Hello everybody.
I decided to delete my Paragon in order to create a Ritualist or Warrior. I've had a Ritualist, which I deleted about a month of playing. I've had a warrior too, my first character which I deleted accidentally ^^'. Now I'd like to get your opinions on this thing. Should I make a Rt or a Warrior? I do have all the campaings. I will probably start to solo farm with my new character, so I'd like to know which one of them would be better for that purpose and for general PvEing too.
Ritualist vs Warrior
360??
Cebe
Ritualist.
They're very versatile and extremely fun. They have great support and great offense. They can create great spikes of damage and have nice options for energy management. Weapon Spells are awesome as are Item Spells. Pre-casting spells is awesome.
Ritualist > Warrior imo.
Keep AWAY from the wammo.
They're very versatile and extremely fun. They have great support and great offense. They can create great spikes of damage and have nice options for energy management. Weapon Spells are awesome as are Item Spells. Pre-casting spells is awesome.
Ritualist > Warrior imo.
Keep AWAY from the wammo.
ZenRgy
Warrior.
Ritualists don't get [skill]Bull's Charge[/skill]
In addition, do you prefer caster classes or martial classes? Warriors are a fun class, but don't play the W/Mo Healing Breeze tank crap, play a warrior.
Ritualists don't get [skill]Bull's Charge[/skill]
In addition, do you prefer caster classes or martial classes? Warriors are a fun class, but don't play the W/Mo Healing Breeze tank crap, play a warrior.
360??
I usually play as a martial class in PvP, if I'm not playing as a monk. In PvE it's always my monk, I don't actually have any martial characters in PvE. My warrior was about 11 months old until he got deleted, and I gotta admit it was fun to play with him. The Ritualist I had got deleted cause I didn't like the spirits they have, but my opinion on that has changed a lot.
But what about solo farming? Which one is better for that purpose?
But what about solo farming? Which one is better for that purpose?
Crazyvietguy
Quote:
Originally Posted by 360°
But what about solo farming? Which one is better for that purpose?
Once again it depends on you. If your goal in farming is killing bosses and high end areas then i'd probably go with ritualist.
But if your bulk loot farming, warrior is probably better because of their high AL. Warriors also can kill bosses effectively.
Really these two classes are completely different. However, due to the ritualist's Spirit's Strength skill a ritualist (if monitored well) can play a martial attacker as well. SO, I would think ritualist would be the choice here, just because they is so versatile.
But if your bulk loot farming, warrior is probably better because of their high AL. Warriors also can kill bosses effectively.
Really these two classes are completely different. However, due to the ritualist's Spirit's Strength skill a ritualist (if monitored well) can play a martial attacker as well. SO, I would think ritualist would be the choice here, just because they is so versatile.
Chicken Rice Seller
Easy to get mission group with rit ... Rit > War
360??
Hmm-m, thanks for your help everyone. I'll make a Warrior now, but I have 2 PvP slots so I'll make my Rit later.
ArKaiN
Pretty sure the opinion of people in the Ritualist threads is unbiased.
Also, the question is dumb. There's no "better class" unless you're comparing them to a mesmer.
Also, the question is dumb. There's no "better class" unless you're comparing them to a mesmer.
360??
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArKaiN
Pretty sure the opinion of people in the Ritualist threads is unbiased.
Also, the question is dumb. There's no "better class" unless you're comparing them to a mesmer. Well I can pretty surely say that warriors are better solo farmers than paragon.
Also, the question is dumb. There's no "better class" unless you're comparing them to a mesmer. Well I can pretty surely say that warriors are better solo farmers than paragon.
tsnorquist
Quote:
Originally Posted by 360°
Well I can pretty surely say that warriors are better solo farmers than paragon.
In your case, a "paraGONE"... ka dink cha! Be here all week.
PS: Ritualist > Warriors 99% of the time, no bias at all... really.
PS: Ritualist > Warriors 99% of the time, no bias at all... really.
