PvE debate: Eviscerate vs. Triple Chop

Grammar

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Aug 2005

18 Nov 2006 at 05:45 - 1

The problem with these two skills is that I love them both.

So help me solve the raging battle going on in my head.

First off, this isn't really a debate between Eviscerate and Triple Chop, but rather a debate between the following combos:
Eviscerate + Cylone Axe vs. Triple Chop + Dismember
(Executioners and Furious Axe are added to both combos so I'll leave them out of the debate)
Basically, if I bring Triple Chop for my AoE skill I'll need to bring Dismember for my deep wound skill, and if I bring Eviscerate for my deep wound skill I'll need to bring Cyclone Axe for my AoE skill.

So which elite upgrade is more worth it?
Upgrade from Cyclone Axe to Triple Chop, or upgrade from Dismember to Eviscerate?

Just curious what you guys think (keep in mind this is for PvE). Thanks.

Dzus

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jan 2006

Order of Corrupted Souls [OoCS]

W/

18 Nov 2006 at 07:19 - 2

With the changes to the UI displaying damage, go with Triple Chop.

BOOM! NUMBERS! =D

Darkpower Alchemist

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Jan 2006

NYC

The Circle Of Nine[NINE]

E/N

18 Nov 2006 at 07:33 - 3

Well, Triple Chop and Eviscerate have 2 totally different uses and 2 totally different applications.

Triple Chop hits multiple opponents, making it more effective in Pve/mob related combat. Eviscerate is a single opponent skill.

I,myself,have used Triple Chop+Cyclone Axe in PvE. In PvP it would be eviscerate+ executionor's strike.

[skill=big]Eviscerate[/skill]

[skill=big]Dismember[/skill]

The elite dwarfs the regular, so if it's about which you should use, that would be obvious for the reason of useful application. However,I would say it depends on what you are doing and the opponents you plan on confronting.

Phoenix Arrows

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Mar 2006

With many other ugly people

We Are All Pretty [ugly]

R/

18 Nov 2006 at 21:33 - 4

Triple Chop is nice for PvE. +30something damage in an AoE every 10 seconds. Eviscerate seems not that great for PvE, as Deep Wound on one target isn't that effective.

Thom Bangalter

Grindin'

Join Date: Dec 2005

MO

E/Mo

19 Nov 2006 at 02:10 - 5

I actually don't like eviscerate that much in pve. I've found by the time I've gotten it charged up, the thing I was trying to kill is near death and it is a waste, and if you're up against groups of 3 or 4, everything is almost dead. Which is why I almost like cleave better. Though Dragon slash is really the way to go for pve.

kazjun

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Aug 2006

HoVa

W/N

20 Nov 2006 at 11:29 - 6

Triple chop and a zealous axe go well, with dismember to speed things along. I wouldn't use evis in pve unless you were farming bosses.

Timore

Academy Page

Join Date: Jul 2006

Windsor/Ontario

The Intervention Of Fire

W/Mo

20 Nov 2006 at 17:42 - 7

i go with the triple chop and axe cyclone and bring ex strike and Dismember
for those guys that just wont die. Eve is a stupid skill for pve unless you are farming bosses. Well thats what i think

Reinfire

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: May 2006

Amsterdam, NL

The Guild of Cunning Artificiers [ANKH]

W/

20 Nov 2006 at 17:50 - 8

I much more prefer Cleave+dismember above those other options, but since that was not choosable, ill remain neutral

Longasc

Forge Runner

Join Date: May 2005

20 Nov 2006 at 20:16 - 9

Triple Chop affects multiple enemies, and in PvE you fight multiple enemies at once.

It builds up adrenaline quickly, goes well with Cyclone Axe and Dismember and a zealous axe.

With Eviscerate you lose one means to build up adrenaline. You save the Dismember slot, but the point is that Triple Chop is a high-damaging, fast recharging AoE attack that also generates adrenaline.

I could say a lot more, but who uses Eviscerate in "normal" PvE except some special farming situation must have confused it with PvP where spike damage is much more needed and you rarely find 3+ targets all around you in range of Triple Chop.

Grammar

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Aug 2005

21 Nov 2006 at 00:22 - 10

Very interesting feedback. Much appreciated.

