Sure you can weapon swap, but can you really be bothered to do that in pve? I mean, swapping for +15 en gear after each time you hit with it?
You could do that in pvp, and you need to if you're going to stance dance, but there's only really so many people you need to kill in pvp. In pve, are you going to do this while you mow down mob after mob? Cause there's a lot of them. Well, sort of mow down since you really only output one attack every now and then in between your normal hits. May be cool to do this at first, but it'd get annoying real quick. Or maybe I'm just lazy...
Sword or Axe?
kazjun
LightningHell
Quote:
Originally Posted by kazjun
Sure you can weapon swap, but can you really be bothered to do that in pve? I mean, swapping for +15 en gear after each time you hit with it?
You could do that in pvp, and you need to if you're going to stance dance, but there's only really so many people you need to kill in pvp. In pve, are you going to do this while you mow down mob after mob? Cause there's a lot of them. Well, sort of mow down since you really only output one attack every now and then in between your normal hits. May be cool to do this at first, but it'd get annoying real quick. Or maybe I'm just lazy... Well, it's reflex to me when I play anything and have something that empties my Energy pool...actually, I hide my energy whenever possible by habit.
You could do that in pvp, and you need to if you're going to stance dance, but there's only really so many people you need to kill in pvp. In pve, are you going to do this while you mow down mob after mob? Cause there's a lot of them. Well, sort of mow down since you really only output one attack every now and then in between your normal hits. May be cool to do this at first, but it'd get annoying real quick. Or maybe I'm just lazy... Well, it's reflex to me when I play anything and have something that empties my Energy pool...actually, I hide my energy whenever possible by habit.
Franco
Is any sword skill better then axe besides sever artery ??
I say axe is better...flame away
I say axe is better...flame away
LightningHell
Quote:
Originally Posted by Franco
Is any sword skill better then axe besides sever artery ??
I say axe is better...flame away Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust
And of course the ability to use an Utility elite.
I say axe is better...flame away Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust Final Thrust
And of course the ability to use an Utility elite.
I Brother Bloood I
http://guildwarsguru.com/forum/showt...php?t=10053997
I did a little thread on swords + utility elites in that topic. Charging Strike->Bulls Strike->Chargins Strike->Final Thrust = GG
EDIT - Nightfall utilities that is.
I did a little thread on swords + utility elites in that topic. Charging Strike->Bulls Strike->Chargins Strike->Final Thrust = GG
EDIT - Nightfall utilities that is.
Franco
IWAY IWAY IWAY IWAY IWAY IWAY EVISCERATE IWAY IWAY IWAY IWAY IWAY IWAY EXECUTIONER STRIKE IWAY IWAY IWAY IWAY REZIGN REZIGN REZIGN
LOL sorry I couldnt resist .
LOL sorry I couldnt resist .
jesh
Quote:
Originally Posted by kazjun
The only time I use a +15 -1 weapon is if it's an emergency and can save my team. Switch after.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Zui
This is PvE. There is no weapon swapping in PvE, no matter how much sense it makes. Autoattack and/or spam keys 1-8 FTW.
That was so funny it made me laugh in a public place. Sadly, I think it's true for most people, and it's also why the pvp crowd tends to look down on whoever plays pve.. I mean they *must* be stupid, right? Why swap weapons when you're getting energy surged, if you can just yell at the monk to heal? *sigh*
The Real Roy Keane
Why did I look at this thread again? My head hurts now.
LightningHell
Quote:
Originally Posted by Franco
IWAY IWAY IWAY IWAY IWAY IWAY EVISCERATE IWAY IWAY IWAY IWAY IWAY IWAY EXECUTIONER STRIKE IWAY IWAY IWAY IWAY REZIGN REZIGN REZIGN
LOL sorry I couldnt resist . Eviscerate is an Elite...I can bring something else as an Elite as a Sword? Empathic, or Expel, or...well... But Evis is great if you want to have a damage Elite. Focus swapping: Set one: Positive energy set. Set two: Normal energy set. Set three: Negative energy set. Usually on: Negative energy set. Casting: Negative or Normal. Emergencies: Positive energy set.
The Real Roy Keane
Quote:
Originally Posted by LightningHell
Having two sets of weapons and swapping to each when different situations occur.