ArKaiN
"No bias at all" my arse. If you need pressure, any mediocre W build will outperform an Rt build. Yes, even with spirit strength and awesome 60 armor.
They're used for different things. Its like asking which is better: A car or an apple.
They're used for different things. Its like asking which is better: A car or an apple.
UnMonoLoco
I beg to differ.
Yes, the warrior has clearly more advantages over a ritualist in a brawl. That is of course common knowledge as the warrior performs the task of his namesake.
Though a melee wielding Rt actualy works quite fine in PvE. (well except DoA, but of course everyone knows that.) 60 armor? dear sir, a Spirit Strength Rt uses Ghostforge insignias boosting him up to 70 armor since there always will be a vital weapon on the character. given the use of a shield and a rank of 9 in tactics the Rt would be able to climb to the meager sum of 108 in armor class through watch yourself. Enough for PvE. PvP on the other hand goes straight to our pure Warrior brethern.
Yes, the warrior has clearly more advantages over a ritualist in a brawl. That is of course common knowledge as the warrior performs the task of his namesake.
Though a melee wielding Rt actualy works quite fine in PvE. (well except DoA, but of course everyone knows that.) 60 armor? dear sir, a Spirit Strength Rt uses Ghostforge insignias boosting him up to 70 armor since there always will be a vital weapon on the character. given the use of a shield and a rank of 9 in tactics the Rt would be able to climb to the meager sum of 108 in armor class through watch yourself. Enough for PvE. PvP on the other hand goes straight to our pure Warrior brethern.
Pick Me
You've already made your decision, but I'll still say my piece.
Both can solo farm.
Both look good in certain types of armor.
Warrior dances are better IMO. But if you have the collectors edition, backup dancers are better than a warrior's dance.
I love ritualists over warriors, but it would seem that you like warriors "deleted my warrior by accident".
Warriors are more popular than Rits, many PUGs still don't know much about Ritualists, so they may be hesitant about taking them.
Overall, based on what you have said in your original post, Warrior would be the one for you.
Both can solo farm.
Both look good in certain types of armor.
Warrior dances are better IMO. But if you have the collectors edition, backup dancers are better than a warrior's dance.
I love ritualists over warriors, but it would seem that you like warriors "deleted my warrior by accident".
Warriors are more popular than Rits, many PUGs still don't know much about Ritualists, so they may be hesitant about taking them.
Overall, based on what you have said in your original post, Warrior would be the one for you.
360??
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pick Me
I love ritualists over warriors, but it would seem that you like warriors "deleted my warrior by accident".
That accident part looks pretty confusing so I'll explain it.
When I play PvP and log out, I usually delete the character I was playing.
One morning when I was very sleepy, I came to play some PvE with my warrior. I logged out and because I was used to deleting characters when I stop PvPing, I deleted my warrior accidentally. That should clear up the thing a bit.
When I play PvP and log out, I usually delete the character I was playing.
One morning when I was very sleepy, I came to play some PvE with my warrior. I logged out and because I was used to deleting characters when I stop PvPing, I deleted my warrior accidentally. That should clear up the thing a bit.
ArKaiN
Quote:
Originally Posted by UnMonoLoco
I beg to differ.
Yes, the warrior has clearly more advantages over a ritualist in a brawl.
*snip* Fixed that for you.
I'm not going to compare how much defense a warrior can stack up to how much a rit can stack up. It would be incredibly silly. If you need someone to pressure, you use a warrior, not someone who deals 3 damage on melee if a 30 second-recharge enchantment is removed. Period.
Yes, the warrior has clearly more advantages over a ritualist in a brawl.
*snip* Fixed that for you.
I'm not going to compare how much defense a warrior can stack up to how much a rit can stack up. It would be incredibly silly. If you need someone to pressure, you use a warrior, not someone who deals 3 damage on melee if a 30 second-recharge enchantment is removed. Period.
Marverick
A Warrior is useless in PvE, don't bother with one. Inferior damage output to a Sin or Derv as melee, inferior tanking to an Elementalist.
