Becoming a better monk.

AerosX

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Feb 2007

Mo/

Hey everyone.

I made this thread because monk is my new favourite profession, and I would love to be a better one. This is for both PvE and PvP.
I have all three campaigns + around 150k to spend on skills, armor, and weapons.
So basically I'd love to hear all your tips and pointers on gameplay, interface,armor,weapons,skills and anything else I forgot to mention
Thanks everyone.

Btw; I did read the Monk guide: Skills and decisions in perspective; was useful, but need more please

moko

moko

??uo??o??

Join Date: May 2006

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10104060

^ should help you out.

Pick Me

Forge Runner

Join Date: Feb 2006

Thornill, ON, Canada

THE CANUCK MONKS (TCM)

W/R

That was a nice discussion on PvP.

PvE tips:

Know the environment and enemies you will be facing.
If conditions are going to be constant (lava, poison, etc.), then extinguish or a fast recharging and casting condition removal is good.
If enchantment removal will be a problem, don't bring lots of enchantments
If monsters interupt, don't cast long casting spells
If monsters hex alot, fast casting, fast recharging hex removal is good.

Most of the tips in PvP do apply here as well.

olly123

olly123

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Apr 2006

sh*tvill england

tgc

Mo/

take protection skilsl over healing

ZB ( zelots benaditction)
GoH ( gift of health)
RoF ( revesals of fortune (ur best skill)
SoA (shild of abosrption)
PS/SB ( protective spirt/Spirit bond)
condition removle ( prefer dissmiss)
Hex removle ( prefer holy veil)
Ress of a kind

15 pro tection
10 healing
rest divine

healing is no where near asgood as protection in PVE.

AerosX

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Feb 2007

Mo/

Thanks, anyone else got anything to say?

Age

Age

Hall Hero

Join Date: Jul 2005

California Canada/BC

STG Administrator

Mo/

When it comes to you UI you need to make so that is more comfortable for you to use when I am kiting I use the mouse and my skill are on the top row default no row.When it comes to armour Sheperds is good as well as Judges or Censors with tats on the hands and feet.I would suggest as well to watch Observer Mode and click on the any Monk to see what they are doing to get a good idea on kiteing to look for a thread on dodgeball by Kuntor.

Kuja

Kuja

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: May 2005

MA

Kame

Mo/W

Practice makes better.

Pick Me

Forge Runner

Join Date: Feb 2006

Thornill, ON, Canada

THE CANUCK MONKS (TCM)

W/R

Quote:
Originally Posted by olly123
take protection skilsl over healing

ZB ( zelots benaditction)
GoH ( gift of health)
RoF ( revesals of fortune (ur best skill)
SoA (shild of abosrption)
PS/SB ( protective spirt/Spirit bond)
condition removle ( prefer dissmiss)
Hex removle ( prefer holy veil)
Ress of a kind

15 pro tection
10 healing
rest divine

healing is no where near asgood as protection in PVE. If this is true, then why not be a bonder?

I tend to think both are good in PvE. Monk & Ritualist are an awesome combo for party healing.

Protection Prayers are almost useless in some areas (areas where enchantment strippers are in an abundance and can strip every enchantment in one go).

But, I'll agree, in most situations, Protection prayers are wonderful and do aid a party better than just a healer.

olly123

olly123

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Apr 2006

sh*tvill england

tgc

Mo/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pick Me
If this is true, then why not be a bonder?

I tend to think both are good in PvE. Monk & Ritualist are an awesome combo for party healing.

Protection Prayers are almost useless in some areas (areas where enchantment strippers are in an abundance and can strip every enchantment in one go).

But, I'll agree, in most situations, Protection prayers are wonderful and do aid a party better than just a healer. with plane bonding ur in need of osme healign as well. where as here u can reduse damage, and heal, take RoF, its set on 80 say. u get hit for Sandstorm, at 38, it heals u with 38dam, not max i know but a nice little heal, +about 40 for divine, then when the next sandstorm comes ur back to where u where, so in thoery no damage seems to b taken, tho its not true. and by this tiem any fool should have moves out of the way, and seeing as my main enchantment is RoF, its removed as soon as there hit, so enchatment strippers = usless, PS is for har hitters, raly use tbh, and SoA, is when ganked.

