fewer people playing GW?

There's also the fact that Hard Mode introduced Guardian and Vanquisher. So most likely, a lot of players are in missions doing Guardian, or in zones Vanquishing stuff. And considering there's 100 or so zones in the 3 chapters, there's a LOT of places for people to be.

What, you didn't think reducing the available freedom that once was in the game to zero would lead to more people playing the game?

I've predicted that this would happen from the moment Nightfall came out. People who liked to chest run? Most left. People who liked to do 5-man SF? Most left. People who liked to farm? Most left. People played the story for like 16 times? Most left.

Just see Guild Wars as an amusement park: The longer you're in it, and the more attractions you ride, the more boring it gets. However, A-Net is even fastening up this process by removing alot of attractions.

A theme park with 40 attractions doesn't get boring as fast as a theme park with 2 attractions.

And everytime A-Net nerfs something to death, another attraction is removed. Sure, the existing attractions sometimes get updated to seem more fun on the outside, but even when updated, you don't want to ride it all day long.

I would have to say it's a different crowd playing, most of my friend's list and guild/alliance was active at the begining of HM but now barely log on, even lost hubby to LotR (I prefer GW myself) He only logs on once in awhile now if I bug him enough (sigh). However, the districts do seem to have more people in them than before, especially the Canthan elite missions.

It has changed. I got into several PUGs trying to get past one of the missions after you go into the Vortex in Nightfall. I am amazed these people got that far. No concept of aggro, party wipes both times as soon as we got into the mission. I could progress much further with Heros and Henchies. So, yea, people that know what they are doing or are capable of playing as a group have gone by the wayside, or at least seriously degraded.

Also, there are a lot of people in pre-searing going for the LDOA title. Pre-searing Ascalon has as many as 4 or 5 districts at a time. One guy on the presearing forum told the group he got banned and Anet told him it was because he was on-line too much (21 Hours average per day) and therefore had to be a bot.

He was putting in service tickets, and complaining hoping to get his account back. But if this is true, it would be kind of odd that Anet comes up with the LDOA title which can only be obtained by extended periods of AFK to allow for deathleveling times, and then banning you for attempting to get the title.

No.GuildWars was killed by Nightfall.

The Introduction of Heroes completely killed pugging, not to mention the skills introduced completely broke PvP.

Nightfall in general had a negative impact on GuildWars.

And what so bad about it? Are you sure it was heroes and not idiot players that killed pug?

The problem is, people don't have to pug so they don't, if it was the only option people would do it more and *might* be better at it? who knows, people always Shun noobs but they should really adopt them and turn them into monsters, sharing experience is always a good thing, And personally i agree NF had a negative impact on the game in alot of ways, but also had a positive one in alot of ways to, it's kinda 50/50 for me.

I can't say for sure if there are less players, it sure feels that way anyways. One thing for sure is...most players seem to use HM for farming only as finding groups for any of the missions on any continent, is very tough to do...at any time of the day. I certainly don't blame heroes for the lack of groups either, since HM requires that you have at least finished the game once before when you do get into pugs they usually have far less trouble in HM as heroes do. IMHO

One other thing I can say is this, many of my ingame friends seem far less excited about GW:EN since we all know that in a way it is all for nothing, with GW2 on the horizon.

Still see plenty of people on but it's always hard to tell if there are actually more or less people then have played in the past. But I do agree with the comments that it's natural over time for people to get tired of a game and move on to other things. I can't think of any other game that I have played this much of for over a year and half so good job to ANET for creating such an interesting, complex beast. But ANET's future challenge will be to keep more people joining the game so that the player population base stays even with the rate of attrition. I would encourage them to spend more efforts on signing up new players.

i think most of the veteran players are getting bored and switching to other games since they've pretty much experienced everything. Alot of my friends have left guildwars already, possibly to return later when new content comes out or for good. I've been playing since the betas, but the only reason i keep playing is to hang with friends, im poor, and my internet sucks so i actually havn't experienced everything..(sigh).

