Ectoplasm Obsolete?
Nevin
Black Dyes are opinion based. To me, they have no value. Simply because they're not needed? Do they make your armor statisticaly better? No.
Hand of Ruin
Supply and demand my simple little friend...
Black dyes are expensive because supply is looooooowwwwwwwwww
Ectos are expensive because demand is hiiiggghhhhhhhh, despite supply being fairly high.
Not to mention for every one set of obsidian created, 100+ ectos are removed from the game.
For every one one set of armor dyed, 5 black dyes are removed from the game.
This is why ectos are stable, and black dye is not.
Black dyes are expensive because supply is looooooowwwwwwwwww
Ectos are expensive because demand is hiiiggghhhhhhhh, despite supply being fairly high.
Not to mention for every one set of obsidian created, 100+ ectos are removed from the game.
For every one one set of armor dyed, 5 black dyes are removed from the game.
This is why ectos are stable, and black dye is not.
Fates
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Originally Posted by Nevin
Black Dyes are opinion based. To me, they have no value. Simply because they're not needed? Do they make your armor statisticaly better? No.
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Tobias Funke
Ya, but what if everyone realizes that fissure armor is f'n ugly, over priced and generally not worth the effort? What happends to ecto then?
nightwatchman
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Originally Posted by Tobias Funke
Ya, but what if everyone realizes that fissure armor is f'n ugly, over priced and generally not worth the effort? What happends to ecto then?
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Bokocasso
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Originally Posted by Tobias Funke
Ya, but what if everyone realizes that fissure armor is f'n ugly, over priced and generally not worth the effort? What happends to ecto then?
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MMSDome
i have seen black dyes go from 2k > 3.5k > 26k (economy went haywire) > 4k > 6k > its current state.
Ecto doesnt fluctuate as much as black dye, black is all over the place. Ecto remains in 1 general price range.
Neither do ectos.
Ecto doesnt fluctuate as much as black dye, black is all over the place. Ecto remains in 1 general price range.
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Originally Posted by Nevin
Black Dyes are opinion based. To me, they have no value. Simply because they're not needed? Do they make your armor statisticaly better? No.
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Tobias Funke
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Originally Posted by Bokocasso
What if everyone realised that they had personal opinion and point of view over things?
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lord_shar
Until ANET allows unlimited gold/platinum carrying capacities on both characters and the Xunlai storage, a second higher monetary-value change system will always be needed. Ecto is the most abundant rare tradable component in actual demand, so it will probably remain the exchange staple until drastic changes are made.
Priest Of Sin
Taking 120 ecto+120 shards out of circulation is a GOOD feeling, i gotta say. But as lord_shar said, nothings gonna change.
Yawgmoth
We can never be sure of the future. Now ectos are the way to go, there's no better and more stable currnecy except cash. But everythinbg can change. Everything can be nerfed or can flood the market.
*Sup Absorption runes dropped from 100k to under 1k just because of increased chance to find them among other runes. Anet has the power to do such things.
*Ectos may become obsolete if people lose interest in fow armors or it starts to drop like crazy in a new area.
*Shards may become the currency if the market gets flooded with ectos but shards supply doesn't increase.
*Black dyes were never good for trading as nobody really needs them in large quantities... and there's a quest in GWN that rewards a random dye...
*Rubies/Sapphires may still have no use in Nightfall or have very marginal use (like Monstrous Eyes in Factions) and their price will drop under 1k
*High end golds may be worth a small fraction of what they're worth now with the Inscription thing in Nightfall (make-your-own-high-end-golds-wtf?)
*Old pre-nerf items may get nerfed to hell like rockmolders making their owners lose big money...
Anet has the power to wreck the whole economy or to slightly adjust it. But i'm almost sure they won't make any update that will *increase* the value of anything. I just can't imagine them *reducing* the supply of anything that's rare and valuable now.
*Sup Absorption runes dropped from 100k to under 1k just because of increased chance to find them among other runes. Anet has the power to do such things.
*Ectos may become obsolete if people lose interest in fow armors or it starts to drop like crazy in a new area.
*Shards may become the currency if the market gets flooded with ectos but shards supply doesn't increase.
*Black dyes were never good for trading as nobody really needs them in large quantities... and there's a quest in GWN that rewards a random dye...
*Rubies/Sapphires may still have no use in Nightfall or have very marginal use (like Monstrous Eyes in Factions) and their price will drop under 1k
*High end golds may be worth a small fraction of what they're worth now with the Inscription thing in Nightfall (make-your-own-high-end-golds-wtf?)
*Old pre-nerf items may get nerfed to hell like rockmolders making their owners lose big money...
Anet has the power to wreck the whole economy or to slightly adjust it. But i'm almost sure they won't make any update that will *increase* the value of anything. I just can't imagine them *reducing* the supply of anything that's rare and valuable now.
