Latest AI buff

Well, everybody has been complaining quite heavily about the nerfing of most farming. Of course it wasn't a direct nerf to farming, it was a new 'buff' if you will, to AI. I can completely understand that they want to make farming harder. When this game first came out, 15k armor was supposed to be a somewhat difficult thing to get, and FoW almsot unattainable. But people have found ways to make money through farming. So again, I can understand why they would want to make farming a more difficult process.

However, this last update is killing me. I had a 55 monk, and it's really not nearly as useful to me as it was before. But that really doesn't bother me, because the idea of having 7 enchants on you and reducing 200 damage attacks down to 5 seems to defeat the purpose of skill anyways. In my opinon though, they did this nerf the wrong way.

Point in case, I was skill capping earlier today and I would walk up to a small group of maybe four or five enemys. It would be me, and my 7 henchies. Now after a few seconds of attacking, the monsters would all scatter and there were double aggros and tripple aggros everywhere. If they move away from you, that's one thing. But when they run half way across the map that's another thing. I guess this is what anet considered "kiting".

Basically, what I'm trying to get at here is...anets doing everything in their power to make this game easier for newer people. Like with the change to 6v6 HA, and adding heros (grr That's a different subject). Now newer people can get in, and this makes things easier on them. So it seems like they're ruining PvP (or at least tombs) to make it easier for newer people, and ruining PvE to make it harder for everybody.

Again, I'm not asking them to turn it back. I'm just asking for a reformatting. If the monsters run away from AoE damage at 40% I could live with that. But when there's just one thing there, and it's just me hittting it. It's pretty sad when I have to chase across the map to kill it becuase of this new update. It makes everything take two, three times longer than it should.

Ya I agree just today I had to chase a couple of monsters around. At least reduce the time they kit or something :/

Sorry but another thread on this tired subject isn't needed, post in one of the other countless threads.

I agree in a way. I do not like having to constantly chase around enemy monks because I get them to low HP. They run, and then my heroes seem to always chase them and then they pull another group. That goes on and on, and then we die. The monks end up completely ditching their jobs to run away to another group..really frustrating.

^learn hench control

don't blame the computer for being smarter than you

Manic I dont think they "intended" for them to run that far away, I think THAT part of the new AI is a glitch. Running away sure, but traversing the map, I highly doubt it.

Again there are many threads about this already -_-

Yeah I've had the same problem, and for some reason they will sometimes bug and follow you ultill you zone, sometimes they will atack you sometimes they will do nothing but follow you. And if you try to attack them they run away very fast...but always cmoe back. Very annoying to say the least.

Especially if it's 4 Dolyak Masters...and they heal everything you try to fight but you can't kill them because they run as fast as you sprint. -_-

the AI does need some work. the other night I tried doing elona and had to deal with the monk boss that runs away when I go after him and when I move on he follows and heals the mobs I was fighting -_-

Yes, same here. We are in middle of a mission trying to kill a healer and he just ran away very fast I must say. The problem if you dont chase him he will heal everything and if you try ti kill him he run away.

Surounding them works. Try pulling so you don't get adds. Easy.

I haven't noticed this problem at all.

Bring snares.

Absolutely loving the new AI update!

Finally my mesmer doesnt end up tanking with the hench.

Yeah, henches running back and forth pointlessly because of the new AI is sure going to be fixed by hench control and it certainly makes them smarter than me.

PvP players should be banned from discussing PvE changes.

Oh, I'm sure that solves the problem, especially on bosses that get half-condition and hex time.

Then you don't play PvE and should stay the hell out of this conversation.

Me neither.
Just finished Nightfall campaign last night.


I played an SS necro (not a melee character, so I personally didn't have to chase anything). I guess my heroes just tear them apart faster than they can run away...

Over in Consulate Docks the priests kited like WTF. That, was some serious ^_-a

However after that, I haven't really noticed any significant kiting, like doing a cross-country marathon as some have mentioned already lol

One of the things that can help some is to notice that heros have a target button. Call a target (control-shift-space) well away from the group, and lock your melee heros onto it. then attack the melee mobs out in front. I do this with my warrior and Koss: my warrior kills the melee mobs, while Koss harries the monks.

Anti-kiting thoughts. Casters seem to automatically run if you target them first. they almost NEVER run when they're the only ones left. If you can, kill all the melee mobs first, then the casters won't usually kite. Or, failing that, tear into the group, do some damage, THEN switch targets to the caster. I've seen monk mobs with no damage on them kite because they didn't have to stop and heal anything. Doing damage to the group first seems to set them up for combat, not running.

