Surely this must have been mentioned before, but I couldn't find any threads about. But here it goes:
Why is the money capped at 100k for a character? Isn't that kind of lame?
Why capped at 100k?
eriktheman
King Kong
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Originally Posted by eriktheman
Why is the money capped at 100k for a character? Isn't that kind of lame?
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DergeDraconis
I think they took an average of what most people have overall and made that the max on what 1 character could hold
bungusmaximus
I think there's a technical explanation for that. A player's inventory is an entry in the large GW database, the reason why theres a limit is mainly storage issues. It takes more resources to store a 4 digit number then a 3 digit number, the bigger the number, the more room it takes, that costs. It's because of the same reason that you can't have unlimited character slots, you have to buy them instead with a perfectly valid reason: Storage room is money.
Mr_T_bot
It was an attempt to control inflation, but since no other thorough attempts to aid in stopping it were carried out, it is now just a hindrance.
I can't possibly be the most veteran person in this game still -_-
I can't possibly be the most veteran person in this game still -_-
JGaff
Your storage is capped at 1000k. After that, start stockpiling ectos. Most people don't have 100k+ to throw around (seeing as a good chunk of the population are more casual gamers...
Feathers
With a 1000 K you can put in your stash, why excatly do you need to be able to have 100K on your person ? The only thing or reason I can possibly think of is the EBAY sellers that abuse the game to sell things for real money. In my book that's just plain sad !
TideSwayer
Lack of forward thinking.
It's a problem that haunts many of GW's flaws, and this is no exception. Simply put, many of the things people have problems with in GW is because the game has simply outgrown many of the older limitations. Storage space is another good example of this. (Don't tell ANet that though. They won't believe you.)
It's a problem that haunts many of GW's flaws, and this is no exception. Simply put, many of the things people have problems with in GW is because the game has simply outgrown many of the older limitations. Storage space is another good example of this. (Don't tell ANet that though. They won't believe you.)
Antheus
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Originally Posted by bungusmaximus
I think there's a technical explanation for that. A player's inventory is an entry in the large GW database, the reason why theres a limit is mainly storage issues. It takes more resources to store a 4 digit number then a 3 digit number, the bigger the number, the more room it takes, that costs. It's because of the same reason that you can't have unlimited character slots, you have to buy them instead with a perfectly valid reason: Storage room is money.
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Your post makes DBAs cry.
For the record, money wasn't capped at launch, or if it was, it was at least 1 million (it's been a while, but I know some had 500k or similar ammounts in inventory)
The only boundaries which make sense are 255, 65535 and 4294967295.
EternalTempest
Upping the cap will cause inflation of high priced items to go even higher.
200k limit turns in to WTS 200k + Ecto for X
200k limit turns in to WTS 200k + Ecto for X
Coridan
it will also affect the price of ectos as that is the standard barter item...which is the reason they are worth more than other "crafting materials"
garethporlest18
It'd be 200k+1e instead of 100k+13e.
It wouldn't effect ecto prices that much, people just wouldn't buy them as much probably driving the price down a bit.
It wouldn't effect ecto prices that much, people just wouldn't buy them as much probably driving the price down a bit.
Gonzo
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Originally Posted by bungusmaximus
I think there's a technical explanation for that. A player's inventory is an entry in the large GW database, the reason why theres a limit is mainly storage issues. It takes more resources to store a 4 digit number then a 3 digit number, the bigger the number, the more room it takes, that costs. It's because of the same reason that you can't have unlimited character slots, you have to buy them instead with a perfectly valid reason: Storage room is money.
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manitoba1073
The real reason why a chars cap is 100k is because that is the most you can pay for any 1 item from an NPC. There is no other reasons for it. dont listen to anyones speculation as that is the reason.
lishi
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Originally Posted by bungusmaximus
I think there's a technical explanation for that. A player's inventory is an entry in the large GW database, the reason why theres a limit is mainly storage issues. It takes more resources to store a 4 digit number then a 3 digit number, the bigger the number, the more room it takes, that costs. It's because of the same reason that you can't have unlimited character slots, you have to buy them instead with a perfectly valid reason: Storage room is money.
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storage space are cheap to come now probably even any post of this thread will use more storage then your account.
btw.
anet use probably 4 bit or bigger (if they use 2bit the max will be something near 65535).
the max number a 4 bit can use is 4194303. no they reason are another.
natuxatu
I don't think you need more money than that anyway.
Plus gaile said you can use ecto/gems whatever as an additonal way of paying money... but frankly anything in this game you can get less than 100k if you wait and search. That said you can also have money in your storage so it's no big deal. If people take it more seriously than that well.. I wont be rude but I think they would be better off with a different game because clearly they have time on their hands to play a more time consuming mmorpg.
