Idle Speculation: What stopped the Auction House? - Guild Wars Guru archive powered by Guild Wars Legacy

Robin_Anadri

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jun 2005

Atlanta, GA

Girl Power [GP]

Me/Mo

23 May 2007 at 18:12 - 1

A reading from the Book of ArenaNet:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaile Gray

Now -- *holds up hand* -- I know the temptation will be to say, "Well, give us an auction house and we won't need to do this." That would be nice, we all agree, but unfortunately, with the many other things we are working on, that's not going to happen in the immediate future. And in the present, and in the future, we'd really like people to be able to both enjoy a conversation and conduct sales.

This is the word of the Gaile. Thanks be unto the Gaile.

The "immediate future" is GW:EN, and since that's the last gasp of Guild Wars before they turn all their energy towards Guild Wars II, this is the final nail in the coffin of our hopes for an auction house in Guild Wars (unless they're secretly plotting Guild Wars: Auction House as an expansion for Q2 '08, but that seems a little far-fetched to me.)

So why isn't the auction house one of the things they're working on? No cynical "because they don't listen to their users" crap, people. They've proven that they do listen - more storage, hard mode, the return of 8v8 HA, the list goes on. No other game company shows the kind of concern and respect for their user community that ArenaNet does. They've known how strongly the community wanted an auction house since the end of the last Guild War, I think, when the sky rained fire and destroyed Ascalon. They've known since the Searing - that's over two years! Hell, I was in the betas and I remember the talk about needing a better trade system back then.

The reason it was stopped has to be either policy or technology.

Was it policy? Did someone in charge put their foot down and say "No, we will not spend development effort on an auction house?" Maybe they felt that having an auction house would make it too easy for the gold farmers, so they didn't implement an auction house because of what they felt it would do the economy. Maybe they felt it would make "rare" things too common, if selling to other players was too easy, the market would be flooded and massive deflation would occur.

Was it technology? Is there something inherent to the client/server design of Guild Wars that makes creating an auction house an insurmountable task? Would keeping track of objects that players wanted to sell create a data storage problem that would overwhelm their disk space? Would it simply require too much retrofitting of the code (ie, they could do it, but they'd have to throw away the current design and build it in with the auction house function planned for from the beginning, and it's just too big an effort for not enough perceived gain?)

I'm curious to what you other folks think. Is there a reason I'm missing, or is one or a combination of the above what stopped the auction house?

mazey vorstagg

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Aug 2006

Nodnol

Meeting of Lost Minds

E/Mo

23 May 2007 at 18:20 - 2

I think is must be technology, wow and CoH amonst others have proved game balance remains stable with an AH.

the fact there is only one visible server must be the problem. A space issue indeed.

Quantum Duck

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: May 2006

Err7

Me/

23 May 2007 at 18:34 - 3

My personal theory:

The distributed dynamic worldwide server architecture made it virtually impossible to add an auction house. Not that it couldn't still be done, but it would require immense development resources *far* beyond those required to add an AH to a sharded game. The traders are only possible because they only have to throw a single number across the network for each material/rune in a small fixed list. Thousands of players posting tens of thousands of uniquely randomly generated gold items would require so much data to be globally distributed that it would simply destroy the current infrastructure.

I'd guess that this is part of why they are going with a sharded (but thankfully still open to at will transfers) model for GW2. They should be able to add something vaguely AH like that only needs to distribute data to the rest of the shard where something is posted.

Again, this is all just a personal theory. But it makes sense to me when I keep hearing that it would be very difficult to make an AH in this game, and people argue back that other lower budget (and always sharded I note) games have AHs. Combine this difficulty with the fact that the GW item system really isn't the same as a that of a typical MMO (a player can conveniently aquire max stat items without ever trading with another player), and I can see why it would be put lower on the priority list than other important projects.

Red-Tide

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jun 2005

Edmonton, Canada

[Liar]

Mo/

23 May 2007 at 18:36 - 4

hmmm 3 million copies sold X $40 USD (approx) = $120000000

Must be financial constraints...

sarcasm aside - If it is an issue with the code and it just not being compataible, I wish they would just say as much. The vague comments made by Gaile leave us more frustrated than anything.