I guess what I'm still struggling with is balancing adren attacks and energy attacks.
I carry 4 attack skills, Flail (adren), Watch Yourself (adren), Heal Sig, and a rez. I also wear full Glads armor and use a zealous mod.
Because of the this setup, I've found it most effective to carry 2 adren attack skills and 2 energy attack skills.
To most people, the simple solution is this: Triple Chop (energy), Cylone Axe (energy), Dismember (adren), and Executioners (adren).

The problem is, these people apparently haven't discovered the newly reworked Furious Axe (energy) yet.
In terms of single-target damage, Furious Axe completely outclasses Triple Chop. On top of that, you probably noticed that my above setup leaves no room for Wild Blow/Swift Chop. Another reason for Furious Axe to be on the bar.
All in all, I'm having trouble dropping Furious Axe from my bar for the ever-popular Triple Chop + Cyclone Axe combo, and running all 3 is obviously too energy heavy.

I suppose the remaining option would be this: Triple Chop, Furious Axe, Dismember, Executioners. But Cyclone Axe just seems like too good of a skill to leave off the bar.
I guess I'll just have to keep tinkering.

In the meantime, one last question...
Seriously, did no one else notice the major buff to Furious Axe in the Nightfall update?
Outside of Eviscerate, Decapitate, and Cleave (all elite), it's now the the highest DPS'ing Axe attack in the game.

Grammar

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Aug 2005

21 Nov 2006 at 02:22 - 11

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grammar
I suppose the remaining option would be this: Triple Chop, Furious Axe, Dismember, Executioners. Sorry to quote myself, but I gave that combo and try and I'm loving it. I can use Triple Chop and Furious Axe immediately upon recharge and never run out of energy, even with Triple Chop hitting just 1 foe every time.
The same can't be said for Cyclone Axe, which I almost never spammed upon recharge (would drain energy too much and result in a few "wiffs" here and there).
Losing the +33 damage from my deep wound skill isn't so bad considering I can get deep wound onto more people now.
Overall I'm fairly satified with the results. You guys were right about Eviscerate being unnecessary in PvE, especially with the buff to Dismember.

My Furious Axe question still stands though, lol. (come on people! +37 damage, 6 sec. recharge, +3 adren if blocked or evaded!)

A Leprechaun

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Feb 2006

W/

21 Nov 2006 at 09:41 - 12

but then you havent thought about critical chop yet - one of the greatest NF warrior skills - 5e 1/2cast 10 recharge +31 dmg if it crits (which it does quite a lot ) you interrupt them - the interrupt is pretty lame but the extra dmg in a half second cast is insane for spiking

Grammar

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Aug 2005

21 Nov 2006 at 17:33 - 13

But spiking isn't important in PVE (which this thread is about); DPS is what's important.

Furious Axe does more damage than Critical Chop, and has a shorter recharge time.
Critical Chop is pretty fun to play with in PvP spikes (Eviscerate -> Executioners -> Critical Chop), but Furious Axe is far superior in PvE.

A Leprechaun

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Feb 2006

W/

21 Nov 2006 at 19:16 - 14

^ your right PvE is not about spiking but i think you can get DoT covered with your other ** attack skills whereas icluding an attack to spike the last bit of monks health off so you can move on to the dmg dealers ripping into your backline is also , i feel, very important
^^
~A Leprechaun~

Draxx

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: May 2006

England Baby!

24 Nov 2006 at 13:12 - 15

Eviscerate was Fantastic when it was 6 Adren...

Now that its 8 its still a Good Skill but i think Triple Chop is better... Within a PvE Enviroment anyway.

Bowstring Badass

Forge Runner

Join Date: Nov 2005

Character selection screen figuring what I want to play...

Purple Lingerie - :D

24 Nov 2006 at 13:18 - 16

AoE warrior attacks are crap seriously Triple Chop is alright in PvE and some forms of PvP (like aspenwood if you want to call it PvP). Eviscerate > Triple Chop any day.

