ok i have jsut borrowed this for another post ( im very sorry jesh, if u dont want this here jsut tell me ill remove it.)
***ALSO THIS IS IMPORTANT, I TAKE NO CREDIT FOR THE FOLLOWING TEXT, THIS HAS ALL COME FORM ANOTHER POST WITH SOME ONE MORE CLEVERER THAN ME POSTING IT. I JSUT BELIVE THAT IT WOUDL BENIFIT Xeones The Great, HERE AS HE COULD BE LES LIKELY TO READ IT ELSE WHERE, AL CRED IT SHOULD GO TO JESH NOT ME, THANK YOU*** ( have to make that clear :P)
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Originally Posted by jesh
A Few Questions
olly123
Light of Deliverance at 16 Healing Prayers heals for a maximum of 85*8= 680hp for 5 energy, which equates to 136hp per energy - very nice! The condition on Light of Deliverance, is of course, the party member has to be below 80% hp. Compare this to Word Of Healing - max of 84+106= 190hp for 5 energy, which equals 38 hp per energy. Notice that this is the same energy efficiency reached by healing only 1 other ally with Heal Area.
The conditions to reach large numbers with Light of Deliverance/Heal Area/Heal Party are also much easier to reach than with Word of Healing. Letting a target get to 50%hp often means they're already dead. so this to me makes it look like LoD s bettetr than WoH, per heal per energy
(again im sorry jesh, if u dissapore jsut tell me and ill remove it :P, i jsut belive he'll benafit form, it here)
The conditions to reach large numbers with Light of Deliverance/Heal Area/Heal Party are also much easier to reach than with Word of Healing. Letting a target get to 50%hp often means they're already dead. so this to me makes it look like LoD s bettetr than WoH, per heal per energy
(again im sorry jesh, if u dissapore jsut tell me and ill remove it :P, i jsut belive he'll benafit form, it here)
Burst Cancel
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Originally Posted by olly123
take what every one has said with a pinch of salt, because its manyly prefrences.
People need to stop saying that skill choice is 'player preference', because it usually isn't, and it definitely isn't in this case. You can argue definitively that for a given situation, spell X is better than spell Y, period. Consider the environment, run the numbers, and you get a solid answer.
For instance, LoD is nice in PvE because damage tends to be moderate and distributed. The 80% condition limits its efficiency somewhat, but LoD still beats many other elites even in non-optimal situations simply because its potential efficiency is so enormously high to begin with. The situation changes if you have a good team that can manage aggro. With such a team, you can reasonably expect that most of the damage will be concentrated on the tank. LoD is far less attractive here because you'll rarely get more than 75 out of it.
For instance, LoD is nice in PvE because damage tends to be moderate and distributed. The 80% condition limits its efficiency somewhat, but LoD still beats many other elites even in non-optimal situations simply because its potential efficiency is so enormously high to begin with. The situation changes if you have a good team that can manage aggro. With such a team, you can reasonably expect that most of the damage will be concentrated on the tank. LoD is far less attractive here because you'll rarely get more than 75 out of it.
Thom Bangalter
Lod on an otherwise traditional prot monk bar is hot.
Xeones The Great
again, LoD is out of question, because its a very little heal. personally, i dont give a crap about 680 total health healed. as burst said, if aggro is managed correctly, damage will usually focus on one person in pve. IMHO, LoD may be one of the worst heal elites out there, next to HH. consider this: what if one person is at 60% health, everyone else is near full. what a waste of an elite!!! also, i believe that even if damage is distributed, its just, imo, stupid to just spam a skill for every1 to gain hp. also, im going heal definitely, so ZB is out of question. so far, i havent been convinced that Word of Healing is not the most energy efficient healing elite out there. thanks.
ubard
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xeones The Great
again, LoD is out of question, because its a very little heal. personally, i dont give a crap about 680 total health healed. as burst said, if aggro is managed correctly, damage will usually focus on one person in pve. IMHO, LoD may be one of the worst heal elites out there, next to HH. consider this: what if one person is at 60% health, everyone else is near full. what a waste of an elite!!! also, i believe that even if damage is distributed, its just, imo, stupid to just spam a skill for every1 to gain hp. also, im going heal definitely, so ZB is out of question. so far, i havent been convinced that Word of Healing is not the most energy efficient healing elite out there. thanks.
it's pve. You need to be ready to play with utter nuts. (although i guess you could say the same about pug pvp.) 
