Everyone knows that Loot Scaling was the point that started the massive bot invasion, and subsequently made a lot of people leave the game.
Recently, however, I've heard there's a new kind of bot system that is actually taking advantage of loot scaling. In various towns and outposts, I've seen parties of 5-8 (usually 6) repeatedly leave and enter the area, arousing my suspicions. Some of my friends who play on the Asian servers say they have new bots that farm in teams to get the benefit of loot scaling, seemingly undermining, and reversing its effects on bot farming.
Has anyone else seen these all-monk groups?
A Rumor About Bots
ogre-mage
FoxBat
Well isn't that hilarious. Even the bots know that team farming is better now. But people still stick to their solo runs...
unmatchedfury
what isn't funny is that the level of drops could be considered farming..
holababe
Hey it makes sense.
if you control all the characters, u get all the drops.
if you control all the characters, u get all the drops.
Roshi_ikkyu
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Originally Posted by ogre-mage
Everyone knows that Loot Scaling was the point that started the massive bot invasion, and subsequently made a lot of people leave the game.
Recently, however, I've heard there's a new kind of bot system that is actually taking advantage of loot scaling. In various towns and outposts, I've seen parties of 5-8 (usually 6) repeatedly leave and enter the area, arousing my suspicions. Some of my friends who play on the Asian servers say they have new bots that farm in teams to get the benefit of loot scaling, seemingly undermining, and reversing its effects on bot farming. Has anyone else seen these all-monk groups? |
A friend of a friend in German did it, and his dead now.
Yet another useless bot thread, atleast the others offered scrn shots and noticable activity.
You can't even tell who is in a party, unless you are! the the tabloid crap please.
signed Vote for a close!
manitoba1073
Actually its not quite a rumor its called multi-accounting. Though for bots different story who knows.
For people actually thats an old story. Duallin UW with my 2 accounts is fun. you know what they say double the fun is better.
For people actually thats an old story. Duallin UW with my 2 accounts is fun. you know what they say double the fun is better.
ogre-mage
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Originally Posted by Roshi_ikkyu
I heard if u say bloody mary into a mirror 3 times she shows up and kills you.
A friend of a friend in German did it, and his dead now. Yet another useless bot thread, atleast the others offered scrn shots and noticable activity. You can't even tell who is in a party, unless you are! the the tabloid crap please. signed Vote for a close! |
signed vote for gtfo
Anyway, I'm more worried about this causing more issues in the game than I am about your doubt, tbh.
DKS
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Originally Posted by ogre-mage
Everyone knows that Loot Scaling was the point that started the massive bot invasion,
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Sk8tborderx
Loot scaling did not affect bots, when will people realize this?
Before the update, the bots would still farm with anti-farm code in effect, which means they were only getting 1/8 of the drops, they still make exactly the same now as they did before.
*sigh* some people never learn.
Before the update, the bots would still farm with anti-farm code in effect, which means they were only getting 1/8 of the drops, they still make exactly the same now as they did before.
*sigh* some people never learn.
Magda
This wouldn't give any benefit.
If they're taking 8 accounts into a map so that they can get full drops from the farm run, they'll get 100% of the drops. However, if they take those 8 accounts into 8 maps solo and each get 1/8 the drops from loot scaling, they'll get 8*12.5%, or 100%....
To put it another way, without loot scaling, those 8 accounts would all be solo-farming at the same time- clearing out 8 different instances for full loot. Having 8 players in one instance means that there are 7 less instances worth of creatures being killed. If the botters buy 8 times as many accounts, sure they can farm gold at the same rate as before- but they could have bought those accounts before and made 8x the gold.
If they're taking 8 accounts into a map so that they can get full drops from the farm run, they'll get 100% of the drops. However, if they take those 8 accounts into 8 maps solo and each get 1/8 the drops from loot scaling, they'll get 8*12.5%, or 100%....
To put it another way, without loot scaling, those 8 accounts would all be solo-farming at the same time- clearing out 8 different instances for full loot. Having 8 players in one instance means that there are 7 less instances worth of creatures being killed. If the botters buy 8 times as many accounts, sure they can farm gold at the same rate as before- but they could have bought those accounts before and made 8x the gold.
Roshi_ikkyu
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Originally Posted by ogre-mage
lol. Captain brilliance, have you yet to notice that when you self-invite to a party (I did say the majority seem to be 6people) you can view the professions/names of all in the party?
signed vote for gtfo Anyway, I'm more worried about this causing more issues in the game than I am about your doubt, tbh. |
Your argument is you see;
* groups of people zoning with full or almost full partys.
* claim to be able to know that there bots based on character name and class.
