Hello, I have a problem with an change featered in the new Dev-Update.
"General
We added a cap of +25 to the armor buff when stacking skills. A single skill can still bring the bonus over +25, but multiple skills with smaller bonuses will not do so. Armor bonuses from shields, weapons, insignias and inscriptions are not affected and still stack. "
This is a quote from the official guildwars wikipedia.
Does this not majorly clash with the existance of high defence builds?
Does this mean that for an earth elementalist the combination of earth armor and kinetic armor is useless since one of them will bring your armor above +25, so the other one will not give an armor boost anymore. Ofcourse the paragon skill, Stand Your Ground, which gives an armor boost of +24 while not moving means that any other armor boosting skill would only boost it by +1!
I just don't get it! Could anyone explain it to me if I have missunderstood this.
New Dev-Update Question, Please assist.
Ryve
LifeInfusion
No, that's not how it works.
Let's say there are 8 skills being used to boost armor:
1 - 25 armor (watch yourself,stand your ground are examples of this range)
2- 40 armor (Physical/Elemental resistance are in this range)
3 - 50 armor (Ward against harm is in this range, but it isn't that great)
4 - 80 armor (Feigned neutrality is in this range)
5- 60 armor
6- 55 armor
7- 45 armor
let's say all 8 skills stack on you (low chance that you will have 8 skills that stack even before the update).
Then the highest armor will count. In this case it would be skill 4. Anything else is disregarded.
If there are different ones:
skill 1- 15
skill 2- 10
skill 3- 12
skill 4- 11
Then they can only add up to 25, no matter how you stack them.
================================================== =========================
To summarize, in your example of armor of earth + kinetic armor: the kinetic armor takes precedence since it gives a bigger bonus.
BTW this thread should be in Q&A.
Let's say there are 8 skills being used to boost armor:
1 - 25 armor (watch yourself,stand your ground are examples of this range)
2- 40 armor (Physical/Elemental resistance are in this range)
3 - 50 armor (Ward against harm is in this range, but it isn't that great)
4 - 80 armor (Feigned neutrality is in this range)
5- 60 armor
6- 55 armor
7- 45 armor
let's say all 8 skills stack on you (low chance that you will have 8 skills that stack even before the update).
Then the highest armor will count. In this case it would be skill 4. Anything else is disregarded.
If there are different ones:
skill 1- 15
skill 2- 10
skill 3- 12
skill 4- 11
Then they can only add up to 25, no matter how you stack them.
================================================== =========================
To summarize, in your example of armor of earth + kinetic armor: the kinetic armor takes precedence since it gives a bigger bonus.
BTW this thread should be in Q&A.
Ryve
Quote:
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Originally Posted by LifeInfusion
No, that's not how it works.
Let's say there are 8 skills being used to boost armor: 1 - 25 armor (watch yourself,stand your ground are examples of this range) 2- 40 armor (Physical/Elemental resistance are in this range) 3 - 50 armor (Ward against harm is in this range, but it isn't that great) 4 - 80 armor (Feigned neutrality is in this range) 5- 60 armor 6- 55 armor 7- 45 armor let's say all 8 skills stack on you (low chance that you will have 8 skills that stack even before the update). Then the highest armor will count. In this case it would be skill 4. Anything else is disregarded. If there are different ones: skill 1- 15 skill 2- 10 skill 3- 12 skill 4- 11 Then they can only add up to 25, no matter how you stack them. ================================================== ========================= To summarize, in your example of armor of earth + kinetic armor: the kinetic armor takes precedence since it gives a bigger bonus. BTW this thread should be in Q&A. |
It also confirms that you can only have so much of an armor boost.
I think nobody complain of any nerf and not complain about this!
LifeInfusion
It's not exactly what you said.
If it is Stand Your Ground + Kinetic armor + Armor of earth, there is no +1 from Stand your ground as both Armor of earth and Kinetic armor give more than 25.
If it is Stand Your Ground + Kinetic armor + Armor of earth, there is no +1 from Stand your ground as both Armor of earth and Kinetic armor give more than 25.
Ryve
Ofcourse alot of people do not notice this because they do not care untill they seem to die faster.
Then again, this update is only for this week, so hopefully they will change it back!
Then again, this update is only for this week, so hopefully they will change it back!
Ryve
Quote:
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Originally Posted by LifeInfusion
It's not exactly what you said.
If it is Stand Your Ground + Kinetic armor + Armor of earth, there is no +1 from Stand your ground as both Armor of earth and Kinetic armor give more than 25. |
Also the +1 would come from some other small armor boosting skill, not from SYG itself.
tenshi_strife
what he is saying is if you have kinetic maxed its +85 armor, so you would get +85 armor and nothing else, is that simple enough
Ryve
Quote:
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Originally Posted by tenshi_strife
what he is saying is if you have kinetic maxed its +85 armor, so you would get +85 armor and nothing else, is that simple enough
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I created this thread to make sure that this is actually happening, because this whole update is kind of drastic.
