I've played through the Factions and Nightfall campaigns as an Earth Elementalist. Sandstorm + Deep Freeze + Eruption + Churning Earth and things tend to die. So, in my attempt to (again) get to know Searing Flames (due to its in-demand style by DoA groups), I simply can't figure out what all the hubbub is about.
By the time High level mob AL is figured in, I'm spamming a 15energy skill for 20-30 dmg. Not to mention the fact that it locks you into one hell of a boring cast sequence... MoR, Liquid Flame, SF, gaze, Glyph... spam spam spam gaze... and all to simply see highly resisted damage numbers.
So, does anyone else share my opinion? Is this a skill highly overrated?
PvE, Searing Flames Overrated?
marmaduke
Dr Strangelove
Searing flames goes berserk when you have 3 or more eles casting it. Even with the stupid AL of endgame mobs, you'll do around 60 damage every 3.75 seconds to everything in the mob, +damage from burning. MS, which is kinda secondary, is nice to keep the Kis interrupted for a short bit as well.
That being said, it's not the only option there, people are just kinda uncreative. Splinter + barrage is pretty sexy, to name one. However, as much as I like the ticking AoE combo in most PvE, it's probably not going to do enough damage in one spike to clear everything out, and if aggro manages to break out of it, it's going to quickly become impossible for you to kill anything while the SF guy continues happily spamming away. If there's any consistent thing I can say about all my DoA runs, it's that things tend to go all to hell at some point in them- aggro breaks, a lone monster shows up and refuses to lock on the tank, you'll mess up and cast at the wrong area, your piece of crap bipper decides he's bored, gets drunk while still on vent, then leaves. Better to have something a little forgiving, IMO.
That being said, it's not the only option there, people are just kinda uncreative. Splinter + barrage is pretty sexy, to name one. However, as much as I like the ticking AoE combo in most PvE, it's probably not going to do enough damage in one spike to clear everything out, and if aggro manages to break out of it, it's going to quickly become impossible for you to kill anything while the SF guy continues happily spamming away. If there's any consistent thing I can say about all my DoA runs, it's that things tend to go all to hell at some point in them- aggro breaks, a lone monster shows up and refuses to lock on the tank, you'll mess up and cast at the wrong area, your piece of crap bipper decides he's bored, gets drunk while still on vent, then leaves. Better to have something a little forgiving, IMO.
Zinger314
After the nerf from 7 seconds to 5 seconds, you need atleast 2 SF to be effective.
Of course, if you have 2 SF, then it's crazy.
Of course, if you have 2 SF, then it's crazy.
ArKaiN
It IS boring as hell, but the sheer damage output alone means its not overrated.
After I finished NF with my elem and bought Factions, I took my team of triple SF elems(myself included)+ToF tank and proceeded to clear every mission on master in two days. It was pathetic. I'm looking forward to hard mode.
After I finished NF with my elem and bought Factions, I took my team of triple SF elems(myself included)+ToF tank and proceeded to clear every mission on master in two days. It was pathetic. I'm looking forward to hard mode.
Dr Strangelove
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zinger314
After the nerf from 7 seconds to 5 seconds, you need atleast 2 SF to be effective.
Of course, if you have 2 SF, then it's crazy. Most SF eles have mark of rodgort, making the shortened burning time irrelevant for the most part.
Of course, if you have 2 SF, then it's crazy. Most SF eles have mark of rodgort, making the shortened burning time irrelevant for the most part.
Thom Bangalter
obviously SOMEONE hasn't been grinding their lightbringer title.
searing flames, unfortunately, was poorly balanced. The skill is spectacular in groups with 3+ sf eles as the burning lasts long enough for the eles to get a couple cycles on it and do a couple hundred damage (before armor is taken into effect). Unfortunately with 1 or 2 eles the burning duration ends before you can get signficant damage on the mobs.
Ideally, the skill would be 15/1/1 and read "target foe and nearby foes are set on fire for 7 seconds. if that foe is already on fire, foe takes 5...80 damage instead." Thus preventing the skill from being a spike skill but allowing 1 or 2 searing flames to pressure and apply direct damage on a target.
searing flames, unfortunately, was poorly balanced. The skill is spectacular in groups with 3+ sf eles as the burning lasts long enough for the eles to get a couple cycles on it and do a couple hundred damage (before armor is taken into effect). Unfortunately with 1 or 2 eles the burning duration ends before you can get signficant damage on the mobs.
