior.
I don't know about most of you 1337 people who have perfect teammates each and every game, but obviously, I'm the butt of the game's joke of a PUG going sour. I'm not saying everyone else's pugs are horrid, I'm saying mine are and I'm sure there's more than just me around who've got to deal with stupid humans... For me, a defensive warrior brings half or more skills on his skillbar for non-damage. >50% is a majority and in my eyes, makes you 'that' type of warrior. If you bring 50% defense and 50% offense, you're to me a balanced warrior... One who'll live a LOT longer than a warrior with absolutely no AL enhancing, stances, or healing on his skill bar. In logic, that also makes sense... 50% = 50% = balanced... Now, enough of the goofy remarks and pointless essays... If you say you only would bring 1 'tank' skill into combat and leave the rest to teammates, I'll accept that [not that I said I'd reject it to begin with, but some people really need to understand that I get more idiots for teammates than the average GW player I'm guessing, fact that my guild is rather empty due to me having a life outside this game doesn't help and I can't join guilds cause one: I like being the leader, and two: I'm not die hard... Only guilds I see want die hards and if they're not, they're probably mostly noob players. I can safely say I spend a ton of time reading up on this game than playing and for some reason, I like it that way... Now, let's get back on track here. Seems to me the ultimate general concensus here is that the best 'party affecting' skill a warrior can carry to be of any use is Watch Yourself!! That's fine. However, after a few skirmishes in Sorrow's Furnace last night, I'd like to update my listing: Watch Yourself!! Bonetti's Defense "Retreat!!" -I'll accept that Healing Signet doesn't help tanking due to your majority votes so there...- Retreat REALLY rocks for anti-wipe purposes, that's for sure...
Evilsod
Maybe so. But is Retreat REALLY worth a skillslot? It stops your party getting wiped... but there should always be someone in a position to retreat without the aid of this skill. I've brought IWAY with me on many occasions. Just because 1 person was killed doesn't mean your party is about to get wiped. The edge from IWAY can give you the edge.
Although on the other side of the debate you could always say that if your whole party gains move speed, potentially scerwing up the agro of everything nearby could also give you the edge. narud
wy and su are the only TEAM help skills worth taking.
I like running wammo, and i use a zealous sword, wy, and the best elite for a wammo in a PUG, empathic removal. empathic is evil when youre loaded on nasty hexes and conditions and so are some of your team mates. And wy gives them a nice 20 armor boost. For a w/n, ive brought well of blood and loaded on adrenaline skills, very usefull actually. w/me not much defensive team help on this secondary, but the offensive and self defense is usefull. w/r if youre running this you should be a self defense with wy i say. Or use apply poison. w/e self defense maybe one ward, ive tried the warding and wasnt very effective in my opinion. Thats covered team help very vaguely. With just using warrior skills, youve most likely, but not always, made yourself far worse then if you used your secondary to its usefullness.
ubermancer
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadow-Hunter
Echo
Arcane Echo Mending And we have a winner. xtremextreme
^^^^^ 3 mendings LOL.
For me, TEAM, would be shields up, watch yourself and charge (one of those useful skills for a quick retreat) I wouldnt usually sacrifice my elite spot for that though. DrunkenPheonix
Well it depends solely on the team you are in. If they understand that the warrior should pull the aggro on him, I would use defensive stance for sure, also watch yourself is good to spawn for a constant +20 defence boost for the whole team, to you it might not be that much of a difference, but to your teammates with the low armor rating it helps a bunch. Then there should be no warrior that doesnt use healing signet, unless you are based solely on adrenaline skills so you can use monk healing skills, wich I think, without divine attribute isnt as helpfull as healing signet.
Pls note that I have a factions-only character. I might use protector's defence when I'm blinded or battling a boss that might take some time to kill, since you can't move.
Rera
Defensive stance is a terrible choice for two reasons: 1) it's a stance, and 2) it ends when you use a skill. In order for Def stance to be effective, you literally have to stand there and do nothing except normal attacking, and that makes your warrior about as effective as a rock (or, according to Ensign, an spell-spamming elementalist, which is much the same thing).