Rits can find groups much easier than Warriors; they can fulfill practically any roll. A Warrior can't really do anything that well.
Plus there's so many idiot warriors out there that they give the class a terrible reputation. I, for one, don't let any PuG Warriors into my groups because they're more trouble than they're worth.
Rits can find groups much easier than Warriors; they can fulfill practically any roll. A Warrior can't really do anything that well.
Plus there's so many idiot warriors out there that they give the class a terrible reputation. I, for one, don't let any PuG Warriors into my groups because they're more trouble than they're worth.
ArKaiN
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marverick
A Warrior is useless in PvE, don't bother with one. Inferior damage output to a Sin or Derv as melee, inferior tanking to an Elementalist.
Rits can find groups much easier than Warriors; they can fulfill practically any roll. A Warrior can't really do anything that well.
Plus there's so many idiot warriors out there that they give the class a terrible reputation. I, for one, don't let any PuG Warriors into my groups because they're more trouble than they're worth. Are you insane?
Finding groups easily means being one of these 3:
Tank
Nuker
Healer
Warriors tank better than any other class. PERIOD. NO ARGUMENT.
Rits can find groups much easier than Warriors; they can fulfill practically any roll. A Warrior can't really do anything that well.
Plus there's so many idiot warriors out there that they give the class a terrible reputation. I, for one, don't let any PuG Warriors into my groups because they're more trouble than they're worth. Are you insane?
Finding groups easily means being one of these 3:
Tank
Nuker
Healer
Warriors tank better than any other class. PERIOD. NO ARGUMENT.
UnMonoLoco
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArKaiN
Fixed that for you.
I'm not going to compare how much defense a warrior can stack up to how much a rit can stack up. It would be incredibly silly. If you need someone to pressure, you use a warrior, not someone who deals 3 damage on melee if a 30 second-recharge enchantment is removed. Period. I wasn't trying to get into a silly argument like that. I know that a warrior can tank a 110% BETTER. I'm just saying that an Rt can actually achieve decent armor rating when going melee. I know enchantment stripping is the death of this gimmick build, but to be honest, I haven't experienced much of that running around in PvE areas like RoT.
I'm not going to compare how much defense a warrior can stack up to how much a rit can stack up. It would be incredibly silly. If you need someone to pressure, you use a warrior, not someone who deals 3 damage on melee if a 30 second-recharge enchantment is removed. Period. I wasn't trying to get into a silly argument like that. I know that a warrior can tank a 110% BETTER. I'm just saying that an Rt can actually achieve decent armor rating when going melee. I know enchantment stripping is the death of this gimmick build, but to be honest, I haven't experienced much of that running around in PvE areas like RoT.
ArKaiN
Quote:
Originally Posted by UnMonoLoco
I wasn't trying to get into a silly argument like that. I know that a warrior can tank a 110% BETTER. I'm just saying that an Rt can actually achieve decent armor rating when going melee. I know enchantment stripping is the death of this gimmick build, but to be honest, I haven't experienced much of that running around in PvE areas like RoT.
As far as I know every single explorable in RoT has foes that remove enchantments.
ArKaiN
Quote:
Originally Posted by UnMonoLoco
I wasn't trying to get into a silly argument like that. I know that a warrior can tank a 110% BETTER. I'm just saying that an Rt can actually achieve decent armor rating when going melee. I know enchantment stripping is the death of this gimmick build, but to be honest, I haven't experienced much of that running around in PvE areas like RoT.
As far as I know every single explorable in RoT has foes that remove enchantments.
Fishmonger
personally, I would go Rit over warrior. I say this because of the variety. Tired of throwing spells? heal. tired of healing? go spirit's strength and melee. Tired of melee? Go spirit spammer or MM.
You will never get bored of ritualists. And in solo farming, I've found more areas are rit farmable than war farmable.
And I totally agree with how wars have a bad name. Lots of newbies play wars because of the low learning curve, while lots of noobs play war and think they are gods. Not saying rits don't have them too, but wars have legions.