LoD and Heal Party are the two best skills in the healing prayers line imo. A prot monk has to work to keep up with party-wide pressure most of the time, yet excels at the protection and healing of individual targets. PvE groups in the harder areas appear to be bringing a prot monk and a heal monk because party-wide healing is one of the only thing healers can do that prot monks can't. I love LoD in PvE. But this is just a suggestion sort of post, just trying my best to enlighten you
WoH is very outdated now, even glimmer of light overshadows that thing.
They way i see it is that LoD is to Heal Party what WoH is to Heal Other... except... even more efficient.
So, my suggestion for a build would either be a Mo/E ZB prot monk with Glyph of Lesser Energy, an LoD healer, or an HB Healer (with glyph heal party)
P.S. somebody feel free to tell me if my guesses about "top-level" pve monking is garbage. i havn't actually been into that new area at all yet.
LoD and Heal Party are the two best skills in the healing prayers line imo. A prot monk has to work to keep up with party-wide pressure most of the time, yet excels at the protection and healing of individual targets. PvE groups in the harder areas appear to be bringing a prot monk and a heal monk because party-wide healing is one of the only thing healers can do that prot monks can't. I love LoD in PvE. But this is just a suggestion sort of post, just trying my best to enlighten you
WoH is very outdated now, even glimmer of light overshadows that thing.
They way i see it is that LoD is to Heal Party what WoH is to Heal Other... except... even more efficient.
So, my suggestion for a build would either be a Mo/E ZB prot monk with Glyph of Lesser Energy, an LoD healer, or an HB Healer (with glyph heal party)
P.S. somebody feel free to tell me if my guesses about "top-level" pve monking is garbage. i havn't actually been into that new area at all yet.
martialis
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if aggro is managed correctly, damage will usually focus on one person in pve.
That is true. When it happens, and it's a joy to watch when it does, you can get by with casting healing breeze every 15 or 20 seconds. But the rest of the time, you need better spells.Word of Healing isn't that bad. It used to be the best heal in the game, and everybody used it. If you want to use it, then use it. But take heal party, too, and things like dwayna's kiss and healing whisper. I think you'll change your mind.
The rest of us played through the game with the choice of our 2 elites, no glyph of lesser energy, and pugs. You kids have no idea how lucky you are.
For example, in that other thread about the river of flame, you have people running through lava, standing in lava and running away from the monsters. Now the warrior tries to tank, but the monsters are casters, and if you can hit them, they can hit you. So people are getting hit by fireballs, meteors, set on fire, attacked by little titans that suddenly appear, etc.
You're going to be spamming heal party non-stop, and it'll make you cry.
Xeones The Great
what i think is that LoD can be equally or even greaterly copied by glyph of lesser energy and heal party. word of healing heals for 228 health for allies under 50% and 122 for allies not under 50%. glimmer heals for 127 no matter what with a shorter recharge and charge. woh>glimmer>LoD
imo, orison isnt that bad, 101 health with 2 second recharge and for 5 energy. dont even try to lead to that singlepost about how horrible orison is, becuz it makes 0 sense.
woh
dwaynas kiss/mend condition
sig devotion
heal touch
orison
glyph of lesser energy
heal party
rebirth
glyph+heal party = some sort of LoD
orison = some sort of glimmer
woh cant really be matched, best way to repair extreme spikes, 228/122 hp every 4.75 seconds is unmatched.
this is the way its gonna be. period.
imo, orison isnt that bad, 101 health with 2 second recharge and for 5 energy. dont even try to lead to that singlepost about how horrible orison is, becuz it makes 0 sense.
woh
dwaynas kiss/mend condition
sig devotion
heal touch
orison
glyph of lesser energy
heal party
rebirth
glyph+heal party = some sort of LoD
orison = some sort of glimmer
woh cant really be matched, best way to repair extreme spikes, 228/122 hp every 4.75 seconds is unmatched.
this is the way its gonna be. period.
Effigy
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xeones
Quote: Originally Posted by Xeones as burst said, if aggro is managed correctly, damage will usually focus on one person in pve. IMHO, LoD may be one of the worst heal elites out there, next to HH. Tanking is not what it once was, but this statement doesn't really make sense. If one person is always holding aggro, how is Healing Hands the worst elite? Healing Hands/Seed excel when one person is taking heavy aggro. HH and LoD work to counter purposes, and each is useful under the right circumstances. The "right circumstances" for HH usually means solo farming or, previously, gear tanking.