2 years we have been told it was coming and then one day, we get a "it's no longer in the plans" type comment from Anef Community relations. BS IMO, if it isnt gonna happen a simple explanation would go a long way to appeasing alot of people. Instead they let specaultion run rampant along with rumoring mongering galore. GG Anerf!

shirosae

Academy Page

Join Date: Jul 2006

UK

Moon Unit Carby

R/Me

23 May 2007 at 18:45 - 5

Guild Wars probably runs on a set of virtual OS running game servers on a building-full of machines in various locations. They've spent a huge amount of time and effort setting this system up - it's the reason they can roll out updates without kicking us all off, and have servers from different builds running at the same time.

Adding a separate auction server (it'd need to be, given that it needs to be global) on a similar level would probably be another huge lot of time and effort. Like, writing a completely new netcode level of time and effort.

Why they don't increase the space available in Party Search, i have no idea.

Bryant Again

Hall Hero

Join Date: Feb 2006

23 May 2007 at 18:50 - 6

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robin_Anadri

Maybe they felt it would make "rare" things too common, if selling to other players was too easy, the market would be flooded and massive deflation would occur.

That's exactly what's happening right now with the release of Hard Mode, so it's safe to rule that out.

But Robin, that is a very good question that I've asked on these boards repeatedly: Okay, we won't get an auction house, cool. It won't be possible to implement with the current Guild Wars build, no problem. But why wasn't it made in the beginning?

The only logical thing that I can come to is time restraints - it may've been something on their to-do list, but they ran out of time.

I thing if it is something hard to program, they won't admit it. I feel as though it would make them look like bad programmers.

x-stunt-x

Banned

Join Date: May 2007

USA

death strikers

W/Mo

23 May 2007 at 18:53 - 7

i just want my old GW back

MSecorsky

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jun 2005

So Cal

The Sinister Vanguard

Me/

23 May 2007 at 18:54 - 8

If they publicly admit flaws in the technology that prevent the viability of an auction house then all they do is fan the flames of the anti-GW crowd, giving them ammunition to try and divert people away from GW and onto lesser games. Mystery is better at making sales than inability.

With all that they've done, it's obviously a technological reason. Imagine everyone putting some semi-crappy gold on the auction house hoping to get 500g instead of 225 from the merchant! There would be so much shmeg it would be near impossible to find items you really want. Talk about a crap shoot. If they try to limit it by allowing only one item in auction at a time... well, it's still hundreds of thousands (potentially) of items out there to sift through. Huge database, huge search routines, ugh. Conjured nightmare.

Consider this... when a database is being added to or deleted from it tends to lock the database so no one else can step on the transaction. Ponder the results of many thousands of people trying to access the same database at any point in time across such a distributed game... ow. Not good.

For the sake of GW, let the auction house die.

korcan

noobalicious

Join Date: Jun 2006

23 May 2007 at 18:54 - 9

does it really matter? speculation is good and dandy but what good will it do? even if the community were given a reason, its not changing the fact that were never ever ever getting an auction house.

i just wish that anet would have been more upfront about it. telling us that it was on the way then cancelling plans for one all together once info about gw2 was released wasnt very professional.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaile_Grey

And in the present, and in the future, we'd really like people to be able to both enjoy a conversation and conduct sales.

obviously, the devs have never tried selling items in-game and having to sell items through a 3rd party fansite is rather inconvenient.

Aera Lure

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Aug 2005

In Baltar's head

Bring Out Your Dead [BOYD], former officer [LBS]

Mo/

23 May 2007 at 18:55 - 10

Its probably auction server support and development needed to track all the data and take constant ping inquiries into it. Its free to play online, with no monthly fees, so even though Red-Tide's figure looks large (its a little more than half that as they sell the game to distributors at around half retail and have production costs), something like WoW dwarfs whatever end figure you come up with due to having monthly fees.

A secondary thing is probably EotN is the end of GW full-on development. Too late to invest so much into it as would be needed for an auction house if they first chose to go ahead with it despite above. They probably looked at both these factors and developer needs for EotN and GW2 and simply canned expanding GW with an AH as too high a cost given other things in play.

