Unique Hero Skills (Gamespot) - Guild Wars Guru archive powered by Guild Wars Legacy

Zinger314

Debbie Downer

Join Date: May 2006

N/Me

19 Oct 2006 at 04:36 - 1

http://www.gamespot.com/pc/rpg/guild...ml?sid=6160066

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gamespot

You'll also be able to teach heroes new unique skills, thanks to hero trainers. As you rise in rank, you get hero skill points that you can use to unlock hero-specific skills. Simply find one of the new hero trailers. These differ from regular trainers in that they specialize only in hero skills, and they don't charge gold for them, just hero skill points.

So, how exactly could ArenaNet do this without imbalancing the game?

Cloudpiercer

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Sep 2006

R/

19 Oct 2006 at 04:44 - 2

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zinger314

http://www.gamespot.com/pc/rpg/guild...ml?sid=6160066

So, how exactly could ArenaNet do this without imbalancing the game?

The PVE portion of the game doesnt need to be balanced. Its basically just like the Monster skills which already exist throughout the game, except they work in your favor.

Anytime they can be used in PVP each side would have access to them so thats already balanced.

Zinger314

Debbie Downer

Join Date: May 2006

N/Me

19 Oct 2006 at 04:45 - 3

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cloudpiercer

The PVE portion of the game doesnt need to be balanced. Its basically just like the Monster skills which already exist throughout the game, except they work in your favor.

Anytime they can be used in PVP each side would have access to them so thats already balanced.

I'll rephrase: What could Hero skills be so that normal professions wouldn't have access to an equivilant of them?

sindex

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Aug 2006

California

Swords of Night & Day [SWRD]

19 Oct 2006 at 04:48 - 4

Dam you posted this before I did. Anyways to answer your question, basically your hero’s have access to all the skills set by campaign (no special hero skills).

Knightsaber Sith

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Aug 2006

Few Fallen Heroes [FFH]

W/E

19 Oct 2006 at 05:04 - 5

Quote:

In fact, you may have to choose between two different heroes to accompany you, which means the one that you don't choose won't be available until you beat the story and unlock everything in the game.

So after we beat the story line we can get all the heroes

Quote:

On a cool note, while you don't need to own Guild Wars or Guild Wars Factions to play Nightfall, there is a neat reward if you do. There's a unique hero based on each of those two campaigns, and you can travel back to Tyria and Cantha and unlock them.

sweeeet

Terra Xin

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Mar 2006

New Zealand

Me/R

19 Oct 2006 at 05:05 - 6

Actually your heroes will have all skills you have unlocked, ever i.e. they are pvp grade. Though, it does say hro-specific skills, so in contrary to what you had just said about there not being hero-specific skills.... got a quote on that?

Cloudpiercer

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Sep 2006

R/

19 Oct 2006 at 05:14 - 7

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zinger314

I'll rephrase: What could Hero skills be so that normal professions wouldn't have access to an equivilant of them?

Ok, I see what your saying now. They definetly cant be as powerful as celestial skills, so maybe they will be like monster skills. Some monster skills dont have an equivalent for players. Also I wonder if they will be linked to attributes. The more I think about it the more its confusing me...

...... Well at least we'll know next week.

Shadowfox1125

Forge Runner

Join Date: Mar 2005

PST

W/

19 Oct 2006 at 05:34 - 8

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gamespot.com

You can customize a hero, all the way down to the skills the hero uses, or the hero's inventory.

Am I reading this correctly?

Riesz

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jul 2006

19 Oct 2006 at 05:51 - 9

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zinger314

So, how exactly could ArenaNet do this without imbalancing the game?

How is it an imbalance if only heroes can use the skills? Sure, there will supposedly be a hero arena but your opponent will have the same number of heroes as you, and access to those skills as well (providing said opponent unlocked them).

We don't know how the hero skills will work, either. Like celestial skills or res sig where it can only be used once until gaining a morale boost?

There is too little known about this to think of any imbalance issues yet...

Best part of the article, besides the hero inventory:

Quote:

(On a cool note, while you don't need to own Guild Wars or Guild Wars Factions to play Nightfall, there is a neat reward if you do. There's a unique hero based on each of those two campaigns, and you can travel back to Tyria and Cantha and unlock them. Not only that, but you can also adventure around the original campaign settings with your heroes.)

Unique heroes! Hooray!

edit: Oh whoops, didn't see the other thread on the article

Slainster

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Feb 2006

19 Oct 2006 at 06:57 - 10

The more I read about the hero system, the more Im liking it

Spura

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Feb 2005

19 Oct 2006 at 08:47 - 11

From the article:

Quote:

And the dervish can also shape shift into the shape of one of the gods in Guild Wars. This is an incredibly powerful ability, but it leaves the dervish vulnerable afterwards

This is false.

