What's this about?

Vandal2k6

Vandal2k6

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Sep 2006

Manchester, UK

The Manchester Marauders

W/Rt

From the main page here at GWG.

Quote:
A note to Guild Wars players from Richard Garriott

Recently, I was surprised to see a quote attributed to me describing the Guild Wars episodic sales model as a "failed experiment." Obviously, that is not true. Guild Wars is NCsoft - North America's flagship product in terms of both number of customers and total profit and thus by any measure is a resounding success. I personally am a big fan of the game and an admirer of the ArenaNet team that has taken many risks in creating an innovative product and a successful new business model for MMOs. In fact, the Guild Wars business model has been so successful that we are pursuing more products with this same model.
Yes, I've heard people question the way GW is developed but for the most part, people agree that GW is a resounding success (as he states). So why does Mr Garriott feel the need to make a statement like this? Who or what has said something that he feels needs a response. I read most GW news all the time and I've got to say I've heard nothing. Can anyone shed any light?

To me he sounds angry and yet worried at the same time.

thezed

thezed

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Oct 2006

Iowa, USA

HoTR

I think he felt the need to make a statement because something was being attributied to him that was not said by him. That kind of thing can cause trouble if not cleared up right away. Especially since the supposed quote has one NCSoft employee critisising another NCSoft company.

Who knows, the higher-ups at NCSoft might have even told him to make a statement to clear it up.

Cacheelma

Cacheelma

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jun 2005

The Ascalon Union

Me/Mo

And where such "failed statement" is? I don't think I've read one either.

Raxxman

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Dec 2005

TEOC

W/N

I heard this rumour, and I did question it.

Guild Wars is very popular so it made little sense.

Vandal2k6

Vandal2k6

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Sep 2006

Manchester, UK

The Manchester Marauders

W/Rt

I can understand him wanting to set the record straight if the comments were attributed to him. Weird how nobody seems to know where or when the accusation was made though. Chillax Richard, we love ya (anyone know who he is btw)?

Kakumei

Kakumei

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jul 2005

Grind is subjective

learn this please

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vandal2k6
I can understand him wanting to set the record straight if the comments were attributed to him. Weird how nobody seems to know where or when the accusation was made though. Chillax Richard, we love ya (anyone know who he is btw)?

You're kidding, right?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Garriott

That's Lord British. You know, guy who made what's considered the very first MMO, Ultima Online--as well as the rest of the Ultima series?

Edit: and according to that Wiki entry, he evidently had hands in Lineage 1/2, CoH/V, and Tabula Rasa. I didn't know all that.

Jaskalas

Jaskalas

Pre-Searing Cadet

Join Date: Mar 2007

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kakumei
You're kidding, right?
Edit: and according to that Wiki entry, he evidently had hands in Lineage 1/2, CoH/V, and Tabula Rasa. I didn't know all that.
Wiki is correct about that, since 2001 Garriott has been at NCsoft. EA took control of his former company and that did not settle well.

Mercury Angel

Mercury Angel

Avatar of Gwen

Join Date: Apr 2005

Wandering my own road.

I haven't seen it yet, but most likely, it is in reference to a recent interview or article that either has, or will be released in the near future, and can not be directly edited.
With so many magazines around the world featuring articles on Guild Wars shortly, the odds are weighted in favour of one of them being the cause of this. Unless every article is an exact carbon copy of the last, barring different languages, it's wholly possible that somewhere along the lines, information was garbled, misunderstood, or mistranslated.

Considering the sheer amount of speculation and unofficial information circulating as it is, I'd imagine it's a smart/necessary move to quash a statement as bold as that.

HalPlantagenet

HalPlantagenet

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Aug 2005

too far from Conwy

The Chained Swan

R/

First we had the off-handed release of news in early February that there wouldn't be a new release of significant GW content until the second half of 2007 via the NCSoft earnings announcement.

Second we had the questionable "Inquirer" article.

Third we had the Asura mini-pet image release, which was controversial at best.