That sounds like caster weapon swapping to me.. a Warrior weapon set generally consists of a Vampiric, Zealous and Elemental Weapon, with a bow or wand for long ranged adrenaline building.
LightningHell
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Real Roy Keane
That sounds like caster weapon swapping to me.. a Warrior weapon set generally consists of a Vampiric, Zealous and Elemental Weapon, with a bow or wand for long ranged adrenaline building.
I * am * a caster, but I generally carry over some characteristics of being a caster when I'm a warrior. Stupid, I know, but helps somewhat when I (for some reason) get edeny'd, need to use Purge Sig, or need to Rebirth after wipe in PvE.
Set 1: Vampiric, 15>50 Set 2: Zealous, 15>50 Set 3: Elemental, 15>50 Set 4: Vampiric, -5e Inventory: Zealous, -5e Elemental, -5e Vampiric, +5e Zealous, +5e Elemental, +5e Of course, whether you have time enough to get to the sets in the inventory is another thing...though I generally figure out which sets I need to use after a minute or two, but then sometimes I don't get the time to change the weapon sets, even. Try to die in the negative energy set. kazjun
Maybe you run things different, but I'd start with neg energy gear, like a +15% -5 en weapon and maybe a neg en focus. You hit destructive, lose all en and then swap to a normal en or +en like the +15 en gear. But thats cause I run frenzy, after I hit the spike I need to be able to sprint or I'd die.
Can you imagine if the other team knows you have no en and are stuck in frenzy? One pip of en regen means nothing to me, I need the quicker en boost. Being stuck in frenzy while waiting for natural regen, you'd be dead before you got 5 en... But if you're in pve you probably wouldn't have to worry about that in pve, since you really shouldn't be running frenzy in pve too much. You could also just use a +12 en focus as well and still have 2 pips regen 
LightningHell
Quote:
Originally Posted by kazjun
Maybe you run things different, but I'd start with neg energy gear, like a +15% -5 en weapon and maybe a neg en focus. You hit destructive, lose all en and then swap to a normal en or +en like the +15 en gear. But thats cause I run frenzy, after I hit the spike I need to be able to sprint or I'd die.
Can you imagine if the other team knows you have no en and are stuck in frenzy? One pip of en regen means nothing to me, I need the quicker en boost. Being stuck in frenzy while waiting for natural regen, you'd be dead before you got 5 en... But if you're in pve you probably wouldn't have to worry about that in pve, since you really shouldn't be running frenzy in pve too much. You could also just use a +12 en focus as well and still have 2 pips regen
Exactly.
Nexus Icon
In general, it depends on what you're doing.
People seem to forget that a lot of PvE mobs aren't fleshy, and so don't bleed. That means that you have no way of applying a deep wound to these mobs with purely sword skills, so axe is better when facing these types. In other words, know your missions and the mobs therein, then pick a weapon based on that knowledge.
Katari
Yup, when I know most of the foes can be knocked down, I go hammer, if enough can't be knocked down, but can still bleed, I go with sword, if not that, then axe it is.
Beomagi
using the critical hit table from
http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Critical_hit at level 9 crit% = 13% (using approximated linear progression) axe - 6-28 average = (28+6)/2 * 0.87 + 28*0.13 = 18.43 dph sword - 15-22 average = (15+22)/2 * 0.87 + 22*0.13 = 18.96 dph aweful close for just level 9! level 12 crit% = 17% axe - 6-28 average = (28+6)/2 * 0.83 + 28*0.17 = 18.87 dph sword - 15-22 average = (15+22)/2 * 0.83 + 22*0.17 = 19.01 dph level 16 crit% = 22.3% axe - 6-28 average = (28+6)/2 * 0.777 + 28*0.223 = 19.45 dph sword - 15-22 average = (15+22)/2 * 0.777 + 22*0.223 = 19.28 dph Now if your skills employ crit attacks - perhaps you're doing an a/w axe weilding phycho, at 16 crit strikes, with 12 axe, and +7% more from (what's the skill name?!?) you'll have a 40% chance to crit - at which point it would make a big enough difference and look like this : axe - 6-28 average = (28+6)/2 * 0.6 + 28*0.4 = 21.4 dph sword - 15-22 average = (15+22)/2 * 0.6 + 22*0.4 = 19.9 dph of course, the difference is multiplied by armor, and what seems like a small difference can be increased when absorb comes into play. e.g. difference between 18 and 20 damage is 10% less than the major, but against 100 armor with 5 absorb, that's 4 and 5 damage - 20% (and still weak  )
cR4zY-n^
Chaos axe - best looking axe
Fellblade - best looking sword Overall I am axe fan, but starting to play with sword and I REALLY like it, and fellblade is just very very nice looking.