If they run away, switch targets back to the melee mobs and attack. The runners will return, just keep switching targets until they stop running from you (or, as above, set your heros to attack the things that will run, while you target something that won't - it seems to actually work)

Hopefully, some of the screwier things about the new AI will get smoothed out, and soon, but for now, you CAN work around the silliness of it partially.

i've found that if 1 mob runs when u attack it just break off and attack a diff mob untill the running one is the last and he wont run. if it's only 1 mob and he runs cripple him

Now that I have played against the new AI for a few days now, I can truly say that:

1. Soloing PvE without henchmen is much easier. The scattering of mobs actually reduces the heat that your character takes in mid-battle. That and, with proper positioning, you can actually separate the enemy monks from the other range attackers, allowing you to pick them off much easier.

2. Solo FARMING has definitely taken a hit, as the strategy of aggroing the enemy and killing them all at once is all but gone. You can still solo farm, but it just takes much longer.

In short, I'm loving the AI update. I'm very close to soloing areas that I had not been able to before given the ability to split mobs (again, in particular separating the healers from the rest).

You know, so many people are used to dropping one target at a time in PvE. What you should be doing is pressuring the monk and then dropping another target. It is a very rare occurance (i.e. 2-uber monks in a group) that the monk NEEDS to be the first target. Sure it makes the group go down faster, but it is not a requirement. Thin the group, then pull and body block the monk. PvE is certainly more interesting than just dropping baddies in the 'standard' order.

I was a little frustrated with how the henchies/heroes were attacking while I was playing my monk. If I'm under fire and kite a few steps or circle around a henchie to lose aggro, the henchies will break off the attack and follow me.

Also, once the henchies kill one target, they auto target the "weakest" enemy, not the closest enemy which is a bit annoying. I like to take out enemy warriors first (as others above mentioned), then move onto the casters. But now if my henchies drop a warrior while I am healing, they start running to the back to kill the weaker mobs. I have to specifically call a closer target. It's not so bad to call every single target in easy to moderate battles, but when you're fully concentrating on the health bars during a tough fight, having to call the proper target is difficult. The way the old henchie AI seemed to work was they would just target the next closest enemy.

For me the latest AI "improvement" is very simple -- they went after farming, and particularly solo farming, with a passion.

This is very annoying to me even though I don't do very much farming. Basically they designed the game so that you can only purchase certain sets of armor if you farm -- period. There's no way in the normal flow of the game you will ever collect the ectos, shards, or the cash to purchase the required items for FOW armor. The 15K armor you might be able to afford if you run several characters through normal game flow and save up for one.

So they are nerfing the activity they made necessary by game design.

Furthermore, the "improved" AI is ridiculous in that several level 22 or higher enemies in a group of 6 or more will run from a single level 20 character using cyclone axe. Yeah, that makes sense. But they don't really run -- that would at least make sense to me. They sit just out of damage range and wait their turn to attack Hollywood style (one to 4 at a time) rather than using the potential advantage of numbers and levels.

If I'm going to run from a battle, I run until no one is following me anymore and I'm well out of aggro range. But I never do this while my party is basically intact. So if this were to be truly improved AI and not just anti-farming AI, the enemies would most likely act in similar fashion. They'd also have to have speed skills that would take up 1 of their 8 slots to outrun speed enhanced players.

How many people would stay grouped with a monk who went on a cross-country run to get rid of his attacker as soon as he was attacked? You expect the monk to circle the tanks and try to ditch the aggro on one of them, not run away as far as he can, assuming there are still a few healthy party members to save.

But the biggest problem I have is what it does to the skill set. What's the point of even having skills like Spiteful Spirit, Cyclone Axe, Ignite Arrows, etc. if they basically get one hit in before the scattering begins? These skills now become next to useless. Are we going to have to degen everything to death eventually?

Many of the useful skills now require a combination of 2 or more slots to be effective. In other words there is a negative side effect of a skill that you have to handle with the use of another skill in order for it to work well, or there is a requirement that the enemy be under a hex or condition to get the benefit of the skill. What this means is now you have to use 2 slots (1/4)minimum of your limited potential to get one useful effect. More and more the useful single slot skills (like SS, cyclone axe, etc) are being nerfed to the point that they have no value by themselves.

I guess the goal is to make everything so equally ineffective that you can pick any 8 skills to throw on your bar and have roughly the same effect in battle.

Beyond the game play aspect I'm a little confused from just a purely logical point of view. The purpose of any business (other than non-profits) is to make money. In this case you make money by selling games. Why is there this drive to annoy the people playing the game? If the people playing aren't cheating (i.e. 3rd party software), hurting your business by how they play, or decreasing the enjoyment of other players by their activities, why would you care what they choose to do with their time while playing your game? Why would you "improve" the AI so that enemies have to be surrounded or continually crippled every battle to keep them from running? This is a step backwards as it requires casters to become part of a blockade instead of running strategic ranks according to the ability to handle and dish out damage.

What's next? Peace symbols on the critters and "make love, not war" signs? If the enemies don't really want to fight then they shouldn't attack us when we wander inside their "aggro bubbles". If they do want to fight then they shouldn't run like scared little girls the first time they break a nail in combat.