Operative 14

Forge Runner

Join Date: Nov 2006

Arizona, USA

[OOP] Order of the Phoenix I

23 May 2007 at 18:55 - 11

So sayeth Gaile, All hail Gaile. Ahmen

I'd have to agree with everyone here. There is no doubt in my mind that it has been one of their major considerations for an update for a very long time, just that the neccesary development would require a very hefty change to the game as a whole. Though I would say not much more a change than would already be required for another Chapter.... Perhaps GW:EN will bring an Auction House or a comparable system(I doubt it

)?

dargon

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: May 2005

The Seraphim Knights [TSK]

R/

23 May 2007 at 18:59 - 12

The main problem is having a viable solution that would work. Having an NPC simply wouldn't work as players would have to scroll through 10k+ items simply to find the one they want. Having player run market stalls wouldn't work as it really wouldn't be any different than now. What they have now isn't ideal, but it does work, this is why an auction house/etc was given a low priority.

And as for EotN being a last hurrah, don't count on it. GW1 still has a full team working on it, there could quite possibly be more expansions for it. This is as per various comments from the assorted devs, etc that have actually made comments, both in the magazine article and online.

Aera Lure

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Aug 2005

In Baltar's head

Bring Out Your Dead [BOYD], former officer [LBS]

Mo/

23 May 2007 at 19:03 - 13

Quote:

Originally Posted by korcan

obviously, the devs have never tried selling items in-game and having to sell items through a 3rd party fansite is rather inconvenient.

Selling items in game actually went more or less fine (sure, could have been better) until the economy took a turn south, be it hard mode, inscriptions etc and everyone having quick access to decent things, or farming nerfs hurting income earning potential. Point at whatever you want, its much harder to sell now than it was, hence the spike in spamming and the resurgance of calls for an auction house.

Oh well. At least we know its not coming and I'd point to Auctions here. I used to use it with great success, except for the fact that for me its way slow to load each and every page, so I am more content lately to just wholesale or merch low and mid-level things in game. Cant remember the last thing I found where I said "gee, someone would pay a good deal for this." The occasional elite tome or green and whatnot being sort of a staple thing for me now. Maybe the odd perfect inscription. About it.

Loviatar

Underworld Spelunker

Join Date: Feb 2005

23 May 2007 at 19:03 - 14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red-Tide

2 years we have been told it was coming and then one day, we get a "it's no longer in the plans" type comment from Anef Community relations. BS IMO, if it isnt gonna happen a simple explanation would go a long way to appeasing alot of people. Instead they let specaultion run rampant along with rumoring mongering galore. GG Anerf!

get it right for once.

they have never promised an auction house......never........period

they said trade improvements of an unspecified type at an unspecified time.

@ Robin_Anadri

somebody posted earlier that the proposed auction house was too close to the WOW setup which is evidently copyrighted and Anet/NCsoft was told legal action would be taken if it went ahead.

rather than redo it they are looking for something else.

since top Anet people came from WOW and were programers there it could be true.

unless someone official says yes/no it sounds like possible but still rumor to me.

my own personal opinion is that Anet is not doing it for 2 reasoms.

1. people using it for storage

2/ bots having Anet sell their stuff and the botmasters simply have more botting time and make cash pickups as needed from sales.

Lonesamurai

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Apr 2006

Cheltenham, Glos, UK

Wolf Pack Samurai [WPS]

R/A

23 May 2007 at 19:06 - 15

Quote:

Originally Posted by dargon

The main problem is having a viable solution that would work. Having an NPC simply wouldn't work as players would have to scroll through 10k+ items simply to find the one they want. Having player run market stalls wouldn't work as it really wouldn't be any different than now. What they have now isn't ideal, but it does work, this is why an auction house/etc was given a low priority.

And as for EotN being a last hurrah, don't count on it. GW1 still has a full team working on it, there could quite possibly be more expansions for it. This is as per various comments from the assorted devs, etc that have actually made comments, both in the magazine article and online.