Silk Weaver

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jun 2006

Hong Kong

Romantically Lethal [RoLe]

R/Mo

24 Nov 2006 at 13:25 - 17

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bowstring Badass
AoE warrior attacks are crap seriously Triple Chop is alright in PvE and some forms of PvP (like aspenwood if you want to call it PvP). Eviscerate > Triple Chop any day. It's a PvE debate. Learn to read. Cyclone Axe is staple for PvE axe already, right?

A Leprechaun

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Feb 2006

W/

24 Nov 2006 at 15:03 - 18

@ bowstring badass
And we have to remeber that the dmg is not the only thing to come with triple chop and cyclone axe you gain a shed load of adrenaline to if you have a few foes around you thus enabling you not onyl to deal dmg with the starting attack but then go on to spam adrenal attacks until the cows come home

~A Leprechaun~

jesh

Forge Runner

Join Date: May 2005

San Diego, CA

Penguin Village

Mo/

25 Nov 2006 at 00:18 - 19

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thom Bangalter
I actually don't like eviscerate that much in pve. I've found by the time I've gotten it charged up, the thing I was trying to kill is near death and it is a waste, and if you're up against groups of 3 or 4, everything is almost dead. Which is why I almost like cleave better. Though Dragon slash is really the way to go for pve. I just wanted to point out the Dragonslash is more adrenaline than Eviscerate.
Furious Axe looks nice for .. well I'm not sure what for. It would be nice for a build that relies mostly on adrenaline, but um guess what. If you're using Triple Chop and Cyclone, you won't have much energy left, and you'll have no shortage of adrenaline. I would rather use Counter Attack with those two skills.
As for replacing Cyclone with it? Thanks but no thanks. I'd rather have *unconditional* adrenaline. Sure the number may not be as large above a single target, but 2 targets close to you means you've already gotten more out of that 5 energy. Area effect skills are simply more efficient in PvE. If you can't get 2 targets all the time with Cyclone.. well then you really need to work on your positioning abilities.

*Eviscerate does less damage than Triple Chop
*Eviscerate also drops deep wound
*Dismember is 5 adrenaline strikes, and also applies deep wound
*Dismember can be applied more often than Eviscerate

What is there to decide on? Triple Chop gives you more damage and with Dismember, more deep wounds. Eviscerate is nice in PvP, I won't argue with that. That's because spiking is useful. In PvE, Eviscerate is simply subpar. It's like using Flurry on your shock axe in PvP.

Silk Weaver

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jun 2006

Hong Kong

Romantically Lethal [RoLe]

R/Mo

25 Nov 2006 at 02:53 - 20

Uhm. Zealous Axe Haft.

Turbobusa

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jan 2006

By the Luxon Scavenger

The Mentalists [THPK]

N/

25 Nov 2006 at 10:15 - 21

Quote:
Originally Posted by jesh

Area effect skills are simply more efficient in PvE. except in the torment. You don't want X monsters more, do you?
I agree with the fact that when you just finish to fill Eviscerate, you target is almost dead in most cases, though

jesh

Forge Runner

Join Date: May 2005

San Diego, CA

Penguin Village

Mo/

25 Nov 2006 at 10:42 - 22

Haven't played that far, I wouldn't know.

Slim

Academy Page

Join Date: Feb 2006

Forever Knights

Me/

25 Nov 2006 at 17:22 - 23

I would go with Triple Chop in PvE because it deals spike damage to multiple targets as opposed to Eviscerate dealing spike damage to one target, and in PvE in most cases you are going to want to be doing damage to everyone in your way.

Evilsod

Banned

Join Date: Mar 2006

England

Lievs Death Squad [LDS]

25 Nov 2006 at 17:36 - 24

I'd rather take Triple Chop and Cyclone Axe (and Dismember). As good as Eviscerate is, if you miss with it thanks to Blurred Vision or anything like that you've lost the bonus damage and the deep wound. Dismember is nicely spammable (probably once every 4 seconds at least).

Spikes really aren't that needed in PvE, especially adren spikes. Ranger spike or Searingway are both nicely powerful and can be done in the first few seconds of fighting. Against Margonites or Torments, the first few seconds of fighting is usually what decides your fate, Triple Chop is a powerful sustainable DPS and can still semi spike w/ Dismember+Triple Chop.