Just get used to the conditionality of many rit skills
You will never get bored of ritualists. And in solo farming, I've found more areas are rit farmable than war farmable.
And I totally agree with how wars have a bad name. Lots of newbies play wars because of the low learning curve, while lots of noobs play war and think they are gods. Not saying rits don't have them too, but wars have legions.
Just get used to the conditionality of many rit skills
Lil_Stu07
Why not try a War/Rit build. Invest some points into channeling and you have a nice little damage spiker if you use Cyclone Axe. Or even a Der/Rit, massive AoE damage.
Div
Warrior is more wanted in PvE PUG groups, but rits are more fun to play in general. Both are pretty good farmers of different things.
Lil_Stu07
Quote:
Originally Posted by holymasamune
Warrior is more wanted in PvE PUG groups, but rits are more fun to play in general. Both are pretty good farmers of different things.
Very true indeed 
I just got Factions Sat and started my Rit, I'm already lvl 17, about to be in Kaineng. Derv's are my favorite right now tho. I might make a Der/Rit. Use the weapons with the Avatars.
I just got Factions Sat and started my Rit, I'm already lvl 17, about to be in Kaineng. Derv's are my favorite right now tho. I might make a Der/Rit. Use the weapons with the Avatars.
Steps_Descending
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArKaiN
They're used for different things. Its like asking which is better: A car or an apple. It's ture in a rit forum no-bias sources will be very rare. But the next sentence made em smile... Is it true? Depending what you mean by "pressure" and depending if you're talking PvP-wise or Pve-wise, my calculation will be worthless.
I can't estimate the warrior DPS but I know a rit Spirit Spam one. So armed with nothign but a calculator, a sharp mind and shinigami eyes (sorry wrong universe) ; I started to do the math.
EDIT : there was a mistake, the calculations are wrong but the final dps's were corected.
With 12 commun and 8 channel and Sunspear rank 1
Skills : Painful Bond, Pain, Bloodsong, Vampirism, (attack spirits)
(Anguish + shadow song as complement (one or the other is in the build)
Boon of creation (energy management), Ritual lord (51% faster recharge)
Rez
Pain + blood song + vamp deal respectively 25 + 16 + 11 + 3x14 from painful bond
That's 94 dmg so far with 1.75 attack speed that gives 53. 714285714... ARMOR IGNORING dps for the core of the build.
If you add to this anguish (kept 100% thanks to rit lord , last 39 sec) : 34 + 14 dmg. that's 27.4285714... dps.
Or with the long part : Shadow Song. 17 + 14 dmg.
45 sec cooldown - Rit lord gives 22.5 sec + cast time : 5 sec = 27.5 sec.
It lasts 20 sec so that's a 7.5 sec window without ShadowS.
The blinding last 5 sec so it ends between 5 sec after spirit's death(if the last attack is just before death) or 1.75 sec before (if it dies just before attacking). On average, that's 0.875 sec from the best scenario.
So the blind ends 4.125 after spirit's death. Which leaves a 3.375 sec window free of condition. That means to build up adren and spike for a warrior.
So the cycle (from spawning to respawning) is 27.5 sec, with a 7.5 sec window. That means it is here72.7272727272... % of the time.
The damage is 17 + 14 every 1.75 sec. So 17.71428571428... dps 72% of the time, so 12.883116883... overall dps.
Add everything and it gives :
56.56 = basic dps, leaves you free do to something else fo a long while, cheap, needs 2 stats, heal over time from vampirism and possible batery from blood song self heal.
69.44 dps + blind on one mob (player or mob) with a 3.4 window = base + shadow song, also cheap,use the elite, same advantages but need more attention and gives an oportunity for a spike.
or
83.99 dps = base + anguish, more freedom but more energy intensive, pure damage, use the elite but can give a 9 sec without anguish to keep the elite, steady dps.