Indeed, and theres nothing stopping ANet doing an auction system that encompasses both games, maybe through the official site... The game already feeds information to the website in a few ways, maybe an auction system could work in a similar way for both GW and GW2, as GW2 is apparently using the same, although heavily modified/updated engine

BladeDVD

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jul 2006

Hawaii

Clan Of Elders

N/

23 May 2007 at 19:12 - 16

I think another thing is priority. AH or no AH is not game breaking (obviously since GW just hit 2 years and is still going strong). So when you combine the amount of time and work to implement an AH (as speculated above), vs. the other things on their to do list...the Auction House keeps losing.

shirosae

Academy Page

Join Date: Jul 2006

UK

Moon Unit Carby

R/Me

23 May 2007 at 19:19 - 17

Scrolling through 10k+ items is a non issue, because it wouldn't happen.

Every item in the game only has so many mods, with so many combinations.

Filter: [Gold]+[Mursaat Hornbow]+[15-28]+[req9]+[15^50]+[Vamp 3/1]+[HP+30] etc.

Or you could have a tree system, where you choose folders to look in:
[Weapon/Offhand/Whatever] > Weapon - [Bow/Hammer/Etc]

For the end-user, the complexity really is nothing too hard to program for.

The database holding all of that, updating and accessing it in realtime with thousands of players is what would scare me. I suppose you could instance individual servers for each, so that the 'Bow' section of the AH was actually a separate server and database.

MSecorsky

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jun 2005

So Cal

The Sinister Vanguard

Me/

23 May 2007 at 19:25 - 18

Quote:

Originally Posted by shirosae

Scrolling through 10k+ items is a non issue, because it wouldn't happen.

Every item in the game only has so many mods, with so many combinations.

But how many weapons have the exact same stats? Even the Mursatt bow you mentioned could have thousands of identical copies out there, each with a slightly different asking price. How about if you're looking at one that someone else buys while you're looking? You go to purchase it, record not found.

It's too massive to support without it grinding very quickly to a halt.

shirosae

Academy Page

Join Date: Jul 2006

UK

Moon Unit Carby

R/Me

23 May 2007 at 19:29 - 19

Quote:

Originally Posted by MSecorsky

But how many weapons have the exact same stats? Even the Mursatt bow you mentioned could have thousands of identical copies out there, each with a slightly different asking price. How about if you're looking at one that someone else buys while you're looking? You go to purchase it, record not found.

It's too massive to support without it grinding very quickly to a halt.

You could do it like SWG used to, and bring up a list of identical items with asking prices.

Or you could do it like FFXI, where each possible item is represented only once, and when you bid over a reserve value you get the lowest priced item. After x days the item is taken off sale and sent back to the player who put it up (their deposit for the sale is not refunded, this way the AH turns into a money-sink itself and discourages AH spamming).

TheRaven

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Sep 2006

Virginia

Spirit of Elisha

W/

23 May 2007 at 19:34 - 20

I tend to agree with Loviatar. I vaguely recall reading somewhere that Anet risked copyright violation if they created an Auction House. This sounds reasonable. I've never played WOW and don't know anything about the game other than what I've read on this forum, but from that I've learned 2 things.

1. WoW does have an Auction House
2. Some A-Net devs used to work for the company that produced WoW.

Obviously those devs cannot simply quit working for WoW and start up a new company (Anet) and take the WoW program code with them. They've be slapped with so many lawsuits, ArenaNet would be bankrupt in a month.

So, they have the issue of trying to program a viable Auction House, yet they also can't just "it was done this way at WoW....let's plug this piece in here...Voila!" They have to unlearn the way WoW did it and come up with something unique for GW.

Please don't be too harsh on Gaile. As a programmer myself I seriously doubt that Gaile knows the exact reasons why an Auction House isn't being developed. She is not a "techie" programmer herself so she's just going by the information the devs give her. If they say "we can't do it". She doesn't understand all the technical reasons why they can't do it. Just that they can't for some reason.

Darksun

Jungle Guide

Join Date: May 2005

USA

Karr's Castle

W/E

23 May 2007 at 19:38 - 21

Quote:

Originally Posted by MSecorsky

With all that they've done, it's obviously a technological reason. Imagine everyone putting some semi-crappy gold on the auction house hoping to get 500g instead of 225 from the merchant! There would be so much shmeg it would be near impossible to find items you really want. Talk about a crap shoot. If they try to limit it by allowing only one item in auction at a time... well, it's still hundreds of thousands (potentially) of items out there to sift through. Huge database, huge search routines, ugh. Conjured nightmare.

