Who else doesn't care for the current HERO SYSTEM?

TsunamiZ

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Oct 2005

Who else doesn't care for the current HERO SYSTEM? You can't customize the appearance of your heroes other than small armor changes. If we had time and items to spare, we would rather spend those on customizing our main characters. If anything, the hero system should let us use our other characters on our accounts as heroes. THEN our heroes would be something WORTH BUILDING. What do you think?

Kuldebar Valiturus

Kuldebar Valiturus

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Nov 2006

Garden City, Idaho

The Order of Relumination (TOoR)

R/

Heroes are undeniably a huge success.

Success has made a failure of our home, I mean game.

But, Heroes are awesome, I use them constantly with my characters in every campaign.

They are customizable in many ways, but don't forget they have their own existence within the game world so we can't re-name them or change their sex, etc.

Future versions of Heroes in new campaigns may allow you to create a Hero of your choice when you start a new character, a leveling buddy or buddies.

tenshi_strife

tenshi_strife

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jul 2006

in sardelac getting yelled at.

Angels of Strife[Aoc]

E/

i totally agree heros rock and i have no problem with them currently. so you cant change how they look so, they are your own personal henchmen, if you dont want to upgrade them then fine, but i love them.

xiaotsu

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Feb 2006

Doomlore Shrine

Just Us Gamers [JUGs]

R/

Change them and others might think it's unfair. You don't have to use them if you don't like them. This just proves that no matter what, people will whine. We wanted better Henchmen, we got them, now people are whining that they aren't good enough, sheesh, it's not exactly 1st grade stuff to program and design a game.

Dex

Dex

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Dec 2005

Chicago, IL

Black Belt Jones

R/Me

Heroes are NPCs. Customizable henchmen. I mean, it would be fun to rename - say Stephan - to "Stephanie" and dress him up like a pretty ballerina, but that's a different game altogether....

What you're talking about is a truly party-based game like Baulder's Gate. I don't think that's the type of game ANet wanted GW to be.

Just goes to show...give people the world and they'll ask for the solar system...

Winterclaw

Winterclaw

Wark!!!

Join Date: May 2005

Florida

W/

I think the current system works more or less, but I think it still has room for improvement.

tenshi_strife

tenshi_strife

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jul 2006

in sardelac getting yelled at.

Angels of Strife[Aoc]

E/

EVERYTHING has room for improvement but that does not mean its broken, as far as im concerned im glad they added heros since it got me through basicly all of nightfall, and yes i would like to see some improvements but i do not dislike the current system.

kazjun

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Aug 2006

HoVa

W/N

Allowing us to use our other characters as heroes is a bad idea. Think about it, you start a new character, doesn't really take long to get your first hero. Then what? You romp all over istan with your party of maxed out characters while your new character just hangs close to get loot and XP? Or you take your lvl20 main, stick your newbie char as a hero and then powerlevel him?
Heh, the canthan power lvl trick? You get a lvl 20 to do all the quests and swap in that lvl3 from pre-sear? And think about how much survivor title would be worth then, between powerleveling and XP quests.

And the running. Does this mean you'd be able to run yourself to droks? The desert? Well, getting those 15 point attrib quests would be much easier then. And farming? What, all the drops assigned to the heroes appears in your other characters inventory? With their share of the loot? 8 man farming groups where all the drops go to yourself? You don't even need to flag heroes away? I mean, sure, give me more loot, but it does seem unbalanced.

I do agree that I wished you could customise the current heroes more though. Maybe more armour skins, some are damn good like primeval Goren and Sousuke. And Melonni. Why can't I get that armour? Or even mysterious Olias and Zenmai. The rest are pretty bland. Master of whispers, Norgu, Zhed, Tahlkora. I mean, Tahlkora is always with me when I take a balanced team, but her skins? Practically the same for all 3 outfits, except the colour schemes. I mean, her primeval? I wanted it to be more regal, and befitting of a princess, but its the same skin just that she's spent her share of the money from pve to buy white dyes. Then again, she's smarter than Koss. He spent his share of the loot to spam "WTB rubies and sapphires. -1k than trader" to get vabbian armour. And what vabbian armour...

