I run this a lot GvG and it works very well.
Fast Casting (11+1)
Domination (10+4)
Inspiration (10+1)
Healing Prayers (1)
Mantra of Recovery (e)
Diversion
Shame
Energy Burn/Shatter Enchantment
Energy Tap
Drain Enchantment
Remove Hex/Convert Hexes
Resurrection Chant
This build has amazing neverending shutdown, and has utility use as well. I realize that it lacks distortion, but Savant's Armor and an axe with +5 defense help make up. Energy Tap isn't for energy denial but for keeping the monk pain rolling. As of now, I'm not entirely sure whether to bring energy burn for guarenteed pressure and damage, or shatter enchantment, which requires an enchantments to be effective (especially at 13 second recharge).
Btw, I don't want to hear that MoR is lame and I should use expel, surge, etc. I really like it when I'm not running expel.
Comments? Suggestions?
EDIT: And what's this about using GoR instead of MoR? I cannot fathom how 15 second recharge on one spell > 15 or less recharge on ALL your spells...besides being able to use distortion...
Mantra of Recovery Shutdown
Cherng Butter
lightblade
"amazing neverending shutdown"
Indeed...just seem to me your build demands a lot of energy...how you going to keep up with it?
Suggestions:
- Replace Shame with Power Drain for energy
- Push Inspiration to 13, Energy Tap goes to 7 at 13
- Remove Hex replace with Inspired Hex for energy
- Energy Burn replace with Ether Lord for energy.
Indeed...just seem to me your build demands a lot of energy...how you going to keep up with it?
Suggestions:
- Replace Shame with Power Drain for energy
- Push Inspiration to 13, Energy Tap goes to 7 at 13
- Remove Hex replace with Inspired Hex for energy
- Energy Burn replace with Ether Lord for energy.
Hella Good
Looks fine. But I'm not a big fan of Tap in GvG. Not sure what to suggest instead, maybe PDrain or Leech Sig. *shrug* Blackout is a consideration as well. Maybe instead of Shame. Diversion is more than enough if you plan on MoR-ing it. Remove Hex is fine, it's good on a high FC Me, and only costs like nrg. Under MoR it's superb. So I'd stick with that. Shatter Chant hurts if fast recharged but it's too nrg intensive, think Burn is better. Drain Chant is good enough chant/nrg management. So basically what I'm suggesting is:
1- MoR
2- Diversion
3- Burn
4- Blackout
5- Leech Sig
6- Drain Chant
7- Remove Hex
8- Res
1- MoR
2- Diversion
3- Burn
4- Blackout
5- Leech Sig
6- Drain Chant
7- Remove Hex
8- Res
Phoenix Arrows
I would drop E Tap for Shatter/Burn, but you are pretty heavy on energy. Perhaps something like PDrain.
LightningHell
Blackout blackout blackout blackout blackout blackout...
Other than that, looks all right.
Other than that, looks all right.
Dragannia
You'd want to be casting all the time, so I'd stay away from Blackout in this case. I personally dislike Blackout on players who have Expel or Remove Hex, or Draw Conditions, because you might miss hexes when the enemy is spiking or fail to save a Monk by Drawing off Deep Wound.
The problem here is energy. If you have another Mesmer on your team, you can drop Shatter Enchantment to give the other Mesmer it. However, if you're the only Mesmer, you have a bit of a problem as Shatter Enchantment is extremely useful in spikes. I'd personally drop Tap for Power Drain; at the hands of a capable player it can potentially take care of most of your energy problems. A Drain Enchantment and a Power Drain every 12.5 seconds should be plenty.
The problem here is energy. If you have another Mesmer on your team, you can drop Shatter Enchantment to give the other Mesmer it. However, if you're the only Mesmer, you have a bit of a problem as Shatter Enchantment is extremely useful in spikes. I'd personally drop Tap for Power Drain; at the hands of a capable player it can potentially take care of most of your energy problems. A Drain Enchantment and a Power Drain every 12.5 seconds should be plenty.
LightningHell
Well, since you already mentioned energy, I decided to go on a different tone.
Blackout should be sparingly used in this strategy, such as on a spike to BO a monk, or disrupting a adrenospike by BO'ing the warrior; such critical situations call for such measures. I'd prefer Gale, but you're Me/Mo.
Blackout should be sparingly used in this strategy, such as on a spike to BO a monk, or disrupting a adrenospike by BO'ing the warrior; such critical situations call for such measures. I'd prefer Gale, but you're Me/Mo.
