You MM Olias MM supporter

Fluffy Butt

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jun 2006

W/Mo

07 Jan 2007 at 05:08 - 1

I just want to know what you think of this idea.

Your skills (MM)

[card]Animate Bone Fiend[/card] [card]Animate Bone horror[/card] [card]Animate Flesh Golem[/card] [card]Blood of the Master[/card] [card]Verata's Sacrifice[/card] [card]Blood Ritual[/card] [card]healing ring[/card] [card]rebirth[/card]

Death spells 12 (1+3)
Blood spells 4 (+1)
Healing spells 7
Soul Reaping 10 (+1)

Olias Skills (MM supporter)

[card]Animate Shambling Horror[/card] [card]Animate Bone Minions[/card] [card]Well of Power[/card] [card]Dwayna's Sorrow[/card] [card]Death Nova[/card] [card]Gift of Health[/card] [card]Signet of Rejuvenation[/card] [card]rebirth[/card]

Death Spells 9 (1+2) (I hate spending money on heros, no +3)
Blood Magic 10 (+2)
Healing Prayer 9
Soul Reaping 8 (+1)

Sadly, I have a MM but he's only level 10. Before I make him a full MM, I want to know if this is a good build before I cap Flesh Golem

beltran13579

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jan 2006

Mo/E

07 Jan 2007 at 05:26 - 2

just so u no botm will take almost 50% with 2 MM

Fluffy Butt

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jun 2006

W/Mo

07 Jan 2007 at 07:37 - 3

Quote:

Originally Posted by beltran13579

just so u no botm will take almost 50% with 2 MM Healing Ring, thats why I have it. Just a FYI

MercenaryKnight

Forge Runner

Join Date: May 2006

Wolf of Shadows [WoS]

07 Jan 2007 at 08:50 - 4

The AI will steal just about all of your corpses, unless multiple ones die at same time. I think it'd be easier just to focus your olias as a blood ritual/ support healing monk build with the extra support from soulreaping to help you and your team.

stueyman2099

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Sep 2005

Clan W A S D [WASD]

W/E

07 Jan 2007 at 09:16 - 5

Dual mm's are fine with BotM. Also, this is PvE. Monsters should be dieing every 5 seconds at least.

dummey

Pre-Searing Cadet

Join Date: Sep 2005

07 Jan 2007 at 17:00 - 6

jagged horrors + death nova on olias.

Stormlord Alex

Grotto Attendant

Join Date: Dec 2005

Beyond the Forest of Doom, past the Cavern of Agony... on Kitten & Puppy Island

Soul of Melandru [sOm]

W/E

08 Jan 2007 at 02:55 - 7

Hmm... interesting idea... I'll have to try it out meself.
Personally... I'd boost my own Blood and drop Verata's sacrifice, taking instead Dark Bond (man... I love that skill) and Well of Power over Golem - I'd be a much better judge of where to lay the Well... and Golem is rather meh. I'd go and give Olias Jagged bones as his elite too - he can do all the minion micro-managing I can't be assed to.

I'd probably drop Signet of Rejuvenation for another heal too... I've never found it to be that strong with AI... they don't time it to nail the conditional bonus.

azathothx

Academy Page

Join Date: Nov 2006

Cork, Ireland

Heros of Titans Realm [HotR]

R/P

08 Jan 2007 at 22:52 - 8

You'll go crazy from corpse interruption. And there are rarely enough corpses around to support two minion masters. BotM will cause huge saccing on you and olias putting undue strain on your monks. Olias also doesn't care about timing of his sac and will wipe himself without a second thought.

Either you be the mm and he be a blood/curses or the other way round. Two mm's is just cause for consternation unless in places like vizunah or the eternal grove.

MercenaryKnight

Forge Runner

Join Date: May 2006

Wolf of Shadows [WoS]

09 Jan 2007 at 02:26 - 9

Also for nightfall's consulate docks mission, 2 MM can be pretty good especially with the one area full of dead npcs already. I would think 2 of the heros using jagged bones elite could keep each others minions up 24/7 once they reach their max off of the elite alone.

itsd0n

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Dec 2006

San Jose, CA

Fatal Prescription [Rx]

D/W

09 Jan 2007 at 09:33 - 10

does any1 have anything for Master of whispers

i jst recently got him and im not sure how to build his char...

i want to go and cap more skills for him but jst unsure what skills i need

can u guys post some builds if possible, skills attributes also

Carinae

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jun 2005

Inside

Fifteen Over Fifty [Rare]

09 Jan 2007 at 23:09 - 11

Wow, so many things wrongs all at once.

Quote:

Originally Posted by azathothx

You'll go crazy from corpse interruption.

If you can't beat Olias to corpses, you don't qualify as an MM in my book. When I actually try, I beat him 95% of the time. But that means the human MM has to manage corpses for both MMs.