I agree that Healing Signet is more effective than monk heals, but I do not agree that every warrior needs a healing skill. The only use I've found for Protector's Defense is against Shiro. Once you have him bodyblocked, you can use Protector's Defense to prevent being party-wiped by Impossible Odds + Battle Scars in the event that some idiot on your team used a high-damage skill while Battle Scars was active. Of course, it's entirely redundant if you have a ranger on the team.
Ulivious The Reaper
Frenzy + Heal sig o.O
/sarcasm To be honest now, i like Gladiators defense+watch yourself + on your knees!+ teinais wind easyg
My favorite tanking skills are (1) Watch Yourself (2) Endure Pain and (3) Heal Signet. I also really like Shields Up, but this is more situational.
I don't really see a problem with warriors having some defensive skills on their skill bars. I usually have 4 or 5 attack skills, maybe an IAS or Cyclone Axe, and 3 or 4 axe or sword attacks depending on the mission etc. I find that having more is kinda pointless in PVE because a frontline warrior (if played correctly) will build adrenaline very very fast, meaning even skills that take 8 strikes are recharging after only seconds. Having more than 3 or 4 adrenaline skills would be overkill. xtremextreme
Is this tanking skills that affect your team or yourself? If it is just yourself, i change my 3 skills to: Dolylak Signet (no need to move while tanking), Endure Pain (nice little boost) Defy Pain (big little boost). Feedback appreciated.
DrunkenPheonix
@ Rera
are you kidding? Defensive stance is one of the best skills available, it saved me countless times, use it when: - You are blinded = You won't be damaging anyway, so why not protect yourself? - Your opponent has a defensive stance of some sorts = Same as with blinded, you won't really do damage - You are overrun with lots of enemies, it gives the others the time to take out the mob around you and your monk will be able to keep up healing you. = Also you should know that some monks might be out of energy, when you need healing the most. - When your other skills are disables/recharging for quite a time cause of some hex = With our without the stance, you will do the same damage anyway, so I don't see the reason why not to use the stance. btw in pvp it isn't really usefull, since the warrior won't be really a tank, but more like a damage dealer.
Rera
Point-by-point rebuttal!
- If you're worried about being blinded, go /Mo for Mend Ailment or /N for Plague Touch, or heck, have your monk take it off of you (even hench monks bring condition removal). Just standing there with 75% block is useless. - If your opponent has a defensive stance, you can do one of two things: 1) Wild Blow that **** down, or 2) switch targets. - If you're 'overrun' by enemies, you're obviously not killing them fast enough because you *didn't bring enough damage*. Killing/interrupting monsters is the most effective form of damage mitigation that a warrior has. Worried about Obsidian Flame? Chain Lightning? Meteor Shower? Kill the ****er that's using it! - I can think of only a few spells that can keep a warrior's attack skills disabled, and they're encountered very infrequently. I would not waste a slot on my skillbar just to account for this case, especially since I don't need to in order to survive. Think about it another way: defensive stance (and many other defensive skills in general) is a skill you take for special situations. Now, if, in a particular mission, you really think you'll encounter that situation very often, or you absolutely must account for this situation to beat the mission, then *take your defensive skill*. But otherwise it doesn't make any sense to take a skill that's only useful 10% of the time, when you could take a skill that's useful the other 90% instead.
Yukito Kunisaki
Well said...
But thanks to this game's mechanics, surviving can be done by either living longer OR killing enemies faster... There's no right or wrong way to do it, some people have time to kill so they tank up so that though they take longer to kill said mob, it's probably the safer route and more insured than a damage dealer only warrior who'll run into walls when the enemy may have more than one competent defender... I find that if I can't kill a target outright, it's time to use them tanking skills... Don't say change target, that makes you a pve idiot, or rather, PvP winner... If target wont' die, make yourself tougher to kill as well I say... 
Evilsod
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yukito Kunisaki
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Don't say change target, that makes you a pve idiot, or rather, PvP winner...
Does Mark of Protection ring a bell? Quote:
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