Consider this... when a database is being added to or deleted from it tends to lock the database so no one else can step on the transaction. Ponder the results of many thousands of people trying to access the same database at any point in time across such a distributed game... ow. Not good.

Good points. It simply IS NOT EASY. It's just not. It's a lot to ask whether we like it or not. If this was a regular subscription-based mmo, then they would probably have it. It's not.

Sir Skullcrasher

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jun 2005

California

15 over 50 [Rare]

W/Mo

23 May 2007 at 19:41 - 22

A-Net never said they're going to make Auction House for us. That idea got started like a year ago when GW were first out.

IlikeGW

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Aug 2005

23 May 2007 at 20:02 - 23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sir Skullcrasher

A-Net never said they're going to make Auction House for us. That idea got started like a year ago when GW were first out.

That's not true at all, and GW is two years old. Anet did make several references to an auction house coming, but just this year they've finally started saying it will never happen.

Longasc

Forge Runner

Join Date: May 2005

23 May 2007 at 20:06 - 24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loviatar

get it right for once.

they have never promised an auction house......never........period

they said trade improvements of an unspecified type at an unspecified time.
[B]

Exactly.

IMO: They never ever thought it worthwhile or desirable, that is probably the reason they never ever put it on a priority list at all.

I think for good reasons.
This does not mean that I like the current spam and lack of proper trade mechanics, but I think people already voiced valid concerns why it would not be great. It works great in WoW, but with GW itemization and many other issues taken in account, I am sure it would not work so well.

Jecht Scye

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Dec 2005

Lucky Crickets[Luck]

N/Me

23 May 2007 at 20:09 - 25

When Guild Wars 2 was announced, ArenaNet said that there were several things they wanted to implement to Guild Wars that their current structure would not allow. My guess is that an Auction House was among that list.

Gregslot

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Aug 2006

Me/

23 May 2007 at 20:18 - 26

Why dont we all go to temple of balthazar international and use the party pannel? At least put ONE item in there, the rest feel free to spam.

Great Temple of Balthazar? Why? Because its the only acessible outpost for every chapter.
Ok? Ok! Spread the word. (helf-way done now huh?)

VanDamselx

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Aug 2006

Buffalo, NY

[TTBH]

23 May 2007 at 20:29 - 27

A-Net didn't promise an auction house, they said trade improvements were coming. No where does that indicate an auction house, everyone just got excited and assumed it did.

FoxBat

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Apr 2006

Amazon Basin [AB]

Mo/Me

23 May 2007 at 20:36 - 28

The first, small change they could do is greatly increase the amount of text you can put in party search description.

The second thing they should do is enlarge party search to be universal and then sort/filter/search it. That would be a tremendous boon to missions, farming, HA or even GvG pugging, and trading alike.

A nice add-on to either would be a spin-off of equipment templates, letting people post individual item codes which the client interprets as links to display the data.

savage vapor 33

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Nov 2006

Regems Basement

The Malevolent Wolfpack [tMw]

23 May 2007 at 20:39 - 29

Quote:

Originally Posted by x-stunt-x

i just want my old GW back

Amen Brotha, Amen.

Zappa

Academy Page

Join Date: Oct 2006

Portugal.

23 May 2007 at 20:42 - 30

Well, I think that it's either a game engine limitation, or, they simply don't want this game to be "like that". Thats what it looks like to me.
I'm always wondering why they (Gaile, Alex, whatever) are so clear and explicit with every other issue, and, when it comes to trading related issues, they just slam us with vague, ambiguous answers, and thats what we get.

They don't want this to be the kind of game where you can build wealth, yet, they don't tell us directly.
Why? To keep ignorant fools like me craving for something that will never happen and still stop them from leaving to other choices.

As strange as it may sound, thats what I feel.

Mediocre trade system, Spam bans, mediocre storage space from the beginning, customized armor... *hint hint nudge nudge*

One thing that annoys me: everyone always mentions "auction house" as an improvement. Why is that? That's not the only viable option. Ever heard of private stores?
Nothing simpler: Arrange a small "trading" area in hub towns, where you could open your private shop, with a limit of 4 or 5 items (non-stack) . I don't think this would have the AH limitations, since it's just a variant of the trade window we have today. I don't get it why they haven't thought about this earlier. Another thing that makes me think that they don't want this kind of game.