Poison Ivy

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jan 2006

Toronto

Hopping

Mo/A

19 Oct 2006 at 09:01 - 12

Never belive advertising articles.

Valiance

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Aug 2005

Order of Corrupted Souls

R/Mo

19 Oct 2006 at 09:06 - 13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spura

From the article:
This is false.

Not totally. I ran the search cause I remember reading it somewhere. Also I think its in the PC Gamer magazine.

"Their greatest power, however, is that of transformation. The Dervish, when roused, may channel divine powers and change their form to temporarily become the physical embodiment of a god."

Guildmaster Cain

Desert Nomad

Join Date: May 2006

Guildmistress Eve [Me], Guildmistress Azura [N], Guildmistress Azumi [A], Guildmistress Jaina [D]

Guildmaster Aeron [Rt], Arthas Ironfist [W], Guild: The Tyrian Templars [TTT]

19 Oct 2006 at 09:26 - 14

So basically beating Shiro up again, unlocks a special Canthan hero that you can have when you also posess Nightfall?

SirJackassIII

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Oct 2005

Belgium

none

N/E

19 Oct 2006 at 09:50 - 15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shadowfox1125

Am I reading this correctly?

Yes and no. Gaile said the same during a Gaile chat, and the same thing was asked when the log was posted on GWO. The "inventory" is apparently the weapon + offhand the heroes have, sadly...

Unless they changed it again ofc.

Tetris L

Jungle Guide

Join Date: May 2005

Germany

Servants of Fortuna

19 Oct 2006 at 11:22 - 16

I don't think this means that the heroes get special monster skills. They have the same skills as human player. The point is that the process of unlocking skills for each individual hero is separate from the unlocking on your account or character.

In the Nightfall preview event the heroes simply had access to all skills unlocked on your account. When I noticed that I immediately thought that this can't be the final version, because that would mean that you must have one character of each profession to unlock skills for your heroes. Somebody who is new to Guild Wars and starts his very first character would only have the default hero skills, and no way to unlock more except through PvP.

Tetris L

Jungle Guide

Join Date: May 2005

Germany

Servants of Fortuna

19 Oct 2006 at 11:25 - 17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gamespot

There's a unique hero based on each of those two campaigns, and you can travel back to Tyria and Cantha and unlock them.

I take it these are Zenmai for Cantha and Olias for Tyria. The fact that they are "foreign" may explain why they weren't listed in most hero features.

Vahn Roi

Forge Runner

Join Date: Apr 2006

[HiDE]

19 Oct 2006 at 11:37 - 18

"Koss is using Spectral Agony!"

Shadowfrost

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Apr 2006

Planet Earth (sometimes)

Nowhere To Run, Nowhere To [Hide]

R/

19 Oct 2006 at 11:59 - 19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tetris L

I take it these are Zenmai for Cantha and Olias for Tyria. The fact that they are "foreign" may explain why they weren't listed in most hero features.

Olias? Never heard of him yet. Can you post a link or something, or pm me?

Gordon Ecker

Academy Page

Join Date: Sep 2006

Vancouver, BC, Canada

N/

19 Oct 2006 at 12:07 - 20

Like Tetris L said, maybe Gamespot misinterpreted things and "heroes can learn exclusive, unique skills" means "heroes can learn regular skills that you haven't unlocked, but those skills are exclusive to that specific hero until they're unlocked". Another possibility is that hero skills might only function in the hero vs hero arena. As for the thing about being particularly vulnerable after a form ends, it wasn't true last month, but they could've altered the skill since then. The one thing I'm worried about is that Zenmai appears to be the only Factions hero, which means that, unless the article's wrong, there appears to be no Ritualist hero.

l Artemis Entreri l

Academy Page

Join Date: Aug 2006

Belarusian Standard Time [BST]

A/

19 Oct 2006 at 12:11 - 21

And the dervish can also shape shift into the shape of one of the gods in Guild Wars. This is an incredibly powerful ability, but it leaves the dervish vulnerable afterwards

This is false.

wtf this is true did u play the preview??look at the skills...avatar of lyssa,melandru,grenth,balthazar,etc. lol

and what do u think on the paragons(might be able to) replacing of the monk?

itll be alot easier to finish nightfall than it was factions(wasnt too ahrd anyway tho) b/c factions had a bunch of assasins running around but in NF we have more support classes

Alex Weekes

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Mar 2005

Brighton, UK

19 Oct 2006 at 12:31 - 22

Hi all,

Just before you get too stuck in here, please remember that it's not unknown for a journalist to either misunderstand something or maybe use embellishment language that can lead to misunderstanding amongst readers.

I can neither confirm nor deny this at the moment, however I'll chase this up and see if I can get it clarified for you.