You claim to have heard about a 'new style of bot' that group farms. Even admited that 'friends' of yours on the asian servers have/use bots to group farm!
I don't know about you but I don't interact with anyone who openly runs a bot program, and I never would. And I also haven't had the chance to be in the 'bot latest improvement circles', to discover the current news and tatics employed by them.
And finally there is the amazing lack of evidence.
But I tell you what it's alot better then your other posts of late, I mean the witless images that you post. ffs atleast post some text to support your attempt at a joke or an insult, what ever your attempting to achieve.
fenix
A lot of the time that I see groups of 'bots', it's one important guy running the others to get skills/armor/etc.
Xapti
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Originally Posted by Magda
This wouldn't give any benefit.
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In addition, currently you'll get MORE loot farming with 8 separate people than a team of 8. Why? because some of your drops won't be loot scaled, such as rares.
The new system makes it pretty good for botters, and pretty lousy for non-botters. Why? Casual players don't farm the same area over and over and over again 24 hours a day. Casual players probably wouldn't even like farming the same area too many times, it's BORING. The fact that drops decreased the more they did the area really isn't too bad.
With bots, they have a limited number of areas they can farm, and they are playing all the time. Even though the drops are considerably less for them, they can farm the Same area NON-STOP for the next 500+ hours straight. VERY easy to program, VERY easy to implement, VERY high rewards.
And about multiple member parties... not only is it pointless for the moment, but it's extremely harder to program in bots. They have very little concept of distance, aggro, kiting, staying together, etc.. it is possible though, but even when done, it's almost certainly slower than 8 times the speed of a solo farmer.
The counter-measures Arenanet is using against botters at the moment is absolutely PATHETIC. Many other MMO games develop efficent counter-measures very quickly.
Nuclear Eclipse
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Originally Posted by Roshi_ikkyu
And your've been given a special ability to know who bots are purely by the character names and professions!?! Whoa dude your awesome GW's first superhero!
Your argument is you see; * groups of people zoning with full or almost full partys. * claim to be able to know that there bots based on character name and class. You claim to have heard about a 'new style of bot' that group farms. Even admited that 'friends' of yours on the asian servers have/use bots to group farm! I don't know about you but I don't interact with anyone who openly runs a bot program, and I never would. And I also haven't had the chance to be in the 'bot latest improvement circles', to discover the current news and tatics employed by them. And finally there is the amazing lack of evidence. But I tell you what it's alot better then your other posts of late, I mean the witless images that you post. ffs atleast post some text to support your attempt at a joke or an insult, what ever your attempting to achieve. |
HawkofStorms
Well, its still an effective way to combating botting in a way. Farmers now have to own and run 4-6 copies of the game to make the same money that they used to make from 1 copy. So even if bot farmers are finding ways "around" loot scaling, they are still being hurt in the long term by undercuting their profit and forcing them to raise prices.
scrinner
[QUOTE=ogre-mage]and subsequently made a lot of people leave the game.
QUOTE]
Not sure who you hang out with. I have yet to find one person that has left the game due to loot scaling. Its not devestating to the regular person but more devastating for the soloer/botters.
QUOTE]
Not sure who you hang out with. I have yet to find one person that has left the game due to loot scaling. Its not devestating to the regular person but more devastating for the soloer/botters.
sprakula
pretty sure botters don't buy copies of the game, Asia is not well known for it's legal software market, more for it's illegal. I'm sure they just have key-code generators that they are using whenever one of their accounts gets banned. Simple as that, their spending cost is what the energy costs to run a few computers, and their income is whatever they are selling the gold for.
It's a nasty nasty business, but I don't know why A-net spends so much time on it. They will never be able to kill it 100%, even 15% and I would be surprised, so why spend so much time on it? Let the people that can't play the game buy gold, let the others play in peace without punishing them for something that no one has control over. That's my opinion, I'm not advocating botting at all, but I'm just saying, why ruin a game for the real customers when the small majority of botters/buyers really has no effect on the game.
It's a nasty nasty business, but I don't know why A-net spends so much time on it. They will never be able to kill it 100%, even 15% and I would be surprised, so why spend so much time on it? Let the people that can't play the game buy gold, let the others play in peace without punishing them for something that no one has control over. That's my opinion, I'm not advocating botting at all, but I'm just saying, why ruin a game for the real customers when the small majority of botters/buyers really has no effect on the game.
wetsparks
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Originally Posted by sprakula
pretty sure botters don't buy copies of the game, Asia is not well known for it's legal software market, more for it's illegal. I'm sure they just have key-code generators that they are using whenever one of their accounts gets banned. Simple as that, their spending cost is what the energy costs to run a few computers, and their income is whatever they are selling the gold for.