Ideally, the skill would be 15/1/1 and read "target foe and nearby foes are set on fire for 7 seconds. if that foe is already on fire, foe takes 5...80 damage instead." Thus preventing the skill from being a spike skill but allowing 1 or 2 searing flames to pressure and apply direct damage on a target.
Cebe
Quote:
Originally Posted by marmaduke
I played with a different combination. Sandstorm > Eruption > Dragon's Stomp. I take Razah with Earthbind. That combination kills most groups of Margonites in about 5-6 seconds (the casters anyway, leaves paragons and rangers at about 10-20% health - Nothing a Churning Earth doesn't fix
)...for some reason they're stupid enough to stay bunched up. Oh well...makes my job easier.Quote:
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Originally Posted by marmaduke
By the time High level mob AL is figured in, I'm spamming a 15energy skill for 20-30 dmg. Not to mention the fact that it locks you into one hell of a boring cast sequence... MoR, Liquid Flame, SF, gaze, Glyph... spam spam spam gaze... and all to simply see highly resisted damage numbers.
So, does anyone else share my opinion? Is this a skill highly overrated? Personally I don't like Searing Flames, it's SO boring. That's not to say it doesn't deal a reasonable amount of damage...and let's not forget the Burning does hurt and degen due to burning ignores armor. Personally I prefer Mind Blast and Mark of Rodgort when I decide to play fire for the added (awesome) energy management. Some times I have been able to stand inside a "ward" by an Ether Seal and keep half my energy intact by the end. It's prety cool. I just feel that my Earth Magic is better in some respects...it has built in team support by blinding and knockdown (= mass interruption)...it just seems to "do" more than a SF spammer.
cellardweller
One of the most fun times I've had was taking 1 tank, 1 monk and 6SF Heroes through domain of fear. I'd run into a group and get them into a nice tight ball then myself then my partner would move the flags right to the edge of my agro bubble.
The torment creatures would all drop into call to torment at the same time then fall over 2 seconds later. Its a beautiful thing seeing 1-2 groups of the toughest creatures in nightfall killed in just over 4 seconds.
Poison Ivy
Quote:
Originally Posted by cellardweller
One of the most fun times I've had was taking 1 tank, 1 monk and 6SF Heroes through domain of fear. I'd run into a group and get them into a nice tight ball then myself then my partner would move the flags right to the edge of my agro bubble.
The torment creatures would all drop into call to torment at the same time then fall over 2 seconds later. Its a beautiful thing seeing 1-2 groups of the toughest creatures in nightfall killed in just over 4 seconds. And drop nothing but junk 
Luciora
So true Poison!
 OP - As stated by a few people already, SF effectively needs 2+ eles to do big damage. But with those in the group they tend to rip through most anything If you are just looking for a fun build, look at savanha heat (sp??)
bungusmaximus
If you think SF is boring, let the heroes take care of it. One of the reasons I love heroes is that they can play boring cookie cutters for me, like MM, or SF ele, spirit pooper and so on. Paired with mark of rodgort SF is still pretty devastating, even on a single ele ^^.
BaconSoda
Quote:
Originally Posted by marmaduke
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by marmaduke
I simply can't figure out what all the hubbub is about.
Why would anyone play Fire Magic in the first place? It's so....boring. You can't frustrate anyone with Fire Magic! I dare that warrior to run and hit me....Icy Shackles + Mending=lose
marmaduke
Well, with the introduction of hardmode, I'm going to forego trying to like SF and be content with Earth for a while (now that the primary thing to do is not simply just DoA).
Possibly an Earth/Air hybrid for going up against lvl30 bosses that repeatedly spike your entire group for 300+ if it's relying on just SF spamming with little defensive capability.
XvArchonvX
Has anyone tried to see if the enemy increased movement speed in Hard mode triggers the KD from [skill]Churning Earth[/skill]?
Ishtar Serket
When its just one ele using it SF is generally overrated. Its mostly used for a good amount of damage in a short time but its most attractive quality is the fact with Glowing Gaze and Fire Attunement you have great energy management. Add to that the fact its one of those builds heroes can easily run and its fairly reliable. Usually when I'm in a party with others I'll go SF nuker since thats what parties are looking for.
As for why people go fire, its the heavy damage of it that attracts people. Personally I've found the recharge and casting time of fire magic to be too severe to make it the best choice in general. I like the hexes of water magic, the spiking of air and earth for its great damage. pingu666
i think SF is the best damage u can get out of fire, sustained anyways
LoyalSoldier
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ishtar Serket
When its just one ele using it SF is generally overrated. Its mostly used for a good amount of damage in a short time but its most attractive quality is the fact with Glowing Gaze and Fire Attunement you have great energy management. Add to that the fact its one of those builds heroes can easily run and its fairly reliable. Usually when I'm in a party with others I'll go SF nuker since thats what parties are looking for.
