Veiled Nightmare; Skills cost 40% more energy to activite.
Is one just one example of the area effects casters have to endure in the realm of torment.
I dont mind the huge mobs of lvl24-28 creatures and I think its cool we get to see Titans and dragons from other campaigns. I think the realm of torment area is cool and original.
But NUKING or high demand skills in these areas is rendered impossible or useless by area effects which cause them to either take twice as long to cast, twice as long to recharge, require half more energy, etc, etc, etc.
What are elementals meant to do in these situations when most of our skills take huge junks of energy, long recharge or casting times.
Yes I could lower energy req skills, and faster casting skills.
But what use does that leave a fire NUKING build?
You cant help but get the feeling they want to completely render nuking or energy demanding skills impossible in these areas.
Anet trying to render NUKING impos in realm of torment?
freekedoutfish
Sister Brianne
This extra energy cost isn't targeted at ele's....don't worry...ANET doesn't hate you.
Monks are almost effected more than elementalists.
If you find your build not working...then change it, don't complain to ANET about it.
EDIT: Glyph of Energy/Lesser Energy/Attunements
Monks are almost effected more than elementalists.
If you find your build not working...then change it, don't complain to ANET about it.
EDIT: Glyph of Energy/Lesser Energy/Attunements
TallDoode
Ya, and try Monking for a bunch of Leroy's in the Realms. It really sucks. <grin>
I have found in these Realms it is better to "avoid" than to fight. Usually you can slip around the wandering bad guys if you time it right and only fight when you absolutely have to.
Tall
I have found in these Realms it is better to "avoid" than to fight. Usually you can slip around the wandering bad guys if you time it right and only fight when you absolutely have to.
Tall
Maximumraver
Elemental Attunement + Fire Attunement
freekedoutfish
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Maximumraver
Elemental Attunement + Fire Attunement
|
I had realised that one. But considering it takes about 35-40 energy to get off meteor shower and invocation, PLUS the extra time it takes to cast it due to other effects....
....even with the elemental attunement on its still rendered useless.
You cant even get skills off in time before clerics get their protection spells off, and then your stuff at deeling them dmg.
Yes changing my build is an idea.
But to what? on average most ele skills take around 15-25 energy. With needing 40% more due to area effects, even the 10 energy ones need about 15 energy, so imagine what there rest need.
Its also the waiting time for your energy to re-gen before you can use your skills.
I had that all nicely timed outside of the realm of torment. Now it takes almost half longer to use a skill.
I understand they want to increase the difficulty. But the lvl24-28 mobs do that well enough, so why punish the spell casters?
Warriors once again can sing and dance.
Its not impossible to play, but it makes it very frustrating when you cant do dmg and your having to skip around every mob you can.
And when you do find a mob, a second one tends to be walking round the corner to join in.
Sister Brianne
Try air
Maximumraver
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by freekedoutfish
I had realised that one. But considering it takes about 35-40 energy to get off meteor shower and invocation, PLUS the extra time it takes to cast it due to other effects.... ....even with the elemental attunement on its still rendered useless. |
Cybah
air is not worth the energy in pve. even water and earth are better here (cause of hexes and wards)
freekedoutfish
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Maximumraver
Do you then get 80% of that cost back or only 80% of the original cost?
|
But it doesnt really equal out, when you consider it takes longer just to cast a pell in the realm of torment.
By which time the enemy could have moved, or rased a protection spell against spells.
You do still do alot of dmg once you get your spells off, but its alot harder to do so when your stood there for an extra 2 or 3 seconds clicking a skill which isnt working because you still need 40% more energy.
Plus the longer it takes to cast, the easier it is for someone to interupt it or knock you over and then you feel like screaming because your skill is wasted (yes i use glypth of concentration).
YunSooJin
That's why its known as the Realm of Torment.
A bigger issue is the retarded AI, but that's for another thread.
A bigger issue is the retarded AI, but that's for another thread.
Bankai
It only takes longer to cast in 1 area of the Realm of torment.
Sora
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Maximumraver
Do you then get 80% of that cost back or only 80% of the original cost?
|
Deleet
So this area is hard?