Age

Age

Hall Hero

Join Date: Jul 2005

California Canada/BC

STG Administrator

Mo/

Quote:
Originally Posted by olly123
with plane bonding ur in need of osme healign as well. where as here u can reduse damage, and heal, take RoF, its set on 80 say. u get hit for Sandstorm, at 38, it heals u with 38dam, not max i know but a nice little heal, +about 40 for divine, then when the next sandstorm comes ur back to where u where, so in thoery no damage seems to b taken, tho its not true. and by this tiem any fool should have moves out of the way, and seeing as my main enchantment is RoF, its removed as soon as there hit, so enchatment strippers = usless, PS is for har hitters, raly use tbh, and SoA, is when ganked. Healing is still usefull though unless you want you elite to be a hex remover and I am talking mass hexes say like suffering try dealing with on protection Monk with only veil.

Coloneh

Coloneh

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Nov 2006

D/W

hybrid, hybrid, HYBRID!
[skill]Signet of devotion[/skill][skill]blessed light[/skill][skill]gift of health[/skill][skill]reversal of fortune[/skill][skill]protective spirit[/skill][skill]holy veil[/skill][skill]guardian[/skill]

posted that on a different thread yesterday, and it hasnt gotten bad since then.

jesh

jesh

Forge Runner

Join Date: May 2005

San Diego, CA

Penguin Village

Mo/

*Protection > PvE
*Learning to kite makes you better than 90% of other PvE players.
*If you like Healing Prayers, learn to use Heal Area without healing enemies.
*Learn to use Heal Party effectively.
*Learn to cast protection spells before the damage occurs.
*Don't use armor that adds energy. HP and additional armor sets are always better.
*Always have a negative energy weapon set - for energy hiding/management.

AerosX

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Feb 2007

Mo/

Thanks guys,
It seems I've done 2 major ( is some peoples opinions ) things wrong
My armor is Ascetics;
And, I'm a clicker, for both Party Members and Skills, so thats already two things I should change.

I've tried using 1-8 for skills, and seem to be ok, theres the odd time I use the wrong skill, but when I get under alot of pressure, I always start clicking again.

Is there a way to "unlearn" my play style, or should I just stick with clicking?

Thanks again

Pick Me

Forge Runner

Join Date: Feb 2006

Thornill, ON, Canada

THE CANUCK MONKS (TCM)

W/R

Quote:
Originally Posted by AerosX
Thanks guys,
It seems I've done 2 major ( is some peoples opinions ) things wrong
My armor is Ascetics;
And, I'm a clicker, for both Party Members and Skills, so thats already two things I should change.

I've tried using 1-8 for skills, and seem to be ok, theres the odd time I use the wrong skill, but when I get under alot of pressure, I always start clicking again.

Is there a way to "unlearn" my play style, or should I just stick with clicking?

Thanks again The only way to "unlearn" is through practicing a different way. What usually do is:

1) have my first 4 skills that I will use most as #1-4. Put my left hand on the top 4 numbers of my keyboard. Then using my right hand, I click on the names of my allies who need healing. Just remember the skills that you have listed from left to right.

2) practice on henchies in low level areas, so you don't feel the pressure and panic. A panicked monk can spell disaster for a team. Keep your cool and things will work out.

3) Know when to heal, and when you can delay your healing/protection, as sometimes you may endup overhealing someone

I used to click on each skill too, but eventually I learned the "right way".

olly123

olly123

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Apr 2006

sh*tvill england

tgc

Mo/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Age
Healing is still usefull though unless you want you elite to be a hex remover and I am talking mass hexes say like suffering try dealing with on protection Monk with only veil. true they work well together but 2 proters, when ther enot stepping on each others toes work just as well/better, but i was more saying whay ZB over bond therew, and i dont remove suffering, whats the point, its 2 dgen, most PVE wars take mending anyway:P

Age

Age

Hall Hero

Join Date: Jul 2005

California Canada/BC

STG Administrator

Mo/

Quote:
Originally Posted by olly123
true they work well together but 2 proters, when ther enot stepping on each others toes work just as well/better, but i was more saying whay ZB over bond therew, and i dont remove suffering, whats the point, its 2 dgen, most PVE wars take mending anyway:P 2Heal and Protect work yes and 2 Heal/Protect hybrid can work well yes but when it come to places that are very hex heavy it is better to have a healing Monk around as you can just keep healing them up instead of getting rid of the hexes.Warriors useing mending wouldn't work as it is no good agianst hexes.