Minus Sign

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Feb 2006

Mo/N

19 Oct 2006 at 12:59 - 23

Thanks for that Alex...(aww; what the heck; I think its funny

) while I can neither confirm nor deny that your post has set me at ease, rest assured that we here at Guru have taken note of your participation in this topic.

Heres' a question: will heroes have the same UAS that they did during the Preview? By that I mean will heroes have access to all of an accounts unlocked skills or are these "special hero trainers" a way to weaken them from what we saw during the beta event?

First time I saw this thread i was thinking the same thing: "sweet; Heroes get monster type skills". But the more I thought about it the more I realised that Anet may have given us UAS per Hero to account only for the preview so players could have full access. Or--just as probable--that the hero trainers were not ready yet during the preview.

I hope very much that you can clearify soon. The thought of skillcapping all the Elites my heroes will need on every single PvE slot)is making me downright tremble.

Robin_Anadri

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jun 2005

Atlanta, GA

Girl Power [GP]

Me/Mo

19 Oct 2006 at 14:11 - 24

Wow, I hope they *don't* change the way the hero's skills were available. That was the coolest thing about the heroes in my opinion. And it wasn't unbalanced because you still only had the low level attribute points, and low level armor, etc. And from what I can guess, there will be no way to "forge run" your hero's armor. You can give them max weapons, but the attribute points will still be low.

Being able to create a low-level version of my boon-prot build on the monk hero was so neat. Or having Koss running Hundred Blades/Ripostes at level 4.

I am somewhat disappointed that we haven't seen any sign of a ritualist hero, though. I hope it turns out we're guessing wrong and a ritualist will be available. I'd much rather have that than the doubled up monks, warriors and elementalists.

I wouldn't mind having to cap *elites* for the heroes, provided they did something like make signets of capture MUCH CHEAPER, or free for your heroes. Because otherwise, it becomes not a gold sink, but a gold BLACK HOLE.

Darakus

Academy Page

Join Date: Aug 2006

The Blitzers Guild

19 Oct 2006 at 14:15 - 25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Minus Sign

Thanks for that Alex...(aww; what the heck; I think its funny

) while I can neither confirm nor deny that your post has set me at ease, rest assured that we here at Guru have taken note of your participation in this topic.

Heres' a question: will heroes have the same UAS that they did during the Preview? By that I mean will heroes have access to all of an accounts unlocked skills or are these "special hero trainers" a way to weaken them from what we saw during the beta event?

First time I saw this thread i was thinking the same thing: "sweet; Heroes get monster type skills". But the more I thought about it the more I realised that Anet may have given us UAS per Hero to account only for the preview so players could have full access. Or--just as probable--that the hero trainers were not ready yet during the preview.

I hope very much that you can clarify soon. The thought of skillcapping all the Elites my heroes will need on every single PvE slot)is making me downright tremble.

I admit that the idea of having to acquire every single skill I want my heroes to have even if I don't have to pay money for it is an idea so daunting I would almost consider leaving them at home.

One of my ideas was to to be able to use heroes for testing purposes and having them with the same weaknesses I do would definitely defeat such a purpose, I can't even start to imagine the type of power levelling I would need to perform to simply get my heroes to an unlocking level that would give me any amount of flexibility.

I certainly hope the system is equivalent to what we saw during the preview with those bonus points present to allow players the ability to unlock skills at a faster rate for the account if they haven't managed to do so already. Specific heroes skills would be fun though maybe a "knock" or other such skills our heroes could use to allow us to get to specific areas.

But I have said enough, I certainly don't want to induce panic in people who like me saw the flexibility of heroes as the way to go even for normal characters and I don't want to launch a discussion either on how such an unlocking system would be completely normal.

FrogDevourer

on a GW break until C4

Join Date: Feb 2005

In your shadow

Servants of Fortuna

19 Oct 2006 at 14:16 - 26

I seriously hope this article is wrong and that ANet didn't kill the best feature of the WPE.

Using tons of unlocked skills on heroes was arguably the most enjoyable feature of the WPE (at least for GW veterans), and the best incentive to get UAS for PvE players.

Being *forced* to replay through factions and prophecies to give the best skills to my heroes, and to grind for hours so that they get enough skill points to try out new original builds... How thrilling! Equipping multiple heroes on multiple PvE character with decent weapons is already pain, so equipping them with a lot of diverse skills is simply a deal breaker for me.

Phoebe

Academy Page

Join Date: Jun 2006

19 Oct 2006 at 15:41 - 27

Déjà-vu? ... The UAS button!

Ole Man Bourbon

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Jun 2005

Atlanta

GONG

W/E

19 Oct 2006 at 16:19 - 28

"Hero-specific skills" suggests monster-type skills to me.

Zehnchu

Popcorn Fetish

Join Date: Dec 2005

[GODS]

Mo/Me

19 Oct 2006 at 16:30 - 29

I just hope that getting skills for hero’s does not cost gold. If it does guess my hero’s will be the dumber then henchmen.

