Rt/R Attuned was Songkai Restoration Build w/ 0 downtime

Shinigami God

Shinigami God

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Apr 2006

Beating Nightfall for the N-th time -_-

Tactical Error [Stop]

N/

18 Oct 2006 at 17:18 - 1
I don't know if this has been thought of before, but this is my build

1. Soothing Memories
2. Mend Body and Soul
3. Spirit Light
4. Weapon of Warding
5. Serpents Quickness
6. Recuperation
7. Attuned was Songkai {E}
8. Flesh of my Flesh (or rez sig if you're in a position that's bad for hard rez)

Attributes:
Spawning Power: 12+3+1
Restoration Magic: 11+1
Wilderness Survival: 6

This build works great, and better than the normal Attuned was Songkai Restoration rit because of Serpent's Quickness. With it, Songkai recharges in 40 seconds, while lasting for 45 seconds. Also, since Serpent's recharges in 45 seconds and you will be using it before casting Songkai, you can keep Songkai's ashes in your hands indefinitely, as opposed to the usual 15 seconds with no energy management. Other than that, it plays like a normal resto rit, just use your serpent's/songkai, throw down recup and begin to heal. Also, serpent's will be active for 21 seconds, so soothing memories can be used as a free heal very often, as well as not having to wait between fights for recuperation to recharge. Take points out of resto magic to put in wilderness as you please if you want a longer serpent's. Any comments and whether or not this has been done before would be great

Jetdoc

Jetdoc

Hell's Protector

Join Date: Jul 2005

The Eyes of Texas [BEVO]

D/A

18 Oct 2006 at 18:03 - 2
Excellent build! The only thing that concerns me is the heavy cost of Recuperation on this build without any other sort of energy recovery mechanism.

Even with + energy armor, you only have an energy base of 37. Use 10 of that to cast Attuned and 25 to cast Recuperation - that doesn't leave you much room for error, even with the insanely low energy cost that Attuned provides on your heals.

Yes, you recover some energy through Soothing Memories spamming, but I'm not sure if that will provide you enought to get Recuperation back up when it expires.

But overall, an excellent build!

SnipiousMax

SnipiousMax

Perfectly Elocuted

Join Date: Sep 2005

18 Oct 2006 at 18:13 - 3
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetdoc
Excellent build! The only thing that concerns me is the heavy cost of Recuperation on this build without any other sort of energy recovery mechanism. Agreed, but it's still very managable. Solid build.

Personally I like using Spirit Channeling when I use Recuperation. The two synergize really well, and I'm instantly gaining energy back.

Cirian

Cirian

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Oct 2005

European Union

The Amazon Basin

18 Oct 2006 at 19:35 - 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetdoc
Use 10 of that to cast Attuned and 25 to cast Recuperation - that doesn't leave you much room for error, even with the insanely low energy cost that Attuned provides on your heals. Don't forget, AwS works on Binding Rituals too.

Shinigami God

Shinigami God

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Apr 2006

Beating Nightfall for the N-th time -_-

Tactical Error [Stop]

N/

18 Oct 2006 at 19:55 - 5
yep, so you can start healing using AwS's reduced costs after spending 26 energy (Recup=12, Serpents=5, AwS=10), leaving 11 energy that is easily efficient as you'll be gaining it back fast, and your Soothing Memories spells are better than free, you actually gain energy for using them. Has it ever been suggested to use serpent's for this? Seems pretty obvious, and I find it too good to be true that I was the first person to think of it

sinican

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: May 2006

SAW

D/

18 Oct 2006 at 20:02 - 6
Sepents Quickness
Stance For 15...27 seconds, recharge times for your skills are reduced by 33%. Serpent's Quickness ends if your Health drops below 50%.