Plus gaile said you can use ecto/gems whatever as an additonal way of paying money... but frankly anything in this game you can get less than 100k if you wait and search. That said you can also have money in your storage so it's no big deal. If people take it more seriously than that well.. I wont be rude but I think they would be better off with a different game because clearly they have time on their hands to play a more time consuming mmorpg.
mrgoat
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Originally Posted by lishi
storage space is never a probrem.
storage space are cheap to come now probably even any post of this thread will use more storage then your account. |
To understand why storage space is limited, take the amount of space it takes to hold one account (which has to account for space used to store things characters may not have yet, IE: waste), then multiply that by three million.
Maybe you just think space is cheap because, say, consumer hardware is cheap right now? I assure you, Arenanet isn't just stacking 200gig SATA drives in their data center.
SilentAssassin
well in total you can store up to as much as you want, just need to buy new char slots 
Hand of Ruin
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Originally Posted by mrgoat
Storage space is always a problem. Storage space is not cheap at all, not even right now, and your GW account probably takes up more space than your post.
To understand why storage space is limited, take the amount of space it takes to hold one account (which has to account for space used to store things characters may not have yet, IE: waste), then multiply that by three million. Maybe you just think space is cheap because, say, consumer hardware is cheap right now? I assure you, Arenanet isn't just stacking 200gig SATA drives in their data center. |
I'm willing to bet that all the accounts for a particular region can be stored in a 200g drive.
teklys
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Originally Posted by Antheus
Please, never go work anywhere near IT on any level.
Your post makes DBAs cry. |
Cygnus_Zero
I agree it's ridiculous, but it is what it is so we move forward using ectos as money. It's completely ghetto that we have to do that but there's no other way.
Shanaeri Rynale
The 100K limit really makes no sense now. Most traders like myself use ecto at the trader price-1k to make up for the cash limit. So lets say someone buys an item for 100K+100 ecto(not unheard of btw). If that person has to buy the ecto from a trader then the transaction will cost them between 50 and 100K extra just to get around this limit.
Of course the 1000K limit forces people to hoard ecto, making the losses due to conversion probably more.
In addition I would like to bet more people have been scammed due to these limits than any other reason in the game.
In data storage terms 1000 plat would take up no more space than 2000 etc, so the only logical reason is for economic reasons. Which are kinda defunct as people use ecto to work around it.
Of course the 1000K limit forces people to hoard ecto, making the losses due to conversion probably more.
In addition I would like to bet more people have been scammed due to these limits than any other reason in the game.
In data storage terms 1000 plat would take up no more space than 2000 etc, so the only logical reason is for economic reasons. Which are kinda defunct as people use ecto to work around it.
mrgoat
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Originally Posted by Hand of Ruin
Not really... all the data anet has to store is compressed... why do you think our gw.dat files are nearly 4 gig? We store all the large shit, and the servers only store the numbers.
I'm willing to bet that all the accounts for a particular region can be stored in a 200g drive. |
Please think about what you're saying before you make ludicrous claims. 100k is a weird number to pick if you're worried about database space, that much is true though.
What they're likely doing is storing heavily-tweaked binary packed data in the various database fields, and just twiddling bits. That sort of thing doesn't tend to compress very well anyway.
lishi
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Originally Posted by mrgoat
I'm willing to bet that all the accounts for a particular region cannot be stored in a 200g drive. It is also unlikely that it's all stored compressed, as the servers would need to uncompress, use, recompress, and store that data constantly, and this a transactional database they're using. That means a huge increase in processing time for compression, which would require more money. I can't think of any reason to store your tables in compressed form, when they're in active use constantly.
Please think about what you're saying before you make ludicrous claims. 100k is a weird number to pick if you're worried about database space, that much is true though. What they're likely doing is storing heavily-tweaked binary packed data in the various database fields, and just twiddling bits. That sort of thing doesn't tend to compress very well anyway. |
10°000 * 3°000°000 = 30°000°000°000
wow my notebook can store it.
now anet is probably using some high perfomance and high reliable raid disk system who might even cost 100x or 1000x my notebook hard disk.
but this isnt the point.
We live in a era of terabytes if anet have probrem to find 10kb for each account then they have a probrem.
(if you think 10k isnt much think it as 100k the reasoning dont change)
if anet
w00t!
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Originally Posted by Cygnus_Zero
I agree it's ridiculous, but it is what it is so we move forward using ectos as money. It's completely ghetto that we have to do that but there's no other way.
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In any event, the limit is just fine. Probably 99.9% of the players will never come close to reaching the cap, and ectos are great for bartering around the limit. The above 100k limit can be managed around by trading ectos back and forth for cash too, so you can actually pay cash for any mount up to 1+ million.
And so what if it is slightly inefficient? Gold sinks are not bad, and inventive people have stepped in to facilitate high value trades.