It's a nasty nasty business, but I don't know why A-net spends so much time on it. They will never be able to kill it 100%, even 15% and I would be surprised, so why spend so much time on it? Let the people that can't play the game buy gold, let the others play in peace without punishing them for something that no one has control over. That's my opinion, I'm not advocating botting at all, but I'm just saying, why ruin a game for the real customers when the small majority of botters/buyers really has no effect on the game. |
If ANET really wanted to get rid of botters and gold sellers, then they should make it so insanely easy to make money that there is no reason to buy gold.
Roshi_ikkyu
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Originally Posted by Nuclear Eclipse
shaadup.....
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Darksun
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Originally Posted by ogre-mage
Everyone knows that Loot Scaling was the point that started the massive bot invasion
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Dzan
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Originally Posted by ogre-mage
Everyone knows that Loot Scaling was the point that started the massive bot invasion, and subsequently made a lot of people leave the game.
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FoxBat
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Originally Posted by sprakula
pretty sure botters don't buy copies of the game, Asia is not well known for it's legal software market, more for it's illegal. I'm sure they just have key-code generators that they are using whenever one of their accounts gets banned.
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Bloodthorn
Hi I used to farm with my 55 Necro at Elonas Reach to make 5K in 30mins per day which I then used to help my other character that I created through the game but thanks to Anets wonderful lootscale thing which they say will not hurt solo farmers thats a joke I can now hardly get anthing from that area. As for ppl saying that there are now more bots than ever and Anet does'nt care about it is just depressing as the ppl who actually sit in front of there computer and farm or play the game are just going to get screwed over with these parisites collecting all the rare weapons and artifacts.
HawkofStorms
Gold items aren't limited from loot scaling Bloodthorn, thus your chance to get uber rare loot from farming is not affected.
Its your ability to get gold which is impeded, via lots of white drops, (the same as with the botters), thus inflation is lowered (the whole point of loot scaling).
Its your ability to get gold which is impeded, via lots of white drops, (the same as with the botters), thus inflation is lowered (the whole point of loot scaling).
Bloodthorn
It not the fact that it drops less gold it drop less things period I'm lucky if I get one thing to sell from killing 20 or so menitors.
ogre-mage
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Originally Posted by Bloodthorn
It not the fact that it drops less gold it drop less things period I'm lucky if I get one thing to sell from killing 20 or so menitors.
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Marth Reynolds
Actually bots would only profit from the loot scale nerf.
They can simpley with let 8 acounts farm a area and get the same amount of money the were able to get roughly, add the fact that they can charge more real life money due to loot scaling (wich makes it harder kuch kuch to get money.)
Honestly i have seen more bots then ever after the loot scale nerf so this little theory of mine might be partially true...
They can simpley with let 8 acounts farm a area and get the same amount of money the were able to get roughly, add the fact that they can charge more real life money due to loot scaling (wich makes it harder kuch kuch to get money.)
Honestly i have seen more bots then ever after the loot scale nerf so this little theory of mine might be partially true...
Chieftain Heavyhand
My theory on the whole bot invasion after the LS is this:
In order for the boters to acquire the same amount of swag as they did pre-LS they must now run 8 times as many bots.
This would account for the explosion of bots after the LS.
Which only shows what I've been saying all along that the LS only hurt the real players and the bots will find a way around the LS. By creating 8 or 10 bots to do the job of 1 bot. It makes no difference to the boter because their bots run 24/7. So they say so you nerfed the loot drop I'll just balance it by creating 8 more bots.
I think this could explain why it looks like there are teams of bots. They are being run by one person and are leaving at the same time, the returning at the same time. Some boters may even be creating teams to see if this will improve their drops rates.
So like I said no matter what Anet does the boters will prevail. The best way to find bots is to look and see which players have been online for over 24 hours. This can still be countered, by programming so I fail to see a way to rid our selves of this pestilence. Oh I know what if people would stop buying gold.
This to is hard to over come because people are buying gold because they cannot make it easily. Not that I think that everyone should be billionaires. Anet has nerfed so many great places to make money like the griffions outside of Argury Rock and a great place to gain runes before reaching level 20 from Enitts around Nebo, and so on and so forth. What really gets me is that they remain nerfed after the LS.
When do you stop cutting things off to spite your face. Bots are a problem but when you cripple real players it is counter productive. Yes things are getting cheaper, but is that because of HM or LS?
In order for the boters to acquire the same amount of swag as they did pre-LS they must now run 8 times as many bots.
This would account for the explosion of bots after the LS.