Darkpower Alchemist
Maybe I'm not getting the point of this thread? Are you looking to be pretty or to be an effective warrior?
If its the later, you can use either to great effect, but axe is for spike damage, and sword offers more steady damage. If you want a damage build with sword, I can call some skills for you, but the swordsmanship must be 16 and strength minimum of 10. Standing slash+silverwing slash+sun and moon slash+ Dragonslash= major sword damage. But thats not a bar I would use in PvP, by any means, since it has no real defense. Sun and Moon Slash, by far, is one of the premier sword skills, but elites make a swordsman, as does his defense, so study up.
LightningHell
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkpower Alchemist
Maybe I'm not getting the point of this thread? Are you looking to be pretty or to be an effective warrior?
If its the later, you can use either to great effect, but axe is for spike damage, and sword offers more steady damage. If you want a damage build with sword, I can call some skills for you, but the swordsmanship must be 16 and strength minimum of 10. Standing slash+silverwing slash+sun and moon slash+ Dragonslash= major sword damage. But thats not a bar I would use in PvP, by any means, since it has no real defense. Sun and Moon Slash, by far, is one of the premier sword skills, but elites make a swordsman, as does his defense, so study up. Axes, as already said (I think), have a higher DPS when criticals are factored in. A Sword warrior does not need his Elite. Usually it is used for utility purposes.
Age
Sword is now the more popular weapon as to the runes sales.I would gather it is from Dragon Slash a worthy elite anyway Eviscrate is getting harder to get being an Prophecies only skill and being all the way in Hells Precipice.It seems that sword is it for now as axes were in Prophecies.
LightningHell
Quote:
Originally Posted by Age
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Isn't Eviscerate also in Sorrow's Furnace?
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Standing slash+silverwing slash+sun and moon slash+ Dragonslash= major sword damage. But thats not a bar I would use in PvP, by any means, since it has no real defense. Switch Standing and Silverwing for Sever and Gash and you have a standard Dragon Slasher. I hear it is sometimes used with FGJ, though this needs to be confirmed - it seemed to be some time ago. It IS usable in PvP, it's just more vulernable to adrenaline-burning stuff like Blackout. You don't really need a lot of defense in PvP as a Warrior...Healing Signet and Sprint/Rush/Dash to cover Frenzy is enough? kazjun
If you're talking pve, then swords are king, with riposte and d.riposte sword only you farm melee. Dragonslash also puts out DPS far superior to just about anything. Doesn't really work nearly as well in pvp since people tend NOT to stand there and try to tank you like the pve mobs will. Also, constant damage really isn't to tough to handle for a good monk, so you want to have spike damage to take people down before they get healed, thus axes.
LightningHell
Quote:
Originally Posted by kazjun
If you're talking pve, then swords are king, with riposte and d.riposte sword only you farm melee. Dragonslash also puts out DPS far superior to just about anything. Doesn't really work nearly as well in pvp since people tend NOT to stand there and try to tank you like the pve mobs will. Also, constant damage really isn't to tough to handle for a good monk, so you want to have spike damage to take people down before they get healed, thus axes.
I know that the mechanics of the game favor spikes. A Dragon Slash warrior having a slower chain is a problem. However, I remember vaguely someone using Dragon Slash in GvG...I think it was NUKE, but I'm nowhere near sure. While warrior spikes are scary, pressure can force kills too. If there is enough of it. One Dragon Slasher isn't going to do crap. Kiting is a problem, but then kiting is a problem for all physicals and all characters who use projectiles.
Also, I was merely refuting the argument that Dragon Slashers cannot carry their weight as Warriors in PvP. I'd still bring a Charge Sword anyday. There is also the argument about application of Deep Wound in spiking, where Axe wins by far with Eviscerate. Hammers need a knockdown + Crushing, Swords need Sever + Gash. It is my personal preference, however, to favor Axe + Sword or Axe + Hammer than 2 Axes while designing dual spiking warriors, though. Final Thrust is good, and so is Backbreaker.
jesh
From my experience playing, hammer can lay the deep wound fastest, not axe. I mean seriously.. shock+crushing. Hey, you're done! Look at that.
