Discuss/rate the new PvE skills

Longasc

Forge Runner

Join Date: May 2005

17 Jun 2007 at 15:11 - 1

I think it is about time to rate the new PvE skills. Are they good? A worthwhile addition, underpowered, overpowered, gamebreaking, fun, boring, useless?

So let us discuss these skills with examples how they could be used to maximum effect.

Warrior

Sunspear Skill "Whirlwind Attack": 6 Adrenaline, 1 Recharge
Melee Attack. Attack target and adjacent foes. Each attack that hits deals +5...17 damage.

At rank 10 this skill does +20 damage and is basically an adrenaline based Cyclone Axe. But it also works for Hammers and Swords. I just wonder why it has a recharge of 1 second. To prevent constant spamming if you hit 6 targets (=instant recharge)? In this case, 1 second is not really stopping this skill from being spammed.

IMO: A really good skill that goes well with Triple Chop and Cyclone Axe, but also with Hammers and Swords. Interestingly, this skill could also be used by Dervish/Warriors as non-energy based attack.

Kurzick/Luxon Skill "Save Yourselves!": 8 Adrenaline
Shout. For 3...5 seconds, all other party members gain 100 armor.

Barrage Rangers and Axe Warriors can make use of this. It is the highest armor boost ingame, as armor buffs sadly no longer stack (I still think this is wrong).
The short duration and relatively high adrenaline cost are probably meant to balance it, but two or three people can keep this up almost constantly, in situations where many mobs attack. Another thing I dislike is that this skill is so much more useful with a high rank. 3 seconds is rather clumsy, 5 seconds is so much more efficient.

IMO: I need to test this more. If you build around it you might be able to exploit the huge armor boost, if not it is not really that good at all due to the short duration. It is probably best to use the moment when you see a boss casting a spell.

Ranger

Sunspear Skill "Never Rampage Alone": 25 Energy, 20 Recharge
Skill. For 15...23 seconds, you and your pet attack 25% faster and have 1...3 Health regeneration.

Rampage as One on steroids. Add this to any of the common Barrage/Pet builds. You only need rank 8 (Castellan) for +3 Regeneration.

IMO: A very strong skill. Works together with stances, as it is a skill. Very powerful. What do you think? If you have a pet with you, this skill alost becomes a must-have, this is why I am not too happy about it.

Kurzick/Luxon Skill "Triple Shot": 10 Energy, 10 Recharge
Bow Attack. Shoot 3 arrows simultaneously at target foe. These arrows deal 50...30% less damage.

Use a preparation to increase damage like Glass Arrows, use Conjure Whatever or simply use it to shoot Splinter Weapon or Nightmare weapon at your target.

IMO: If you really want to spike something in PvE, use this. It is still not as good as Barrage/Splinter Weapon/Nightmare Weapon. I think this is a good skill. It is not vastly more powerful than current skills like Barrage or Dual Shot, which reduces Bow damage only by 25%.

Monk

Sunspear Skill "Seed of Life": 10 Energy, 1 Cast, 20 Recharge
Enchantment Spell. For 5...9 seconds, whenever target other ally takes damage, all party members are healed for 2 Health for each rank in Divine Favor.

The usual duration at ranks 8-10 is 9-10 seconds. Add a 20% enchantments wrapping and it becomes 12. With 11 to 16 Divine Favor you can heal for 22 to 32 damage per hit. Everyone. This is Healing Seed on steroids. I can also see this in duo farming builds. I recently tested it in Urgoz Warren and it simply rocks…

IMO: I think this skill is by far too good. Someone suggested dumping it on a bonder and bonding the whole party. I have not tested this, but just using it together with Healing Seed makes it very powerful. This skill is too good to be true, it should not exist.

Kurzick/Luxon Skill "Selfless Spirit": 5 Energy, 0.25 Cast, 60 Recharge
Spell. For 10...20 seconds, spells you cast on that target an ally cost 5 less energy. This enchantment ends if you cast a spell on yourself.