Which only shows what I've been saying all along that the LS only hurt the real players and the bots will find a way around the LS. By creating 8 or 10 bots to do the job of 1 bot. It makes no difference to the boter because their bots run 24/7. So they say so you nerfed the loot drop I'll just balance it by creating 8 more bots.
I think this could explain why it looks like there are teams of bots. They are being run by one person and are leaving at the same time, the returning at the same time. Some boters may even be creating teams to see if this will improve their drops rates.
So like I said no matter what Anet does the boters will prevail. The best way to find bots is to look and see which players have been online for over 24 hours. This can still be countered, by programming so I fail to see a way to rid our selves of this pestilence. Oh I know what if people would stop buying gold.
This to is hard to over come because people are buying gold because they cannot make it easily. Not that I think that everyone should be billionaires. Anet has nerfed so many great places to make money like the griffions outside of Argury Rock and a great place to gain runes before reaching level 20 from Enitts around Nebo, and so on and so forth. What really gets me is that they remain nerfed after the LS.
When do you stop cutting things off to spite your face. Bots are a problem but when you cripple real players it is counter productive. Yes things are getting cheaper, but is that because of HM or LS?
Sophitia Leafblade
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Originally Posted by Chieftain Heavyhand
By creating 8 or 10 bots to do the job of 1 bot. It makes no difference to the boter because their bots run 24/7.
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lennymon
The bots aren't the threat in my opinion. They can bot up all the gold in the world, but if they can't sell it they'll go away. I'm sure you've all noticed by now the gold sellers are more aggressive? Site spamming in towns? Obviously banning the spambots won't help as they are instantly replaced. Can Anet legally track IP addresses.
The bot banning is good, but when does it cross the line into a witch hunt? I know I've gotten nervous (I hope needlessly) about the bot hunt. If farmers can't play and have fun isn't it by definition too much?
The bot banning is good, but when does it cross the line into a witch hunt? I know I've gotten nervous (I hope needlessly) about the bot hunt. If farmers can't play and have fun isn't it by definition too much?
Mister Muhkuh
I've just seen someone repeatedly running a group of monks (all the same lvl, secondary profession and armor, stupid names and without guild(besides dye))
hmm... he seems to have a lot of friends who like to play monk *coughs*
hmm... he seems to have a lot of friends who like to play monk *coughs*
StarGatherer
The bots are every freaking where! Gio to Rilohn Reach and look at all the e/a's, or The astralarium and check out the m/d.everywhere.I think the mix of LS and Hard mode has them breeding like rabbits.
lyra_song
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Originally Posted by FoxBat
No, they aren't. You can't make a keygen without access to at least the validation binary, which isn't a part of GW's client. Every game with MP has run a seperate, narrower validation set for their servers than clients to avoid exactly that, and 99% of them have never had this server-side validation cracked.
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Stolen or hacked accounts turned into bots (or bought with in game gold).
Amy Awien
A stolen credit-card or GW-account is still not a key-generator. What is your point?
HawkofStorms
Key loggers (follow and track your typing) =/= Key generators (a program that creates valid game keys by breaking the algorithim that creates them).
Sorry Lyra, I think you misunderstand those previous posts.
Sorry Lyra, I think you misunderstand those previous posts.
ogre-mage
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Originally Posted by lennymon
The bots aren't the threat in my opinion. They can bot up all the gold in the world, but if they can't sell it they'll go away. I'm sure you've all noticed by now the gold sellers are more aggressive? Site spamming in towns? Obviously banning the spambots won't help as they are instantly replaced. Can Anet legally track IP addresses.
The bot banning is good, but when does it cross the line into a witch hunt? I know I've gotten nervous (I hope needlessly) about the bot hunt. If farmers can't play and have fun isn't it by definition too much? |
ichigo_panty
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Originally Posted by orge-mage
Actually, I've still been buying gold in an effort to support bot farming. Because at this point, Anet has ruined everything for me, so I try to respond in kind.
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So, you are just complaining about the increase in gold price that these bot are selling?
Anyway, the best way to not support bots is simple.
Do not buy gold. Is this too hard to accomplish?
Just let the bots farm all they like, but with no buyers to their golds, anet will benefit, we will benefit, bots will suffer.
scrinner
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Originally Posted by ogre-mage
Actually, I've still been buying gold in an effort to support bot farming. Because at this point, Anet has ruined everything for me, so I try to respond in kind.
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Self - Owned
ogre-mage
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Originally Posted by scrinner
Two Words for you.
Self - Owned |
madman24749
Anet needs to start asking peoples dam opinions instead of charging off, doing what they want and losing more people