works but then doesn't... it is a stance and it can be removed it requires spending att in wilderness survival which takes atribute points away from restoration and spawning... which less restoration means less healing and less spawning mean shorter lasting attuned... also the stance is wrecked when you fall bellow 50% health... this is why i use ghostly haste instead since if your going to use a spirit in the first place with your resto healing build why not use a spell that profits from that spirit to do your bidding yes it is an enchantment and i know it can be removed but it recahrges in 30 seconds versus 45 seconds... but they are pretty close... i cant argue about that... biggest turn off to me is that the attribute points needed... by all means though u dont need to spend the att points in survival and just use it as a prep for attuned when it needs casted... that would save you from having to take away from resto or spawning

Recuperation cost way to much anymore for how long it lasts and the benefits it actually provided... this is why i chose Life instead as it does not provide regeneration it does burst heal which seems to be in line with the amount recups regen offers

everything else i agree with... It is my opinion though that you are not healing as much as you are capable of because of the lost points that are sunk into survival for a single skill... and again i dislike how many conditions it does require to be met... stance (removable) below 50% health and its gone...

welp recup... i wish they would have left that spirit alone and left it at 15e cost...

id run it in my rit build if i didnt run several different builds with the same Rit/Me... but i found ghostly works fine for me

JoeKnowMo

JoeKnowMo

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Oct 2005

Wessst Siiide, USA

Mo/

18 Oct 2006 at 20:38 - 7
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shinigami God
Attributes:
Spawning Power: 12+3+1
Restoration Magic: 11+1
Wilderness Survival: 6

.... Any comments and whether or not this has been done before would be great The serpent's and attuned combo is mentioned on Guildwiki and Forgerunner here http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10053444 and was brought up by Waarph in a recent thread http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10061814

Nice build.

A few comments:
I think 16 Resto, 13 Spawn, and 3 Wilderness are a better way to work your attributes around.
Just activate serpent's 5 secs before you use Attuned the first time and it will always be available before you have to re-cast Attuned. It's best to re-cast your new Attuned while the old one is still active so it costs you only 6e.

You only need this stance to be active while casting Attuned (2 secs), so if it is removed right after it's not a problem whatsoever. And, if your health is <50%, well get it back up and then go for the serpent's and attuned combo.

To me, those 2 skills are the core part of this build. The rest is totally optional, or according to one's taste.

My feelings about recup are the same way I feel about mending

I'd go with Soothing, Mend B&S, Weapon of Warding, Resilient Weapon, Wielder's boon, and Flesh of my Flesh along w the 2 core skills (attuned and serpent's). As I said above, the rest of the skills are upto you. I'm a fan of Resilient Weapon and don't like to deal with spirits if my main job is healing. So MB&S won't remove conditions, but Resilient takes advantage of them and allows me to throw Wielder's boon on top of it.

SnipiousMax

SnipiousMax

Perfectly Elocuted

Join Date: Sep 2005

18 Oct 2006 at 21:17 - 8
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeKnowMo
My feelings about recup are the same way I feel about mending
<shrug>

With a potential 240+ Heal per ally, I've no problems with using it. It's not like spirits die as quickly as enchants get stripped, nor do you give up a pip of energy regen per ally affected. Life is too fickle and imprecise to use as a heal, and it's really only useful to fuel other spells. Restoration gives small bits of healing constantly, so I don't feel like I'm playing the lottery with my spirit's usefulness.

Skuld

Skuld

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Sep 2005

Thousend Tigers Apund Ur Head [Ttgr]

A/

18 Oct 2006 at 21:26 - 9
Sinican - AFAIK you only need it up for a second to get the fast songkai. Lets face it, you're a lot more likely to be interrupted than have a 2 sec required stance up removed :P

sinican

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: May 2006

SAW

D/

18 Oct 2006 at 21:57 - 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skuld
Sinican - AFAIK you only need it up for a second to get the fast songkai. Lets face it, you're a lot more likely to be interrupted than have a 2 sec required stance up removed :P Too true... and i agree with Joeknowmo about only sinking a 3 in survival versus lowering your spawning and or restoration to use quickness... and just cast it 5 sec before using attuned...