Fourth, we today's odd disavowal from Mr. Garriott.

The boards here reflect growing confusion and alienation among the player community as a result. All of it could have been foreseen and all of it is unnecessary. Please, Arenanet, in hope of your continued success, please take whatever steps are necessary to address this.

Scutilla

Scutilla

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Sep 2005

Tyrian Explorers League

R/P

The Inquirer article was not released by ANet. Either there was a leak in info somewhere, or they're just pulling it out of their rear.

The Asura mini doesn't have anything to do with new info, other than Asuras being mentioned in the Inquirer. Some people like it and others don't, but that's true of any addition to the game, and I don't see how that's marketing's fault.

The statement made by Garriott had nothing to do with ANet's marketing, either. From what I can tell, someone claimed he said that ANet's business model was a failure, and he went on record saying otherwise. Nothing at all said by ANet itself.

I don't see how any of the things you've mentioned are ANet's fault.

lacasner

lacasner

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jun 2006

As Froid said: Every action a human does happens for a reason, consciously or subconsciously.

So obviously there is some worry, if he didn't worry he wouldn't care about just another man's opinion, unless he knows that opinion is more widespread than people think.

HalPlantagenet

HalPlantagenet

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Aug 2005

too far from Conwy

The Chained Swan

R/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scutilla
...I don't see how any of the things you've mentioned are ANet's fault.
We could argue about about the leak that resulted in the Inquirer article, but that's beside the point. If information about the next release of GW and the franchise's future had been released more sensibly, recognizing the strong interest on the part of the player community, the Inquirer article, had it happened would have been small news. In addition, do you really think that the Asura minipet was the first image you'd want to release of GW's future? Finally, Mr. Garriot's disavowal is yet another indication of information being created to fill a void. Arenanet's Marketing, could have avoided this by providing other information to fuel and feed the message boards, which is an aspect of Marketing.

And that is why the current situation is both unnecessary and could have been prevented by Arenanet. BTW, there are plenty of successful models in Hi-Tech, to look at. This is not rocket science.

lacasner

lacasner

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jun 2006

Removed reference to deleted spam.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scutilla
The Inquirer article was not released by ANet.
IF people realized this there would be much less panic and anger, your absolutely right Scutilla.

Loviatar

Underworld Spelunker

Join Date: Feb 2005

[QUOTE]
Quote:
Originally Posted by HalPlantagenet
First we had the off-handed release of news in early February that there wouldn't be a new release of significant GW content until the second half of 2007 via the NCSoft earnings announcement.
anybody who can pull all that information from the words *MAJOR UPDATE TO THE GUILD WARS FRANCHISE* is either a mind reader or delusional

Thargor

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Mar 2006

I personally dont see anything wrong with the way anet handles things. If they don't release any info then they get flamed almost non stop about it. If they release info or screenshots then they get flamed almost non stop about it. Take the assura mini for example. Check the thread about Gaile showing it off for us, it is nothing but a flame fest about how "ugly and useless" it is.
If they are gonna get nothing but treated like crap by the community then why go to the trouble of releasing any info at all? Saves time and work since they are gonna get the same response anyways.
I feel that this is the communities fault for being so rude all the time.

Rhedd

Rhedd

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: May 2005

You ever have to clean up after a Moa bird?

True Solunastra [SLA] Profession: Moa Wrangler

They've done nothing wrong.

Statements like the OP's are a classic political maneuver, even though I'm sure he did it in ignorance.

I can take a perfectly happy group of people and write an article that states, "The entire group is terrified of what is to come in the murky future!" Suddenly, the whole group really is terrified, wondering what they don't know about the future.

CUT IT OUT!

The total silence before the PC Gamer exclusive is really annoying, but it's standard business practice. The only thing that casts it in a bad light is the (probably 98% fictitious and definitely unofficial) Inquirer article, which said a lot of scary things, leaving people to fret and wonder until PCG comes out.