LagunaCid
What about USING that money and moving GW economy? I personally think ecto storage is ridicoulous.
lacasner
Ehh, I guess ArenaNet could solve this problem once and for all and just make an unlimited storage amount and trade amount of cash, but for some strange reason they are not doing it. Ok now, I don't want to shift away from the point of this post, but this next topic I am going to introduce has to do with it.
Why doesn't ArenaNet allow us to reimburse our investment and return our armor for what we payed for it. ( x amount of materiels and cash). After all, it is customized so we can't trade it, so why don't they change this fact. I would think it is useful, as my 15k glads are no longer worn after I got FoW, and I would think it would be fair to get the cash back. Just a thought, any opinions?
Why doesn't ArenaNet allow us to reimburse our investment and return our armor for what we payed for it. ( x amount of materiels and cash). After all, it is customized so we can't trade it, so why don't they change this fact. I would think it is useful, as my 15k glads are no longer worn after I got FoW, and I would think it would be fair to get the cash back. Just a thought, any opinions?
Jas D
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Originally Posted by Nevin
Black Dyes are opinion based. To me, they have no value. Simply because they're not needed? Do they make your armor statisticaly better? No.
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Moist Muffin
I save both. I would rather get a black dye drop than an ecto any day. We just get way more ecto's than dye. I always have them in my storage or on my mule. I like to mix black with other dyes for all my armor or go with plain black (I like the look the best). So black dye are more valuable to me than ecto's. I never have a hard time selling black dye or buying them. Its just never more than 5 at a time unlike ecto's. Plus the price is way more steady for dye. I will always buy a dye for 8k, never will I need to buy an ecto!
Ozric
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Originally Posted by lacasner
Why doesn't ArenaNet allow us to reimburse our investment and return our armor for what we payed for it. ( x amount of materiels and cash). After all, it is customized so we can't trade it, so why don't they change this fact. I would think it is useful, as my 15k glads are no longer worn after I got FoW, and I would think it would be fair to get the cash back. Just a thought, any opinions?
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But back on topic. I don't think anyone was really suggesting to replace ecto wholesale for black dye. 100k+ x black dye just wouldn't work. It's just a practical alternative to stacking more and more ecto after you have filled your ecto material storage slot. Why not? Black dye's price is more stable, and you can sink more gold into a single black dye, potentially saving some storage space. Think of it as popping some of your gold away in an IRA, waiting for the day a new armor comes around.
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Originally Posted by Yawgmoth
... and there's a quest in GWN that rewards a random dye...
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Aegeroth
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Originally Posted by Griff Mon
Great, Socialism comes to GW, next we'll open a welfare office in Lion's Arch for poor players.
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Tobias Funke
I personally think the game economy is too stable and therefore boring. I think introducing random events to stir things up would be a fun added dimension to the game. In real life the money you invest is a risk. I'd like to see guild wars do the same thing. I'd like to hear about a forrest fire in Maguuma that drives the price of wood sky high or about a new coal mine in the Shiver Peaks that causes coal to plummet in value. ANet could have various existing NPC's say dialogue that hints at changes in crafting material supply and demand.
Over a stable game economy allows people to hord their gold and show their e-johnsons with expensive stuff, but I thinks its boring. I say stir things up.
Over a stable game economy allows people to hord their gold and show their e-johnsons with expensive stuff, but I thinks its boring. I say stir things up.
manitoba1073
well with things going who knows FoW may become free also
The Herbalizer
Ectos can be bought in bulk easier than black dye.
I can go to toa and buy say 200 ectos with relative ease as people farm uw and sell in bulk. Black dye cannot be farmed so you would have to buy them one at a time which take forever.
There are lots of people wanting fow armor so there is plenty of demand for ectos in bulk when selling. Black dye is rarely bought or sold in bulk and people usually only require 4/5 for their armor.
Lol. Wouldnt suprise me by chapter 4 anet remove gold and just offer everything for free at a npc in ascalon.
I can go to toa and buy say 200 ectos with relative ease as people farm uw and sell in bulk. Black dye cannot be farmed so you would have to buy them one at a time which take forever.
There are lots of people wanting fow armor so there is plenty of demand for ectos in bulk when selling. Black dye is rarely bought or sold in bulk and people usually only require 4/5 for their armor.
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Originally Posted by manitoba1073
well with things going who knows FoW may become free also
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Cottage Pie
the same reason why rubies and saphires will not replace ecto (and also juggling the value of two items would be unbearable, people would be forever trying to slight one to make more on the other), there's simply not enough of them. Black dyes are hellishly rare compared to ecto, i'd rate them at at-least 200k to the ectos 7k in rarity (not trade value). if the weapons market crashed (what's this inscriptions thing i am hearing about?!) then yes, there would be SO many useless ectos out there that thier value would plummet to almost nothing regardless of them having a use for armour.
beta man
personally i prefers to keep black dye to solve the problem of having more than 1 million plat. that is just me though.