There is still a place in this game for Healing Monks and some prefer to do just that and I don't see why not.

jesh

jesh

Forge Runner

Join Date: May 2005

San Diego, CA

Penguin Village

Mo/

Thing is, the ele can keep purple bars up just as easily. Heaven forbid someone take Divert Hexes.

olly123

olly123

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Apr 2006

sh*tvill england

tgc

Mo/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Age
2Heal and Protect work yes and 2 Heal/Protect hybrid can work well yes but when it come to places that are very hex heavy it is better to have a healing Monk around as you can just keep healing them up instead of getting rid of the hexes.Warriors useing mending wouldn't work as it is no good agianst hexes.

There is still a place in this game for Healing Monks and some prefer to do just that and I don't see why not. the thing is with heavy hex i normaly scout out the palce b4 to see what type of foes i wil b facing and swap out moves, tho ZB works very well in normal areas, and the mending trhing was with silly hexs like suffering. and to save e, instead of straight healign ur have to remove the hexs in the first place. to save the healing

Age

Age

Hall Hero

Join Date: Jul 2005

California Canada/BC

STG Administrator

Mo/

Not everyone can be come a protection Monk and if went back and did it can you still do it if some asked you to.Diversity is good for the game sure I like Protect as well but sometimes a little diversity.

pingu666

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Jul 2006

guildhall

[DETH]

i prefer healing over prot, mostly, just enjoy it more

i use 1-8 for skills, and mouse to click on party member name

am i the only one who finds the ZB worship amusing?, its a prot skill that can heal!. its just a heal spell, but in protection prayers

olly123

olly123

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Apr 2006

sh*tvill england

tgc

Mo/

Quote:
Originally Posted by pingu666
i prefer healing over prot, mostly, just enjoy it more

i use 1-8 for skills, and mouse to click on party member name

am i the only one who finds the ZB worship amusing?, its a prot skill that can heal!. its just a heal spell, but in protection prayers that its true, but it means it gives more diversaty to a prots bar, where as b4 u only had GoH, to bring party members from near death, RoF was nice but when u only heal for 14 its a bummer. i think its over used also, like WoH was an boon prot

age what u said there was right, but 9/10 times healing monks r not the bes, not throught the attrabut, but throguth the player him/her self. ive seen d protection monks also but, ive seen better monks play prot than healing

Coloneh

Coloneh

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Nov 2006

D/W

The entire point of ZB is to be able to run a full prot bar and still have a straight heal. prot is way better than healing, but players still need to be healed.

Chilly Ress

Chilly Ress

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Oct 2005

Kinetic Fusion [kF]

Me/

Um...

There is nothing wrong with click monks with the exception of infusing. There really isn't. It is solely a personal preference.

druggedchimp

druggedchimp

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jul 2005

Chilly is right; there isn't anything wrong with flat out clicking, but only if you're ridiculously fast w/ that mouse.

Sometimes time is of the essence.

Age

Age

Hall Hero

Join Date: Jul 2005

California Canada/BC

STG Administrator

Mo/

Quote:
Originally Posted by olly123
that its true, but it means it gives more diversaty to a prots bar, where as b4 u only had GoH, to bring party members from near death, RoF was nice but when u only heal for 14 its a bummer. i think its over used also, like WoH was an boon prot

age what u said there was right, but 9/10 times healing monks r not the bes, not throught the attrabut, but throguth the player him/her self. ive seen d protection monks also but, ive seen better monks play prot than healing I guess we could have nothing but protection Monks but then why come up new healing skills?The answer healing is still viable in both PvE and PvP as to the amount of damage taken if someone missed it it can be healed.There are moments when you healing is the only thing that can be used and it depends on what chapters you have ZB is a nice skill but if it gets shutdown or countered then what are you going to do.It is called diversify using healing and protect either together or separate as 2 or a 2 person Monk on a team.

There are really only 2 attribute lines the Monk uses and that is healing or protect.We don't use our Devine Favour or Smiting only in farming.Lets not forget about healers boon.

dt the healer

Academy Page

Join Date: Apr 2006

Austrlia

Monking is what i love doing best, personally, i like to heal more, alot more effective than provetning damge, the sandstorm example that olly made, RoF, is say 5 nrg, if u used something like etheral light you would have more health than u started with, just my opinon, probaly wont make sense, i am to tired to try and make a good agruement

Master Ketsu

Master Ketsu

Desert Nomad

Join Date: May 2006

middle of nowhere

Krazy Guild With Krazy People [KrZy]

R/

The enitre point of ZB is not only is it a wa y for prot monks to still have a direct heal, but its free. A good ZB monk will use SoA / prot spirit on someone as they near 50% ( So they cant be spiked down as easily ) , and then ZB around 40% for a free 200 health.

personally Im halfway in the "ZB is broken" crowd. its a little too easy imo, and its really hurt RA and TA since there arent any really good spikes in it.

knock the energy bonus down from 50% health to 33% health. that way its still a good skill it just cant be uber spammed without some planning.