Quote: Originally Posted by Xeones what if one person is at 60% health, everyone else is near full. what a waste of an elite!!! You have 7 other skills on your bar, right? If only one person is hurt, the obvious solution is to use a single target heal. That doesn't make LoD any less valuable when multiple players are taking damage.
Quote: Originally Posted by Xeones
also, i believe that even if damage is distributed, its just, imo, stupid to just spam a skill for every1 to gain hp.
What is this supposed to mean? Having one skill that can handle widespread pressure is somehow "stupid?" What would be the "smart" thing to do in that situation? Single target heals? :?
Originally Posted by Ensign
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Quote:|
Originally Posted by Xeones
also, im going heal definitely, so ZB is out of question
If you're deadset on the pure healing route, you'll only progress so far as a monk. It's ok as a way to learn the ropes, but I think you'll like prot better once you get a little more perspective.
and if Quote:
I dunno, the full guild hall scares me as well.
Quote: prot>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>h eal, then why the hell did they even make healing an attribute? prot yay prot prot wtf? to everyone: if u play a heal monk, ur a ----ing retard. is that what ur trying to say? u really confuse me. T-T Heal exists for heal party, it's elite version, gift of health, infuse health and maybe healing seed. Beyond that, the line is just retardedly stupid. There are points for heal monks. They can pump out massive amounts of healing, it's true, but in nearly all circumstances prot monks splashing into healing for top ups will outperform heal monks. The conditions where heal monks are useful is when there you have a specialist prot monk, who does nothing else, as in cases like the old HA 8v8 backline. If you're not running a specialist prot monk, then run prots with splash into heal. Generally pure heal monks are retarded, they have horrible bars, with five variations of orison, no heal party and no energy management. It's like the monk version of stance tanks. Utterly retarded but the pve crowd seems to like them. Quote:
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which means u play better with that skill...
The fact that you can't even get a big, flexible heal, at any energy cost, is one of many reasons why Healing is widely considered a giant pile of shit.
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Originally Posted by Ensign
The fact that you can't even get a big, flexible heal, at any energy cost, is one of many reasons why Healing is widely considered a giant pile of shit.
thats what im talking about. that.
martialis
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what if ur protting and someone gets uber spiked. isnt that what healing is for?
This thread is too long. You really need to stop asking questions and start using some of these spells. >< | The answer is no, that's what this is for: [skill]Protective Spirit[/skill] When you're evaluating a spell, the important question to ask is, "How much damage can I heal or prevent with this spell?" They're the same. Healing damage and protecting someone against it help the party equally, because you have to keep up with all the damage somehow. So for PS, imagine how much energy worth of healing you could save by using that? You've been to the desert, right? Think about not having to out-heal all those meteors and infernos. PS protects a person from a small number of very high-damage attacks. Shield of Absorbsion protects them from a large number of low-damage attacks. Casting them both on one character makes her immune to damage. Totally invincible. If you want proof, check the farming forum. Think about the energy you can save with these. As for elites, if you actually look...you'll see that 5/10 are healing spells. 3 of which are good and have all been listed, repeatedly, but they're still just healing. There's only one actual protection elite in the protection line, which is...specialised. I think it's good, but only in some areas, and most people disagree with me. dgb
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xeones The Great
if u say prot, what if ur protting and someone gets uber spiked. isnt that what healing is for?
THEY SHOULD BE BLOODY PROTTED IN THE FIRST PLACE SO THEY DON'T GET UBER SPIKED.
can you stop being dense. Anyway, the answer (as allways) is prot with splash into heal for gift of health.
LightningHell
Some people see Infusers catch spikes and say, wow, that's one big spike killer there.
What they don't realize is that Protection can do that, if not better, while also offering other opportunities. A protected person can't be "Uber Spiked".
Thom Bangalter
A good team will know when the infuse isn't actually catching the spike and it's the preprotting+team mitigation, so my advice? play with good teams.
Effigy
The only problem with using prot against spikes is the current prevalence of enchant hate. Grenth dervishes alone can slice through them like nothing. Dual Shatter mesmer spike usually gets by enchants without much trouble as well. If you go up against teams like this, Infuse may be the best option for stopping spike. Angelic Bond is another option; my guild fought a team using an AB paragon and it was kind of annoying.