Valkyries
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cherng Butter
EDIT: And what's this about using GoR instead of MoR? I cannot fathom how 15 second recharge on one spell > 15 or less recharge on ALL your spells...besides being able to use distortion...
Well... you are really comparing two separate things.
First off... GoR doesn't half recharge your skill. It completely recharges it. So meaning you can cast two Shatter Enchants in a row if you want. Or two Cry of Frustration. The point of Glyph is you don't have to wait for ANY recharge and if played correctly you can always have your skills open for when you need them, because Glyph has a very fast recharge time (only 15 seconds). Also its VERY cheap to cast at 5E.
MoR does indeed work on all your skills, but its only half recharge. So you STILL have to wait 15 seconds for that power Drain to recharge (minus the 0 seconds you want for GoR). So thats a huge difference...
Personally, I LOVE GoR and I'd never use MoR because I prefer my skills to be ready then and there, especially in a fast paced environment such as PvP. However, I really think its very much personal choice. Both are exceptionally good but you can't compare the two. Apples to Oranges.
First off... GoR doesn't half recharge your skill. It completely recharges it. So meaning you can cast two Shatter Enchants in a row if you want. Or two Cry of Frustration. The point of Glyph is you don't have to wait for ANY recharge and if played correctly you can always have your skills open for when you need them, because Glyph has a very fast recharge time (only 15 seconds). Also its VERY cheap to cast at 5E.
MoR does indeed work on all your skills, but its only half recharge. So you STILL have to wait 15 seconds for that power Drain to recharge (minus the 0 seconds you want for GoR). So thats a huge difference...
Personally, I LOVE GoR and I'd never use MoR because I prefer my skills to be ready then and there, especially in a fast paced environment such as PvP. However, I really think its very much personal choice. Both are exceptionally good but you can't compare the two. Apples to Oranges.
fatboyslimerr
Dragannia is right. The whole point of a MoRecovery mesmer is to be able to throw spells of fast and continously. If your wasting 5 seconds using BO, thats 5 seconds in which you could cast 2-3 spells. BO really doesn't fit a MoR mesmer imo. I would run something like
1. MoR {E}
2. P-Drain
3. P-Leak or CoF
4. Diversion
5. E-Burn
6. Shatter Enchantment
7. Drain Enchantment
8. Resurrection Chant
Really, if you can land p-drain every 12.5 seconds you'll have more than enough energy to continue your spamming. Save shatter for spikes or when you want to dual remove boon or something. Save CoF (if you take it over p-leak which I personally wouldn't) for when it can have the most affect.
Then just spam e-burn, diversion, p-leak etc. If your build lacks support but not damage, there's always the option to replace shatter enchant with remove hex or draw condition.
1. MoR {E}
2. P-Drain
3. P-Leak or CoF
4. Diversion
5. E-Burn
6. Shatter Enchantment
7. Drain Enchantment
8. Resurrection Chant
Really, if you can land p-drain every 12.5 seconds you'll have more than enough energy to continue your spamming. Save shatter for spikes or when you want to dual remove boon or something. Save CoF (if you take it over p-leak which I personally wouldn't) for when it can have the most affect.
Then just spam e-burn, diversion, p-leak etc. If your build lacks support but not damage, there's always the option to replace shatter enchant with remove hex or draw condition.
Scourgey
Quote:
Originally Posted by Valkyries
Personally, I LOVE GoR and I'd never use MoR because I prefer my skills to be ready then and there, especially in a fast paced environment such as PvP. However, I really think its very much personal choice. Both are exceptionally good but you can't compare the two. Apples to Oranges.
I agree, I love doing double shatter hex/enchant against hex/enchant heavy teams with GoR!
But for OP build, MoR is better as diversion can be cast constantly.
But for OP build, MoR is better as diversion can be cast constantly.
LightningHell
I retract my BO comment after further thought. Somehow I equate MoR with GoR.../slapself
Some things I find irritating: lack of Distortion, and you might want to put Draw Conditions in.
Some things I find irritating: lack of Distortion, and you might want to put Draw Conditions in.
Hella Good
GoR allows for some pressure- double burns, double shatters, etc. But I think MoR might be better for pure Diversion purposes.
Redfeather1975
I prefer MOR more, but that's because my mouse gives me a tingling feeling everytime I click it. So I tend to of course favour the super spams.
Valkyries
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hella Good
GoR allows for some pressure- double burns, double shatters, etc. But I think MoR might be better for pure Diversion purposes.