I have not tested this skill myself yet. It reminds me of Divine Spirit.

IMO: It seems to be fine, long recharge, but absolutely free healing… that is too good. I think Monk healing power should not be boosted even more. They already have a monopoly, Ritualists can still not compete and are still not accepted by most players as healers.

Necromancer

Sunspear Skill "Necrosis": 5 Energy, 1 Cast, 2 Recharge
Spell. If target foe is suffering from a Condition or Hex, that foe suffers 30...66 damage.

66 damage at rank 8, 75 at rank 10. This is Discord plus. Makes the elite useless for PvE. As it is not an area damage spell it does not break PvE, it is not too strong in the PvE environment. It is also not tied to Curses, Blood or Death magic.

IMO: Fine, still sad to see that it outclasses Discord.

Kurzick/Luxon Skill "Signet of Corruption": 1 Cast, 20 Recharge
Signet. Target foe and all nearby foes take 15...27 damage. For each affected foe suffering from a Condition or Hex, you gain 2 Energy (maximum 12...18 Energy).

It is like an Elite version of Signet of Lost Souls. I am not sure how to use this. Soul Reaping still gives me enough energy, so I would rather have another skill. If you are constantly struggling with energy, it might be worth it. SoLS seems to be more reliable and gives a similar amout of energy.

IMO: Despite so many Necros having issues with energy, I really do not need another energy management skill. I still get enough energy. I think this skill can stay like this.

Mesmer

Sunspear Skill "Cry of Pain": 10 Energy, 0.25 Cast, 20 Recharge
Spell. Interrupt target foe's skill. If that foe was suffering from a Mesmer Hex, that foe and all foes in the area take 40...88 damage.

At rank 10, it is 100 damage. It has a 20 seconds recharge, best use it with a staff to have the 20% recharge of all spells bonus. It is 88-100 armor ignoring damage in the area!

IMO: Works with Illusion and Domination, a worthwhile addition. Still: Will it make Mesmers wanted for PvE?

Kurzick/Luxon Skill "Ether Nightmare": 10 Energy, 3 Cast, 25 Recharge
Hex Spell. Target foe loses 4...7 Energy. For each point of Energy lost in this way, that foe and all foes in the area suffer -1 Health degeneration for 10 seconds.

Okay, -7 area degen for 10 seconds. The wording could be improved. Now this is powerful indeed. It only needs a simple SF Ele to achieve constant max -10 degeneration.

IMO: It will only give -4 degen to most people, as it is tied to the much more grind intensive Kurzick/Luxon title track. Mesmers will want to use both skills for PvE. Maybe together with Energy Surge, Cry of Pain and Shatter Hex. Will this fix Mesmers for PvE? Not sure about that, but these skills are good. A pity that Ether Nightmare is the Kurzick and not the Sunspear skill.

Elementalist

Sunspear Skill "Intensity": 5 Energy, 1 Cast, 30 Recharge
Enchantment Spell. For 15 seconds, your spells deal 15...23% more damage.

You want to use this skill. It works best with Fire Elementalists, spamming Searing Flames as usual. While this is pretty one-dimensional, it works and together with the Kurzick Skill you can have 20 Fire Magic. It also buffs the damage of Lightbringer's Gaze!

Also read the Wiki note:
This skill does not boost the spell itself, instead the damage boost is to all spell damage while this enchantment is in effect. In other words, if the user has it up, throws down a Meteor Shower and then it wears off, none of the Meteor Shower hits will have the boost. Conversely, if the user throws down a Meteor Shower and then puts it up, the meteors will start hitting for more damage.

IMO: More damage. A pure damage buff. This is bad. GW PvE is already in a state of power creep. Effective and not overpowered IMO, but a bad choice for the Elementalist skill. It lacks any appeal or creativity.

Kurzick/Luxon Skill "Elemental Lord": 10 Energy, 1 Cast, 45 Recharge
Enchantment Spell. For 30...54 seconds, your elemental attributes are boosted by 2.