In general though, I'd agree that prot is a more powerful option. Infuse has its place though.
Burst Cancel
The best option for saving spikes is good team play. Any team that relies on their infuser to stop spikes is going to get rolled by any spike team that's any good. A good spike is either not going to be reliably infusable, or is going to have some way of getting around the infuser - either by repeatedly spiking down the infuser or spiking fast and hard to pressure out the monks.
Infuse is definitely the best anti-spike skill in the current metagame, but it's not enough on its own.
Divineshadows
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Originally Posted by Ensign
Could be several reasons. Monsters don't really hold aggro terribly well anymore, they love to break off and get into your mid/backline without really expert body blocking and the like. Multiple people taking damage is par for the course, really. I don't think you ever really want to be planning around only one person taking damage as a Monk, because those situations are so trivially easy to deal with.
Yeah, this statement pretty much sums up what a monk has to be prepared for in PvE. With the current skill balance, there were certain skills that never left my bar all the way through Elona:
- Light of Deliverance - Aegis - Prot Spirit - Shield of Absorption - Glyph of Lesser Energy At least 2 of the other 3 skills were almost always for condition and hex removal, but they varied based on the area. If I knew that an area had no threatening hexes, then I would run without a hex removal skill. I set my hero monk with zealous benediction, gift of health, aegis, shield of absorption, and spirit bond. If my guild decided to PUG a monk instead of using my perfectly capable hero monk, then I dictated their bar to them.
Thom Bangalter
The monk heroes are really bad if you bring two of them because they'll burn through their energy like crazy topping off bars, which is why it's so much better to travel with a real monk.
JYX
They spam certain spells as if they were heals that's true. This is why I've stopped using Prot Spirit and Spirit Bond on my ZB hero. They appear to think that these spells are heals, and will top bars off with them.
Usually I use the 2 monk henches because they're passable, whereas the hench damage is really bad, the monk henches seemed to do okay. When I do use my monk heroes, it's always 1 ZB prot 1 LoD heal. GoLE and Aegis on both of them, it turns out most of the time they understand this combo. Res sigs on both of them as well. No signets because they can't use them, no prot spirit/spirit bond because they can't use them.
crazyFanatic
my healing monk build is:
WoH/LoD(i use lod if the prot monk use ZB) Dwayna's Kiss Heal Touch Signet of Rejuvenation Healing Seed Signet of Devotion/heal party(depends on the mission) Resurrection Chant Glyph of Lesser Energy/Leech Signet/Channeling 16.healing prayers 13.divine favour(i decrease the amount AP in divine favour if i use leech signet or channeling and put em in inspiration magic) This build works gr8 if u got an decent prot monk Flashy
*cough*
Ofcourse its freaking sarcasm but still, mending WAS 1 of the 1st skills that runners used in Droknars and many other runs... I just want to say every skill got their usages  Thought I have to agree with the last line lol, that WAS kind of stupid and nonsence I'm gonan scrap it right away... Cause I was thinking later: hmmm ask other peoples experience and then experience it yourself later Excuses for you guys...I will get ontopic BTW: My build mostly is based on both, but sometimes I get entirely different builds.. for example: Word if Healing/Healing Light Vigorous Spirit Dwayna's Kiss Protective Spirit Orison of Healing Dismiss Condition Inspired Hex/Holy Veil Channelling Pure a fun build but worked quit effective with 3 or more W or R or A or D in your team... These days I just run standard builds: Spirit Bond Dismiss Condition Reversal of Fortune Zealous Benediction Gift of Health Guardian Shield of Absorption Channelling I actually made up the ZB build in Halls when I was in 'Please Wait We Load Kinda Slow[prOn]' (this is no nonsense or bullshit) I seen the heal on ZB and the perfect oppertunity to have 2 prots in 1 team (2x Guardian - PS and SB) since ZB and GoH will take care of the healing and RoF would do a good job too... But a downside if u miss the < 50% but with the guild I was in then that was no problem we even got halls with it and held like 4 times the 1st time I tried this combination but u hardly see ZB anymore.Another thing about the WoH or LoD its nice yes I agree but LoD won't save the hero, WoH does... cause I played with [cute] and really, WoH is still nice in HA
Xeones The Great
okey dokey then im going healing after all ive seen, how do i close this damn thread?
LightningHell
You ask us to.
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