I am 49 years old, and I have been playing Guild Wars for almost 2 years now (23 months plus) and although I have tried many of the other mmorpg games, I have not found any other game whose gameplay, graphics and storyline can hold my interest like Guild Wars does, it's the only game I now play on a daily basis.
Although I love the game, I have become very concerned with some of the changes that Anet has announced will be put in to Guild Wars 2. One of the aspects I love about Guild Wars is it's fluid movement in both combat and overall gameplay. Being quite a bit older than the average mmorpg player, my manual dexterity and reaction time is not what you would call great! That said, it was very disconcerting to me when I learned that Anet plans to do away COMPLETELY with the click to move and go with a Z-Axis system.
I am totally aware and agree that the Z-Axis system will eliminate some player exploits (such as attacking an enemy above you on a hill with a melee weapon) and allow a much more rich interaction by enabling players to swim, slide, jump, etc... HOWEVER are we to expect a control system similar to WOW or LOTRO where a melee character has to practically be on top of his enemy in order to attack, or a character to be right on top of a chest or npc in order to interact with it? I have read that target locking will not change in that you will still be able to lock on to an enemy and not just 1 part of the enemy's body HOWEVER, will a melee player still be able to click or double-click on an enemy from a distance and automatically move towards it and attack?
It is likely that many current players of the game may not find these issues to be of a major concern to them, however I can say that (although a minority) I speak for thousands of devoted gw players who love the game because of it's simple control system and find the WOW / LOTRO gameplay systems frustrating at best and not enjoyable at all to play.
Z-Axis and melee in Guild Wars 2
DAD's Boss
Aera
Guild Wars has the lock-on attack system, so you don't have to press any buttons to attack, therefore, you don't have to be REALLY close, hugging the enemy and I'm sure they won't remove this in GW2.
FoxBat
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Originally Posted by Aera
nd I'm sure they won't remove this in GW2.
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Kityn
Actually Jeff Strain or Mike O'Brien has stated in an interview that the targetting that we have in GW will be passed along to GW2.
lightblade
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Originally Posted by DAD's Boss
I am 49 years old, and I have been playing Guild Wars for almost 2 years now (23 months plus) and although I have tried many of the other mmorpg games, I have not found any other game whose gameplay, graphics and storyline can hold my interest like Guild Wars does, it's the only game I now play on a daily basis.
Although I love the game, I have become very concerned with some of the changes that Anet has announced will be put in to Guild Wars 2. One of the aspects I love about Guild Wars is it's fluid movement in both combat and overall gameplay. Being quite a bit older than the average mmorpg player, my manual dexterity and reaction time is not what you would call great! That said, it was very disconcerting to me when I learned that Anet plans to do away COMPLETELY with the click to move and go with a Z-Axis system. I am totally aware and agree that the Z-Axis system will eliminate some player exploits (such as attacking an enemy above you on a hill with a melee weapon) and allow a much more rich interaction by enabling players to swim, slide, jump, etc... HOWEVER are we to expect a control system similar to WOW or LOTRO where a melee character has to practically be on top of his enemy in order to attack, or a character to be right on top of a chest or npc in order to interact with it? I have read that target locking will not change in that you will still be able to lock on to an enemy and not just 1 part of the enemy's body HOWEVER, will a melee player still be able to click or double-click on an enemy from a distance and automatically move towards it and attack? It is likely that many current players of the game may not find these issues to be of a major concern to them, however I can say that (although a minority) I speak for thousands of devoted gw players who love the game because of it's simple control system and find the WOW / LOTRO gameplay systems frustrating at best and not enjoyable at all to play. |
lucifer_uk
I agree something more simple or even more effective than the WoW control system is a must for a lot of players, saying that it needs to have the freedom feeling of being able to jump, swim, etc.
I personally feel like although the current system is effective and easy, it lacks the feeling of freedom and makes the game feel far too robotic and predetermined to me.
I personally feel like although the current system is effective and easy, it lacks the feeling of freedom and makes the game feel far too robotic and predetermined to me.
Nuclear Eclipse
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Originally Posted by DAD's Boss
I am 49 years old, and I have been playing Guild Wars for almost 2 years now (23 months plus) and although I have tried many of the other mmorpg games, I have not found any other game whose gameplay, graphics and storyline can hold my interest like Guild Wars does, it's the only game I now play on a daily basis.