In other words, get yours but leave enough for Olias. Don't hog them all, and don't allow him to hog them.

Quote: Originally Posted by azathothx And there are rarely enough corpses around to support two minion masters. There are ample corpses in NF for two MMs, except in areas with Djinn/elementals, including RoT.

Quote: Originally Posted by azathothx BotM will cause huge saccing on you and olias putting undue strain on your monks. Well this is true. Olias and I are taking single hit sacs of ~45% PLUS I am throwing OoU on top of it.

However..... pretty much no one else is taking ANY damage with 20 minions around. And battles don't last long with 20 minions plus heroes.

Quote:

Originally Posted by azathothx

Olias also doesn't care about timing of his sac and will wipe himself without a second thought. He cares. Olias has never, ever sac'd himself to death while I've been watching. Not in a double-MM squad or in a single-MM squad. He even seems to understand that BOTM hurts him worse when I have minions also, and he uses it properly.

NOTE: I *have* sac'd myself to death in a double-mm build, but ONLY because I wasn't paying attention, or due to an unfortunate series of interrupts and degen. Both were my fault for pushing too hard.

Quote:

Originally Posted by azathothx

Either you be the mm and he be a blood/curses or the other way round. Two mm's is just cause for consternation unless in places like vizunah or the eternal grove. I'm stubborn. My job is to bring damage. Minions are not graceful or elegant on a battlefield, it's about raw maintainable DPS. If you can maintain your minions for long enough, they will kill anything.

I tested my dual MM + 2R/P build for several days in Vabbi/Kourna with no issues and figured lets go for it...

Battle of Turai's Procession.

I gathered 20 minions ahead of time, but beside that, I employed NO TRICKS of any kind. No real players except me. 3 heroes, 4 hench. Brute force vs Brute force. Direct head-on combat, on an open plain.

Wow. That's an intense fight.

The first wave crumpled before they reached melee range. OoU FTW. The next wave got to melee and didnt last long but hurt the minions bad. The third wave nearly broke us, but my hench/heroes rallied (for lack of a better word) and we finished then right as the last wave arrived.

Zero deaths on my side. Olias even had 4 Jaggeds left, I had 2 Fiends.

Dual-MMing is very viable. It is really overkill, and you have to deal with toting 20 minions around the map, and all the issues that brings. But them's the big guns, if necessary.

Zinger314

Debbie Downer

Join Date: May 2006

N/Me

09 Jan 2007 at 23:19 - 12

Meh. Why go Double MM when you can go SS/MM? The tools an SS has access to (Barbs, Reckless Haste, Enfeebling Blood, and SS, duh) plus an MM is much more effective, efficient, and safe than 2 MM...

Carinae

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jun 2005

Inside

Fifteen Over Fifty [Rare]

10 Jan 2007 at 01:26 - 13

Cause it's cool to have 20 minions on the field again.

Dr Strangelove

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Dec 2005

Wasting away again in Margaritaville

[HOTR]

10 Jan 2007 at 01:39 - 14

Just curious: Would Jagged bones work on an ally's minions? If so, you could have Olias be the mm, and use jagged bones to leech off his mob, or vice versa.

Carinae

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jun 2005

Inside

Fifteen Over Fifty [Rare]

10 Jan 2007 at 06:07 - 15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Strangelove

Just curious: Would Jagged bones work on an ally's minions? If so, you could have Olias be the mm, and use jagged bones to leech off his mob, or vice versa. You can do just what you say.

xundeadx

Pre-Searing Cadet

Join Date: Jan 2007

greek drunken b...

N/Mo

30 Jan 2007 at 17:22 - 16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zinger314

Meh. Why go Double MM when you can go SS/MM? The tools an SS has access to (Barbs, Reckless Haste, Enfeebling Blood, and SS, duh) plus an MM is much more effective, efficient, and safe than 2 MM...
Im using the opposite.Im MM and olias is SS.I dont know if its right but
its working good.

Evilsod

Banned

Join Date: Mar 2006

England

Lievs Death Squad [LDS]

31 Jan 2007 at 02:49 - 17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carinae Dragonblood

Cause it's cool to have 20 minions on the field again. Its also cool to have 1 Jagged Bones/Minion Bomber and an SS with Mark of Pain or Barbs... If 10 minions fail miserably and explode, most likely because of AoE, so will 20.

Forgetting the downside that heros with Jagged/Nova tend to get left behind the party a bit... they use the build extremely well. Hell if you MUST run 2 Death necros... give 1 Jagged Bones and 1 Discord. Maybe throw Aegis in as a general support skill on them and chain it.

Angel Netherborn

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jun 2006

Lower Ward, Sigil

Goda Vos

31 Jan 2007 at 08:40 - 18

Quote:

Originally Posted by xundeadx

Im using the opposite.Im MM and olias is SS.I dont know if its right but its working good.