Okay. All Elementalists are now at 18 Fire Magic. Add +2 if you use the Glyph, combine with the Sunspear skill for major carnage.

IMO: Moooar damage! Powerful indeed. But a testament that PvE Eles are nothing but area nuke spamming dudettes. Very one-dimensional, but probably needed to excel in Hard Mode areas, where damage Hexes still rule. I do not like it for the fact that both skills will become pretty much standard must-haves on the bar. At least it scales nicely at low levels, despite being a Kurzick/Luxon skills

Assassin

Sunspear Skill "Critical Agility": 5 Energy, 1 Cast, 30 Recharge
Skill. For 6...13 seconds, you attack 33% faster and gain 10...22 armor. This Skill reapplies itself every time you land a critical hit.

Oh, an IAS skill, not even stance! Plus an armor buff. Now this can really make Assassins worthwhile and closer to the Armor Levels of Dervishes and Warriors in PvE.

IMO: A good skill, it is still up only 50% of the time, 15 seconds max with 30 recharge. The problem is that any melee class can use this! W/A, D/A, R/A… Yet another assassin skill that can be used even better by other professions? This is bad.

Kurzick/Luxon Skill "Shadow Sanctuary": 5 Energy, 0.25 Cast, 30 Recharge
Enchantment Spell. You are Blinded for 10 seconds. For 10 seconds, you gain +5...9 Health regeneration and +40 armor.

I could not test this skill. Again, it can be used by any melee class! The "Blinded" drawback cries for A/Mo, A/P, A/R or using Signet of Malice on a foe with a condition. This skill favors high faction rank. This skill can also be used by casters for free armor.

IMO: It has already been discussed if these skills should not be limited to the primary class, as you can otherwise have 4 PvE only skills on your skillbar, all being usually very powerful. I think this skill is a prime example why I begin to favor this approach of limiting the skill to primary classes.

Ritualist

Sunspear Skill "Vampirism": 10 Energy, 3 Cast, 30 Recharge
Binding Ritual. Create a level 1...8 Spirit that dies after 30...78 seconds. Attacks by this Spirit steal up to 10...18 Health, and you are healed for 10...18 Health.

Another spirit, can replace Bloodsong which went into the Channeling line. The only problem is that I would definitely go Channeling Ritualist in PvE and spam weapon spells on other party members. But this spirit is a nice addition and in combo with the Kurzick skill we might see Ritualists carrying a bunch of spirits around!

IMO: Fine. Use together with the Kurzick skill!

Kurzick/Luxon Skill "Summon Spirits": 5 Energy, 0.25 cast, 10 Recharge
Spell. All Spirits you control shadow step to your location, and gain 40...88 Health.

This skill fixes the problem of the low mobility of Spirits in PvE!

IMO: Very good skill. Must have for anyone going the spirit spammer route. Now Ritualists can carry their spirits with them. Damage Spirits + Vampirism together with this are quite sexy!

Paragon

Sunspear Skill "There's nothing to fear!": 15 Energy, 10 Recharge
Shout. For 10 seconds, all allies within earshot take 15...31..35% less damage. Affected allies are healed for 20...52..60 Health when this Shout ends.

The replacement for the PvP-nerfed Paragon skills. The energy cost could be even 25 and/or the recharge 20 seconds, and it still would be good. Even without the heal. Does it stack with "They are on Fire"??? Paragons can keep this up constantly, 33% damage less. Extremely powerful…

IMO: Do we really want a permanent, unconditional 30-35% damage reduction? Yeah, people will want a Paragon for this. I think this skill is just too good and needs some nerfs, then it would still be invaluable. By far too strong!

Kurzick/Luxon Skill "Spear of Fury": 5 Energy, 1 Cast, 8 Recharge
Spear Attack. Deals +20...36 damage. If this attack hits a foe suffering from a Condition, you gain 2...4 strikes of adrenaline.