then again i use ghostly in the same manner i only cast it right before using attuned.. though without putting any other attribute points into another tree i get more effectiveness out of ghostly after its primary objective if it hasn't been removed by enchantment removals...

just a mater of preference... ghostly does require the spirit to be up first... which is one main reson i chose life as my spirit (damn anet though for increaseing the cost of recup)

i still prefer 2 sup runes on my rit build... and using armor that boosts my AL... after all armor that boosts energy/health is only temporary in its true effectivness because if your low on energy you low on energy and the plus energy doesnt help you regain it... only bene of it is if you need to pre high cost spells first... same goes for health really... the numbers on hp look good but really the amount of health armor gives vs end game stuff is negligable..

btw... AFKAIK????

JoeKnowMo

JoeKnowMo

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Oct 2005

Wessst Siiide, USA

Mo/

18 Oct 2006 at 22:51 - 11
Originally Posted by JoeKnowMo
My feelings about recup are the same way I feel about mending

Quote:
Originally Posted by SnipiousMax
<shrug>

With a potential 240+ Heal per ally, I've no problems with using it. It's not like spirits die as quickly as enchants get stripped, nor do you give up a pip of energy regen per ally affected. Life is too fickle and imprecise to use as a heal, and it's really only useful to fuel other spells. Restoration gives small bits of healing constantly, so I don't feel like I'm playing the lottery with my spirit's usefulness. Sorry, I misspoke about my feelings regarding recup. Recup is a group mending w/o the energy degen and w/o ppl having to put pts into healing prayers. And when the group gets hit w poison from death nova (for example) it's nice to see that it's only 1 pip of degen instead of the 4 it could be. So, in those ways recup is great.

However, as a healer, I usually find my biggest challenge is to keep someone alive while they're getting spiked. The regen from mending/recup is nice but won't help much in this case. I should have said "Recup nice, but not against spikes..." or something like that.

Anyway, I didn't want to come off as a cantakerous old bastard.

btw, mending wars will rule in NF with mending refrain from paragons and recup from rits, for a constant + 9 regen

TomD22

TomD22

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jul 2005

18 Oct 2006 at 22:56 - 12
That's actually a really good idea . I never thought of serpent's quickness for Attuned was.

Personally, i prefer resilent weapon (in most areas) + wielder's boon than warding and spirit light, and much prefer life to recuperation, but yeah. Looks good. I guess me pve rit id going /r.

Kais Unduli

Kais Unduli

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Sep 2005

Room V

18 Oct 2006 at 23:00 - 13
AFAIK = As Far As I Know. Internet shorthand.

Build looks solid. I find myself not taking weapon of warding less and less, only because rits have no primary way to deal with hexes, so I prefer the bonus given from resilient weapon a bit more.

I really wish restoration magic had a few more spirits to choose from. I like Recuperation and I like Life, but the debate about which to use will go on forever. I think Recovery is the only new restoration magic spirit, but I honestly don't think it's worth using. Wielder's remedy might be a good fix, but what skill do you drop for it? Also, you'd need a spammable weapon spell, like vengeful, to gain any real benefit from remedy.

sinican

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: May 2006

SAW

D/

19 Oct 2006 at 00:26 - 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kais Unduli
I really wish restoration magic had a few more spirits to choose from. I like Recuperation and I like Life, but the debate about which to use will go on forever. I think Recovery is the only new restoration magic spirit, but I honestly don't think it's worth using. Wielder's remedy might be a good fix, but what skill do you drop for it? Also, you'd need a spammable weapon spell, like vengeful, to gain any real benefit from remedy. QFT... i wish there was a reso spirit similar to divine boon like recup is to mending... or even a stupid spirit that moves would be damn nice LOL or a spell that makes a spirit follow you

Redfeather1975

Redfeather1975

Forge Runner

Join Date: Sep 2006

Apartment#306

Rhedd Asylum

Me/

19 Oct 2006 at 00:43 - 15
There are spirits that move!
The ones you fight when doing your ritualist quests in shing jea.
Stupid cheating enemies.
I wish we could have a skill with a moving spirit too.