As for why people go fire, its the heavy damage of it that attracts people. Personally I've found the recharge and casting time of fire magic to be too severe to make it the best choice in general. I like the hexes of water magic, the spiking of air and earth for its great damage. Fire is mainly used for the area damage. Basically in PvE it is the sexiest choice. Still some earth builds aren't half bad.
Xiaxhou of Trinity
IMO SF has been overrated for a long time....I like to run SH, with MoR and Glowing Gaze. For earth, I like to run things like churning earth and etc, throw in ob flame if I feel like messing around (seriously hate the exhaustion off that, makes me angry). Course for PvP I like to run weird builds, E/A with dags, E/N with grenths balance.
XvArchonvX
I think a lot of people run as the only SF ele in a group when they try it for the first time and end up being relatively unimpressed. SF is a skill that really shines when ran in a group with multiple SF eles.
NinjaKai
SF is most effective with 2 or more SF elementalists. In PUGs where you normally get an amalgamation of professions whivh are normally unstructured. Then a build not relying on another person tends to be superior.
Cebe
Backfire .
I Will Heal You Ally
Backfire, any increasing energy cost ranger spirits, Domain of Secrets Enviroment Effect, long battles without a BiP
Maetel
I vote for daze !
DarkGanni
Backfire + Soul Leach = owns every caster (till they remove the hex anyway)
zling
Power Leach is also nice, drain them of energy and than do whatever you want to them...
but my favourites are: Daze->Migraine->Arcane Connundrum
IllusiveMind
Power Block + Mantra of Flame + Frigid Armor = GG.
LightningHell
Backfire in general is a terrible PvP skill...
...unless you bank on your opponent being absolutely, painstakingly, stupid, but then you'd be winning anyway. AlienFromBeyond
Quote:
Originally Posted by XvArchonvX
Has anyone tried to see if the enemy increased movement speed in Hard mode triggers the KD from [skill]Churning Earth[/skill]?
That's certainly something worth checking at least. Wouldn't be very hard to do.
KazeMitsui
YES IT DOES TRIGGER cause i had one of my friends bring that first thing when we brought a earth ele to do some missions wards and churnning EARTH PWN THEM NUB CHARR
also freakin dshot pwns SF hahhahahawfhhahhafhkjsadfhkasfdkj
MBP
enchantment removal messes up SFers pretty good
and Vow of Silence for Dervish and Spellbreaker for Monk sure irritate me when I'm trying to roast them Margonites. I guess a melee char with good elemental resistance could make mince meat out of them too....cripple...then hack and slash away xDusT II
Signet of humility?
That or just spread out and have the monk remove the burning as soon as it's applied.
Cebe
Yes, I have been having much fun with Churning Earth. It is usually on my Earth Magic skilbar. Well worth taking imo.
Also regarding Vow of Silence and Spellbraker...there are lots of options here: - [wiki]Disenchantment[/wiki] - [wiki]Chilblains[/wiki] - [wiki]Signet of Disenchantment[/wiki] - [wiki]Well of the Profane[/wiki] - [wiki]Assault Enchantments[/wiki] ...there are plenty of non-spell based enchantment removals...and as has been said. Signet of Humility is nice too.
Mourne
Well my question is why do people even bother with eles
 .Acolyte Jin, Margrid the Sly, and Olias are my brothers/sisters. I run them everywhere I will be finding bodies. Who says B/P groups shouldn't be used in places besides ToPK and SF . I do run eles where corpses are a problem, besides that, I can't get away from this setup with its interupts and minions keeping ppl alive.
Ozric
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mourne
Well my question is why do people even bother with eles
.Acolyte Jin, Margrid the Sly, and Olias are my brothers/sisters. I run them everywhere I will be finding bodies. Who says B/P groups shouldn't be used in places besides ToPK and SF,... Well my answer would be that I don't feel like I'm playing the game when I have heroes and henchies do the work for me,... and that feeling extends to minions as well. That's why I tank ToPK with my ele in an all nuker group. No minions helping you out in Tombs makes for a nice bare-knuckle brawl!
erfweiss
Quote:
Originally Posted by LightningHell
Backfire in general is a terrible PvP skill...
...unless you bank on your opponent being absolutely, painstakingly, stupid, but then you'd be winning anyway. That form of PvP is Alliance Battles. PvP for morons. |