I don't understand why everyone's so creeped-out by Mr. Garriott's statement. Someone obviously lied and quoted him saying something he didn't. Just because we aren't familiar with what he's referring to doesn't make it weird. Frankly, with all the stupid theorizing on this forum, lately, about GWII being pay-per-month, etc., I found his words comforting!

Did I mention.... CUT IT OUT!

EDIT: This thread seems to have been merged with another. All references above to the "OP" should be to HalPlantagenet, not Vandal2k6.

sindex

sindex

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Aug 2006

California

Swords of Night & Day [SWRD]

This is not due to their profit margin of money, but how fast it accumulates. It’s somewhat of a slow crawl in sales number for GW (though it’s starting to change now). Especially since NCsoft has literally become dependent on GW, then most of its other game titles that are on the market. Auto Assault was a total hit to the side of NCsofts net profits. The problem is not so much to the community; it’s to the shareholders that have stocks.

Guild Wars fiscal earnings.

NCsoft stock via yahoo.

A Blog on NCsofts earnings.

Vandal2k6

Vandal2k6

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Sep 2006

Manchester, UK

The Manchester Marauders

W/Rt

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kakumei
You're kidding, right?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Garriott

That's Lord British. You know, guy who made what's considered the very first MMO, Ultima Online--as well as the rest of the Ultima series?

Edit: and according to that Wiki entry, he evidently had hands in Lineage 1/2, CoH/V, and Tabula Rasa. I didn't know all that.
Ahh he's a busy lad. Also explains why I don't know him. GW is my first ever online RPG I've played so all the other games mentioned there are just names. I was more of a CS man before this.

Rhedd

Rhedd

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: May 2005

You ever have to clean up after a Moa bird?

True Solunastra [SLA] Profession: Moa Wrangler

Quote:
Originally Posted by sindex
This is not due to their profit margarine of money, but how fast it accumulates.
Profit margarine! It's like moneybutter, but with half the fat! ^_^

I'm sorry, I just couldn't stop myself...

Cymboric Treewalker

Cymboric Treewalker

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Apr 2005

Imperial Palace - Cantha

[SFK] Sacred Forge Knights (founder)

Me/Mo

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kakumei
You're kidding, right?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Garriott

That's Lord British. You know, guy who made what's considered the very first MMO, Ultima Online--as well as the rest of the Ultima series?

Edit: and according to that Wiki entry, he evidently had hands in Lineage 1/2, CoH/V, and Tabula Rasa. I didn't know all that.
Actually Ultima Online is not the first MMO, nor anywhere near it.

The first graphical MMO was Airwarrior.

The first graphical MMORPG was Neverwinter Nights.

This does not take away from who Lord British is -- he is an icon and living legend in the RPG genre.

- - - - - - - - - - - - -
I would appreciate your feedback and ratings for my newest article in the FiringSquad.com contest - thanks.

lyra_song

lyra_song

Hell's Protector

Join Date: Oct 2005

R/Mo

Good marketing can require very little effort to stir up hype and talk.

Its called viral marketing.

They do a leak.

Voila.

Everyone's talking GW.

Good or Bad, we are talking about it.

Guess what, thats called marketing.

Vandal2k6

Vandal2k6

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Sep 2006

Manchester, UK

The Manchester Marauders

W/Rt

I'm kinda in agreement with the OP.

The way news has been dribbled out over the last few months about the next GW episode and GW2 (?) has been confusing at best. Ask anyone now what they know about these two things and most will tell you they've not got a clue. Sure, we will know soon enough, but it's better for no news to be released rather than conflicting, confusing statements. The Inquirer article may well be from leaked info, but the fact they have some right (as Gaile has confirmed) says it's come from someone in the know. Why mix what is fact to the Inquirer with falsities? (of course The Inquirer may just've filled the article out with bollox but again, where did they get the real facts from?)

I've also noticed that Gaile doesn't seem to know half of the things happening. This is not her fault, someone in the know should inform her in advance (seeing as it's her job to pass on any things like this). Too many times I've seen her posting about having to contact the dev team to find out about something, something someone here has already told her!