I don't know if you would do anything like this in pvp, but I do it all the time. I guess if you're getting mobbed, a quick To The Limit! can land you a dismember, but imo this is much more conditional than a KD.
LightningHell
Quote:
Originally Posted by jesh
From my experience playing, hammer can lay the deep wound fastest, not axe. I mean seriously.. shock+crushing. Hey, you're done! Look at that.
I don't know if you would do anything like this in pvp, but I do it all the time. I guess if you're getting mobbed, a quick To The Limit! can land you a dismember, but imo this is much more conditional than a KD. "Fastest" meaning "in least time starting from start of spike", of which Eviscerate or Dismember under Frenzy would be winner. Also, Deep Wound does not kill the target. If the target would be at negative health, the character's health would be at 1. You would need an extra attack to kill...of course, there's always Protector's Strike.
Age
Quote:
Originally Posted by LightingHell
Isn't Eviscerate also in Sorrow's Furnace?
Dragon Slashers are absolute killing machines. By the way, I did forget to reply to this. It seems it is in Sorrows Furnace but even that is hard to get at if want to get ran there but Dragon Slash is very easy to cap in Factions.I use mine in variouse ways.
Rera
The speed at which you can deliver a deep wound from neutral (ie. 0 adrenalin, full energy, etc.) isn't really important. The only purpose of DW is 'virtual' damage during a spike. A DW on its own at any other time is just going to be removed.
More guilds are experimenting with DS warriors in pressure builds for their superior DPS. Their primary weakness is their reliance on DS itself as an adrenalin engine. Anything from a Blackout to just having DS miss will severely lower the DPS of the warrior. Also, they don't have the spiking power of axe or hammer warriors. In PvE, a DS warrior puts out more DPS than any other warrior build I can think of, with the possible exception of Enraged Smash builds. kazjun
Yeah, thats a big problem with the dragonslash builds in pvp. For great justice only lasts for so long, and if they spend a lot of that time kiting, evading, blocking, or blinding and knocking you down, then the biggest reason you'd take dragonslash is gone. Without chaining, it's really just an expensive galrath that gives some adren back. Also, sever+gash isn't that scary unless you can keep reapplying either.
In pve, yeah its the DPS king. Mobs who bunch close together and are too stupid to run FTW
LightningHell
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rera
More guilds are experimenting with DS warriors in pressure builds for their superior DPS. Their primary weakness is their reliance on DS itself as an adrenalin engine. Anything from a Blackout to just having DS miss will severely lower the DPS of the warrior. Also, they don't have the spiking power of axe or hammer warriors. In PvE, a DS warrior puts out more DPS than any other warrior build I can think of, with the possible exception of Enraged Smash builds. |
Thank you. I can never explain anything.
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Yeah, thats a big problem with the dragonslash builds in pvp. For great justice only lasts for so long, and if they spend a lot of that time kiting, evading, blocking, or blinding and knocking you down, then the biggest reason you'd take dragonslash is gone. Without chaining, it's really just an expensive galrath that gives some adren back. Also, sever+gash isn't that scary unless you can keep reapplying either. In pve, yeah its the DPS king. Mobs who bunch close together and are too stupid to run FTW Sever-Gash isn't scary unless you are attempting a spike.
jesh
Quote:
Originally Posted by LightningHell
Also, Deep Wound does not kill the target. If the target would be at negative health, the character's health would be at 1. You would need an extra attack to kill...of course, there's always Protector's Strike.
Cmon, even I know that. =P
I usually cast shock+crushing on one target, switch to a diff target and then unload the full chain of attacks, repeat... The first target still dies 20% faster, and it's not like I wasted much on em. (enemy condition removal in pve? naah =P) I guess I get what you mean.. though really, Devastating Hammer+Crushing isn't much slower. EDIT: Sever->Gash is scary at all? I always thought the bleeding was a dead give away. The damage that Gash adds is also tiny..
SnipiousMax
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rera
In PvE, a DS warrior puts out more DPS than any other warrior build I can think of, with the possible exception of Enraged Smash builds.