These are all signs of a vibrant economy.
Mr_T_bot
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Originally Posted by Shanaeri Rynale
In data storage terms 1000 plat would take up no more space than 2000 etc, so the only logical reason is for economic reasons. Which are kinda defunct as people use ecto to work around it.
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IT WAS PUT IN AS A CAP TO HURT INFLATION
Some Guru Named Kai
Anet was running out of things to "nerf". 
shardfenix
The cap is 100k because it limits item prices.
MerLock
If people stop buying things over 100k, then you wouldn't be seeing things 100K + x ectos. 
leprekan
Simple solution ... everyone give me all thier gold above 90k. I am here to help
Antheus
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Originally Posted by leprekan
Simple solution ... everyone give me all thier gold above 90k. I am here to help
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mrgoat
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Originally Posted by lishi
ok lets say an account is 10 kb
10°000 * 3°000°000 = 30°000°000°000 wow my notebook can store it. now anet is probably using some high perfomance and high reliable raid disk system who might even cost 100x or 1000x my notebook hard disk. but this isnt the point. We live in a era of terabytes if anet have probrem to find 10kb for each account then they have a probrem. (if you think 10k isnt much think it as 100k the reasoning dont change) if anet |
That's three million megs, or, 2.8 terabytes. Lets add overhead on a transactional database, to ensure integrity, and rollback capability: 10 terabytes, right there, at least. Please do not underestimate the requirements to keep transaction logs. They are large.
Surely you can cram that on your run of the mill drive you picked up from best buy. No, you won't need a serious datacenter with specialized hardware to access 10 terabytes of data with sub 1 second access times. Yes, I'm sarcastic.
Like I said, please think before you claim it's "easy" or "cheap" to do what arenanet does. You're not a dba, and you're certainly not a dba well versed in data warehousing. If you were, you wouldn't have said what you said. If you are, and you said what you said, I wish you well when you get fired.
If you're so sure you can store, access, and process that data, why exactly haven't you offered arenanet your laptop up to help run Guild Wars? Surely you and your single core P3 with a 200gig drive can take care of all our lag problems.
Why, I bet I can run arenanet's datacenter on my old 286! I'll just stab a monkey with the power cord and we'll be good to go: saving arenanet enough money per year to retire to the carribean while putting out guildwars 2: electric boogaloo.
Let's have a go and see how that works out.
death fuzzy
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Originally Posted by JGaff
Your storage is capped at 1000k. After that, start stockpiling ectos. Most people don't have 100k+ to throw around (seeing as a good chunk of the population are more casual gamers...
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2000k when ch 4 comes out.
Yawgmoth
100kB data per account is actually pretty high estimate, i'm sure it's not more. But it doesn't matter in this topic.
The 100k gold limit per character and 1kk storage limit was a design choice. Technically it would be no problem at all to have it much much higher, but there were some other reasons to have them at that level.
Devs expected that there would be trades at over 100k with some items used as currency. So the limit doesn't affect the prices at all, if something is worth more than 100k people will find a way to make the deal and get around that limit.
I hate the limits myself but unfortunately for me I don't expect them to be increased.
The 100k gold limit per character and 1kk storage limit was a design choice. Technically it would be no problem at all to have it much much higher, but there were some other reasons to have them at that level.
Devs expected that there would be trades at over 100k with some items used as currency. So the limit doesn't affect the prices at all, if something is worth more than 100k people will find a way to make the deal and get around that limit.
I hate the limits myself but unfortunately for me I don't expect them to be increased.
phoenixtech
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Originally Posted by mrgoat
There's no way an account is 10k. No. Possible. Way. There's the unlocks, the map data for all three campaigns per character, the inventories (including dye colors on items), the builds, the unlocked skills per character, the quest logs and state data, all title tracks, etc. The list goes on. Let's say a whole account takes 1meg, an estimate on the very low side.
That's three million megs, or, 2.8 terabytes. Lets add overhead on a transactional database, to ensure integrity, and rollback capability: 10 terabytes, right there, at least. Please do not underestimate the requirements to keep transaction logs. They are large. Surely you can cram that on your run of the mill drive you picked up from best buy. No, you won't need a serious datacenter with specialized hardware to access 10 terabytes of data with sub 1 second access times. Yes, I'm sarcastic. Like I said, please think before you claim it's "easy" or "cheap" to do what arenanet does. You're not a dba, and you're certainly not a dba well versed in data warehousing. If you were, you wouldn't have said what you said. If you are, and you said what you said, I wish you well when you get fired. If you're so sure you can store, access, and process that data, why exactly haven't you offered arenanet your laptop up to help run Guild Wars? Surely you and your single core P3 with a 200gig drive can take care of all our lag problems. Why, I bet I can run arenanet's datacenter on my old 286! I'll just stab a monkey with the power cord and we'll be good to go: saving arenanet enough money per year to retire to the carribean while putting out guildwars 2: electric boogaloo. Let's have a go and see how that works out. |
EVEN if you were to assume that it really does take up 1 megabyte of storage. I'll give you a nice comparison. I can find multiple free-web based emails that will give me 1 GIGABYTE+ of storage and they prob have several MILLION customers. Keep in mind that most of these webmail service is provided for FREE. We pay GW every chapter and they can't store 100kb of data? Get serious.