As for Mr Garriott. His statement was aimed at Guild Wars players, us. Yet none of us know what he's talking about. Why give a reply to a statement that obviously upset him to people that have no clue what he's talking about. THAT is what I would say is wierd. (if someone does know what/where the statement he's refering to is then please, let me know).

So, even though I don't think it's doom and gloom, I also think things could be done better.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lyra_song
Good marketing can require very little effort to stir up hype and talk.

Its called viral marketing.

They do a leak.

Voila.

Everyone's talking GW.

Good or Bad, we are talking about it.

Guess what, thats called marketing.
True, it is a known marketing strategy. Again though, I don't understand how some true fact and total rubbish can be "leaked" at the same time. Why do this? If you're going to stir up interest in an item, release something exciting and real.

Loviatar

Underworld Spelunker

Join Date: Feb 2005

Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vandal2k6
From the main page here at GWG.



Yes, I've heard people question the way GW is developed but for the most part, people agree that GW is a resounding success (as he states). So why does Mr Garriott feel the need to make a statement like this? Who or what has said something that he feels needs a response. I read most GW news all the time and I've got to say I've heard nothing. Can anyone shed any light?

To me he sounds angry and yet worried at the same time.
so you have gotten all news worldwide and if you havent seen it it didnt happen.

why should they republish the false guote for you?

he is angry that someone put completely false information out and claimed he said it.

he is worried because a bunch of complete idiots will believe he said it.

Exoudeous

Exoudeous

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Mar 2006

Honor Warriors

E/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vandal2k6
I'm kinda in agreement with the OP.

The way news has been dribbled out over the last few months about the next GW episode and GW2 (?) has been confusing at best.
the point is, you still arnt getting that its not news, non of that stuff was supposed to be put out. The Inquirer isnt an offical source of news, its talking about rumors.

Leaks and rumors happen with just about any game company, so to say anet has a problem you are kinda ignoring the fact that most companies have it happen, people dont know how to shutup and keep the secrets they are supposed to, so to even blame a whole company cause some ass descided to spill the beans is rather stupid. in the end it just something else people find to complain about cause they can never be happy.

Jaskalas

Jaskalas

Pre-Searing Cadet

Join Date: Mar 2007

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cymboric Treewalker
Actually Ultima Online is not the first MMO, nor anywhere near it.

The first graphical MMO was Airwarrior.

The first graphical MMORPG was Neverwinter Nights.

This does not take away from who Lord British is -- he is an icon and living legend in the RPG genre.
UO: Sep 30, 1997

NWN Jun 16, 2002

Don't know about Airwarrior, but since NWN is clearly four years after UO I'd like to know why you called it "first graphical MMORPG ".

Kook~NBK~

Grotto Attendant

Join Date: Mar 2005

A little chalet outside Drok's

Natural Born Killaz

Quote:
Originally Posted by HalPlantagenet
First we had the off-handed release of news in early February that there wouldn't be a new release of significant GW content until the second half of 2007 via the NCSoft earnings announcement.
I wouldn't call it off-handed. release of new products and existing product improvements go hand-in-hand with a company's financial status. (It's all part of a good business plan)

Quote:
Second we had the questionable "Inquirer" article.
Don't take everything you read on the internet as fact. It's already been discredited by A-Net as containing a lot of wrong information, which A-net is not responsible for, nor are they responsible for what people say on these boards.

Quote:
Third we had the Asura mini-pet image release, which was controversial at best.
The only "controversy" is whether people think it's cute or not. You're grasping at straws, here.

Quote:
Fourth, we today's odd disavowal from Mr. Garriott.
I'm gonna go out on a limb here and guess that he made that statement more for the sake of the company's shareholders than anything else. But I'm also sure that consideration was made for all who have an interest in the company's success.