Although I love the game, I have become very concerned with some of the changes that Anet has announced will be put in to Guild Wars 2. One of the aspects I love about Guild Wars is it's fluid movement in both combat and overall gameplay. Being quite a bit older than the average mmorpg player, my manual dexterity and reaction time is not what you would call great! That said, it was very disconcerting to me when I learned that Anet plans to do away COMPLETELY with the click to move and go with a Z-Axis system. I am totally aware and agree that the Z-Axis system will eliminate some player exploits (such as attacking an enemy above you on a hill with a melee weapon) and allow a much more rich interaction by enabling players to swim, slide, jump, etc... HOWEVER are we to expect a control system similar to WOW or LOTRO where a melee character has to practically be on top of his enemy in order to attack, or a character to be right on top of a chest or npc in order to interact with it? I have read that target locking will not change in that you will still be able to lock on to an enemy and not just 1 part of the enemy's body HOWEVER, will a melee player still be able to click or double-click on an enemy from a distance and automatically move towards it and attack? It is likely that many current players of the game may not find these issues to be of a major concern to them, however I can say that (although a minority) I speak for thousands of devoted gw players who love the game because of it's simple control system and find the WOW / LOTRO gameplay systems frustrating at best and not enjoyable at all to play. |
RSGashapon
If they can design a good balance between the ease of movement and targeting in GW1 with the freedom to swim, jump, crawl, slide, etc. common to many other games, then I'm all for it. Give people the ability to really move around, yet also stick with the easy click-to-move features people are used to.
Just because you can bound around like a Jack Russel Terrier, doesn't mean you have to.
Just because you can bound around like a Jack Russel Terrier, doesn't mean you have to.
fenix
Well, since they are removing click-to-move, it will be interesting to see how they change the movement in GW2. I think it could be a lot like WoW, but we'll have to wait the whole 2 years to find out :P
Shoitaan
I pretty much WASD anyway unless I want to check out my chars armour while he's running but I can understand your concerns. If what czymann said is right then I'm sure you have nothing to worry about. What I was dreading was PvP melee resembling the stupid crap from WoW where people jump through each other and basically whoever turns faster is better - but then I remembered the gw's has glorious body blocking XD
Kas
Even if they wouldn't be adding all the jump nonsense, the Z-Axis would have to be fixed for GW2. The faulty Z-Axis is the perfect soil for a horde of bugs. Attacking and blocking through walls and bridges, teleporting onto otherwise unaccessible areas, Line of Sight problems etc etc etc
Mylon
About every MMORPG I have seen in the past 5 years has all used the same map system. A simple bumpy grid with objects plopped on. I'm tired of looking at the same ugly looking mountains, flat, steep but not vertical cliff faces, a complete lack of bluffs, and so on. Let's get a fresh map system in, please! This includes having more variety in terms of Z axis.
Omega X
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Originally Posted by DAD's Boss
That said, it was very disconcerting to me when I learned that Anet plans to do away COMPLETELY with the click to move and go with a Z-Axis system.
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EVERY recent MMO that I know of has click to move in one form, shape,or fashion.
Though you can't blame this on a Z-Axis system however. The Z-Axis will remove a ton of issues with the current form of Guild Wars, yes. But the GW1 control system can easily fit into GW2 without much modification.
Trying to reinvent the control wheel will only turn off a lot of current players of the GW1.
Taki
I'm with the OP on this one. I love click to move, it's a lazy man's pot-o-gold in these types of games. Having the keyboard as the only option for movement isn't very healthy either. Strange enough, every Korean 3-D mmorpg I've played has had c2m and it worked like a charm. Click 20ft in front of you where there's a drop-off and guess what happens when you reach the end of the ground you're on - that's right, you drop off. I really hope c2m makes it way into GW2 someway. Keyboard only movement sucks to the highest degree
Celestial_Kitsune
Properly implemented Z-axis may be a good thing because it will increase complexity of the combat. I can see wammos doing this in GW2...
DAD's Boss
I am glad to see some very good responses to my post (both for and against keeping c2m) and I do believe those who said to keep click to move as an option are on the right track.
The z-axis system will eliminate lots of exploits that are currently in the game and heck z-axis will give us jumping swimming etc... (an I am all for that) it's just that that in all the z-axis games I have played like wow and lotro, if you are melee you have to be almost on top of the enemy before you can attack them.
I believe Anet should keep click to move as an alternative to keyboard. If they are able to do this and and implement all the other features that z-axis will give us, GW2 should be a great playable game and many more GW1 players will make the move over to GW2.