The bottom line for me is this latest update to the game was a downgrade. Most people who have expressed an opinion either hate the new AI for PvE enemies or are telling how they can exploit it. That's not the hallmark of a good move.

I feel that they need to make monsters kiting in circles instead of running across the map. Also, how the hell is the AI buffed, I still play tank in pve, I ran in and they all attack me, while my caster heroes just nuke them from behind. How smart =.=''

After a couple days of decayed Orr Emblem farming I noticed something about the AI.

If I attacked the casters first they run. If I attacked and killed tanks and rangers first they didn't run. In fact no one ran. I tested this scenario about 200x. Each time I go after the casters first they ran and didn't stop running. Each time I attaked the tank and killed him no one ran. Once the tanks are dead the casters don't run.

Someone else test this yet? Anyone have a different result?

This begs the question. If a tank attacks the tank and the rest of the group attack the casters what would happen? I haven't been able to try this because I don't belong to any guild and can't get a reliable team to test it.

Please post result if you test this.

Yes, Illicit Awakening isn't smart after all...

I think the AI buff (including the latest AoE patch) is to stop solo farming in general. But i don't get it.. if A-Net want to stop solo farming shouldn't they do it long ago instead of now? Shouldn't A-Net patrol ebay and other sites to find these botters and ban them on sight? Shouldn't they lock down all those sites that sell items for real life money?

I have talked to several peoples about this latest AI Buff. Now it's effecting runners doing Droknor Forge run. Personally, i don't see any difference. I was on Starter Island for Nightfall with my level 20 warrior and i can run away from the mobs. Althought they took longer to get away from you.

Today,I ran a Fire Nuker build with [skill=card]Glyph of Renewal[/skill] and [skill=card]Meteor Shower[/skill].

When I attacked a tank type monster, the group didn't run away early on, but when I used the second MS to drop the backline,the attempt to run was already cut off.

I do believe that,tactically,the casters would need to run fast in order to stay alive longer than a tank type. Also,if you are killing the casters, won't the team,in general, all lose out?

I would run when I'm the caster,too. Matter of fact,I did run.However, the point is,yes, the casters set the backline moving, making the frontline move back as well.That is called a tactical retreat, and a smarter move than previously known to be the actions of monsters in PvE.

There is no tactics involved here. You can chase the runner forever and the enemy group will form a giant conga line behind you as you traipse across the entire map. Sorry, that's not tactical, that's not improved AI, that's just retarded.

the casters will run if they have other fighters in the group. if you've killed their friends, they just stay and fight; this is certainly to avoid long chases after lone monks and mages who are the last remaining members of their respective groups. They know how to run, but they also know when they're lost so they just give up and die .

Care to tell us why you're chasing the monsters accross the land letting a giant conga of monsters pile up behind you? Because that's not very tactical.

It is if you know you can kill them all when the music stops. =)

I noticed that too.

They all seem to attack the highest lvl/AL character in the party. I had the pleasure of standing in Talus Chute for about 3 hours watching Koss powerlevel Tahlkora, Dunkoro, Olias, & Melonni. Not once did they even notice that I or the rest of the heros being there. Starter Shing Jea chest piece from 55 setup for me until Koss had AL above 60.

Might try doing something similar with my necro's heroes tonight.

Ia Oooooooooooooooooooooowwwwwwwwnnnnnnzzzzzzzzzz

I noticed that before I knew about the AI update, I thought I'd practise using my newly made SS/55 necro with the low level centaurs in northern shiverpeaks and I went for the monk because he kept healing the warrior, I chased him around a try for about 3 minutes then realised what I was doing was pointless, I casted SS on him and attacked the warrior, he kept healing the warrior but SS killed him for doing that lol. The fight ended not long after I killed the warrior.

There's no tactics because you didnt use any. Why are you chasing the runner forever? And where are your snares?

Here's a friendly tip. If there's a runner, break off targeting him and pick another. Or back away and kite a bit, that will bring the runner back. Or use degen like poison and bleeding. If they are running with degen they will die. There's even an assassin skill that renews degen if the target is running.

Seriously people why are you not using tactics and skills and complaining about a non existant problem instead?

I just throught of this build quickly that might help


Sprint
Charge<e>
Heal Sig
Hamstring (bold for importance)
Server Artery
Gash
Bonetti's Defense
anything else, more healing probably.

"lol the ai is stupid running away for the whole map isn't a tactic"

It's a damn good tactic if they get you to chase them across the whole map, aggroing everything in sight.

Has anyone tried killing off their frontline attackers before attacking the backline? I guess not, otherwise there wouldn't be so many threads about a monster running and running and the attacker keeps chasing and chasing until the end of the zone. The backline casters will always run if there's frontline (warriors, rangers) attackers that are still there. lol, this is too funny sometimes.

Happend to me ( altho not full map ) oh i was pissed of at the monk.

It's nice to see crippling attacks finally mean something in PvE now. Rarely did anyone even bother with it before. My heroes are all equipped with either crippling or degen.