foo
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Originally Posted by phoenixtech
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EVEN if you were to assume that it really does take up 1 megabyte of storage. I'll give you a nice comparison. I can find multiple free-web based emails that will give me 1 GIGABYTE+ of storage and they prob have several MILLION customers. Keep in mind that most of these webmail service is provided for FREE. We pay GW every chapter and they can't store 100kb of data? Get serious. |
Chris Blackstar
it's to protect the in game economy, and nothing else. With out a cap of some kind, players would have huge amounts of gold or items, and become banks, thus causing players to abandon normal play, and just go to them for money. It's bad enough to see items going for 100K+xx ectos, given that most ectos go for 6K between players, nothing in the game is worth 700K to 1000K. Personally I am glad there is a limit, it prevents people with too much time on there hands to minipulate the game and system, just because they have the attitude, "I can do it". Anet nerf it by bringing in titles, so players would abuse that instead of hording money. Now titles are a joke because of the players out there with the "I can do it" attitude, these are also the same type of players that are knowm as hackers, it's the only challenge out there for them.
Remember this game is supposed to be balenced, so the limit is just that, to increase it would be the same as if they decreased it, it would devalue the game economy.
Remember this game is supposed to be balenced, so the limit is just that, to increase it would be the same as if they decreased it, it would devalue the game economy.
Shanaeri Rynale
Thats the point, it's not protecting the economy, people just use another denomination of gold called an ecto. So why not do away with the limits since it's pointless.
It's a little like saying we'll limit everyones bank acount to 1000 dollars and if you want to spend more than that you need to use gold to make up the difference when all thats needed is to make a 1000 dollar bill.
It's a little like saying we'll limit everyones bank acount to 1000 dollars and if you want to spend more than that you need to use gold to make up the difference when all thats needed is to make a 1000 dollar bill.
Nexus Icon
Just to echo what phoenixtech has said, I'm willing to bet that the storage capacity for an account's storage space (not character information) is miniscule in data terms.
Ever wondered why material stacks are limited to 250?
8 bits of information make 1 Byte.
The maximum number of combinations for those 8 bits is 256.
So the numeric value of a given stack can be stored in 1 Byte of information.
We can be generous and assume that the necessary identifiers for a stack (colour, name, type, owner, etc.), are stored in an extra 3 Bytes.
That's 4 Bytes.
For 3 million accounts, that would be 12 million bytes.
There are 1024 Bytes in a KiloByte, so 12 million Bytes = 11,719KB (and that's rounded up).
There are 1024KB in a MegaByte, so 11,719KB = 12MB rounded up, uncompressed.
My my, that's a HUGE amount of disk space!
Really, the space occupied by user accounts on ANet's servers is probably trivial.
The more pertinent issue to those familiar with data, storage and networks is providing simultaneous access to that information for 3 million + accounts. That's some serious computing power and network/disk bandwidth required.
So in closing, storing user information is of barely any concern whatsoever, but providing access to that storage for all users is where things get complicated.
Ever wondered why material stacks are limited to 250?
8 bits of information make 1 Byte.
The maximum number of combinations for those 8 bits is 256.
So the numeric value of a given stack can be stored in 1 Byte of information.
We can be generous and assume that the necessary identifiers for a stack (colour, name, type, owner, etc.), are stored in an extra 3 Bytes.
That's 4 Bytes.
For 3 million accounts, that would be 12 million bytes.
There are 1024 Bytes in a KiloByte, so 12 million Bytes = 11,719KB (and that's rounded up).
There are 1024KB in a MegaByte, so 11,719KB = 12MB rounded up, uncompressed.
My my, that's a HUGE amount of disk space!
Really, the space occupied by user accounts on ANet's servers is probably trivial.
The more pertinent issue to those familiar with data, storage and networks is providing simultaneous access to that information for 3 million + accounts. That's some serious computing power and network/disk bandwidth required.
So in closing, storing user information is of barely any concern whatsoever, but providing access to that storage for all users is where things get complicated.
Anarion Silverhand
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Originally Posted by shardfenix
The cap is 100k because it limits item prices.
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Anet has many times said that this game isn't about having the phattest lewt, but it's all about player skill.