The z-axis system will eliminate lots of exploits that are currently in the game and heck z-axis will give us jumping swimming etc... (an I am all for that) it's just that that in all the z-axis games I have played like wow and lotro, if you are melee you have to be almost on top of the enemy before you can attack them.
I believe Anet should keep click to move as an alternative to keyboard. If they are able to do this and and implement all the other features that z-axis will give us, GW2 should be a great playable game and many more GW1 players will make the move over to GW2.
Yawgmoth
Click to move has to stay! I don't mind adding lots of new options but using mouseclicks to move character is the fastest and most comfortable way. If you don't believe, come and solo me on Dragon Arena 
Mouse movement FTW!
Guardian of the Light
I'd like a Lock-on system where you could attack while doing some moves to elimate button mashing but make it more inivative.
Space Bar = Lock on
You lock on you yoiur foe and automatic move within range if your target moves just like in our current GW however there would be other features.
(W,A,S,D)(movementkeys) + Jump key would make you jump in that direction and if you jumped forward with the attack lock you would lunge forward and attack.
Combining with attacks would also create cool effects
Lets use some common GW skills as examples
W (forward)+jump+ galrath's used in midjump = Jump Forward Then roll and slash target foe with Extra damage.
W + jump + Point blank shot used quickly = Jump up above you foe (if your close enough and he doesn't move too quickly) and shot 1 arrow that deals a fair amount of damage and land on the other side.
A + jump + Cyclone Axe = side jump then roll around your foe and jump and slash everyone with your axe.
W + jump +Inferno = Elementist jumping towards foe and exploding on contact with a bunch of fire.
Basically all these skills would have use that seem common sense if they were done jumping or rolling.
Space Bar = Lock on
You lock on you yoiur foe and automatic move within range if your target moves just like in our current GW however there would be other features.
(W,A,S,D)(movementkeys) + Jump key would make you jump in that direction and if you jumped forward with the attack lock you would lunge forward and attack.
Combining with attacks would also create cool effects
Lets use some common GW skills as examples
W (forward)+jump+ galrath's used in midjump = Jump Forward Then roll and slash target foe with Extra damage.
W + jump + Point blank shot used quickly = Jump up above you foe (if your close enough and he doesn't move too quickly) and shot 1 arrow that deals a fair amount of damage and land on the other side.
A + jump + Cyclone Axe = side jump then roll around your foe and jump and slash everyone with your axe.
W + jump +Inferno = Elementist jumping towards foe and exploding on contact with a bunch of fire.
Basically all these skills would have use that seem common sense if they were done jumping or rolling.
Darksun
It is confusing that they would remove click to move. Having the option of both is nice, and traveling long distances isn't a chore since you can click far away.
I assume they will keep the targeting, the whole LOTR "must be facing target" thing is retarded.
I assume they will keep the targeting, the whole LOTR "must be facing target" thing is retarded.
DAD's Boss
Although it's a small sampling, (like myself) the majority of the people who have responded to this thread seem to be in favor of keeping click to move in GW2, at least in some form. Arena Net has a gained reputation for listening to the GW community, I sincerely hope that in the case of "click to move" they continue to listen.
Bryant Again
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Originally Posted by Darksun
It is confusing that they would remove click to move. Having the option of both is nice, and traveling long distances isn't a chore since you can click far away.
I assume they will keep the targeting, the whole LOTR "must be facing target" thing is retarded. |
To Gaurdian's Light: Sounds a lot like Zelda. If Guild Wars 2 followed that, then I'd be doomed...I probably couldn't stop playing. In more seriousness, it's a good, fun and realistic combat system to follow. Not overly stressful and somewhat simple, too. I guess we'll wait and see...
Draco_Zandros
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Originally Posted by lightblade
There are thousands of devoted WoW players that found GW system frustrating and not enjoyable.
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As for Click-to-move, I tend to use WASD for general movement and tab for targeting but it's a lot faster to target a specific opponent with the mouse than tabbing through them. The mouse is also handy for when moving around in a town, been able to click somewhere and knowing that in the majority of the cases the computer will move me there without any problems is nice.
I also use click-to-move for picking up loot and when I'm multi-tasking, as I usually have another computer running with either Guild Wiki open or a forum.
So I say we keep click-to-move!
carrot guy
what is anet exactly planning to achieve removing this from the game..clicking is something i use most of the time when moving..and it should definately be kept in guild wars
Bryant Again
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Originally Posted by carrot guy
what is anet exactly planning to achieve removing this from the game..clicking is something i use most of the time when moving..and it should definately be kept in guild wars
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vergerefosh
Keep click to move, it's easy when you're feeling lazy, or when you've got one hand full, so you can move and bash things easily
Clord
Some people can actually play LOTR Online before saying combat system is totally like WoW. Options got setting for auto move to targeted monster.