I can't speak for everyone here, but I know why my girlfriend and I quit this game. I come back to check news, forums and updates, in hope that what made me quit has been fixed, removed, or something has been done to address it. I do this because I honestly loved playing this game. It -was- fun for me.

For my girlfriend, who dragged me into this game in the first place, she stopped playing because of the SR nerf. That isn't to say she didn't wait for the alleged fix that is "coming soon". It just hasn't come in time to salvage her interest in this game. She is also an avid farmer, because, let's be honest here, GW is a game of flashy things. Why have so many things that basically does the same thing, but look so much better than others? She didn't like the changes, so she stopped playing.

I too like to farm and buy pretty things, but with the economy going downhill, it's kind of hard to do, such that if I don't put in endless hours a week on trying to get money, I can't buy these things. But for the most part, I have what I want; 3 sets of FoW armor, bunch of highly desired skinned weapons, and things of the like. That having been said, there's very little to do in GW now. DOA? Urgoz? The Deep? HM? PvP? A lot of these areas are filled with either elitist asshole players who yells "NOOB" at any chance they get and just whine and bitch at any opportunity that presents itself, or on the opposite side of the spectrum, firestorm rangers whose builds are utter crap which makes you wonder how they made it that far in the first place. There's little in-between, and that gap in the player base is astounding. I see little effort, which is different than saying there is no effort, made to bridge this gap. Add that in with the heroes, and you have even less people to group with to do something.

I'm not trying to blame one side or another, ANet or the players, elitists or "noobs". I'm merely stating that this is what I've observed, what I've personally experienced. I'm speaking for no one but myself (and a bit for my girlfriend I suppose), but I would suggest to who aren't content with the game to move on. Complaining won't help bring ANet any closer to solutions, but on the other hand, players shouldn't play something that doesn't bring them happiness. It's a game after all. With that philosophy in mind, I've stopped playing Guild Wars in hope that some day I can return. And if not, well there's always other games to fall back on.

I call shenanigans. :P

Speak for yourself, or at least document that this is from people you know or first hand experience.

You speak as if you are telling facts.

I haven't really noticed a change much. Its just logical to think that more people are going to be on Saturday afternoon than Sunday at 3 AM. I frequently play long into the night when I'm not busy, and yes, people log out because its late.

I'd say that if anything, the population of active players is going to GROW during this summer, and of course with the release of GW:EN. Don't fret about it, all games have their ups- and downs, perhaps this is the time.

HA sucks so bad , GVG sucks , RA suck TA suck , PVE sucks , Elite mission suck.....this game sucks

People is tired of the same content and the grinding, its a PVP game that lack of style and new content. The only "big improvements" since the release are :

Big Storage + Material Storage
Heros
Double Faction Weekends
Events

Oh yes - Fort Koga (E3 Event players will know what I'm talking about) ftw! Just reintroducing that kind of map would greatly boost PvP fun to be honest, it was a great concept. Ok so it's not exactly like UT2004 Assault, but it had the same kind of atmosphere going for it. Some genuine objective-based PvP challenges would be cool too.


You mention Double Faction Weekends, but neglect to mention faction itself!? Definitely the best change since release has been the introduction of faction points. Countless players - including myself - were left sorely disappointed after release when we were forced into PvE farming for skills to be able to participate in PvP properly. Faction points changed all that.



As for fewer people playing Guild Wars nowadays... I have no idea. Up until about a week ago I hadn't really bothered with Guild Wars since, oh... Summer 2006? I finally booted up Nightfall and got back to playing now.

While I agree with you on everything else, it was PUGs that killed PUGs.

It could be hand me down accounts... New players trying the game while older players move on to other games?

This the time of year gaming take down time when spring and summer come to the Northern part of the world.There will be less if don't anything else to do.

I agree.

Logging in to the game and visiting a lot of hot spot areas will often bring 1 or 2 districts compared to the 5-7 districts most areas get. Not to mention that there was supposed to be a new Chapter released, but that never happened. Eye Of the North is a little out of reach for now so those who are looking for their adventure fix won't find it in GW again until its released. Obviously, those types of players won't care about Hard Mode so their options are clearly other games.