Cymboric Treewalker

Cymboric Treewalker

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Apr 2005

Imperial Palace - Cantha

[SFK] Sacred Forge Knights (founder)

Me/Mo

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaskalas
UO: Sep 30, 1997

NWN Jun 16, 2002

Don't know about Airwarrior, but since NWN is clearly four years after UO I'd like to know why you called it "first graphical MMORPG ".
Because you are referencing the second Neverwinter nights -- the rmake by bioware not the first one.

Neverwinter Nights (1991)

That predates UO by a whopping six years.

Airwarrior (1987)

And there were many non-graphical MMOs before those two.

My favorite MMORPGS from the "early" era were the The Shadow of Yserbius series by Sierra Online

The best search for a really good MMO history is searching MMO on wikipedia.

MMSDome

MMSDome

Raged Out

Join Date: Sep 2005

lol all you people bash the devs and Guild Wars all the time so when one of them comes out with a statement you all get pissy. Thats not really fair to them.

Vandal2k6

Vandal2k6

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Sep 2006

Manchester, UK

The Manchester Marauders

W/Rt

Quote:
Originally Posted by MMSDome
lol all you people bash the devs and Guild Wars all the time so when one of them comes out with a statement you all get pissy. Thats not really fair to them.
Who's pissy?

The original question was did anyone know what he was refering too? We've got news on GwG from someone at NCSoft regarding GWs but it's only half the story. I just wondered if anyone knew what he was talking about. People seriously need to read these threads before posting ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Loviatar
so you have gotten all news worldwide and if you havent seen it it didnt happen.

why should they republish the false guote for you?

he is angry that someone put completely false information out and claimed he said it.

he is worried because a bunch of complete idiots will believe he said it.

LOL Jesus. OK here goes ... again.

Mr Garriott has sent a message to US. I don't know what he's talking about. Whether it happened or not, is not the point. He said it did, so it must've. However, if he's saying to me "don't believe what was said" then I'm bound to say "why, what WAS said"? That's all I asked, nothing more. If someone knew what he was talking about can they let me know, I'm interested. That's all, nothing more. It's not rocket science is it.

Aerian_Skybane

Aerian_Skybane

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Apr 2006

House of Caeruleous [HoC]

R/E

I can almost guarantee that he is responding to what someone might have said, attributing a quote to him that was completely made up, and he is reacting to it because if I were attributed to an idea that was not in my vein of thought, I would make a statement as well. Most likely this was said in some forum or public opinion area.

Doomsayers eat your heart out then realize you can't live without it.

Vandal2k6

Vandal2k6

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Sep 2006

Manchester, UK

The Manchester Marauders

W/Rt

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aerian_Skybane
I can almost guarantee that he is responding to what someone might have said, attributing a quote to him that was completely made up, and he is reacting to it because if I were attributed to an idea that was not in my vein of thought, I would make a statement as well. Most likely this was said in some forum or public opinion area.

Doomsayers eat your heart out then realize you can't live without it.
That makes sense. If it was in a news article I feel certain someone would know about it, seems nobody does though. The fact it could've been said on a forum somewhere does tie-in with the fact it's a little known comment.

Alias_X

Alias_X

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Apr 2005

Its a great success if you want to make games which the company that created it can profit from for 2 or 3 years, and then after that make a new game.

VitisVinifera

VitisVinifera

Banned

Join Date: Nov 2005

Northern California

HoTR

N/Me

yes, Anet is pretty bad at the PR game, and Gaile, after a really good run, has had a miserable time since Factions.

However, to put this in perspective, if people remember the lead-up to Half Life 2 and Valve's multiple huge embarassments (missed release dates, the code and game getting leaked), this pales in comparison.

Loviatar

Underworld Spelunker

Join Date: Feb 2005

Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by lacasner


The reality of the story is that people expect more from Anet and from Guild Wars, and that also people don't just make any random comments for any random reason at any random time. To assume that there is no reason for his comments would just be blissful ignorance in my opinion, and even if he is hiding something that's fine. Everyone has problems and the world isn't coming to an end, and there is no reason for your tirade.
read what i said.

i stated that he HAD a reason to respond specifically that he saw something attributed to him that was flatly wrong.

as for the rest just look at all the posts/threads/sites claiming the inquirer is proven fact

and the people yelling about his correction would say it is proven fact if he did not deny saying it

Kakumei

Kakumei

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jul 2005

Grind is subjective

learn this please

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cymboric Treewalker
Actually Ultima Online is not the first MMO, nor anywhere near it.