All of those are armor ignoring, but can't burst and the spirits take incontrolable target (not a problem with 1 target avaliable).
So how do the war fare in comparison?
EDIT : now that I look into it i'm an idiot! I conted Vampirism as an alegiance skill (corrected in the edit), with Sunspear it will be much highter than 1. with 6 the damage is 16 which means the basic DPS is 56.56 instead of 53.71. (edited in text, all dps's were added 2.85)
ArKaiN
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steps_Descending
So how do the war fare in comparison?
Horribly.
Warrior's DPS doesn't get decimated by a single AoE spell and they're actually mobile.
Pretty sure you don't know what pressure means.
http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Pressure
In a nutshell, it means constant damage.
When moving slightly out of range stops damage completely, that's not pressure. Pressure is also a pvp therm. Vampirism is right out.
Also, a Warrior needs about 2 seconds to get ready for combat. That build needs what, 30 seconds laying down spirits, while people just wail on you? Assuming no interrupts?
No.
If you want to go after what I quoted, try a dagger wielding rit with spirit's strength, not spirits. That does a ton of damage, until someone actually notices they're doing damage, and completely destroys their frail, 60-armor body with a couple of blows.
...but congrats on a ton of useless math, when a quick search on wiki could have saved you a lot of trouble.
Horribly.
Warrior's DPS doesn't get decimated by a single AoE spell and they're actually mobile.
Pretty sure you don't know what pressure means.
http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Pressure
In a nutshell, it means constant damage.
When moving slightly out of range stops damage completely, that's not pressure. Pressure is also a pvp therm. Vampirism is right out.
Also, a Warrior needs about 2 seconds to get ready for combat. That build needs what, 30 seconds laying down spirits, while people just wail on you? Assuming no interrupts?
No.
If you want to go after what I quoted, try a dagger wielding rit with spirit's strength, not spirits. That does a ton of damage, until someone actually notices they're doing damage, and completely destroys their frail, 60-armor body with a couple of blows.
...but congrats on a ton of useless math, when a quick search on wiki could have saved you a lot of trouble.
Div
You also know that it takes forever to drop your spirits and cast painful bond, and once it's casted your SF nukers have killed the enemy mob already with the help with the warrior...
Fishmonger
you can't take SF into account, then you're just comparing eles and rits. basically if you are wondering dmg, ask yourself this. Which could kill faster with less deaths (kills/deaths), a party of rits or a party of wars?
Steps_Descending
All I have to say about the 2 post responding to my post is : True! True! And true! then again Arkain speaks about constant damage, which is what I calculated. But notice I said that depending what exact meaning you gave to pressure my calculations were useless (which they were).
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArKaiN
Quote:
...but congrats on a ton of useless math, when a quick search on wiki could have saved you a lot of trouble.
Thanks! I love to do useless math!
(no sarcasm, really)
(no sarcasm, really)
Marverick
You can use Summon Spirits to bring your spirits from your last fight, as well as take them out of an AoE spell if necessary.
Spirit's Strength does more damage than a Warrior anyday. Yes they have 83 armor instead of 116/96, but that's not the point. If you prefer to tank then go ahead.
And Warriors are not wanted in PuG groups... last time I heard PuGs only want warriors to tank, not damage, thus only 1 Warrior per group. And Warriors have a terrible reputation with all the newbies and noobs playing them.
Spirit's Strength does more damage than a Warrior anyday. Yes they have 83 armor instead of 116/96, but that's not the point. If you prefer to tank then go ahead.
And Warriors are not wanted in PuG groups... last time I heard PuGs only want warriors to tank, not damage, thus only 1 Warrior per group. And Warriors have a terrible reputation with all the newbies and noobs playing them.
Thom Bangalter
wowow. this is a real thread?
the two classes do completely different things. One has some mediocre heals and some nice melee buffs, and the other tanks/beats the shit out of things.
the two classes do completely different things. One has some mediocre heals and some nice melee buffs, and the other tanks/beats the shit out of things.
around
Quote: