Will the HoM only reward grinding?

You know there are a few really unique rewards given in the real world. One I can think of is the Congressional Medal of Honor. Check and see how many of those who received them were still alive to get the honor. Of the rest, check and see how many were too scared to do anything but what they did, too busy to notice, or thinking - "Gee if I grind away rescuing fellow socldiers today I might get the CMH..." And yes, that is not a video game, but the recognition system in GW is based on enforced hours of tedious monotonous play or routine tedious monotonous practice for no life enriching result.

You cannot walk into a dental office and apply for a technical assistants positions because you made Champion. You cannot get into the Bar Association of your state or territory based on the number of griffons you killed on your last run. You cannot buy diapers based on the number of missions you pwned in Factions five years down the road. No one is going to care nor are your grades or life earning potential going to be increased by the excessive hours you spent in the arenas earning hero points or doing Guild vs. Guild when it is time for you to go get a job.

What is ANet's seeming best response to this - "You have been playing for 2 hours. Please take a break." Yet, at the same time, the entire game is structured to encourage grind and so far seems to be still structured to encourage grind. End result, people believe grind is the function of having fun. I pity the modern world where people feel WORKING to have fun is the nature of having fun.

As I mentioned above, I no longer have anything to put in the HoM. I destroyed all of my characters. I gave my Kuunavang to a friend to hold in case I ever came back. She is a sweet elderly lady, and disabled, I am certain she would return it if she was still on line. She is not. My disatisfaction with Factions, with the fiasco of its production, with the misinformation about how it would work, with the changes between preview and full release, with the destruction of the Minion Master, with the control of access to content areas by people in PvP over and against PvE, with the Faction system which is prejudicial against free thinking individuals, the utterly slow response to months and months and months of issues with storage and botting, etc. greatly soured my position on what should be an excellent experience.

But then I am one of those casual gamers who is not supposed to be able to enjoy the game more than 20% of the time you elite players do.

Earning titles, in ANY game, is always based on doing the same repetitive things over and over. I admit, doing so does not make someone a better player. Thus, most titles could be earned by completing a few quests as well, if its only about using skills. But many players like it this way, and everyone is free to join it or leave it. So I would not be bothered about that.

Another thing is doing repetitive things to become more powerful. Either by earning gold to buy better gear/skills, or by increasing in level. In a good balanced game grinding should not be necessary. Certainly not if its for gold or items. When players grind for that, it means the game is too 'scroogy'; droprates are too low.

I have no clue how this will be in GW:EN or in G2. Probably for GW:EN nothing much will change, since its related to existing GW1 chapters. I hope this will be differend in GW2. After having played for some months one may expect to retrieve high level content without grinding. That is what I call 'balance'.

Guys, hold up one second.

Remember that new titles will be available in GW:EN. From the sound of them they will be quite different to what we've been doing so far. So hopefully it will be less of a grind and more "fun".

Though in regards to the explorer titles, I feel they're more of a "grind" than anything else because they're so difficult to get!!!

You could try to go for the titles included in GW:EN.

Anyway, there will be plenty of time to set a course of action between GW:EN and GW2.

Did you really think Areanet would actually do something nice to anyone, especially after the release of Grindfall? Grinding is their new mantra ¬¬ One only has to look at sunspear point grind, or almost every title, and they are all based on grinding.

Anyway my point is that no one can be sure about the HoM, as areanet has been very self-contradicting. Firstly I heard that weapons COULD be transfered (this was on guildwars.com) and then I read they could NOT (guildwars wiki) so perhaps they will allow transfer of other things, I know money and characters are no 100 % and I do agree somewhat.

My playing style is not so dissimmilar to yours: I have no interest in the grindfest that Areanet and co. enjoy imposing on you (2500 sunspear point grind well done on totally ruining grindfall) and I enjoy making many characters. Of course I won't be able to do that after they introduce their beloved grind to levelling also... *sigh*

There will most likely be a monument in Gwen that allows you to earn a weapon ... to use in GW2

you dont earn chaos axes...they drop.

Sigh, ok to start ARENAnet do lots of nice things for their players, it's just that a lot of those players don't think they're nice. Sure the weekend events we don't excite everybody but at least they're something. The holiday events have all (imo) been good.