Good, it's end-game.
Using any class that requires energy is hard here.
Good, it's end-game.
Using any class that requires energy is hard here.
Shadis
With so much melee hate the game has thrown at people since Prophecies, it's only right that casters feel some of the pain as well. 
jimmy_logic
Yeah... those Fingers hurted 
xuemin
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Maximumraver
Do you then get 80% of that cost back or only 80% of the original cost?
|
only thing you can really do is slow the pace down to regen inbetween and bring a hero/hench/player with BR or BIP
Terra Xin
The penalty from the Realm of Torment applies to all classes, and the only care that the OP has is how it affects Nukers... *clap*
I don't know what to say... does: "suck it up you pansy!" do it?
I don't know what to say... does: "suck it up you pansy!" do it?
Lampshade
It's hard? OH NOES!!! I never had any problems. Just use the right build (paragons and necros can help if you REALLY need energy)
But if you play smart you'll be fine.
But if you play smart you'll be fine.
dgb
Bring EW? Oh noes it's logic coming to kill us!!!
Honestly, it's an environmental effect designed to make the area tough as it should be, not to kill your precious NUKAH!1!
Honestly, it's an environmental effect designed to make the area tough as it should be, not to kill your precious NUKAH!1!
explodemyheart
All of this whining since Nightfall, it's getting ridiculous. I wasn't around the forums when Factions was released, was it this bad then too? Dear lord.
Honestly, everybody I see complaining are people that are too lazy or unwilling to come up with a solution to their problem. You're presented with a problem, fix it! Don't come here and whine about how it's so hard, or impossible, or Anet should nerf it. Fix the problem. If you can't come up with a solution yourself, ask someone else if they have any ideas for a solution.
I finished the game first on my nuker. The only time I had a problem with the Realm of Torment was the first time I zoned out into it before I knew what the area effect did. My whole party wiped, we decided to go back and start over and I fixed my build accordingly. Yeah, it's annoying when a meteor shower takes 36 energy, but if you fix your build, it's workable. The warrior and monk in my party ended up having worse energy problems than I did.
Here's an idea: don't target them? ZOMG. Apparently you don't pay attention to the way that the casters, meaning the sorcerers and warlocks, bunch around the clerics. Instead, maybe you should target a sorcerer or warlock and then you won't have just spent 36 energy and 9 million minutes casting a spell, just to have it rendered useless because the cleric put spellbreaker on itself.
There's so many solutions, it's ridiculous. Double attune, use glyphs, don't double meteor shower but instead, echo something like fireball so you can spam that instead. Take a better party setup so that they don't have to rely on you double nuking just to be able to kill things.
Honestly, everybody I see complaining are people that are too lazy or unwilling to come up with a solution to their problem. You're presented with a problem, fix it! Don't come here and whine about how it's so hard, or impossible, or Anet should nerf it. Fix the problem. If you can't come up with a solution yourself, ask someone else if they have any ideas for a solution.
I finished the game first on my nuker. The only time I had a problem with the Realm of Torment was the first time I zoned out into it before I knew what the area effect did. My whole party wiped, we decided to go back and start over and I fixed my build accordingly. Yeah, it's annoying when a meteor shower takes 36 energy, but if you fix your build, it's workable. The warrior and monk in my party ended up having worse energy problems than I did.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by freekedoutfish
You cant even get skills off in time before clerics get their protection spells off, and then your stuff at deeling them dmg.
|
There's so many solutions, it's ridiculous. Double attune, use glyphs, don't double meteor shower but instead, echo something like fireball so you can spam that instead. Take a better party setup so that they don't have to rely on you double nuking just to be able to kill things.
Terra Xin
Quote:
| All of this whining since Nightfall, it's getting ridiculous. I wasn't around the forums when Factions was released, was it this bad then too? Dear lord. |
Mathias Deathwater
Yes, builds that rely solely on high energy skills are much less useful in this area. This is why we were given the blessing called the save templates button, which allows you to save you nuking build, and go try something else that would be far more effective in such an environment. Really, the margonites are so bad that the only "nuke" you really need is lightbringer's gaze, leaving you with many options (especially if you have ether prodigy.) The fact is, although it is good to know a build well, I really think these areas were designed to get people to try different builds to overcome the areas special problems. And besides, it's not just nuking, ever tried a defensive sprit spam build there without attuned? It's not gonna happen.
Avarre
I feel that the Domain of Secrets was implemented just to teach people that 'when I have 0 energy, the mob is dead!' is not a standard method of managing your energy. I run nuker henchmen there when farming margonites, glyphs and attunes help immensely.
I also do not run any 25e spells, out of common sense. The more you use, the more you lose out there. Fortunately as Mathias mentioned - Margonites have paper mache armor and foam weapons.
I also do not run any 25e spells, out of common sense. The more you use, the more you lose out there. Fortunately as Mathias mentioned - Margonites have paper mache armor and foam weapons.
biofrog
Yah, really just use energizing wind.. even the monks will be able to get a use out of it then!
Perfect way to mass-counter the effect, with the minimal inconvenience of slightly longer cast times (which just means you drop a double attune for the EW and take an extra damage skill instead to keep the DPS up)
Not having tried it in there tho, I think it would still be:
25 energy skill, plus 40% from area, minus 15 from EW = 20 per cast?
Still a saving of 5 (or a 10 mana skill would still take 10 instead of 14)
Perfect way to mass-counter the effect, with the minimal inconvenience of slightly longer cast times (which just means you drop a double attune for the EW and take an extra damage skill instead to keep the DPS up)
Not having tried it in there tho, I think it would still be:
25 energy skill, plus 40% from area, minus 15 from EW = 20 per cast?
Still a saving of 5 (or a 10 mana skill would still take 10 instead of 14)
lg5000
I messed up didn't I? I took an illusion mes through that and didn't even realise we were under energy restraints till I got through it.. sure I ran out of energy, but I figured that was cause I was casting spells too fast
Rera
...
Two things:
1) If you aren't monking, don't complain
2) Change your builds
Think about it for a second. If your skills take an extra 3s to recharge in one area, bring skills with longer recharges. The +3s hurts the most on spam skills, because it can double or even triple their recharge in many cases. This actually hurts warriors the most, because skills that are recharging don't gain adrenaline. If your skills cost an extra 40%, take skills with lower costs. 40% of 25e is a lot. 40% of 5e is not so much.
At least you have an area where you aren't really affect (15% less healing). Monks get shafted in pretty much every area, and their job was a lot harder than anyone else's to begin with, even without the environmental effects.
Two things:
1) If you aren't monking, don't complain
2) Change your builds
Think about it for a second. If your skills take an extra 3s to recharge in one area, bring skills with longer recharges. The +3s hurts the most on spam skills, because it can double or even triple their recharge in many cases. This actually hurts warriors the most, because skills that are recharging don't gain adrenaline. If your skills cost an extra 40%, take skills with lower costs. 40% of 25e is a lot. 40% of 5e is not so much.
At least you have an area where you aren't really affect (15% less healing). Monks get shafted in pretty much every area, and their job was a lot harder than anyone else's to begin with, even without the environmental effects.
Zinger314
My MM Hero has had no problems and can constantly keep a full army of Minions in the Domain of Secrets. I haven't noticed any problems with my Searing Flames hero.
0mar
I thought the Domains were the coolest part of Nightfall. It really introduced another aspect that you had to watch out for and made every battle even more intense 
Quit whining and play the game! I swear, some of you guys will never be happy until the monsters kill themselves as you approach.
Quit whining and play the game! I swear, some of you guys will never be happy until the monsters kill themselves as you approach.
Talic
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Cybah
air is not worth the energy in pve. even water and earth are better here (cause of hexes and wards)
|
freekedoutfish
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by explodemyheart
Don't come here and whine about how it's so hard, or impossible, or Anet should nerf it.