Omega X
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Originally Posted by Guardian of the Light
I'd like a Lock-on system where you could attack while doing some moves to elimate button mashing but make it more inivative.
Space Bar = Lock on You lock on you yoiur foe and automatic move within range if your target moves just like in our current GW however there would be other features. (W,A,S,D)(movementkeys) + Jump key would make you jump in that direction and if you jumped forward with the attack lock you would lunge forward and attack. Combining with attacks would also create cool effects Lets use some common GW skills as examples W (forward)+jump+ galrath's used in midjump = Jump Forward Then roll and slash target foe with Extra damage. W + jump + Point blank shot used quickly = Jump up above you foe (if your close enough and he doesn't move too quickly) and shot 1 arrow that deals a fair amount of damage and land on the other side. A + jump + Cyclone Axe = side jump then roll around your foe and jump and slash everyone with your axe. W + jump +Inferno = Elementist jumping towards foe and exploding on contact with a bunch of fire. Basically all these skills would have use that seem common sense if they were done jumping or rolling. |
Bryant Again
Now, none of you may remember it, but I thought Silver had a fun combat system. What you did was you had to face an enemy, then hold down the left mouse button and move your mouse in a direction to swing at the enemy.
From what I remember, it worked pretty well. I need to see if it's on eBay...
From what I remember, it worked pretty well. I need to see if it's on eBay...
The Lost Explorer
Hey Unc, Bleeding here just wanted to say that i to agree with everything your saying about the z-axis. As u know im a Warrior too and im worried about the z-axis too but i also would enjoy the swimming and jumping features. I hope whatever Anet does it want ruin the game for Meleers like us.
Noanoa
I'd certainly be interested in using a pad/controller with GW2. What's been discussed here reminds me of FFXI, which didn't have click-to-move (and thus was very hard for me to master, so I started to use a playstation pad via adapter and it became really fun and easy to play).
autococker985
I am with you Uncle, although I am not quite as old as you are. lol
I also agree with Draco that I use the WASD keys some what, but the click to move is important to me when I am chatting with team members. I just click up screen and that gives us old people just enough time to type in chat comments just before having to fight the next monster. That is just one pro of the click to move feature that no one has discussed yet.
I guess with out click to move I just won’t be able to fight and chat with my team or guild.
That is all I have to say on this subject for now.
Thanks,
Mon Mothara
Proud Officer of DAD 1
I also agree with Draco that I use the WASD keys some what, but the click to move is important to me when I am chatting with team members. I just click up screen and that gives us old people just enough time to type in chat comments just before having to fight the next monster. That is just one pro of the click to move feature that no one has discussed yet.
I guess with out click to move I just won’t be able to fight and chat with my team or guild.
That is all I have to say on this subject for now.
Thanks,
Mon Mothara
Proud Officer of DAD 1
sweat man
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i liked the theory that was presented about the interaction with skills, ie the jump + skill used, could look pretty class and add a new element to the game, although i love the movment system atm, i am realy lazy and il get bored quickly moving long distances without click to move
carrot guy
unless your planning on just using hotkeys you need a mouse..
Giga Strike
I guess im the only one here that would rather not have the click to move function. there are many times when i try to click an ally only to miss, click the ground, and accidentally move up to the front line. and being a monk, thats a bad thing.
even after playing runescape for a year i prefer the wasd controls. i feel it gives me more direct control over where im going and it also makes it easier to dodge non-solid obstacles, like lava, that i would otherwise have to click multiple times to prevent a simple strait-line path from taking me though it.
the introduction of the z-axis would easily bring more possibilities to the gameplay than clicking to move could ever hope to.
even after playing runescape for a year i prefer the wasd controls. i feel it gives me more direct control over where im going and it also makes it easier to dodge non-solid obstacles, like lava, that i would otherwise have to click multiple times to prevent a simple strait-line path from taking me though it.
the introduction of the z-axis would easily bring more possibilities to the gameplay than clicking to move could ever hope to.