SnipiousMax

SnipiousMax

Perfectly Elocuted

Join Date: Sep 2005

19 Oct 2006 at 02:31 - 16
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeKnowMo
Anyway, I didn't want to come off as a cantakerous old bastard. Not at all! Just want to make sure the skill gets a fair shake!

Lord Jerhyn

Lord Jerhyn

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Dec 2005

Scotland

Wu Dynasty Warriors [WU]

W/

19 Oct 2006 at 04:10 - 17
speaking of cheating enemies... the spiders in FoW have 2 elites!!!

bastards.

Kais Unduli

Kais Unduli

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Sep 2005

Room V

19 Oct 2006 at 14:31 - 18
Alrighty, tried using this build in 2 missions (unwaking waters and raisu palace), and it works great. I brought Life instead of Recuperation, simply because I wanted a spirit with shorter casting time. I never ran into any energy management problems.

Like I mentioned earlier, I bring resilient weapon instead of weapon of warding. Since restoration magic isn't maxed, I find the +6 given and the armor bonus more useful than the +4 and 50% chance to block, especially in a place like raisu palace with the higher level enemies. Also, resilient lasts longer, giving an extra little buff incase once the conditions/hexes were removed by the monk and reapplied. In raisu palace with the hexes and conditions being tossed around, resilient weapon made a nice cover up spell.

Jetdoc

Jetdoc

Hell's Protector

Join Date: Jul 2005

The Eyes of Texas [BEVO]

D/A

19 Oct 2006 at 15:16 - 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cirian
Don't forget, AwS works on Binding Rituals too.
...d'oh! I normally use AwS for spells, and I totally forgot that it works on Binding Rituals too.

Now you got me thinking about the typical Spirit Spammer (aka Ritual Lord)....

Because of the energy problems that most Ritual Lords are running into nowadays, I wonder if Serpent's Quickness + Attuned might be a possible solution.

And apparently, someone else has already beat me to the punch. Man, I love this site.

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10053444

sinican

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: May 2006

SAW

D/

19 Oct 2006 at 22:46 - 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetdoc
...d'oh! I normally use AwS for spells, and I totally forgot that it works on Binding Rituals too.

Now you got me thinking about the typical Spirit Spammer (aka Ritual Lord)....

Because of the energy problems that most Ritual Lords are running into nowadays, I wonder if Serpent's Quickness + Attuned might be a possible solution.

And apparently, someone else has already beat me to the punch. Man, I love this site.

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10053444 didnt check the link myself yet, but imediately id be concerned about having fast enough recharges on my spirits without spirit lord... since u cant equip 2 elites youd have to sac rit lord to use attuned... and serpents doesnt quite stack up to how fast rit lord recharges spirits...

time to go check

JoeKnowMo

JoeKnowMo

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Oct 2005

Wessst Siiide, USA

Mo/

19 Oct 2006 at 23:10 - 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by sinican
didnt check the link myself yet, but imediately id be concerned about having fast enough recharges on my spirits without spirit lord... since u cant equip 2 elites youd have to sac rit lord to use attuned... and serpents doesnt quite stack up to how fast rit lord recharges spirits...

time to go check Rit Lord has been nerfed to hell. Used to be that you could keep putting up the spirits as they recharged. Here's how it currently works (at 16 Commun, 13 Spawn):
Cast Boon of Creation early so energy regens fully, then Shelter (25e), hit Rit Lord while Shelter is 3/4 done casting (10e), Union (15e), Displacement (15e). You can get in one more Shelter (25e again) before Rit Lord expires and maybe a Union or Displacement. However, often Rit Lord has expired and putting up Union or Displacement (15e each) with Rit Lord (10e) active as soon as they recharge is impossible due to energy issues.