Alex Morningstar

Alex Morningstar

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: May 2006

Team Asshat [Hat] leader - [GR] Alliance

Mo/

The best thing you can learn on your monk is energy management, and the rest will fall into place. My advice on this, is not to over heal. Get familiar with what skills you like, what the do and how much they heal for (if they heal) or other applicable effect.

Anarion Silverhand

Anarion Silverhand

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Sep 2005

Denmark

None

I agree with Alex. Your job is not to keep everyone at 100% health, it's to keep the party from wiping. Try finding a build you feel comfortable with and then stick to it.

rabwatt

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jun 2005

Mo/Me

Nobody has mentioned Aegis....
Even as a pure Healing Monk, I always found a place on my spell bar for that

olly123

olly123

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Apr 2006

sh*tvill england

tgc

Mo/

Quote:
Originally Posted by dt the healer
Monking is what i love doing best, personally, i like to heal more, alot more effective than provetning damge, the sandstorm example that olly made, RoF, is say 5 nrg, if u used something like etheral light you would have more health than u started with, just my opinon, probaly wont make sense, i am to tired to try and make a good agruement
i was mearly using sandstorm as an example, but there r tiems when u prevent 80dam, and so heal for 80dam, meaning ur have healed for more than most striaght heals, u prevent that 80 damage, then heal for 80, so in reason it heals for 160.

Quote: Healers do not mitigate damage, they heal over it. Hence they are reactionary instead of proactionary monks, and in general suck. Damage in guild wars can come surprisingly quickly and a couple melees, even in pve, can output enough damage to overwhelm a healing monk. This counts double if you're with bad puggers who don't kite. They need to learn a lesson from the henchies.

Quote:
I guess we could have nothing but protection Monks but then why come up new healing skills?The answer healing is still viable in both PvE and PvP as to the amount of damage taken if someone missed it it can be healed.There are moments when you healing is the only thing that can be used and it depends on what chapters you have ZB is a nice skill but if it gets shutdown or countered then what are you going to do.It is called diversify using healing and protect either together or separate as 2 or a 2 person Monk on a team.

There are really only 2 attribute lines the Monk uses and that is healing or protect.We don't use our Devine Favour or Smiting only in farming.Lets not forget about healers boon. well age, im not totaly agaisnt healing monks as its how i started out monking, (orsiorn ftw :P), but with a hybrid build u can use the moves such as gift to catch thoes moves the the protection failed to get. if ZB gets siverted, then theres holy veil cover/ GoH, for the heal, and if u have an enchanted peron, use dissmiss, theres a nice heal hidden in that move

AerosX

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Feb 2007

Mo/

Thanks everyone

Toutatis

Toutatis

Walking Wiki

Join Date: Nov 2006

Isle of Medication

Visitors from Aranna [VFA]

Me/E

Another thing that you could consider when monking is using skills that can hinder your opponents a bit. Not many parties will want to take along a specialised disruptor like a mesmer, but they will always want a monk. There are a few monk skills that cause knockdowns (a guaranteed interrupt - handy if nobody else is equipped to deal with that annoying elementalist who's about to drop a meteor shower on top of you). There's a lot more to keeping your party alive than just watching red bars all day, and monks have quite a few options in that department.

You also need to make a point to the rest of your team that as a character capable of patching everyone up, you deserve the most vigilant protection. Reinforce that point by using a rez skill like Unyielding Aura if they're being difficult with you - if they don't cooperate to make sure that you stay standing and able to keep them from dying, turn the aura off. They'll come around to your point of view quite quickly; trust me on that! You may also want to consider packing a skill like Symbol of Wrath, as I've found it to be an ideal skill to get enemies off you if you find yourself surrounded in PvE and the rest of the team can't reach you quickly enough.

There's much more to monking than just healing and protection

dt the healer

Academy Page

Join Date: Apr 2006

Austrlia

What Alex moring star said is the best advice u can ever get, and the smartest thing and the most improtant thing to being a monk, doesnt matter how bad your skillz are, if u can mange your energy, you'll be fine in any situation. Learn to mange your energy.

easyg

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jul 2005

Hawaii

FPS

Mo/Me

The main key to being a good pve monk is good energy management.