Agreed completely..
But the OP was asking why anyone would use GoR over MoR and I was just justifying it thats all
I love Glyph for all the reasons I mentioned before. But for sure its personal preference. Both are great in their own way.
But the OP was asking why anyone would use GoR over MoR and I was just justifying it thats all
I love Glyph for all the reasons I mentioned before. But for sure its personal preference. Both are great in their own way.
HolyHawk
I'm just curious, does the 20% recharge stack with mantra of recovery, let's say, energy burn used under mantra of recovery will recharge in 5 seconds once in a while?
lightblade
Quote:
Originally Posted by HolyHawk
I'm just curious, does the 20% recharge stack with mantra of recovery, let's say, energy burn used under mantra of recovery will recharge in 5 seconds once in a while?
Yes...and if you use 2 20/20 wand/focus...you'll have 4% chance to have it recharge in 2.5 second.
Valkyries
Quote:
Originally Posted by lightblade
Yes...and if you use 2 20/20 wand/focus...you'll have 4% chance to have it recharge in 2.5 second.
Actually not true...
For RECHARGE its different than Casting Time. This used to be the case but not any longer. Now only Casting time gets the 4% change, where as the recharge is stuck at 36% from 20/20 HSR. Which is too bad because I like that 4% to be quarter recharge time but sadly no longer.
I think his question was though, does it stack with MoR and Im not sure the order but yes Im pretty sure it does.
Im just not sure if you count the MoR first, then use the 20/20 or vice versa. I think its the latter but someone will have to confirm.
For RECHARGE its different than Casting Time. This used to be the case but not any longer. Now only Casting time gets the 4% change, where as the recharge is stuck at 36% from 20/20 HSR. Which is too bad because I like that 4% to be quarter recharge time but sadly no longer.
I think his question was though, does it stack with MoR and Im not sure the order but yes Im pretty sure it does.
Im just not sure if you count the MoR first, then use the 20/20 or vice versa. I think its the latter but someone will have to confirm.
HolyHawk
Yeah, I went to nameless test it. Casting stacks, even with stolen speed it seemed, but recharge is capped at half. I had 2 x 20/20 + recovery, still got 10 second recharge for burn everytime, or maybe I was just too unlucky.
LightningHell
Quote:
Originally Posted by HolyHawk
Yeah, I went to nameless test it. Casting stacks, even with stolen speed it seemed, but recharge is capped at half. I had 2 x 20/20 + recovery, still got 10 second recharge for burn everytime, or maybe I was just too unlucky.
Recharge is capped at half.
Scourgey
There was a patch recently that stopped half recharge from going below 50% as lightning hell said.
It does mean there isn't much point in bringing half recharge wands/focus as a MoR mesmer. Yes, I didn't like that update much at all.
It does mean there isn't much point in bringing half recharge wands/focus as a MoR mesmer. Yes, I didn't like that update much at all.
Cherng Butter
Thanks for the comments guys. I totally thought GoR did something else for some reason, but now I see its use.
I guess I'll replace Tap with Power Drain, but I'm a little iffy for Shatter replacing Burn. Shatter does more damage, but I find it a little unreliable for spikes or damage in general...
I know I'm probably being stupid, but could I still fit distortion in here? (Maybe lower FC and inspiration) I know it overwrites MoR, but if you use it sparingly and in emergencies, a ~10 second duration of no MoR isn't that bad, is it? You probably aren't going to be casting if you have a warrior on you anyway...maybe replace remove hex?
I guess I'll replace Tap with Power Drain, but I'm a little iffy for Shatter replacing Burn. Shatter does more damage, but I find it a little unreliable for spikes or damage in general...
I know I'm probably being stupid, but could I still fit distortion in here? (Maybe lower FC and inspiration) I know it overwrites MoR, but if you use it sparingly and in emergencies, a ~10 second duration of no MoR isn't that bad, is it? You probably aren't going to be casting if you have a warrior on you anyway...maybe replace remove hex?
Valkyries
I think Distortion is only REALLY necessary in PVP. In PVE its simple to get rid of aggro (most of the time anyways)... so it tends to not be an issue so much.
In PvP though its very nice to have. Not completely necessary as a staple but pretty damn good. So Its really a matter of personal taste if you want to bring it.