Primeval Koss, enemies die just by seeing him. Ah, my poor bleeding eyes...

MirageMaster

MirageMaster

Banned

Join Date: Mar 2007

EU

Right now the only problem with hero system i got is that i can use only 3 at one time,cant dye their armor,cant make them use head gear.I dont get the reason for not letting us dye them.

Innoccence

Innoccence

Academy Page

Join Date: Feb 2007

Georgia, United States

The Lords Of Chaos [LoC]

Alright, this complaint has been made numerous times. IN my opinion I disagree with what you said and agree with everyone else that there could be some improvments.

Disagree: You mentioned using your other Characters as heroes correct? Well in order to do that I believe you'd need to do the following: As the other character you have for a Hero they would need to have reached the same area that you're trying to use them in, fix the Friend's list so it doesn't show that you're playing as two characters, and you'd need to find a way to earn them in the storyline.

Also there could be some downsides to such a thing, it'd be just like duplicating yourself with all of your armor and status and junk like that. Dunno I just don't like that Idea.

Agree: The part I agree with is the fact that there could be some changes. Here's something I might suggest:

Perhaps we could get just a player model of a Class (I.e. Mesmer, Monk, etc.) and then be able to dress them and color them such as a PvP Character but be unable to add inscriptions and runes. You could name them and only have 1 of this truely 'customizeable' hero. Then once you've picked your 1 Hero to have then you'll just save them to that character and ta da! Though this is similar to the 'cloning' complaint I made above, I believe this one may be more reasonable than creating a clone of another character of yours, even if that would be a nice thing to see.

Also some improvements could be:
*More Choices For Armor
*More Fighting Style Choices (Along with Attack, Defend, and Avoid.)
*Ablilty to Attack Different Enemies Instead of Attacking the Foe You Target
Etc.

And that's all I'll say for now. G'day All
~Rayne Alishari

gameshoes3003

gameshoes3003

Forge Runner

Join Date: Feb 2006

Been suggested that your old characters should be heroes... that was shot.
The hero system is fine as is.

A C E

A C E

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Aug 2006

U.S.

The Order Of The Frozen Tundra

Mo/

To put it plainly, if you have played the game since prophecies, everyone has to use pure henchmen teams at some time. If you can play it with henchmen and almost beat every campaign with hench, dont worry about your heroes, only for the missions they require. So dont complain about it in my opinion, the system has worked perfectly to me. But yes they do take some work to build up and level but that is the fun of Nightfall

VitisVinifera

VitisVinifera

Banned

Join Date: Nov 2005

Northern California

HoTR

N/Me

thank GOD for heroes. As long as you give them a fairly easy build (healer, mm, nuker, interrupt ranger/mesmer), they fit the bill. The flagging heroes away for farming thing has been wonderful. 2 people can take on every part of the game except doa with them

Knightsaber Sith

Knightsaber Sith

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Aug 2006

Few Fallen Heroes [FFH]

W/E

/notsigned

The current hero system is just fine. Being able to alter their armor appearance seems just fine to me. Since they do play a role in the story-line, it wouldn't make sense for you to be able to customize them further such as face, hair and so forth. It wouldn't make any sense to be able to use your own characters as heroes and I don't see why it should ever happen.

CDittric77

CDittric77

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jan 2007

A Famous Small Town in PA

Saints of Avalon

R/Mo

Hey, wait, can't we get customizable size altering, facial changing, hair style optional, no underwear REGULAR henchies?

:/

If it aint broke, don't fix it. The hero system ain't broke

cyberjanet

cyberjanet

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Feb 2007

The Netherlands

Rich Mahogany

N/

I'm not keen on the idea of characters as heroes.
I think doing missions for new hero armour is fun. I've only ever got one piece, so Jin now has elite sunspear.
I'll certainly be tackling the missions this weekend though.