In addition to that, WoW just got a major addition, EQ2 just got a huge addition, Lot's of new and popular games came out. Also Summer Vacations, Graduations, Weddings, all happen around this time of year too.

So, I'm hard pressed to believe that "login counts are up", unless they are just logging in just to see what's going on and leave shortly after.

Hmm. I'll actually chime in as someone who has played a lot in PUGs over my time in GW. Not that I disagree with you really. PUGs can sometimes showcase the best of what is worst about communication, teamwork, patience and above all else, human nature.

Still, because I get bored fast with running around with henchmen, and now heroes or both, I have always played in PUGs to some degree. Sure, first choice I always went and did something with guild members, but otherwise I found players to play with randomly.

My experiences have by and large been very good too, surprisingly, because yes, i have been in some of those atrocious PUGs we all fear and dread. I completed Protectors for Prophecies and Factions on five or six characters (I cant even remember now - they are all retired sans my monk) and the rest got as far as they did, by and large in PUGs. Great fun was had. I like the randomness, the interaction, the humor and all that goes along with it. Only time i grabbed henchmen was for skill capping and the odd quest - something i could do far too quickly on my own to even warrant the bother of collecting someone to tag along.

Reason I preface all that is because yes, PUGs have gone downhill. Badly. I noticed this in Nightfall and now all around. The reason I think is heroes. Honestly, I'm fairly convinced that anyone halfway able to make it through the game with experience and/or competence, simply does it now with only either heroes or guildies, maybe some close friends, and that is it. Period. Those people PUG no longer. Ever. The only people that seem to be pugging now are unable for whatever reason to make it by even with heroes, friends or guildies.

Didnt use to be that way of course, because your only option was henchmen without the flagging interface, as well as their oh so well designed builds and lack of skill slots, so grouping even with random people was at least for some, a bit more preferable. Its a lot less common now. You can go to most any town or outpost and advertise LFG and see all the silent people standing around with (4) over their heads as you can hear the gears in their heads going round "Wonder if my heroes can outplay them at that class. Probably" and they say nothing. Sad to say a competent human player in any of those roles is better than a hero, but sure, you know what you get with a hero and wasting time in a game like this is everyone's bane.

So anyway, yes, PUG quality killed PUGs by reputation, sure, but much as I like heroes and fun as that is, Nightfall played a role in their demise as well imho. I still PUG anyway though, or at least try to. In normal mode in any campaign its easy as hell now to do it all alone with heroes/hench. I just cant bring myself to do it for very long anymore. I have more fun playing with other people, and i sometimes meet great people randomly. Met some great people recently. ^^ Comes down to how one wishes to play I suppose, as it always does.

Most people are playing in Elona but i always see alot of people in all the major towns in each campaign.

Look in outposts for the facts. I never see more than 2 districts in Deldrimore Warcamp, which used to be 4, sometimes 5 districts in weekends.

People have complaining in outposts forever that only FoW chest running was worth it. It's just common knowledge now that keys are 90% of the time a waste of time. (Not saying it's true, most people just say this).

And I know of entire guilds stopping cause the farming got nerfed.

The proof that people are quitting is around you.

BTW for me personal... ALL friends in friends list quit, except some friends in my own guild (But they are not in the list). My Guild is down to only a few active members, as well. And if someone is online, he/she is most of the time bored, and goes offline a few minutes later.

I miss the time where we could just do what we want...

Can you honestly tell me, that you checked EVERY outpost and counted the number of districts before nightfall and then compared the number of districts and compensated for the amount of players to spread out those districts from previously 2 games to now 3?

I dont think you did. Your opinion is still arbitrary.

Deldrimor Warcamp has been overfarmed and theres no incentive to go there when theres better items in factions and nightfall.

Chest runners? FoW wasnt the best place to chest run, it was Hell's Precipice. Sephis Axes and Dead Bows commanded higher prices than Chaos and Shadow weapons.

Your examples seem to be based only on people who play for MONEY. Farmers and chest runners.

And I dont have to spell out what i think of people who center their gameplay on greed and money, but if thats your only reason to play, i think the problem is your needs and wants and the direction of the game do not match.