Grinding - compared to other games, the amount of grinding you needed to get the required amount of Sunspear points is NOTHING. On my first character i got them by doing all the quests and generally getting from A to B. Regarding other titles, well tell me how we should go about getting them then. Open 10 chests, voila you've got the treasure hunter title. Win a ouple of ABs, your Champion of whoever. Apart from Sunspear, none of the titles are necessary, even the ones that affect gameplay like Lightbringer. I really don't see what the problem is with titles, don't like grinding for them, don't do them then.

Regarding HoM, no point in speculating about something that is a long way away. It doesn't matter what you seen on what website, official or not, as it may change anyway.

If you don't like grinding, then this is the game for you. As I already said, the 2,500 Sunspear points you need to advance is NOTHING. It takes no effort whatsoever to get them. That mechanic didn't ruin Nightfall. Finally in GW2 you will still be able to make lots of characters, you just won't get them all to the same level as someone who concentrates on one character., but then again what did you expect?

I'm going to ask the question again, since Fitz - though quoting the question in his post - did not answer it:
If you don't like the idea that "grind" would not be commemorated in the HoM, "grind" in this case being apparently doing anything other than just beating the game and aimlessly questing for the rest of the time, what would you like to be commemorated that is actually special?

And totally flawless, one can participate in holiday events without losing titles one is working on correct? Deaths from the Mad King will not destroy your Survivor Title correct?

I'm not playing other games and there is probably a reason for that. As it is I have one warrior, Ritter Hunder, who would be appropriate for the Encourageable Ale Hound Title - to get it he must grind for approximately 16,670 Hunter's Ales - or 3,334,000 g, . Of course there is no grind whatsoever in such a case - none, right. But if one wishes to be totally normal like ANet seems to want, then they will buy their gold on E-Bay at about $12/100k and the title is only about $408.00 for all you rich people out there.

Because unlike most computer gamers who are simply looking for some kind of complex Pong with pretty pictures I actually consider a bit of role play. And yes, I am quite aware GW is not an RP game, just an MMOG.

On this I completely agree. Whatever happens will happen. We couldn't even count on Factions to be what we experienced through the preview weekend or were promised by ANet representatives. GW and ANet don't know and won't know what they are going to do until after they have done it and then they will change it. ( , Yeah, I'm still upset over Factions and ANet has gotten no more money out of me since then.)

I will have to take your word for it as the more I hear about Nightfall the less I think it is worth investing in. So far, it sounds like a mash of monster munchkins, overly complex opsys, enforced grind, and little relief from the "you will be assimilated" mentality of Factions.

This is a curious statement to make after "no point in speculating about something that is a long way away." Are you saying we will have a limited pool of experience points? Or a limited pool of levels to distribute among our characters? Those are novel concepts...

What I expect is a game that is playable in a reasonable amount of time to epic levels of play. That means that a casual player, putting in a few hours a week (3-5) and a dedicated player, putting in several hours a week (9-12), could obtain their goals fully in two or three classes in 3 to 6 months. It means that excessive players would not be rewarded with excessively stimulated economies and statistics that destroy opportunity for casual and normal human players. It means game content is not withheld from people because they have real lives to live, children to feed, and bills to pay, or homework that takes priority over video addiction.

Edited time frame of achievement.

I would guess yes.

You'r entire post is full of logical sygoimies. Please read my critism to learn how to better structure a proper arguement. You'll probablly just flame me later and ignore everything I say, but its worth a shot...

Correct. If you have maxed the survivor title, you can then die as many times as you want without losing the title.

Wow, a completely optional title that offers no benefit to the player at all requires time and grinding. Oh, and don't assume all players who have money e-bayed. Name calling does not strengthen an arguement.

As I've explained in other threads, its pretty difficult to RP in GW. Since GW actually has a plot (ie all people who play NF are Sunspears who fight against Abbadon) its difficult to roleplay as something else without completely ignoring the plot. If you don't like a structured game with a storyline, there is nothing a.net can do to fix that. It's a personal preference. A.net can't please everyone.

Please do not complain about a game you haven't even played. Rellying on the opinions of others (especially on a forum) is a bad way to form valid opinions since your conclusions will be made on baised 2nd hand assumptions.

While it is to early to speculate about specific game mechanics, it isn't to early to speculate about broad archtypes of any online game (ie, GW2 will be a fantasy setting online game with multiple people playing and interacting together). Your statement of a "limited pool of levels" was never mentioned. That was not his arguement. You are just setting up a "straw man" arguement to attribute to your opponent.

What content are you mad about not getting? The ability to display a title? I believe that a "reward" is not the same thing as "content."