Actually IMO (and I KNOW a lot of ppl will disagree) Im really liking Leech Signet over Power Drain and Tap. Reason is, it hits EVERYTHING not just spells and the net return is still excellent. It only has a very slightly longer recharge time @ 30 seconds, it still nets me 12 energy in my build (and 0 to cast, keep that in mind), and in addition I counter Res Signets, Troll U's, Healing Sigs, etc, etc. I got SO extremely frustrated in PVP not being able to interupt my oponents Res as it was being cast, so I decided to play around with it. Extremely happy with the results. I simply run Leech and Drain Enchant as my energy mgmt and its perfect for me. Gives me a huge boost when I need it (I run ESurger usually so a bit different than your build but similar in the way of Energy Mgmt).
Just something to think about.
In PvP though its very nice to have. Not completely necessary as a staple but pretty damn good. So Its really a matter of personal taste if you want to bring it.
Actually IMO (and I KNOW a lot of ppl will disagree) Im really liking Leech Signet over Power Drain and Tap. Reason is, it hits EVERYTHING not just spells and the net return is still excellent. It only has a very slightly longer recharge time @ 30 seconds, it still nets me 12 energy in my build (and 0 to cast, keep that in mind), and in addition I counter Res Signets, Troll U's, Healing Sigs, etc, etc. I got SO extremely frustrated in PVP not being able to interupt my oponents Res as it was being cast, so I decided to play around with it. Extremely happy with the results. I simply run Leech and Drain Enchant as my energy mgmt and its perfect for me. Gives me a huge boost when I need it (I run ESurger usually so a bit different than your build but similar in the way of Energy Mgmt).
Just something to think about.
carbajac
I saw a mesmer running a similar build in a gvg the other day. He used (I love observe mode, gives such good ideas) MoR, E burn, Power Drain, Shame, Diversion, Drain Enchant, and Cry of Frustration, and res chant. Seemed to work fine...I'm no good at mesmer...ing (heh, healbot). I like the idea of Cry and I've never seen MoR used creatively before.
LightningHell
For me Leech Sig's problem is that it's unaffected by Fast Cast, aside from the higher net gain.
I leave the Res interrupting to the Cripshot.
I leave the Res interrupting to the Cripshot.
Dragannia
Uhm, Leech Sig has a 1/4 cast time. Fast Casting is irrelevant here 
I think you mean it's unaffected by MoR.
I think you mean it's unaffected by MoR.
LightningHell
Err, yes, hit me in the head for trying to think after going on a trip.
Cherng Butter
I switched remove hex for distortion. It worked pretty well, you don't need distortion all that much besides when you can predict that evicerate coming after you get shocked...and hex removal isn't that big of a deal, nobody runs hex spam nowadays, and blessed light is plenty hex removal.
I'm still a little iffy on power drain. Normally I'm going to be harassing monks with this build, and I know I'm not going to be able to interupt most monk spells...so it leaves me having to switch targets consistently, which is annoying (especially when I miss the interupt anyway, I have reflexes like a sloth). I find that 2x energy tap is good enough energy management already coupled with drain. The cast time is a little long, but so is diversion's, so meh.
Thanks for all your comments btw!
I'm still a little iffy on power drain. Normally I'm going to be harassing monks with this build, and I know I'm not going to be able to interupt most monk spells...so it leaves me having to switch targets consistently, which is annoying (especially when I miss the interupt anyway, I have reflexes like a sloth). I find that 2x energy tap is good enough energy management already coupled with drain. The cast time is a little long, but so is diversion's, so meh.
Thanks for all your comments btw!
LouAl
I gotta say something about Leech Sig.
I really like it and used to take it instead of P Drain because I could catch whatever with it, but - and this is a big deal- the biggest reason to bring either is not the interrupting, that is just a happy side effect, it is the energy return. I kept screwing myself over by using Leech to hit something like Troll's or res and then running out of energy becuase I got no return from it. I am not saying that you couldn't control yourself and only use it against spells, but the fact that the energy return is already lower than P-drain and I sometimes used it when I would get no benefit (other than the interrupt) made me make the switch and use P-drain alsmot exclusively. I really prefer using something that doesn't require me ot interrupt, but you can't argue with the net gain.
The other big issue is that when you use Leech against a res, you really only stall the res for a few seconds (while Leech takes another 30 to recharge). It isn't really a good trade off...