It would be nice if we could dye the hero armour.

freekedoutfish

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jun 2006

E/

This obviously passed you by somewhere....

If you dont like using something, then dont use it!. Heroes may not be to everyones liking, and I expect your one of these anti-Hench players.

But as others have said, they are a huge improvement and the best thing which Anet added in the last few months.

It doesnt take a huge amount of effort to equip them with weapons or runes (Bonus items, drops, collector items and rare drops).

It doesnt take a staggering amount of time and effort to level them up either, provided you have the sense to use them as you play.

The armor upgrades automatically saving you gold to spend on new sets, and even different styles are free provided you farm the rare items for them.

You can use already unlocked skills from other characters, saving you gold to buy more. What more do you want?

At the end of the day, it takes very little effort and virtually no gold to create an effective hero.

Heroes are 95% just as customisable as your playable character. The only tiny difference is we cant have multiple armor sets. Whats the issue!

Again! If you dislike them so much, then DONT USE THEM.

As for using existing characters as Heroes

I expect you want to do this because your just too lazey to make any effort to build up your Heroes.

We dont need this (although it would be cool), because you can make any heroe virtually identical in everyway to any playable character you own. Give them the same stats, runes and weapons and there you go - Identical.

It just a takes little time and effort, so either DONT user heroes, or put the effort in to make them effective instead of winging.

arzamond

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Feb 2007

Batavia

The Order of Baa [Baa]

R/

i think the hero system is fine... perhaps the weakness of this system is it makes anti-social people easier to do mission.

nekopowa

nekopowa

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Dec 2006

Croatia

A/P

I finished Nightfall in two days with heroes. It would take me 2 weeks with pugs so yeah, heroes ftw. All the customization you need is there, its not hard to farm a few greens to give them. I'd just like an AI upgrade, because my hero just casted splinter weapon on a monk.

MithranArkanere

MithranArkanere

Underworld Spelunker

Join Date: Nov 2006

wikipedia.org/wiki/Vigo

Heraldos de la Llama Oscura [HLO]

E/

Yup, this is not the first game where you can recruit NPCs with fixed values you can't change.

Ferret

Ferret

Elite Guru

Join Date: Jul 2005

England

Ferrets Unity of Rogues (FUR)

R/Mo

I pretty much like the heroes as they are. I dont think i'd really want to use my other characters as heroes.

The heroes are one of the best features to come out in GW and actually brings it closer to a real RPG with your own little adventuring party. It makes the game much easier to progress through, especially in areas where you cant find other players.

The Gripping Hand

The Gripping Hand

Banned

Join Date: Feb 2007

California

The Mkultra Syndicate [TMS]

A/R

I LOVE the hero system. As a solo PvE players (well, mostly), they are an essential cog in my quest to become a Grand Master Cartographer of all three Chapters. Being able to control agro, attach runes, give them specialized weapons, and direct both their movement AND skill chaining... well, then you seriously don't get it.

Yes, using our other chars within the account would be cool, but from what I know about code, system requirements (not mine in particular, but the lowest common denominator), and load times... this is simply not feasible. At least not until everyone in the world has those new crazy multi-core processors Intel is talking about plus 4 gigs of RAM.

Bottom line... The Heroes Rule! Hey, don't feel bad. Maybe you'll warm to them in time. They didn't like Van Gogh either at first.

Stoneys Rock

Stoneys Rock

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jul 2006

Wales, United Kingdom

Great Success [GS]

Mo/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dex
Heroes are NPCs. Customizable henchmen. I mean, it would be fun to rename - say Stephan - to "Stephanie" and dress him up like a pretty ballerina, but that's a different game altogether....
^^ aye that's a different game seeing as you need certain people to be in certain missions it would be ridiculous to be able to change their name lol the cutscenes would be wrong for a start

;-) I think hero's are the best thing to happen to the game but thats just me lol

I like the heroes as they are they have their own personal background and story, mindless random npcs would be boring imo ^^

legion_rat

legion_rat

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Aug 2006

668 the neighbor of the beast

TFK

A/

/unsigned

Heros are great, and i like the way they look personally. Norgu is great. Not the trim uber cool actor but the short pudgy kid in a theatre class. Sorry to the OP but heros are one of the best things in GW. I was able to get protector title using heros in certain dead areas of tyria.

thank you anet.