Haggard
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Originally Posted by Sooty
I think ecto is far more practical than black dye, however I wonder if the appeal of fissure armor is still as great as it was before factions? I realise this is in the eye of the beholder but to me the 15k sets in factions are almost universally more attractive than a fissure set for that class. There will always be those who buy it for status reasons but if less people in general are tempted by fissure armor will this drive ecto value down?
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) than in 15k glads like every other third-rate wammo.
jamal555
Well u are all wrong a little bit, but it was fun to read... as no1 of my senior partners in crime (ppl with lots of cash that play a long time) wont to reply to this i have to...
As every other big trader knows Ecto values arent based on supply and demand but are artificialy maintained by anet... u might remember the days when the market was limited and merchants had just a certain amount of something... u could "in theory"
buy off everything and dump it on the market for a far greater price... remember the ectos being 20k... i do...
not a coincidence... and not supply and demand... 3-4 ppl "could have" put together their milions and wreck the economy of gw in under 2 hours earning 10-15 mil in process... and anet couldnt do anything about it coz its their design flaw... then came the "new" trader sistem with unlimited trader stock and " supply and demand" bull....
Did some1 noticed how everyone had fow armor now... 3-5-8 armors... well in the old days of economy u couldnt drop off 150 ectos at merchant and not drop the price for 2-3k... now... u can drop it 1000 ectos at trader and it will stay 7.5k.... artificial prices... ectos drop less then ever and prices are still low...
So to summarise...
ALL TRADER PRICES ARE ARTIFICIAL... ANET IS DOING IT BY HAND... U CANT REALLY PREDICT A MARKET ANY MORE COZ THERE IS NO MARKET ITS ALL CONTROLLED...
PS if its really supply and demand why is it only 500 or 1000gp difference... i never saw 1-2-10gp difference... as it should be in real market...
As every other big trader knows Ecto values arent based on supply and demand but are artificialy maintained by anet... u might remember the days when the market was limited and merchants had just a certain amount of something... u could "in theory"
buy off everything and dump it on the market for a far greater price... remember the ectos being 20k... i do...not a coincidence... and not supply and demand... 3-4 ppl "could have" put together their milions and wreck the economy of gw in under 2 hours earning 10-15 mil in process... and anet couldnt do anything about it coz its their design flaw... then came the "new" trader sistem with unlimited trader stock and " supply and demand" bull....
Did some1 noticed how everyone had fow armor now... 3-5-8 armors... well in the old days of economy u couldnt drop off 150 ectos at merchant and not drop the price for 2-3k... now... u can drop it 1000 ectos at trader and it will stay 7.5k.... artificial prices... ectos drop less then ever and prices are still low...
So to summarise...
ALL TRADER PRICES ARE ARTIFICIAL... ANET IS DOING IT BY HAND... U CANT REALLY PREDICT A MARKET ANY MORE COZ THERE IS NO MARKET ITS ALL CONTROLLED...
PS if its really supply and demand why is it only 500 or 1000gp difference... i never saw 1-2-10gp difference... as it should be in real market...
Yawgmoth
jamal555 you're completely wrong.
Trader system is still supply-demand based AND the trader can still be bought out of certain materials (see : tanned hide squares during the first day of GWN preview)
The prices of ecto at trader are very stable because very he has very large quantities of them in store and it stabilized through many months. Try buying more rare materials from him, for example monstrous claws where for every ~~50-70 you buy, the price will increase a little. The more expensive the matarial is, the more stable the price.
Trader system is still supply-demand based AND the trader can still be bought out of certain materials (see : tanned hide squares during the first day of GWN preview)
The prices of ecto at trader are very stable because very he has very large quantities of them in store and it stabilized through many months. Try buying more rare materials from him, for example monstrous claws where for every ~~50-70 you buy, the price will increase a little. The more expensive the matarial is, the more stable the price.
KamikazeChicken
Look up price ceilings and supply-demand curves. That'll tell you everything you'll care to know about the relationship ectoplasm has in the GW "economy," and you should be able to predict what will eventually happen to it in the long run.
Sir Skullcrasher
Here the idea as long as there is new character classes. There would be a demand for ectos and shards. But do you think ectos might one day jump back to it's 15k to 20k price range?
valtonray
because the ecto market is down right now, and black dyes are up thats it. it did the same thing shortly before factions was released(ecto price dropping) because people are saving up for new armor and items that'll be avaible with the expansion. so i say hold your ecto's and sell your dye.
Ismoke
welcome to the world global market!!! WTS 700ectos!(sarcasm)Maybe
lollololo
lollololo