Miral
well we'll see exactly how it works tomorrow when the update goes live. until then its mostly speculation based on how its worded eh?
Age
The other thread got Locked so I will post it here.The Dev. update won't do the Mesmer a world of good.Rangers can Interrupt at father ranges than they can and who can degen the best the Necromancer.The only thing is is hex removal with expel for Mesmers in PvE.I really wouldn't worry to much about the armour stacking just apply one after the other.
I would say that hexes are really over powered in general.
I would say that hexes are really over powered in general.
bhavv
Welcome to the club. I dont think we need to wait to see how this will work. Anyone that plays HM will realise how badly its going to affect the game.
Gaile has already explained the wording that the highest armor enchant only will affect you, e.g. if you have bladeturn and wath yourself on you, watch yourself would trigger from anything that isnt slashing damage, but if you get hit by a sword, Bladeturn will be used instead as it has a higher AR bonus.
Gaile has already explained the wording that the highest armor enchant only will affect you, e.g. if you have bladeturn and wath yourself on you, watch yourself would trigger from anything that isnt slashing damage, but if you get hit by a sword, Bladeturn will be used instead as it has a higher AR bonus.
Miral
Quote:
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Originally Posted by bhavv
Welcome to the club. I dont think we need to wait to see how this will work. Anyone that plays HM will realise how badly its going to affect the game.
Gaile has already explained the wording that the highest armor enchant only will affect you, e.g. if you have bladeturn and wath yourself on you, watch yourself would trigger from anything that isnt slashing damage, but if you get hit by a sword, Bladeturn will be used instead as it has a higher AR bonus. |
Age
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by bhavv
Welcome to the club. I dont think we need to wait to see how this will work. Anyone that plays HM will realise how badly its going to affect the game.
Gaile has already explained the wording that the highest armor enchant only will affect you, e.g. if you have bladeturn and wath yourself on you, watch yourself would trigger from anything that isnt slashing damage, but if you get hit by a sword, Bladeturn will be used instead as it has a higher AR bonus. |
Miral
[skill]Bladeturn Refrain[/skill]
bhavv
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Miral
except the question is, will mobs suffer from the same cap? it could just turn into a fix for the long drawn out battles that go on forever when both sides have 200+ armor...
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Ive never really had that problem I can kill things fine in HM as long as my henchway is cladded in SYG/WYS + ToF with SF (lol for abreviations).
Now were just gonna die really fast
Kale Ironfist
Mobs don't use multiple +armor skills IIRC. Hence the cap is only for us.
Marth Reynolds
This armor cap will probaly make monks way more important, protection then being the best choice for reducing dmg, a lot of tanks will probaly get replaced but in the mean time we have to think of something decent :|
I think kale is right, i don't recall seeing a single creature in cantha HM having armor boost skills they had build in armor boosts it would seem!
I want it to go away after this week ..
I think kale is right, i don't recall seeing a single creature in cantha HM having armor boost skills they had build in armor boosts it would seem!
I want it to go away after this week ..
eremos
This may be overcomplicating things, but perhaps they could modify armor boosting skills to either stack or not stack above 25.
They're on fire, for example, should stack because it's conditional.
So non-stacking bonuses can stack up to 25. From that point, only stacking skills can take you higher. Of course you can still use skills that take you over 25 but from then only stacking bonuses apply.
Take damage from a non-burning foe, +25 is applied, or if you have AoE, +53.
Take damage from a burning foe with ToF and you get that bonus too.
Edit: Oops, bad example. How about stances stack, shouts, enchants, etc. don't?
24 from defensive stance + 21 from "Watch Yourself!"
If you have, say, Defy Pain (+20) up at the same time only the higher one applies.
Otherwise what's the point of defensive stances? 1 person in each party just brings WY cos there's no way to improve your armor bonus beyond that anyway.
They're on fire, for example, should stack because it's conditional.
So non-stacking bonuses can stack up to 25. From that point, only stacking skills can take you higher. Of course you can still use skills that take you over 25 but from then only stacking bonuses apply.
Take damage from a non-burning foe, +25 is applied, or if you have AoE, +53.
Take damage from a burning foe with ToF and you get that bonus too.
Edit: Oops, bad example. How about stances stack, shouts, enchants, etc. don't?
24 from defensive stance + 21 from "Watch Yourself!"
If you have, say, Defy Pain (+20) up at the same time only the higher one applies.
Otherwise what's the point of defensive stances? 1 person in each party just brings WY cos there's no way to improve your armor bonus beyond that anyway.