~the rat~

GuildWiki Jamie

GuildWiki Jamie

Academy Page

Join Date: May 2006

Heroes Of Primeval Eden

N/Me

They need to drop heroes as a requirement for missions. Nothing worse than having a full alliance team of friends then having to kick someone because we need a hero... I'm looking at you Master of Whispers *scowls*

SpeedyKQ

SpeedyKQ

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Dec 2005

E/Me

I'm surprised the OP is getting so much hate. He wants to use his own characters as heroes, not get rid of the concept. I know I'm tired of having 8 Kosses.

I think it'd be cooler if you could use your own other characters as heroes (they wouldn't have to get loot or xp), or if you could design-a-hero from scratch with the character creation interface.

freekedoutfish

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jun 2006

E/

Quote:
Originally Posted by SpeedyKQ
I'm surprised the OP is getting so much hate. He wants to use his own characters as heroes, not get rid of the concept. I know I'm tired of having 8 Kosses.

I think it'd be cooler if you could use your own other characters as heroes (they wouldn't have to get loot or xp), or if you could design-a-hero from scratch with the character creation interface.
As I said in an earlier reply; I dont see the need for this.

You can turn any Heroe you own, into an identical clone of any character you might already have made.

You have the same skills to use.
You can use the same runes.
You could share or find the same weapons (more or less).

I dont see the difference with using an existing character as a Hero and just giving a Hero the exact build as one of your playable characters.

I think most people want it purely as an Athetics thing. They want to see other characters they have in their team. It doesnt really have anything to do with adding any advantage which we dont already have.

Darko_UK

Darko_UK

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Feb 2007

England

R/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dex
Heroes are NPCs. Customizable henchmen. I mean, it would be fun to rename - say Stephan - to "Stephanie" and dress him up like a pretty ballerina, but that's a different game altogether....

What you're talking about is a truly party-based game like Baulder's Gate. I don't think that's the type of game ANet wanted GW to be.

Just goes to show...give people the world and they'll ask for the solar system...
Players are also "Heroes" in the game

Dex

Dex

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Dec 2005

Chicago, IL

Black Belt Jones

R/Me

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darko_UK
Players are also "Heroes" in the game
Semantics.

Mars Dragonblade

Mars Dragonblade

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: May 2006

Awesometon.

Ministry of Fate [MoF]

W/

I hate heroes, overly glorified henchies in my eyes. To me all heroes are are AI versions of more characters on your account that you need to spend a tonne of gold on and waste time making them effective, just the same as a regular character slot. You need to buy all of their weapons and skills, and, optionally, their armour (if you want to make them look different ~_~). Then, if you want them to be the same no matter what character you use, you'd need to spend multiples of what you already have depending on how many characters you want to use them on. I can't believe people who say they've spent at least 50k+ apiece on cheap AI human character replacements where even henchies don't need anything done to them and can do the same thing. It's even easy doing Abaddon's Gate mission with henchies and achieving master's reward. I'd put any of my real chars first or anyone else for that matter before I even dream of using heroes. Sorry if I've offended anyone, I just have a strong objection to using heroes, for me they're a useless addition to the game.

Perkunas

Perkunas

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Aug 2006

In my own little world, looking at yours

Only Us[NotU]

E/

My main deisre for my heros, is let them wear my guild cape. Makes it easier to track the 'twins' in battles.