I really like it and used to take it instead of P Drain because I could catch whatever with it, but - and this is a big deal- the biggest reason to bring either is not the interrupting, that is just a happy side effect, it is the energy return. I kept screwing myself over by using Leech to hit something like Troll's or res and then running out of energy becuase I got no return from it. I am not saying that you couldn't control yourself and only use it against spells, but the fact that the energy return is already lower than P-drain and I sometimes used it when I would get no benefit (other than the interrupt) made me make the switch and use P-drain alsmot exclusively. I really prefer using something that doesn't require me ot interrupt, but you can't argue with the net gain.
The other big issue is that when you use Leech against a res, you really only stall the res for a few seconds (while Leech takes another 30 to recharge). It isn't really a good trade off...
Arkantos
Tried out this build in ab, and it dominated. I love how most of the casters have no hex removal.
holden
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cherng Butter
I run this a lot GvG and it works very well.
Fast Casting (11+1)
Domination (10+4)
Inspiration (10+1)
Healing Prayers (1)
Mantra of Recovery (e)
Diversion
Shame
Energy Burn/Shatter Enchantment
Energy Tap
Drain Enchantment
Remove Hex/Convert Hexes
Resurrection Chant
i really like glyph of renewal for a mesmer in gvg. give it a shot.
but i think this is a nice build. shame and diversion are greatness. remove hex is great here. i'd just bring power spike instead of e-tap, since it's a 10 second recharge anyway and you can always use an interrupt. especially an interrupt that's back up every 6 or so seconds. shatter enchantment instead of energy burn for sure.
you'll take pressure. the monk will hate you and tell his team allll about it.
Fast Casting (11+1)
Domination (10+4)
Inspiration (10+1)
Healing Prayers (1)
Mantra of Recovery (e)
Diversion
Shame
Energy Burn/Shatter Enchantment
Energy Tap
Drain Enchantment
Remove Hex/Convert Hexes
Resurrection Chant
i really like glyph of renewal for a mesmer in gvg. give it a shot.
but i think this is a nice build. shame and diversion are greatness. remove hex is great here. i'd just bring power spike instead of e-tap, since it's a 10 second recharge anyway and you can always use an interrupt. especially an interrupt that's back up every 6 or so seconds. shatter enchantment instead of energy burn for sure.
you'll take pressure. the monk will hate you and tell his team allll about it.
just rude
Quote:
Originally Posted by LightningHell
Blackout blackout blackout blackout blackout blackout...
Other than that, looks all right. there was a time before blackout and its "Coming around, Coming around, Coming Arahhound"
some jerry shit
Other than that, looks all right. there was a time before blackout and its "Coming around, Coming around, Coming Arahhound"
some jerry shit
Apple
Oh my god. My guild faced a guild who ran TWO of these exact same mesmers and they basically completely flattened us : I think i got like 5 casts off the whole match due to skillful Diversion removal using Inspired hex hehe. But, being odd and Korean meant that when they had an err 7, they ALL resigned out, even though we said we would resign out for them. We got lucky, that's for sure, but it was horrible to monk against!!! 
Tainek
Faced two of these in a gvg on monday, i was the Blight, and had a boon on my team
The boon was fine, he could Cop boon if he had to make a saving cast
I however got screwed royal, with no hex removal except veil (which i kept on myself most of the match because...) , and using a 2 second sig of devotion as my energy management without veil they'd get it on me litterally 1/4 sec before devotion finished.
I got very used to using only one spell at a time to heal, thank god the team had little damage potential, and the boon was fine
The boon was fine, he could Cop boon if he had to make a saving cast
I however got screwed royal, with no hex removal except veil (which i kept on myself most of the match because...) , and using a 2 second sig of devotion as my energy management without veil they'd get it on me litterally 1/4 sec before devotion finished.
I got very used to using only one spell at a time to heal, thank god the team had little damage potential, and the boon was fine
Dragannia
Quote:
Originally Posted by [Apple
]Oh my god. My guild faced a guild who ran TWO of these exact same mesmers and they basically completely flattened us : I think i got like 5 casts off the whole match due to skillful Diversion removal using Inspired hex hehe. But, being odd and Korean meant that when they had an err 7, they ALL resigned out, even though we said we would resign out for them. We got lucky, that's for sure, but it was horrible to monk against!!!
In those situations you basically have to get your Warriors to just wail on their Mesmers. This forces them to kite and therefore stop their casting. And timely Shock come in handy too. Splits also work extremely well because of the relatively non-mobile nature of these Mesmers.
In those situations you basically have to get your Warriors to just wail on their Mesmers. This forces them to kite and therefore stop their casting. And timely Shock come in handy too. Splits also work extremely well because of the relatively non-mobile nature of these Mesmers.