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by explodemyheart
Here's an idea: don't target them? ZOMG. Apparently you don't pay attention to the way that the casters, meaning the sorcerers and warlocks, bunch around the clerics. Instead, maybe you should target a sorcerer or warlock and then you won't have just spent 36 energy and 9 million minutes casting a spell, just to have it rendered useless because the cleric put spellbreaker on itself.
|
I probably will change my build, but I was just trying to make the point that the realm of torment seems to try and put more pressure on casters.
And YES I DID SAY CASTERS in my OP. It may have been more orientated towards my ele and his skills, but I DID mention that it effects ALL casters.
So NO, im not completely ignorant to the effects it has on healers and alike.
Drazilus
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Zinger314
My MM Hero has had no problems and can constantly keep a full army of Minions in the Domain of Secrets. I haven't noticed any problems with my Searing Flames hero.
|
It seems that Veiled Nightmare does not affect to heroes. So they dont get that energy cost penalty there. Spotted that thing when i was checking my MM hero energy usage.
freekedoutfish
Actually heres a question!
Do the area effects, effect the creatures you fight?
If not, its a bit unfiar. Which is a justified comment.
Do the area effects, effect the creatures you fight?
If not, its a bit unfiar. Which is a justified comment.
vojnik
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by 0mar
Quit whining and play the game! I swear, some of you guys will never be happy until the monsters kill themselves as you approach.
|
(five char)
aron searle
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by freekedoutfish
Actually heres a question!
Do the area effects, effect the creatures you fight? If not, its a bit unfiar. Which is a justified comment. |
Infinity^
darwin in action
freekedoutfish
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by aron searle
Now your just grasping at straws
|
.Besides, I said i like the realm of torment, its cool and original and I dont care about the mobs.
Its just the area effects which I find a bit excessive.
Avarre
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Zinger314
My MM Hero has had no problems and can constantly keep a full army of Minions in the Domain of Secrets. I haven't noticed any problems with my Searing Flames hero.
|
Ah, Drazilus mentioned it already.
Theus
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Talic
You have got to be kidding.
|
I've gotten through this game quite easily using an Air Based Zhed.Turning him into my own personal Blind Bot...Which is great in places like the Realm of Torment to blind the Ranger monsters or the Dervish ones.
not to mention the fact that I raped Varesh with him.
Eilsys
My Sever Artery/Power Attack build doesn't hit against those archers with Whirling Defense, in Nightfall! I understand wands and bows don't hit either, but I take FOUR DAMAGE, and they don't take any!
WHY ANET, WHY?
WHY ANET, WHY?
Pebbles
Really? My ele had no major problem there. The only area I had horrible problems with was in the first area.
"all skills take +3 Seconds to recharge" This might seem minior wheather its intentional or not it completely fuccxxed my Fire build. Glyph of renewal won't function. at all, It looked like after I fired metor It was recharged for a second but then after casting it was disabled for 33seconds. whitch is really harsh.
Archane echo dosen't function normally either. (Although I hate echo builds)
Wasn't so bad tho, just asked to go back at the start and I just switched to my double attuned flashbot build and I was still able to help the team with vast blinding and weakening of overpowered foes. aswell as kicking off sizable chunks of health of foes.
The area your complaining about only irriated me once. that was when I was already low on energy, I was around 22/84 energy (And if im getting low i'm not gonna fire off 25e spells.) Fire attunement on its own stops my energy dropping too low. Only that time somthing decided to shatter it as is the overall trend in nightfall ¬_¬
"all skills take +3 Seconds to recharge" This might seem minior wheather its intentional or not it completely fuccxxed my Fire build. Glyph of renewal won't function. at all, It looked like after I fired metor It was recharged for a second but then after casting it was disabled for 33seconds. whitch is really harsh.
Archane echo dosen't function normally either. (Although I hate echo builds)
Wasn't so bad tho, just asked to go back at the start and I just switched to my double attuned flashbot build and I was still able to help the team with vast blinding and weakening of overpowered foes. aswell as kicking off sizable chunks of health of foes.
The area your complaining about only irriated me once. that was when I was already low on energy, I was around 22/84 energy (And if im getting low i'm not gonna fire off 25e spells.) Fire attunement on its own stops my energy dropping too low. Only that time somthing decided to shatter it as is the overall trend in nightfall ¬_¬