Speaking of greed and money,I know this story right..

"The E/A Sliver build is a PUBLIC BUILD. She didn't give away any "SECRET FARMING BUILD".She did NOTHING wrong. She knew you as family & you stab her in the back. Gold before friends huh?
Guild: She was right & you didnt defend her. Dont pretend it never happened to clear your conscience. Jerk. I'll remember!Since I will have the scars on my wrists ro remind me!"

^^^^ now i am lost

The direction of the game, actually, in my mind, sort of supports and encourages the pursuit of money, despite in spirit it may not have set out to do so. Since character and weapon stat progression caps fairly early, its the pursuit of ever more rare weapon and armor skins that is character progression for some people. Isnt that what most any MMO is all about anyway? Character progression on some level or another. I can totally understand that. Its a completely valid pursuit, since once you've been through a new chapter's content for the fun that the new content always provides, the return to pursuit of wealth or titles comprises a large part of what PvE is at its core.

Nerf those systems too much and some players become discouraged. Have a long gap between new chapters and others get bored. Some will always stay to work on titles and be perfectly content doing that, while others are happy simply being social and helping friends or guildies or playing other characters through the game content over and over. Like it or not though, there's going to be some who want to play for perceived progression, and that's income, and i dont think its fair to say that's an invalid way to play PvE or something to be frowned on.

I didn't particulary check every outpost, but I do always pay attention. The amount of people in outposts now is way less than before. Even if the game was not split up, I don't think there were this few people in outposts.

Most people found FoW better, cause the high gold-rate. Chest running isn't only about rare skins. Alot of people chest-runned for gold items, to get the mods of which then would easily sell for 25-40K, depending on the mod.

Ohh, and doesn't anyone play for money? After you beat the game and are out of money, you'll have no other choice.

My needs/wants is freedom in the game again. I don't care about the money, but make chests key-less then. Don't be asking 1K per skill, then. Don't nerf everything so that it is impossible to do, and if it's possible, it's just plain annoying. And take away the friggin heroes if you want to promote team-play.

Boredom.

12 chars

Sounds familiar. But with only 2 less chars.

Guild Wars has a lot of freedom.

Anet lets you buy skills youve unlocked. As opposed to forcing you to go to certain locations just to buy some skills.
ANet lets you play PvP without PvEing.
Anet lets you play PvE without PvPing.
Anet has now allowed players to have any armor skin with any armor stats.
Nightfall weapons allow you most customization than ever.
Anet lets you transfer items between characters through a common storage.
Anet lets you have titles and none of them are mandatory, being

and one of the more important ones

Anet lets you play without having to play with other people.

Take away the heroes? I thought you wanted freedom, but you want to take away a choice?

Bravo. Thats some major contradiction right there.

Exams perhaps?

several of my friends have left guild wars to play all the new games (LOTRO and Vanguard), and have told me they will come back when EoTN or GW2 comes out. many have also played 1+year and got kinda bored. it's the holidays, and i guess some people wanna go out with vacations and stuff like that. no new content, and the weekend events aren't really great, it's going to start repeating eventually...
but those are just my thoughts. i'm going to continue playing, because maybe i'll miss out on something...

Well you can't exactly play 1 game forever, can you? Unless you're in a big guild, that always seem to have something to do together, HM, elite missions, fow/uw, GVG etc. My current guild is one of those guilds, even then I don't play as much as I used to.

GW:EN will make people come back, when it come out. Alos there're a lot of new stuff out there to try out and not just games.

I was to poor to enjoy guild wars for awhile.

Then I sucked it up, but seriously a skill balance would be nice, the game despite what every1 says is boring until they change the skills!

i see more and more stubborn head noobs around

oh my goodness.. How many "oh Noesss! GW players are leaving for Grand Theft HaloCraft 3!!!" threads are we going to have? People will always try to rationalize their idea that gamers are leaving en mass. They seem to get off on the game crashing in flaming glory for some reason.

QFT
Yes... Everyone who is playing and enjoying it are just lying to themselves. Yeah... that must be it..

45 more to go. And will that game come out on Saga Dreamcast? It sound fun.