Umm... it may be good, but it's definitely ineffective. Heroes and henchmen will only target the one you're targeting. Unless u actually micromanage the SS on your hero.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evilsod

Forgetting the downside that heros with Jagged/Nova tend to get left behind the party a bit... they use the build extremely well. Huh? You didn't realize that as long as you keep running, your heroes won't stop for skills?

Grip Gambler

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Dec 2006

Online Gamer's Network

Mo/Me

31 Jan 2007 at 22:08 - 19

If I'm taking both me and olias/master as a death magic necro, I usually bring my full skillset of death magic, flesh golem, fiend, shambling, botm, deathly swarm, dark bond, taste of death.. then I equip the other necro with flesh golem, botm, verata's sacrifice, and putrid explosion. both running all attributes at max death and soul reaping. I like keeping the skillset on my hero's low so that they use useful ones often. Also, a good thing with keeping only a flesh golem on him is, useing verata's sacrifice, while it normally has a 1 minute recharge, will recharge instantly useing only 1 minion. While flesh golems aren't that great at dealing damage, two of them with a constant botm and the occasional verata's makes them good tanks/meat shields.

Usually when I bring two necros though, I either go complete curses build and leave an entire MM build to the hero, or I do the MM part, and just give the hero awaken the blood, SS, mark of pain.

Servant of Kali

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Jan 2006

Me/

02 Feb 2007 at 20:02 - 20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zinger314

Meh. Why go Double MM when you can go SS/MM? The tools an SS has access to (Barbs, Reckless Haste, Enfeebling Blood, and SS, duh) plus an MM is much more effective, efficient, and safe than 2 MM... No it's not. 2 MM's are more effective.

By the time you cast SS, MM hero will already kill that target.

byggryn10

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Oct 2006

11 Feb 2007 at 06:46 - 21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Servant of Kali

No it's not. 2 MM's are more effective.

By the time you cast SS, MM hero will already kill that target. Have the SS use Mark of pain 1st and enjoy the bloodbath.

Marverick

Forge Runner

Join Date: Aug 2006

13 Feb 2007 at 01:13 - 22

Jagged Bones is pretty much useless with the update.

And if you want to be able to heal 20 minions with efficiency, you need Aura of the Lich + Mystic Regeneration. Otherwise you can't really spam BotM and heal minions under heavy fire, resulting in heavy minion losses.

Coloneh

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Nov 2006

D/W

13 Feb 2007 at 05:35 - 23

why would you want to waste 2 part slots on having a MM?

TheDarkOneVK

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Nov 2005

[VK] - The Order of Vanguard Knights

N/Me

14 Feb 2007 at 18:59 - 24

The build I use for a dual-MM setup is:

1. Animate Bone Horror
2. Animate Bone Fiend
3. Aura of the Lich
4. Dark Bond
5. Deathly Swarm/Bitter Chill(rapid fire due to health decrease from AoL)
6, 7, and 8 depend on what mission/area.

I used this build to easily get master's on Vizunah Square by including Master of whisperers as an MM support (with jagged bones+death nova). But since the Jagged Bones nerf I haven't used that method as much.

This also works well with a Paragon using GFTE and "Fall back".

Rest assured, 2 minion masters is doable and works really well. I once ran this build in Vizunah and had ANOTHER mm come in from the other side. Three MM's is a beautiful thing in that mission.

crosshatch123

Academy Page

Join Date: Jan 2007

Netherlands

The Cymax Brotherhood

Mo/E

14 Feb 2007 at 19:24 - 25

I dont know if Olias will use this build well, but this build rocks my PvE Necro:

[skill]Animate Bone Horror[/skill] [skill]Animate Bone Fiend[/skill] [skill]Aura of the Lich[/skill] [skill]Dark Bond[/skill] [skill]Infuse Condition[/skill] [skill]Mystic Regeneration[/skill] [skill]Blood Of the master[/skill] Rez

or [skill]Taste of Death[/skill] or [skill]Signet Of Lost Souls[/skill] or [skill]Deathly Swarm[/skill]

The great thing about [skill]Aura Of The Lich[/skill] + [skill]Dark Bond[/skill] is that the damage your closest minion gets trough Dark Bond is halved aswell. =)

Once again, I dont know if Olias can use this build well!!!

EDIT: o... I misread, I didnt know it had to be a support build. Well you can adjust this build. Cause the great thing about this build is that Olias can frequently spam BotM. So he can keep your minions alive =)

TheDarkOneVK

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Nov 2005

[VK] - The Order of Vanguard Knights

N/Me

14 Feb 2007 at 19:44 - 26

That's a great idea using mystic regeneration along with AOTL + DB enchants, mind if I steal it?

crosshatch123

Academy Page

Join Date: Jan 2007

Netherlands

The Cymax Brotherhood