They're very close in DPS.
Spydergst1
Both! I have found that both are needed. I play with a sword but I have found there are times I need an axe instead (like for rotscale).
When you can't use energy or can't regen energy then an axe is better because the skill for axe are mostly adr.
SnipiousMax
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spydergst1
When you can't use energy or can't regen energy then an axe is better because the skill for axe are mostly adr.
Ahh... Dragonslash? Spydergst1
Quote:
Originally Posted by SnipiousMax
Ahh... Dragonslash?
See! just when you think you have good advice someone points out a skill I can't get because I don't have Factions. Now I gotta go buy it and not just so I can have the skills but so I can give good advice. I was hoping to not buy until I got at least 3 max titles on Prophecies.
Issac
Swords all the way lol
LightningHell
Quote:
Originally Posted by jesh
Cmon, even I know that. =P
I usually cast shock+crushing on one target, switch to a diff target and then unload the full chain of attacks, repeat... The first target still dies 20% faster, and it's not like I wasted much on em. (enemy condition removal in pve? naah =P) I guess I get what you mean.. though really, Devastating Hammer+Crushing isn't much slower. EDIT: Sever->Gash is scary at all? I always thought the bleeding was a dead give away. The damage that Gash adds is also tiny.. I don't think Sever-Gash is ever scary, but Final Thrust afterwards is scary. No, the time taken is nowhere near. Evis under Frenzy takes .88 (recurring) seconds, while Crushing under frenzy, even with Shock, takes 1.9166 (recurring 6) seconds.
the doomgiver
Quote:
Originally Posted by A Leprechaun
triple chop rocks in pve and its easy to cap
i think triple chop is probaly the best axe skill. i use it with my axe warrior it does decent damage and is a good start attack i use it with wings axe where i got triple chop from^^. wings axe is a good axe, and you can buy it for 10k or go and farm it from wing three blades.
jesh
Quote:
Originally Posted by LightningHell
I don't think Sever-Gash is ever scary, but Final Thrust afterwards is scary.
No, the time taken is nowhere near. Evis under Frenzy takes .88 (recurring) seconds, while Crushing under frenzy, even with Shock, takes 1.9166 (recurring 6) seconds. That's not fair. Include Shock before Eviscerate and you see what I mean. =P Both warriors are going to do it, so why count the conditional difference? That's all I meant. Of course the target still has to take damage afterwards for the deep wound to register.. which makes the spike even longer.
LightningHell
Quote:
Originally Posted by jesh
That's not fair. Include Shock before Eviscerate and you see what I mean. =P
Both warriors are going to do it, so why count the conditional difference? That's all I meant. Of course the target still has to take damage afterwards for the deep wound to register.. which makes the spike even longer. But Evis-Exec DOES take shorter time than Shock-Crushing-Whatever attack skill/attack. And it does the job.
Yukito Kunisaki
Though Eviscerate is Proph. only, I still see Axe as being useful despite the odds...
Now that Dismember = Pen. Blow/Chop in A. cost, slamming someone with a deepwound combo is easier [though less damaging than Eviscerate, by 29 points or so] Furious Strike got a nice beef up. Which was smart, wtf have an adrenaline skill that punishes stancing? IT'S TOTALLY COUNTERPRODUCTIVE... Good move Anet... In VERY rare PvE occasions, I see myself bringing Dismember more often to combo up with Triple Chop {E} as my elite. But if you want to save skill slots, Eviscerate {E} is still the absolute best warrior weapon elite I've seen to date. I think for the other weapons to be more appealing [at least to me], is to make a hammer and sword variant of Eviscerate. wtb?! Well, devastating hammer is a KD + Staggering blow in one [without the lose all adrenaline bs]. Why not make a super hammer elite by using the same combo, but instead of weakness [pointless vs. your real targets: casters] provide a hit that does KD + Deep Wound? Sword could have an elite that sounds just disgusting: Disembowel. Have it do Final thrust style damage [YOWCH] with Deep Wound on top. How about THAT for an elite? Adrenaline cost can be adjusted accordingly for each weapon as to balance them. [If all 3 elites existed at 8a. Eviscerate would sadly be the 'weakest' of the bunch. They'd have to make it +50 damage or lower the cost ^_^ imo.] |