Bad monks are always tapped out on energy. When a monk is out of energy, chances are some of his comrades are gonna die. Good monks never seem to run out of energy.

So the real key to being a good monk is using energy efficiently. I was a bad monk for a long time. I used Heal Party a lot. I became a good monk when I stopped using Heal Party a lot and started to use Dwayna's Kiss.

Like someone else said, monks really need to be aware of their surroundings. Having said that, it's sad how so many monks don't carry hex removal at all, even in areas where there are lots of hex heavy monsters. These are bad monks.

creelie

creelie

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jan 2007

Alberta

Charter Vanguard [CV]

Mo/

In general I find healing to be less stressful because you don't have to try and guess who to enchant - you just react to the damage. A judicious healer can mitigate a ton of damage without wasting any casts.

Spellforge

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Mar 2006

Guildless

N/

I always heal , until last night.
I couldn't find an UW group as a heal monk - would you believe it.
Got in to one as a Bonder in a 5 man team and I STANK.

But the group was friendly and patient and pointed me in the right direction.
I didn't have life barrier so off I trotted to Beacons. 25 attempts later (me - 3 L20 heros and 2 L10 Hench) I have it capped - mainly due to the boss not spawning

I then tried Bonding some more and can see the benefit of the protection line

Burst Cancel

Burst Cancel

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Dec 2006

Domain of Broken Game Mechanics

I cannot stress this enough:
DO NOT STARE AT THE PARTY WINDOW
DO NOT STARE AT THE PARTY WINDOW
DO NOT STARE AT THE PARTY WINDOW

This is probably the #1 mistake that prevents decent monks from becoming good monks. The worst part is, most of the people who make this mistake don't even know it's a mistake. So I'm telling you now: if you are monking with your eyes glued to the party window, you are doing something wrong.

Healing damage is less efficient than preventing it, with few exceptions (ie. LoD/HP vs. mass degen). This is common knowledge by now, so I have no idea why some of you continue to say otherwise. Also, while bonding may illustrate some of the advantages of prot, it requires no skill to play and therefore is not an accurate representation of prot monks in general.

Managing energy is a matter of bringing efficient skills and using them at their maximum efficiency. Do not use Reversal of Fortune against a 10-damage wanding attack. Do not use Mend Condition to remove bleeding from someone who is near full health (exception: the bleed is being used to trigger something else, like Gash). People who are not in danger of dying have last priority - it doesn't matter if someone is at half health if they aren't taking damage.

Get used to weapon swapping. A 15/1 set increases your energy by a huge amount with nearly no effective penalty (-2 pips for 1~2s per cast), a negative energy set reduces the effectiveness of edenial, and a defensive set (often the same as the negative set) is self damage prevention.

Seef II

Seef II

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Nov 2005

US

R/Mo

Quote:
Originally Posted by creelie
In general I find healing to be less stressful because you don't have to try and guess who to enchant - you just react to the damage. A judicious healer can mitigate a ton of damage without wasting any casts.
DO NOT STARE AT THE PARTY WINDOW QFT. Battlefield awareness is key. Notice an assassin coming towards you? Move next to an ally or SoA yourself. Margonite Sorceror casting something long? Click to him and powerdrain his Invoke, or move away from your allies and protspirit your squishies. It is *imperative* to keep an eye out on the battlefield, because staring at red bars doesn't tell you what's going to happen. It tells you what already has happened.

Heavenly Lily

Heavenly Lily

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Oct 2006

Mo/Me

Well I don't have much to offer in terms of how to play your monk but only that if you would rather not use your head as much, go Healing. If, on the other hand, you rather like being aware of everything around you and are good at observing what is going on, go Protect. (You might want to research on spells from all other professions though.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by dt the healer
What Alex moring star said is the best advice u can ever get, and the smartest thing and the most improtant thing to being a monk, doesnt matter how bad your skillz are, if u can mange your energy, you'll be fine in any situation. Learn to mange your energy. The sad part is, I still, (after much PvPing), don't see the harm in having Healing Breeze in your bar. Many people would prefer having something like 'Heal Other' (which is very helpful) but I find that it can be used for emergencies and "quick fixes" against hexes and the added +9 health regeneration can quickly mitigate the damage that was caused, thus preventing the person from dying.

Heal Other and Healing Breeze both cost 10 energy and are both 'instant casts' so to speak. So it's not a problem of energy.

I suppose people prefer a sudden instant heal as opposed to an unreliable mass health regeneration though. -.-