The first graphical MMO was Airwarrior.

The first graphical MMORPG was Neverwinter Nights.

This does not take away from who Lord British is -- he is an icon and living legend in the RPG genre.

- - - - - - - - - - - - -
I would appreciate your feedback and ratings for my newest article in the FiringSquad.com contest - thanks.
There's a reason I said "widely considered". I'm fully aware UO isn't actually the first, but it's certainly the game that really got the genre going, thrusting it into the spotlight.

Redfeather1975

Redfeather1975

Forge Runner

Join Date: Sep 2006

Apartment#306

Rhedd Asylum

Me/

I've seen countless topics on forums and articles written saying the business model for GW is failing and quoting some article quoting yearly sales for NCsoft as proof.
The statement made is probably related to that.
Those topics and articles complaining won't end until the game is magically shaped to those players every whim. So I imagine that statements like this will be made every once in a while to keep everyone informed that the game isn't doomed, like the players who aren't getting everything they want say it is.

strcpy

strcpy

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jul 2005

One of Many [ONE]

As to the first MMO's - I would have to say MUDS. They existed in the late 70's during the early days of DARPA. I can not see how any pre-date that, though I suppose one could argue they were not "massive". They definitely were by the late 80's early 90's and one would need to know the number you need for "massive", though they would still be the very first no matter what.

Again, as someone else said - Lord British is one of the creators of electronic gaming and helped push gaming into mainstream. The Ultima Series has to rank up there with Atari in the early era's of gaming. While it did not not invent many (any?) ideas, he did pretty much make one of the major archetypes of RPG's popular. I didn't realize that he was working for NCSoft, though If I had thought for a moment I would have realized that as I knew which projects he was working on. Pretty much any gamer that is 30 or above knows of him and his games/ideas.

As to the rest of the "controversy" good luck finding someplace that makes you happy. Standard operating procedure is to have one place have the exclusive official announcement of a product with "leaks" happening all over. As to if it is intentional or not, that is up to the reader (my guess is not - someone says an offhand remark and some gaming publication figures they now have the "exclusive" and runs it even though everyone knows it is 90% wrong). I doubt NCSoft and Anet really have the advertising they want from this - however The Enquirer most certainly does even if it turns out to be 99% wrong.

Redfeather1975

Redfeather1975

Forge Runner

Join Date: Sep 2006

Apartment#306

Rhedd Asylum

Me/

I know who Lord British is!
And I've never played an Ultima game!
Although some of my buddies did when we were young.

Off topic, but one of my friends said that what we know as video games today were first approached to the miliary as training aids. Is that true?

Kuldebar Valiturus

Kuldebar Valiturus

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Nov 2006

Garden City, Idaho

The Order of Relumination (TOoR)

R/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vandal2k6
So why does Mr Garriott feel the need to make a statement like this? Who or what has said something that he feels needs a response. I read most GW news all the time and I've got to say I've heard nothing. Can anyone shed any light?

To me he sounds angry and yet worried at the same time.
Is it really that difficult to understand? I mean, really?

If something is falsely attributed to you, it is only natural to correct the record. This is especially true when the falsehood or misquote could do damage of some kind. Someone decided to stir things up by spewing a falsely attributed statement to one of founding fathers of online gaming. The internet makes things type of rumors very easy, so a lot of effort is required to counter it. So, why is it so hard to understand why a public statement would be released?

People have been sniping at ANet and Guild Wars for 3 years now, from the moment it was announced that the game was following a completely different business model unparalleled in the game industry.

Edit: Sure, Lord British didn't make the first online game and George Washington didn't bring forth the first republic in the world, so what?