Dex

Dex

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Dec 2005

Chicago, IL

Black Belt Jones

R/Me

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mars Dragonblade
I hate heroes, overly glorified henchies in my eyes. To me all heroes are are AI versions of more characters on your account that you need to spend a tonne of gold on and waste time making them effective, just the same as a regular character slot. You need to buy all of their weapons and skills, and, optionally, their armour (if you want to make them look different ~_~). Then, if you want them to be the same no matter what character you use, you'd need to spend multiples of what you already have depending on how many characters you want to use them on. I can't believe people who say they've spent at least 50k+ apiece on cheap AI human character replacements where even henchies don't need anything done to them and can do the same thing. It's even easy doing Abaddon's Gate mission with henchies and achieving master's reward. I'd put any of my real chars first or anyone else for that matter before I even dream of using heroes. Sorry if I've offended anyone, I just have a strong objection to using heroes, for me they're a useless addition to the game.
Odd. I've spent very little time making most of my heroes very effective. You absolutely do not have to buy their skills. They have access to any skill you have unlocked on your account, and you can use Balth faction to get any additional ones you don't already have. You don't have to spend a single gold piece on their armor (it improves as they level), and you can purchase a full set of most runes and insignia for around 3k. 50k on a hero? That's just silliness. As far as weapons, I give them leftovers (that almost-perfect sword might not be worth anything, but Koss can kill with it just fine) or simply give them collector weapons, which are great.

With a basic set of runes and collector weapons your heroes are already much more effective than any henchmen. Add on top of that the fact that you can control their builds (BiP Olias to fuel your monks, anyone?) and control their dispositions, movement, and skill usage (no, Lina, I don't want you to run into that army of ice imps to resurrect Little Thom, ok?). This makes them 1000% more useful than henchmen in challenging areas.

Abbadon's Gate isn't all that difficult a mission in the grand scheme of the game, so what? Missions that are actually challenging become much less frustrating when you can tell your monk to back out of the melee so he/she doesn't get killed trying to foolishly heal a warrior. Most of the time bringing 3 of my heroes along makes for a stronger party than bringing 6 henchmen. Especially if I bring along a necro hero with a MM build to help soak damage. Besides, I enjoy being able to assign builds to my AI party members.

The henchmen aren't much more than brainless meatshields with one or two useful skills. I don't really care that I don't have much control over what the heroes look like. I'm more interested in controlling their movement, actions, attributes, and skills.

I'm not telling you that you're wrong - you're entitled to your opinion. I just don't understand your arguments.

Sol Deathgard

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Dec 2005

Shadows of the Dragon

W/N

Only thing I'd like to see differnet is the ablity to take 7 heros with me instead of 3 heros & 4 hench.

freekedoutfish

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jun 2006

E/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mars Dragonblade
You need to buy all of their weapons and skills, and, optionally, their armour (if you want to make them look different ~_~). Then, if you want them to be the same no matter what character you use, you'd need to spend multiples of what you already have depending on how many characters you want to use them on. I can't believe people who say they've spent at least 50k+ apiece on cheap AI human character replacements where even henchies don't need anything done to them and can do the same thing.
I have all my Heroes leveled to 20 and using max weapons and runes.

The grand total which I spent doing that would be...... very very small.

The only thing which I actually spent any gold on concerning my Heroes were runes. Cheap miner health runes and the odd superiour one. Gold which I had no other use for or which I was able to farm very easily.

The only weapons and items I use are either drops, bonus items (using the /bonus code) or green drops that I dont use or dropped for me.

I've spent very very little on my Heroes to make them effective. If someone wants to be vain and buy the "best" weapons and gear for their heroes, then they can. If they want to use drops and cheap runes, then can.

You can build an effective Hero using very little or no funding. So to make a statement saying you hate heroes because they are a waste of gold is daft.

And just because you prefere real players to Henches or Heroes, is that a good reason to "hate" them? No!

You cant deny that Heroes have alot more funcationality then Henches. The ability to give them builds and set weapons, is priceless compared to a Hench. If you dont find Heroes effective, then its the way your using them, not the programming.

But your welcome to prefere Humans over AI, but that is no reason to hate the AI.

But again.... if you dont like using Heroes, then dont use them.