DAD's Boss
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Originally Posted by Giga Strike
I guess im the only one here that would rather not have the click to move function. there are many times when i try to click an ally only to miss, click the ground, and accidentally move up to the front line. and being a monk, thats a bad thing.
even after playing runescape for a year i prefer the wasd controls. i feel it gives me more direct control over where im going and it also makes it easier to dodge non-solid obstacles, like lava, that i would otherwise have to click multiple times to prevent a simple strait-line path from taking me though it. the introduction of the z-axis would easily bring more possibilities to the gameplay than clicking to move could ever hope to. |
I don't understand, you currently can use wasd keys in Guild Wars, so what's your point, is it that you just don't want people to have the click to move option in Guild Wars 2 just because you personally do not like it?
Omega X
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Originally Posted by Giga Strike
I guess im the only one here that would rather not have the click to move function. there are many times when i try to click an ally only to miss, click the ground, and accidentally move up to the front line. and being a monk, thats a bad thing.
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Point blank, Lack of click to move without a decent replacement means they won't be getting my money.
Replicant
wow, lots of mouse users....
I guess it's my FPS game history, but W A S D and holding the right mouse button seems to feel the most comfortable, and personally hate the mouse move clicking stuff. (No offense anyone, if it works for you guys use it =P) Don't understand why they'd remove it, it's usually in every MMO game out there.
only thing concerning me about the Z-Axis, is things like bridges and stuff with enemies below you, you can get body blocked or things like Thunderhead Keep where theres rangers up above and warriors can't do any damage to them until the group gets up and opens the door (unless they use cyclone axe or something below them).
I guess it's my FPS game history, but W A S D and holding the right mouse button seems to feel the most comfortable, and personally hate the mouse move clicking stuff. (No offense anyone, if it works for you guys use it =P) Don't understand why they'd remove it, it's usually in every MMO game out there.
only thing concerning me about the Z-Axis, is things like bridges and stuff with enemies below you, you can get body blocked or things like Thunderhead Keep where theres rangers up above and warriors can't do any damage to them until the group gets up and opens the door (unless they use cyclone axe or something below them).
Pynne
I also love the click to move method found in GW. I rarely use any keys for moving, just using the keyboard to open various menus. I can play with one hand, and just be lazy in general, nice and relaxing. When your attention is divided between the game, wife, kid, TV...click to move is a godsend.
I tried the LOTRO preview, and though there were many things I liked about the game, I just hated not having "click to move". I gave it six hours, but I missed my nice, easy GW controls too much to stay away any longer.
I really love GW, and it would break my heart to look elsewhere, but in my opinion, the movement options are among the most important parts of any game. If there is no click to move option in GW2, then it will be very tough for Anet to get my money.
I tried the LOTRO preview, and though there were many things I liked about the game, I just hated not having "click to move". I gave it six hours, but I missed my nice, easy GW controls too much to stay away any longer.
I really love GW, and it would break my heart to look elsewhere, but in my opinion, the movement options are among the most important parts of any game. If there is no click to move option in GW2, then it will be very tough for Anet to get my money.
DAD's Boss
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Originally Posted by Pynne
I also love the click to move method found in GW. I rarely use any keys for moving, just using the keyboard to open various menus. I can play with one hand, and just be lazy in general, nice and relaxing. When your attention is divided between the game, wife, kid, TV...click to move is a godsend.
I tried the LOTRO preview, and though there were many things I liked about the game, I just hated not having "click to move". I gave it six hours, but I missed my nice, easy GW controls too much to stay away any longer. I really love GW, and it would break my heart to look elsewhere, but in my opinion, the movement options are among the most important parts of any game. If there is no click to move option in GW2, then it will be very tough for Anet to get my money. |
I too played LOTRO (played up to lvl 15) and it was extremely frustrating for me to play a melee character. Even though they have a option for setting auto move to targeted monster, it was implemented poorly, you still had to be relatively close to the enemy to lock on and auto move to it, and many times the target would not stay locked while moving towards it.
In addition, I found the overall combat movement as a melee character not to be nearly as smooth as the combat in Guild Wars, I am not sure why but I assume that it may be inherent to the z-axis system. If Anet can go with the z-axis system while still keeping click to move as an option and implement movement in combat much better than we see in LOTRO then they will get my money.
carrot guy
i played WoW,LOTRO and who knows how many other games and none compare to guild wars.
i generally do use WADS but when targeting something..like i'm sure the majority of the guild wars community does i will click the target..guild wars by far has the best combat system than most of these games so if anything they should still make it so you can target while clicking ATLEAST
i generally do use WADS but when targeting something..like i'm sure the majority of the guild wars community does i will click the target..guild wars by far has the best combat system than most of these games so if anything they should still make it so you can target while clicking ATLEAST