An alternative might be to go secondary Mes (15 Comm, 11 Spawn, 10 Insp) and try to manage your energy that way. However, it's still pretty rough. Rit Lord just recharges your spirits way too fast given how much energy is needed to get them back up. Serpent's won't always be active when putting down your spirits, so you may not even benefit from it's recharge in some cases. However, Tarnok's build allows you to put the spirits up everytime they become available, and leaves you room for other spells too.

sinican

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: May 2006

SAW

D/

19 Oct 2006 at 23:23 - 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeKnowMo
Rit Lord has been nerfed to hell. Used to be that you could keep putting up the spirits as they recharged. Here's how it currently works (at 16 Commun, 13 Spawn):
Cast Boon of Creation early so energy regens fully, then Shelter (25e), hit Rit Lord while Shelter is 3/4 done casting (10e), Union (15e), Displacement (15e). You can get in one more Shelter (25e again) before Rit Lord expires and maybe a Union or Displacement. However, often Rit Lord has expired and putting up Union or Displacement (15e each) with Rit Lord (10e) active as soon as they recharge is impossible due to energy issues.

An alternative might be to go secondary Mes (15 Comm, 11 Spawn, 10 Insp) and try to manage your energy that way. However, it's still pretty rough. Rit Lord just recharges your spirits way too fast given how much energy is needed to get them back up. Serpent's won't always be active when putting down your spirits, so you may not even benefit from it's recharge in some cases. However, Tarnok's build allows you to put the spirits up everytime they become available, and leaves you room for other spells too. oh how i know...

I like displacement.. i posted my ulternative in that other thread after the nerf came about...

dissonance with 16 com and 15spawn will absorb 7 attacks which doesnt seem like much... but it is enough in pve to kill off the high dmgers and typically not much longer till it can be recast... in pvp it is enough for my party to do dmg to the team trying to deal it putting them on the defensive and them ehausting most of their prime skills while displacement ruined it for them... ultimately screws most assassins with their chain requirements and other conditional skills/spells

union will take the backdraft between casts and ill throw up shelter when i have the enrgy for it... the build is of corse not as good as it used to be before the nerf but seems to still be very functional

plus 15 spawn allows dissonance recharge to 17 seconds which makes a huge diference and more spamable with the 3 sec cast time totally 1 disonance every 20 seconds to take out 7 attacks

Redfeather1975

Redfeather1975

Forge Runner

Join Date: Sep 2006

Apartment#306

Rhedd Asylum

Me/

20 Oct 2006 at 00:59 - 23
Displacement might be useful being cast far in the backline in preparation of a melee spike and then drawing it close enough to trigger it's effect when the time is right? I haven't tested that.

unmatchedfury

unmatchedfury

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jul 2006

Cookie Cutter [FTW]

26 Oct 2006 at 01:23 - 24
okay lemme explain why resto rits really arn't viable in TA, GvG, and RA compared to monks. it all comes down to something other than energy costs and hp healed. its 3/4 seconds of differance, and in GW time that makes a world of reaction differant. 1 sec spells of the rit are easily interuptableand cant be spammed one on top of the other.
Some of you may know what i mean. A monk can put up prot spirit and RoF for 10-14 mana in 1/2 a second. this is why monks are better. they can react, in a half a second a spike is taken care of. the only spell that a rit can use for this is vengful weapon+ transfer spirit. and transfer spirit requires a spirit which stops you form healing for a long 3 seconds. 3 seconds is more than enough to set up a spike, and then your screwed because you can't react fast enough. this is why the rit sucks so very badly at healing in GvG.

he can easily keep up with points healed by a monk, and his weapon spells have the advantage of being unremoveable. but a second is enough for someone to get spike in GvG or even TA, you dont have the luxury to wait 2 seconds to replentish a health bar, by then either you or you teamate is dead.

I think a rit monk combo would definantly work well, attuned resto won't run out of mana and can keep up with steady pressure much better than a boon protter. but a boon protter can respond to spikes much much faster.