Kale Ironfist
"They're on Fire!" is flat %damage reduction, so it isn't part of the update...
Miral
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Marth Reynolds
This armor cap will probaly make monks way more important, protection then being the best choice for reducing dmg, a lot of tanks will probaly get replaced but in the mean time we have to think of something decent :|
I think kale is right, i don't recall seeing a single creature in cantha HM having armor boost skills they had build in armor boosts it would seem! I want it to go away after this week .. |
Lord Natural
This update only removes trash tanks from the game. It has little effect on organized pvp, and in PvE mobs don't typically stack armor skills. Playing PvE, I guess it may effect some farming builds, but playing through the game (even on HM) can be done without these types of builds.
Does-it-Matter
Seeing as how I've beaten all three games with Hench or Hench/Hero and none of the ones I use have any more than a single armor buff, I don't see this as a problem (and I don't really consider myself that "leet" of a player.)
As for HARD mode? Sure, it'll be more difficult if your entire plan hinged around one-two characters loading up on as much armor as they can and sitting there... but for the rest of us *shrug* not a problem.
Every time I see a complain about the armor change (in the what, six threads about it now?) I hear "it's going to be impossible!" to beat hard mode now. And I just remember back to when a team with no monks (and only core characters) beat THK. Or when a team of ONLY monks beat THK. There were calls up and down that said no one could do that... and they did.
As with all things, the community will adapt.
As for HARD mode? Sure, it'll be more difficult if your entire plan hinged around one-two characters loading up on as much armor as they can and sitting there... but for the rest of us *shrug* not a problem.
Every time I see a complain about the armor change (in the what, six threads about it now?) I hear "it's going to be impossible!" to beat hard mode now. And I just remember back to when a team with no monks (and only core characters) beat THK. Or when a team of ONLY monks beat THK. There were calls up and down that said no one could do that... and they did.
As with all things, the community will adapt.
Shikaru
I don't think this update is going to affect even HM that much TBH...
I've gotten guardian and vanquished almost all the zones and managed to do it with heros and henchies using ZERO +armor skills. In fact, my entire party consists of all squishies with the highest armor rating of 70 on a ranger. I manage to vanquish most zones in under an hour with the exception of maybe Hidden City. Only damage reduction I rely on is, myself, the prot monk.
I've gotten guardian and vanquished almost all the zones and managed to do it with heros and henchies using ZERO +armor skills. In fact, my entire party consists of all squishies with the highest armor rating of 70 on a ranger. I manage to vanquish most zones in under an hour with the exception of maybe Hidden City. Only damage reduction I rely on is, myself, the prot monk.
SlyClone
You know what I find funny about Guru and the ability to voice our opinion on things that Anet does with their game?
Anet depends on community feed back, but Guru outright closes all the threads that have valid complaints. How can Guru consider itself any useful now that all we do is talk to a wall of Moderators and follow rules that are 10 times more enforced than those that Anet "supposedly enforces".
I think my time on Guru was short lived and the biggest waste of typing I've ever had the chance to excersize.
I got what 25 posts in 14 months. Most of them were helpful. only 10% were complaints which were then dismissed by myself because, in essence there's no way that the Mods here will ever let us effectively discuss any topic unless it affects them directly in game. We are just as much fans of GW as they are, yet they still think they know better than us. So why use them?
From now on I will shut the RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO up on Guru. Because I know that it's pointless to even try to reason or reply to any given thread without it being moved or deleted or closed by said "GW Gurus".
Useless I tell ya.. Useless to bitch and complain about GW. Simple as that. Only Moderators get heard. Not by choice btw. Players lost their voices here. Not because every single discussion gets out of hand, but because they let it, then regret it.
See ya Guru.
Anet depends on community feed back, but Guru outright closes all the threads that have valid complaints. How can Guru consider itself any useful now that all we do is talk to a wall of Moderators and follow rules that are 10 times more enforced than those that Anet "supposedly enforces".
I think my time on Guru was short lived and the biggest waste of typing I've ever had the chance to excersize.
I got what 25 posts in 14 months. Most of them were helpful. only 10% were complaints which were then dismissed by myself because, in essence there's no way that the Mods here will ever let us effectively discuss any topic unless it affects them directly in game. We are just as much fans of GW as they are, yet they still think they know better than us. So why use them?
From now on I will shut the RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO up on Guru. Because I know that it's pointless to even try to reason or reply to any given thread without it being moved or deleted or closed by said "GW Gurus".
Useless I tell ya.. Useless to bitch and complain about GW. Simple as that. Only Moderators get heard. Not by choice btw. Players lost their voices here. Not because every single discussion gets out of hand, but because they let it, then regret it.
See ya Guru.