Well, spam would be, at least, moderately reduced, since you could just leave your character sitting there.

Heck, they could even program a trader title, for the most successful sellers.

At least it would make more sense than that ridiculous "sweet tooth" title track. What is the point, really? lol

And, please, if they can program boardwalk games, they can program an area for opening private stores.

They just don't want it...

Star Gazer

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Nov 2005

Zerohour Enterprises [ZHE]

W/

23 May 2007 at 20:54 - 31

They could have options like the Preist of Balthazaar does: descriminate between perfect mods, class, color (blue purple gold green) req, and the whole 9 yards. So shifting through 10k items as you say would not be a problem if they introduced that. Or maybe even a *gasp* search feature XD

Sir Skullcrasher

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jun 2005

California

15 over 50 [Rare]

W/Mo

23 May 2007 at 21:05 - 32

Quote:

Originally Posted by IlikeGW

That's not true at all, and GW is two years old. Anet did make several references to an auction house coming, but just this year they've finally started saying it will never happen.

Ummm I don't remember Galie or anyone from A-Net saying something like this "We're going to come up with an auction house soon". Trust me, I been on this board long enough.. it was started as a RUMOR/IDEA by someone here.

noblepaladin

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jun 2005

23 May 2007 at 21:06 - 33

Most likely it is a technical issue, probably because it is too difficult (or maybe even impossible) to implement. I know when WarCraft 3 came out, a lot of people complained about their replay system because you cannot watch replays from previous patches and you cannot watch replays with your friends (a feature that was in StarCraft). Blizzard responded by saying that it was their mistake that they didn't think of that before they released the game and that it was too difficult to make the changes after the game came out because it would require large sections of code to be rewritten, which would inevitably introduce bugs into the game. That means that they need to do another alpha/beta test to make sure that everything works correctly. It is simply unreasonable for them to spend so much time on a small feature.

This might be the same case for GuildWars. ANet has shown that they listen to fans and they do care, but it might just be too difficult to implement an auction house. If they need to modify large amounts of code, many bugs may be introduced (even in some of the small updates, some skills mysteriously get broken and they have to re-patch it a few hours later). It's simply unfeasible for ANet to spend large amounts of time modifying code and retesting the game to make sure everything is working correctly, especially if most of the developers are busy making EotN and GW2.

I hope they do come up with some other system though, even if it is not as good as an auction house.

bamm bamm bamm

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jul 2006

23 May 2007 at 21:19 - 34

You can't copyright an in-game auction house. I suppose you could patent one, but even that's a stretch (although it seems anything goes these days).

Maybe it's technically difficult to put one in now, but I don't buy into technical difficulties before the game was released. I have a feeling they just didn't think to put one in. Maybe they thought that with the ease of getting max items in GW an auction house wouldn't be necessary. I don't think they realized the power of vanity and the e-peen very much at all back then.

MSecorsky

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jun 2005

So Cal

The Sinister Vanguard

Me/

23 May 2007 at 21:19 - 35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Star Gazer

They could have options like the Preist of Balthazaar does: descriminate between perfect mods, class, color (blue purple gold green) req, and the whole 9 yards. So shifting through 10k items as you say would not be a problem if they introduced that. Or maybe even a *gasp* search feature XD

We're still talking about hitting a database with hundreds of thousands or more items each and every time someone looks at it, turns the page, selects something different, buys something, add something... not to mention every time you load a page it's potentially already obsolete, so the item you select could have been sold already (removed from the DB) thus generating errors...

Forget display. Display can do anything, sure. Think behind the scenes.

VitisVinifera

Banned

Join Date: Nov 2005

Northern California

HoTR

N/Me

23 May 2007 at 21:29 - 36

resources and motivation

two things that are hindering pretty much any movement in the first 3 titles

Melody Cross

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Dec 2006

Alliance of Anguish [aOa]

Mo/

23 May 2007 at 21:48 - 37

I have a crazy idea. Maybe they really do want us to use outside forums for high end trading. Lots of players are saying that Anet listens to us in places like GWGuru and GWOline and other forums. One of the things that I use Guru for is buying and selling high end items. It is the first reason I came here.