If you didnt like the taste of a pint of fosters, are you going to buy one anyway and sit in the pub complaining how it tastes?

Kuldebar Valiturus

Kuldebar Valiturus

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Nov 2006

Garden City, Idaho

The Order of Relumination (TOoR)

R/

As I said before, Heroes were a stroke of genius and a huge success, but like most things in life that we enjoy, they are probably bad for us.

Yup, it's been said so often that even I am getting sick of it, but diluting player interaction isn't a sustainable method for an online game to take. It's counter to one of the biggest reasons people flock to online games.

The solution isn't to ditch Heroes, that cow's already out of the barn. But, ANet does need to start nurturing player interaction in some way, creating a better trading environment would be one such way. Making PvP more approachable/inviting to players is another. (Factions was an attempt, didn't work, maybe they could fix it)

freekedoutfish

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jun 2006

E/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kuldebar Valiturus
....
Compeletely void of the OP'ers post, but...

..GuildWars has a very impressive online community and the game does a very good job of forcing us to PUG and help one another.

Compare it to other games such as WoW.

Alot of people saying WoW is better at incouraging social interaction and PUGs. No it isnt. Its actually worse. WoW has no storyline to follow, its entire aim is to reach lvl70 by any means necessary. This can be done by purely solo'ing the entire game. The quests you do dont form a story, they are completely unconnected and just move you around the map.

I've reach lvl39 in WoW and played about 1% of it in teams.

Guildwars on the other hand, has 3 great-decent storylines which pull you through the game. The aim of the game is to actually finish to the story and complete the game. You have a reason to do things. Not just level up and collect skills and armor.

It requires you to do missions to move forward, and to do certain quests or you cant continue.

Alot of those missions and quests are hard for some players and they requires PUGs to complete them, or it makes you use a team of AI which discourages solo'ing.

By making us learn to use an AI team, we dont complain about PUGing because we're used to it. This is one of GWs really strong factors.

GWs forces us to use teams because the quests and missions are alot more challenging then the hack-and-slash-fest you get in other games.

Yes all these things can be done with AI. But because you always come to a point in GWs where you need more then AI, you always end up in a human team. You also have bonus and master titles to earn which require a bit more thinking.

We will have the hard mode soon which will incouraging more use of humans.

By the time I was about lvl14 in GWs, I was already using PUGs to do missions and quests.

GWs and Anet have done a damn good job of incouraging PUGing in GWs. Especially compared to other games.

....anyway that was out of topic from the OP. Sorry.

OhCrapLions

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jan 2007

Ivalice

D/P

The only problem I have with the heros is their AI. The AI should be customizable becuase the RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOers use the skills the wrong way even after I reorganize them in "order of importance" (left to right).

An AI sentence would do fine:

Skill 1: Echo
Use this skill-Only before-Skill 2
Skill 2:Spiteful Spirit
Use this skill-Whenever available-In groups of-three or more-if possible-on a monk
Skill 3: Reckless Haste
Use this skill-Only on-A target hexed with-own hexes
Skill 4: Blood Ritual
Use this skill-Only on-A target with-30% energy or less-if health is 40% or more

Using this AI sentence, the heroes will act EXACTLY how you want them to.

mazey vorstagg

mazey vorstagg

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Aug 2006

Nodnol

Meeting of Lost Minds

E/Mo

I love this idea, I was just coming here to post it myself, lol. I think that you should be able to replace your heroes with the look and name and armour/weapons of other chars on your account.

For example, instead of taking koss I can have my warrior with me instead (well, at least someone with her name, her looks, her armour and her weapons) and the same for all other professions.

I vote yes, add this a-net!

Tarun

Tarun

Technician's Corner Moderator

Join Date: Jan 2006

The TARDIS

http://www.lunarsoft.net/ http://forums.lunarsoft.net/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sol Deathgard
Only thing I'd like to see differnet is the ablity to take 7 heros with me instead of 3 heros & 4 hench.
I agree 100% and if you made this a suggestion, I would sign it. :P