Lord Sarevok

Academy Page

Join Date: Oct 2006

Ottawa, Canada

W/

19 Oct 2006 at 16:36 - 30

It did mention in the article that heroes were using all previous unlocks you had like in the preview. However, I'm surprised no one mentioned what was said in the last part of the article. You must be swallowed up by a wurm and then you get to control the wurm with the ability to body slam people. Cool? Indeed.

A unique hero for Canthans and Tyrians is also a neat touch. I just hope it's not Mhenlo for us Tyrians.

We can't really comment on unbalanced hero skills without knowing what they are. There are many monsters skills in the game which are not super powered. They may be intended to add a bit of a unique touch to your heroes which is cool.

FrogDevourer

on a GW break until C4

Join Date: Feb 2005

In your shadow

Servants of Fortuna

19 Oct 2006 at 16:40 - 31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zehnchu

I just hope that getting skills for hero’s does not cost gold. If it does guess my hero’s will be the dumber then henchmen.

At 100~1000g a skill, we're speaking of 2k-20k to fully equip a full team of 3 heroes. Even with more heroes, it's not exactly a big problem for the casual player, as long as you keep the same henchmen-like builds on your heroes.

However all the fun we could have playing with the heroes' skills and builds will be destroyed by the need to farm XP and gold.

Cloudpiercer

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Sep 2006

R/

19 Oct 2006 at 16:48 - 32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zehnchu

I just hope that getting skills for hero’s does not cost gold. If it does guess my hero’s will be the dumber then henchmen.

According to the preview the hero skills wont cost a dime. So if they got there info right all you need are Hero skill points.

Guildmaster Cain

Desert Nomad

Join Date: May 2006

Guildmistress Eve [Me], Guildmistress Azura [N], Guildmistress Azumi [A], Guildmistress Jaina [D]

Guildmaster Aeron [Rt], Arthas Ironfist [W], Guild: The Tyrian Templars [TTT]

19 Oct 2006 at 16:55 - 33

Well, good for me (and my heroes) I got almost have a full skill unlock with both chapters ^^...

pigdestroyer

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jan 2006

Los Chavos Del [ocho]

W/

19 Oct 2006 at 18:21 - 34

hero skills will be like monster or npc skills, like claiming resource whats the big deal noob?

Riesz

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jul 2006

19 Oct 2006 at 18:47 - 35

Quote:

Originally Posted by pigdestroyer

hero skills will be like monster or npc skills, like claiming resource whats the big deal noob?

Actually something like Claim Resource does make sense.... there are going to be missions where certain heroes are required to be in the party. Maybe the hero's special skills will be used in those missions to open doors, kill something, etc.

Tozen

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Apr 2005

All Senses Failed [aSF]

A/N

19 Oct 2006 at 19:00 - 36

It sounds like Anet made some good decisions involving the heroes. I am glad that we don't get them all during the course of the game (Which makes the storyline more interesting) but that we can unlock them all at the end (which makes PvP more interesting)

Everything sounds like a lot of fun. Seven days to go!

NeHoMaR

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Feb 2006

19 Oct 2006 at 19:37 - 37

I think is just a hero trainer, that train only heros, with NORMAL skills.

Mr.H.Mishima

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Mar 2006

The Summit of Human Evolution

W/

19 Oct 2006 at 19:57 - 38

How about it works like this:

Hero trainers can unlock skills for your Hero's without costing you a skill point AND not making that skill available for your own use.

You can still equip and skills you already have unlocked and elites, but say, if you haven't unlocked 'Mark of Rogdort' because you don't play an ele and your Warrior has no use for it, you don't have to waste one of your own skill points to purchase it.

Sounds reasonable to me.

thezed

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Oct 2006

Iowa, USA

HoTR

19 Oct 2006 at 20:08 - 39

I am happy to hear you will get all the heros (even the ones you skipped in the plot line) at the end. Makes the decision of who to choose a bit less of a burden.

GloryFox

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jan 2006

Good ol' USA, where everyone else wants to be

Now Plays World of Warcraft on Whisperwind

19 Oct 2006 at 21:09 - 40

Quote:

posted by Hells Last Survivor
How about it works like this:

Hero trainers can unlock skills for your Hero's without costing you a skill point AND not making that skill available for your own use.

You can still equip and skills you already have unlocked and elites, but say, if you haven't unlocked 'Mark of Rogdort' because you don't play an ele and your Warrior has no use for it, you don't have to waste one of your own skill points to purchase it.

Sounds reasonable to me.

/agree

This makes logical sense to me. If someone only plays a monk and has no warrior skills unlocked or is a new player to the game, then that player can properly equip his Warrior HERO with a decent build. Otherwise only his Monk HERO's would benefit from that players experience.