Even Gaile Grey suggests it in the post the OP quoted. She said “Use the Trade Channel or consider using one of the excellent fansite trade forums.”

Selling in forums gives these outside forums a feeling that many players need to come here or they are missing out on something. And while they are here, posting their auction and bumping their threads daily, they have a chance to take a few minutes to look around and read some of the other threads.

With all the people that ask for an auction house, I’m sure they would put one in if they could though. Most of the problems are technical and legal I am sure. So while I don’t think forums are the biggest or only reason why we don’t have a global trade network, it may be one.

If that is the case, I’d like to see an “official” GW Trade forum sponsored by Anet and managed by Anet on the GW website. Lag free, crash free, linked to the game start screen as “the place to trade” and with enough bandwidth that people can post decent screenshots, etc. It would be great if we could link item descriptions the same way we can link skill templates now. Then, on a site like this, we could post those links and it would translate them into a nice picture (with a price check too???) for buyers to look at and sellers to compare with before they post their own stuff.

It’s all using technology in the game that has already proven to work (just a website link and templates. We might need a new “trader” screen in the hero panel or a menu option to open the new template maker, but that can’t be too much code) so it would not mess anything up

If they won’t give us an in-game auction house or bulletin board and do point us to this outside alternative, then I think it would be nice if they gave us a controlled environment to trade in, even if it is outside the game.

But that might take away from forums like this, so I dunno.

GGs

Nexus Icon

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Aug 2005

Natis Ignigena

Me/

23 May 2007 at 22:03 - 38

Something that would cut down on the spam dramatically, and we know it's within their capabilities:
Make items hot-linkable to chat, and make it so that they can only be hot-linked to the trade channel.
Hell, make them hot-linkable to the party window too.

Sure, it's a similar system to WoW, but guess what?
WoW stole it from other previous MMOs, so I don't think ANet have to worry about copyright there.

If you're not going to give us an auction house ANet, at least give us SOMETHING.
The current system is unworkable and frustrating for all involved.

Addendum: for the hard-of-thinking, hot-linking is where the name of the item, when clicked, brings up a window displaying the properties of said item.

VitisVinifera

Banned

Join Date: Nov 2005

Northern California

HoTR

N/Me

23 May 2007 at 22:05 - 39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Melody Cross

I have a crazy idea. Maybe they really do want us to use outside forums for high end trading. Lots of players are saying that Anet listens to us in places like GWGuru and GWOline and other forums. One of the things that I use Guru for is buying and selling high end items. It is the first reason I came here.

Even Gaile Grey suggests it in the post the OP quoted. She said “Use the Trade Channel or consider using one of the excellent fansite trade forums.”

you are right on your facts but wrong in your reasoning. Gaile wants us to use these forums precisely because they can't/won't make an AH. It's the same response you get when you email Anet about a problem or bug -- they tell you to take it to the forums instead. Water off their back.

Quote:

If that is the case, I’d like to see an “official” GW Trade forum sponsored by Anet and managed by Anet on the GW website. Lag free, crash free, linked to the game start screen as “the place to trade” and with enough bandwidth that people can post decent screenshots, etc.

I second this. Actually, just make these forums lag and crash free. I've Err 404'ed and databased errored 3 times in the first half hour of cruising the GW forums today.

shirosae

Academy Page

Join Date: Jul 2006

UK

Moon Unit Carby

R/Me

23 May 2007 at 22:11 - 40

RE: Database hits

This website has 2.6 million posts. Posts which are considerably more complex than 'item 011010010100100100101010 25 plat user xyz'. It has 131 thousand registered users. There are 2500 people surfing here as i type. And this forum has all of the mechanics behind that - preprocessor parsing, admin control, user rights etc. That's more than an auction house needs. GWGuru manages it on a web server - probably a shared webserver at that.

The database mechanics needed to manage something of the size required already exist. I'm absolutely sure that Guild Wars server setup could easily pull off an auction house.

The issue isn't technical impossibility or difficulty. There's no way that a company able to develop a server network capable of real-time virtualising on-demand game servers hosting multiple server-builds with real-time update roll-outs and an inbuilt content delivery system is incapable of programming a series of databases to host an auction house. The problem is less complex than running a large forum like this.

The issue has got to be the time and resources required to get an auction house up and running.