I would sure like to know what benefits people are going to get in GW2 from getting all these titles. I will not get a single title until I know what I am getting. I hope it is something decent for everyone who likes titles.

Most likely be a hat or a mini pet!

"WOW you wasted 2000 hours of your life for this mini pet, which only 1million other players have got!"

well boohoo.

If you have nothing to show off, you cant show off in the HoM. If you really care about showing stuff off, you really need to work for them.
If it worked the way you want, and people that didnt work hard on stuff, and they all get free titles. In that case, those free titles wouldnt be any 'show-off', since everyone has them.

Quit naggin on grinding people, it is hypocritical to do.



Neway, Protector of Tyria is really easy to get. You can do almost any mission including their bonus in one try. Only takes like 10 hours and cant be called grinding, since it is actually playing the game and enjoying it. Not doing exactly the same thing for xxxxxx hours, like Sunspear, Lightbringer, Gamer, Hero Battles and more.

Not everything identified as pseudo-reasoning is in fact without observed or reasonable existence; there are in fact slippery slopes.

Um, I think you will find the conjugation in reference is in the present progressive not past tense. Hence, I have indicated GW made no accommodation to allow people working on the title to be able to participate but instead requires them to sit in the corner while every one else plays. While sitting on the sidelines is something adults may do when necessary (or in the good old days of Monday Night Quarterbacking when Cheerleaders still showed up on TV) it is not generally the type of thing one expects in a game where people are invited to play – regardless of age; and certainly not kids. “Here, come play this game, but you can’t play the fun stuff if you want to be a Survivor…” It’s almost as rational as having explorable areas that count against you and then making those explorable areas unaccessible (unless you are a monk or necro before the spells were changed).

If it is completely optional and offers no benefit then there is no reason to require excessive time and grind. There is no reason that said title should cost 16,670 Hunter’s Ale, 3,334 k, or $408.00. At the rate I see gold that comes to about 835 hours of game play, provided I spend gold on nothing else. For what should be a casual rate of play according to GW that would be about 9 months - and again assumes one buys no armor, no weapons, etc.

All players who have money do not e-bay for gold. They either e-bay for gold or they are part of a few elite, and probably very young players, who sell to those who do. I have heard in many conversations that because people work for a living, and getting anything done in this game is too hard, they buy gold so they can enjoy playing. I refuse to buy gold, and since I can’t afford to buy what I want, and will never find what I want, and will never be able to afford the posh titles designed for the rich kids who steal mommy and daddy’s credit - I do without.

I have been role playing for over 30 years and this is just pure hog wash. There is a striking difference between plot, theme, and characterization. A plot is a sequence of events which lead froma begin point to an end point in one pattern or another. Depending on the story being told the plot may be parallel, linear, divergent, etc. Themes give an overall feel or mood to a story setting and guide decisions in act, action, purpose, person, and thus word choice. The character is role played within the plot and theme. A trapper traps, a marksman works as support artillery and draws enemy into ambush, a beast master works their companion with precision and skill.
Where ANet failed the Role Play experience was in refusing to make characterization and expression equivalent. Because of horrid inequalities in CT an Aeromancer is useless compared to a pyromancer. One cannot play an Ascalonian Mage and be of any value. The RP experience was destroyed not by the lack of opportunity, but by the lack of consistency between powers created in the System. There should have existed an equivalent to Flare for each element that costs the same and had the same CT , even if there was a slight difference in damage to make other benefits work out equal – but work out equal. There should have been defensive spells in each element and attribute area of each class, etc. to enhance the RP potential.

Granting the characters the ability to work and express personal themes, have more control over their appearance (and not making decent looking armors as distastefully distant or worse than the cost of a title), RP would come down to player interaction as they perform the quest. In character comments become the RP. We can have a discussion over the loss of a beloved nobel, or the irritating rash we get just after being rezzed, or the next festival. We might even express the theme of a character, such as Ice or Fire, or Hatchet Man, etc. if ANet actually made supporting such themes viable enough to play the game successfully; they generally do not forcing one to be flexible and to divest oneself of individuality in all guises.

Dually noted. However, I also have my previous experience and the responses of the head of GW and Gaile to go by. I suppose I should completely discount those three sources as well. I play chess and mahjhong, I do not play parcheesi. I play NN1&2 and GW, I do not play WoW, EQ, DDO, etc. It took GW months to get near the top of my lists, on both counts. In general I doubt they will ever care enough to get back on my better side, but I will never subscribe to Spinoza’s philosophy of “Love it or Leave it,” I still advocate “Love it and fix it.”

Um:
That may not have been his intended argument. It was however his resulting inference. He made a direct correlation between the number of characters one had to the number of levels one could achieve. In GW:P I had characters on 2 accounts go all the way to 20th level. I found the Assassin and Rit classes too useless to bother playing, and so stayed with the core classes. (Assassins were always dead because of being forced to fight close in and Rits were always dead because none of their skills CTs happened in the same calendar year.)

No, game content controlled by Faction and Hall of Heroes. Primary reasons I quit playing the game. And if you do manage to get permission from Favor of the Gods to go into someplace like UW then you get slaughtered in the ante-chamber by Aatxes set to obliterate 55 monk bots and overseas sweatshop teams of elite players farming to sell on e-bay.

Contrary to popular belief the primary reason one plays a fantasy game is so one can have a fantasy. That is to say, that since we cannot be heroes/heroines, kings, princes, death defying mages, super assassins, paragons of virtue, etc. in the real world we seek to do so in the escapism of our fantasy life. There is no point in playing a fantasy game if you are going to make us work for our fantasy as hard as getting a job in the real world.

Edit: I will continue to use the title: Encourageable Ale Hound which would fit the RP aspect of a chararcter I have made - Ritter Hunder.
To acquire said Ale I need $408.00 to ebay for gold, 835 hours grinding just for gold to by Hunter's Ale, or I could repeatedly make the same Canthan newbie 618 times for enough Monastery Credits and Gold to buy the Ale that way. Then of course I have to administer it over 10,000 minutes of stages 3-5 level drunkeness, or up to maybe 278 hours (11 1/2 days solid days with no bathroom breaks for me) of being drunk. At our GW 3 hours a day gaming, just the title should take 1,113 days (just over 3 years) to complete, provided we do nothing else and our starting weapon and armor hold up.

Less complaining, more knowing what you're talking about please.

Except that the time spent is the POINT of titles. They are not RP goals, they are gold sinks and time wasters to provide goals for those who have done everything else in the game. Take away the expensive, hard to get titles, and you take away the sole goal left to many veteran players. All RPGs have grind; GW's is just optional for those who choose to pursue it.
No one ever said they were for casual players; if you divide players into "casual" and "non-casual", you necessarily must have goals in the game that casual players cannot attain, else there will be nothing for the noncasual players to do. You may think it's not fair that you can't do or have EVERYTHING in the game, but at the same time it's not fair to take away the entire reason that a large portion of the population plays the game.

Wrong. Don't speculate on inflammatory things that pretty much declare it impossible to make money in the game except by ebaying gold.
You sound like the kind of person who would complain about elite gear in WoW because it took hours to get. Guess what, that's the genre, just be glad that GW didn't include rare stat weapons that you had to grind to get. If the WORST problem you have with the game is that someone else is spending millions of gold to get a line of text under his name, and you can't do it too, seems like you need to get your priorities straight.

Sorry, but balancing a game for its RP value? Not. Happening. If you want to RP, go ahead; honestly air isn't as crappy an att as you make it out to be. The only reason it's not used is because it only generally hits one target at once, but it does way more single target damage than fire. Hey wait, might this be the "equality" you were talking about ANet trying to acheive...nah, couldn't be.
BTW, people don't use fire because of flare. No idea what you expect to happen if all atts got a flare-type spell (which, generally, they do; ice javelin is awesome).

You're looking at the wrong game mate. Seriously. I can tell you want a deep roleplaying experience, like the old tabletop RPGs and such; this is not it. This is a game that's trying to be balanced for both pvp and pve, and sorry but roleplaying considerations fall through the cracks, because you are an INCREDIBLY small minority right now. Maybe you're not a minority in the grand scheme of rpgs, I wouldn't know, but you're definitely a minority in GW, because...well, I would imagine all the other RPers actually tried GW out before they bought it, and realized it's not terribly deep as far as character customization goes. Hell, the story is linear in all 3 campaigns we have so far; there is no opportunity for real roleplaying anywhere in the game, unless you're just ignoring the storyline and pretty much all the npc dialogues. Apparently this is changing in GW2, and partially in GW:EN; good, I wouldn't mind having more ways to play. But I'm at least grounded in reality enough to realize that balancing skills on RPers is not how GW works, or ever will work.

I do belive the original idea of his post was more along the lines of "You'll be able to get to a very high level in GW2, and you could spend nearly forever pushing one or two characters' levels up (even though it will have a negligible effect on your atts, if what we hear is to be believed), so either you can work on all of your characters equally and have a lot of midlevel guys, or you can just focus on 1 or 2 and have a couple low-to-mid level guys and 1 or 2 really high leveled ones." I don't think he intended it to be read as, "You only have so many att points / levels per account," more as, "You only have so much time to spend."

Also, I wasn't aware assassins self-destructed by getting near enemies. Well, I guess factions gave you a bad impression of that, what with the afflicted and all. They really do have decent survival (especially with Nightfall skills).

Wait, game content that was just rectified by adding scrolls? Rejoice!
Er, sorry the Prophecies elite area is decently hard. I wasn't aware Prot Spirit was a "elite sweatshop player" exclusive skill, or that "Aggro Control" was an elite skill cappable only if you paid ANet $100 every Sunday. And bots don't go to UW anymore; dying nightmares randomly spawning make that just not too profitable.

I wasn't aware there was a global poll on "Why do you play fantasy games?", nor that you have the results from said poll. Self bias much? Seems to me that there are more and better reasons to choose to play GW over other RPG fantasies other than escapism.
Believe it or not, what you consider work other people consider challenges, goals, acheivements. You want a chill game, this is as chill as you can make it, but you can't remove or devalue the stuff that other people like to do just because you want it, but don't want or can't follow their gameplay.

First, well met from another 30 year RPG'er. Chainmail anyone?

Second, your statement above doesn't make sense.

Here's the basics of Guild Wars:
1) Guild Wars in no way requires Grind
2) Gulid Wars has certain titles that do require Grind, but they are optional and, with a recent exception (Lockpicks), do no provide any material benefit.

Why not? It's a wonderful Gold Sink for those who like grind.

Totally disagree there. GW is my one hobby. My RL job I'm a manager at a Fortune 100 company. You might call my son young (he also plays GW and is in High School), but not many would accuse me of that anymore.

I play a few hours late at night as stress relief. I farm, but only social farming with online friends (Tombs or Sorrow's Furnace anyone?). I have neat items, and lots of money over the 2 years I've played GW, but nothing I have is any better (other than in appearance) that what a person could get with, say, a few Putrid Cysts. Never have, and never will, buy eBay Gold.

Send me a private message here, I'll meet you in-game and can help you out gratis. My grind = your gain. I'd also suggest you join a Guild that helps each other out.

I've yet to find an online game that has true role-play, in either the paper and dice, or the LARP fashion. Can't blame Anet for for the complete lack of role-playing that occurs online (yeah, there are a few MUDs out there, but don't get me started...)

NONE of this requires Anet, though I do with they would reserve a district SOMEWHERE for RPG'ers. The Grotto comes closest, but meh.

Hmm, bad PUGs methinks.

If you don't have your copy of Chainmail laying around, perhaps we could play Bunnies and Burrows, Champions, Top Secret, The Morrow Project, Runequest, or Call of Cthulu.

If your name is Gary Gygaxx, we may have something to discuss here.

As has been mentioned GW is not an RP game. Hence it is an MMOG and not an MMORPG. When at the tender level of 4th my muskateer was granted a Queen's Jewel and named Queen's Champion it was a Role Play title. It did not involve grind and it did not require my 10 year old buttocks to spend $408 dollars ebaying for gold, or 3 years at 3 hours a day doing nothing else in game to achieve. If the only thing left for Veteran players to think about once they have finished the game is themselves and the mental jerking for titles they hold meaningless, except as something to waste time while avoiding homework, waxing the car, or doing the dishes, then I can tell you exactly why I have never wanted to be in any guild with said self-centered self-important myopic beings anyway.

A part of what you are missing is that to best this one needs to be not only a professional player, but must of necessity be a professional farmer, use bots, and develop skills as an e-bay agent. This is no longer playing a game. This is working to have fun. It is excessive. People who have to pound on the key board that often that hard to do repetitive monotonous farming for hour after hour of meaningless acquisition of gold in order to equal a bot should be in outpatient treatment or a 12 step-program. They are no longer playing a game, they are addicts. Further, they inflate the economy and force GW/ANet to constantly raise the bar against what should be normal and casual play. We are not just discussing regular elite and casual game play, we are discussing addicted elite versus regular elite and casual play.

I worked this game for months with very powerful characters all the way to LDD and NEVER saw the kind of money people were throwing around. I twice got upto 100k over a years worth of playing and was thus able to put 15k armor on two of my characters. I was never able to achieve the appearance, and therefore present the role I wanted to play with a couple of my characters from Sept, 05 through Aug 06. I saw runes, like Superior Absorption go for as high as 95k, and selling (as well as scamming). I knew and talked to regular players on a regular basis who stated they could not afford the time to get gold, either because they had homework to do or mouths to feed, so they purchased it. I do not speculate. I know. People do not admit something that is a violation of game etiquette and potentially EULA just for the fun of it. But the fault in this lies in catering to elite addicts rather than maintaining a game for balanced play.

That could very well be. My personality profile states I do not tolerate the injustice of unfair or unequal treatment of persons based upon prejudicial action or systemic bias. That value is not only one which I hold personally, but religiously, and is up-held as the fundamental legal principle of my Nation. But as far as I can tell GW has indeed created said conditions. There are weapons and armor one can only get by kissing upto and being part of mega-corporations of faction factories, and if you do not kow-tow to them, demolish your personal expression and join one of their guilds, etc. you are SOL.

I generally play mages in almost every game I do play, computer or PnP. I played every core class, and am familiar with doing both the Aero-Earth mix, as well as both and Ice and Fire mages. (I used Ice in the Fire Islands.) But a rank 15 Aeromancer simply is ineffective compared to a Pyromancer, because it does not have area effect. There is no reason why there could not have been single target spells with penetration and area effect spells without in all four elements. But this is not just about Elementalists, it is across the board. What about Dark Fingers, where green-black lightening delivers dark damage for Necros, etc. I am not saying that there should not be some things that are specific to certain attributes or classes, but rather that a greater constancy should have occured across core effects with variant graphics but familiar stats. This would have made theme characters easier while establishing more flexible builds - as skills would be avail in more than one attributive form.

Show me one place where I said anything about a conversation with an NPC. My entire description dealt with in party in group expression and communication. However, attempting to RP a character theme - which could still be possible (and is more possible in Cantha than in Prophecies), is very difficult to do without the appropriate props. It is sort of like attempting to RP A Christmas Carol in bathing suits. (Which does make Scrooge's Knee knocking much more amusing!)

Why won't we have enough time? Is GW going to crash our game every three hours when we don't take a break, and refuse to let us access our account for 21 hours? The professinoal players, who only take time out to post in the forums and listen to Rush, am I'm sure going to spend their regular 14 to 20 hours a day playing in order to amass those 50,000,000,000,000 k bank accounts they never e-bay for (or sell).

I wasn't aware Protective Spirit was an Elementalist, Mesmer, Necro, Ranger, or Warrior skill. I have seen a few 55 Necros and 55 Monks in action; not very many 55 Warriors.

The fallacy here is in GW over other RPG Fantasies. Per Venn Diagram you have already included them as subsets of the same genre, Fantasies, in which GW is set aside only from the subset of others. The very nature of playing fantasy is departure from reality, by definition. If you wish to determine this is an escape rather than an exploration I would suggest the bias is yours. The more amuzing part of our departure is that inability to relinquish order which demands that our fantasy not only be said departure, but in departing must be more orderly and more comprehensible than our reality.

I spent more than enough time in game to acquire anything I wanted, frankly. I went on idiot farming runs because I had to in order to get what little I got, not because I wanted to. That isn't playing the game, that is Elite Addict BS.

But let's look at some Titles:
01. Survivor: Cowards title for mapping out faster than dying while abandoning the group. Most easily lost due to lag or game programming to steal opportunity if one makes the mistake of celebrating festivals.
02. Drunkard: Max title will take about 3 years to accomplish - The OpSys of the computer will be obsolete before one gets close to obtaining the title.
03. Treasure Hunter: Wiki estimates about 6,000,000 gold just to open enough chests to get the title. Frankly I don't see a reason to bother with chests as the contents were NEVER worth it. I found 1 Superior Vigor, a gold earth staff, and a gold sword in over 2,100 hours of game play that were worth keeping. All three found outside the War Camp.
04. Wisdom: It either happens or it doesn't. Seems like the only one so far that will just happen with enough game play.
05. Sweet Tooth: Only need about 10,000 Mandragor Roots to get this one. How many years farming is that?
06. Defender of Ascalon: Possibly the only repetitive grind that also allows doing the laundry and mowig the yard.
07. Protector: Never could get Dunes of Despair Bonus. Nor did anyone I knew, though I heard some did it.
08. Guardian: Hard Mode did not exist. And this should be the answer for your Elite Addict Prima Donnas who want a harder game, not making the economy and game rewards unavailable to the rest of us who also paid to play.
09. Cartographer: Excellent idea, specially for a ranger, then of course there are no ranger skills for getting to those liitle nooks and crannies - but then I understand they nerfed teh spells that could too.
10. Skill Hunter: Uh-huh. At about 1 k a cap sig that is 291,000g and how many hours?
11. Vanquisher: Doesn't sound like anything I will ever worry about. But at least it is not based upon cost and would actually aid in getting the Exploration Title.

I hope the Cartographer title is included, as it's the title I focus most on.

Also, Aataxe's existed in the UW BEFORE the 55 farming build was even invented! It was the dyning nightmares that were added to prevent them from farming. Thus your arguement about "attaxes that deal a ridiculous amount of damage to combat 55ing" is an invalid statement (since prior to the nerfs on the original protective bond 55 build, farming aataxe's and smite crawlers was the POINT of the 55 build).

Aataxe's can be beaten by blindness, weakness, necro hexes, mesmer hexes, snares, traps, or having a protection monk. Quit acting like protective spirit is the only thing that can counter them. It's the only thing that can counter them solo, but in a team build defeating them is perfectly possible and actually pretty easy if you have 6 or so competent players. There are only 3 of them in a group after all. Your entire party should not wipe.

The title I brought up is an RP title. It holds an RP function only. The idea that the game needs a Gold Sink only means that GW has done a horrific job of managing the in game economy and therefore is creating options, which ought to have other more intrinsic game value, as a bandage to staunch the wound. So:
Punishment of Role Players because of greedy and/or elite pong addicts grind-festing is not an acceptable response to their failure to manage properly.

I am disabled. I have taken a break from GW since last Summer. In the year I played I managed to accrue almost 2,000 hours of game play. In the course of an expectable 280 day work year, that would have made me the equivalent of a professional player averaging about 7 game hours per gaming day. I did receive a couple of greens as gifts from friends. Beyond that, everything I got I earned.

I am aware of the appearance thing. Appearance makes the man, and the concept. Presentation, while it may not deliver stats, it often delivers satisfaction. If I’m going to die repeatedly I might as well look good doing it. However, I have for the most part lost the better part of my friends in the game. They have either moved on or rarely play. One was deaf and had a rough time with people not being considerate of her gaming needs (Just taking a little time to communicate ahead of time. She was an excellent warrior and mesmer, often solo farming with either since people would not call and would not coordinate.) Some may now be overseas.

At no point in the ads did it say that in order to play equally with others one had to submit to being a member of a guild. The game was, when I purchased it, advertised as an RPG, even though it never has been. The only thing I have in this game that reflects me is my Guild, Colors, and Guild name. However, I know oriental culture respects the hero that being the last member of their Guild/Clan/Tong survives to destroy the evil warlord or emporer and rebuild their guild. And when alliances were first discussed the indications were that we would no longer be penalized for being individuals with individual expression. I no longer even have a single starting character or any of the effort that 2000 hours went into making because of becoming irate and despondent with the failed promise keeping of GW/ANet over Factions, destruction of the MM, the issues with Favor control of FoW/UW access, Guild vs Guild not being open to allow friends to work together flexibly, bots, farming as a way of life to achieve anything, elitist control of content and making it worse with Faction Factory Mega-corps in Factions, etc. But have not and do not surrender my integritty and my honor by submitting my creativity and personal expression to others when I was never told I should be penalized for bothering to express them unless I coerced people into being my subordinates or required them to submit to my rule.

I will grant I was very fortunate in my RP experience to be part of one of the best teams of RPs possible. Of the group, I was the only non-thespian, and my major Communications Theory/Human Relations didn’t leave me too far. I have seen the LARP, whose rules are also arranged so that civies will not be too radically alarmed by the weirdoes.
I agree, we are a long way from true role play, even among the educated that practice the art. The best get jobs in Hollywood and quit playing without a paycheck. But the things I outlined should not be difficult concepts to understand. I am the son of art majors. I have an epic sense of story-line, art, and literature. I was raised on La Chanson de Roland and Le Morte d’Arthur, and have since become familiar with others. I have been trying for 30 years to learn to program and never figured it out. But if I could, , I have the basics of my own gaming system outlined.

Action, actor, act, setting, and purpose – if these to not align then the RP (especially in a visually communicated medium) is missing. Hence our experience:
“No! Really! I am the Q U E E N Of S T O R M S! Can’t you tell my hair is light lavender like a storm cloud?”
“Yes, little sister,” the Steel Fist says, and winks at his Bone Ringhands.
“You just don’t get it!” she fumes.
“Ok, so why don’t you ever throw something besides firestorm?” slides in the Necro.
“Well, because my Air spells don’t cover enough ground, and,” she blushes, “I like watching Steel Fist's buns when he has to chase after the devourers running away from my fire storm.”

I swear, with Mythia Astralis and a few others we made it as far as the chamber where the kids quest gets done and we all died. I fought from the moment I materialized until we were all dead without moments rest. That was the most successful I have ever seen in UW. I don’t even know what the quests are because there is no time to enjoy them. The only scenery I remember was stairs and steers. Since it cost 1,000g to fail in a matter of seconds, provided PvP had their collective heads in the sunshine so we could have god’s permission, it just wasn’t worth bothering with.

Sadly, most of my stuff was lost in a friend's house fire back in '98 (no one was injured, TG). But I do miss Engarde, Chainmail, Eldritch Wizardry, Harn Master, the ORIGINAL Traveler, Castle Faulkenstien, and also INWO, Wooden Ships and Iron Men, Third Reich, Alexander vs. Darius, Fortress Europa, Africa Corps, Eastern Front, Richtofen’s War, Feudal, etc.


HawkofStorms,
I have never seen Aataxe's appear in numbers less than 9-15.

Where the HoM could be of most benefit is being able to reacquire one's colors and the armor of one's ancestors. I do not remember how long ago or how far back, but it has been discussed that it would be nice to be able to leave armor from one character on an IP to another owned by the same person who is passing them down from generation to generation. My original group was a family.

Fitz Rinley (Wa/Mo) - Illegitimate son of the Baron of Rin
Mrs Aranel Rinley (Me/Mo) - Wife of Fitz
Gowan Rinley (Mo/Ne) - Legitimate son of the Baron of Rin
Ravenia Rinley (Ne/Wa) - Wife of Gowan
(!CRS!) Rinley (E/Ne) - Son of Fitz
Ash Rinley (R/Mo) - Wife of son

I never bothered finishing or trying to finish factions because of the control of content by guilds and because of the unfulfilled promisses we had been waiting a year, and some people longer, to see on game fixes. But it would have been nice, had GW been something that could have made be feel my thousands of hours of effort were worth anthing, if something like an HoM could be used as a check to transfer armor and customized weapons from a generation of heroes to their descendants.

Even though GW does not require grind doesn't mean that many won't. So gold sinks don't at all hurt the casual player (except that they can't lay claim to a title) and helps balance the economy. I have a guildie who has spent several million in pursuit of titles (he has 20ish maxed). That's what he enjoys doing, so more power to him. And no, he did not eBay any of his millions. He plays constantly, and very intelligently.

No, but it helps make the game more social. Friends lists can work equally well, as most of my farming buddies were on my friends list long before we landed in the same guild.

I will again assert that there has never been a real online RPG, at least in the manner that you and I would define one.

(lots of stuff snipped)

More to the point that you're not going to find what you're looking for in GW, or any Online RPG for that matter. No game can replace the up-close-and-personal experience that is paper and dice RPG's. And it takes me back to my original point, which is you can't blame Anet for a systemic fault of online gaming.

Seriously, if you ever decide to venture into GW again, look me up. It would be my honor to escort you through some of the more dangerous areas. Not much role-play to be had for sure, but lots of fun nevertheless.

I still have Traveler, and Wooden Ships too! Wooden Ships is my all-time favorite game, with the possible exception of Terrible Swift Sword, or Fire in the East, the mother of all wargames. Anything with 6,000 plus pieces that recreates the Nazi invasion of Russia, and is so complex that it plays nearly in real time, can't be beaten!

And I'm serious about my offer to help you out if you ever play GW again. All of my stuff was gained through the honorable slaying of monsters, mostly in Sorrows Furnace, and not through RL eBay gold pruchases.

Quote wars is ftw.