Despite the icon being fugly as hell, I think this skill is quite balanced and a good addition to spearchuckers. I will use it, it is also a bit more interesting than straight damage buffs.

IMO: Okay as it is.

Dervish

Sunspear Skill "Eternal Aura": 10 Energy, 1 Cast, 30 Recharge
Enchantment Spell. All nearby foes take 40...88 holy damage. For 10 seconds, nothing happens. When this Enchantment ends, all other Dervish Skills are recharged.

Balthazar/Melandru forever. Enough said.

IMO: You love it? I hate it. It promotes the use of Avatars even more. I will never see the pretty arse of my Dervish again, but that of Melandru and Balthazar most of the time. The skill name is quite fitting. Nothing wrong with this skill… but as I stated above, it is a love-hate relation for me.

Kurzick/Luxon Skill "Aura of Holy Might": 10 Energy, 0.25 Cast, 25 Recharge
Enchantment Spell. All nearby foes take 30...46 holy damage. For 20 seconds, you deal 20...30% more damage with your scythe. When this Enchantment ends, all nearby foes take 30...46 holy damage.

Oh yeah, the melee version of Intensity. Why make a hard mode, when you buff damage even more.

IMO: Straight damage buff. Nothing too serious, Scythes have very variable damage anyways. It just lacks any appeal and is almost a must have, I do not like this skill.

Feel free to add your thoughts!

Aera Lure

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Aug 2005

In Baltar's head

Bring Out Your Dead [BOYD], former officer [LBS]

Mo/

17 Jun 2007 at 15:54 - 2

I'm disappointed with the monk skills frankly. They are underwhelming compared to the others, although mesmers too have very little to cheer about.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Longasc

Sunspear Skill "Seed of Life": 10 Energy, 1 Cast, 20 Recharge
Enchantment Spell. For 5...9 seconds, whenever target other ally takes damage, all party members are healed for 2 Health for each rank in Divine Favor.

This skill is ok. I tried it in HM Gate of Madness. Generally got a few pips of heals over the duration and that was nice, but in hard mode use the return was too low and the cost too high to warrant its placement on the bar over the choices I had made through all the rest of hard mode while completing Legendary Guardian. Bear in mind too its an enchantment, so in some areas its effectiveness is even less. I do better simply without it and that is not, by my understanding, what the PvE-only skills are all about. They should be an almost crucial choice on the bar in a wider array of context if you have the skill to a decent rank.

In normal mode I can see this skill being a bit powerful, sure, but I dont need any help in normal mode anymore at all. Normal mode is far too easy *yawn*. As you mentioned though, the skill does have great synnergy on a bonder and I'd like to test that. It does also lend itself to application on a tank holding aggro, but it was far less useful in a party with heroes or where the heal target changed often. I'm a bit underwhelmed and view it more or less as a better Healing Seed, bringing it only in circumstancial cases.

Conclusion: ideal for a bonder, otherwise... very limited use.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Longasc

Kurzick/Luxon Skill "Selfless Spirit": 5 Energy, 0.25 Cast, 60 Recharge
Spell. For 10...20 seconds, spells you cast on that target an ally cost 5 less energy. This enchantment ends if you cast a spell on yourself. The recharge time kills this skill. The skill has promise in its being similar to Air of Enchantment without having the conditional on enchantments only. Similar too to Divine Spirit, but only costs 5e less and Divine Spirit isnt even an elite.

Conclusion: very limited use if at all.

Pretty unhappy with the monk skills overall, but they do have good utility in some circumstances. They are certainly not at all on par with some of the other PvE-only skills and, if I went through HM again, as I am while helping a guildie currently, I'm not likely to take either often if at all. You cant put both of these on a bar and be better able to play your role (exception: bonder), as is the case with skills designed for some of the other classes. You'd likely actually be less successful and better off sticking to the nuts and bolts in the profession, except for a few cases. Not what I expected from these skills.

Longasc

Forge Runner

Join Date: May 2005

17 Jun 2007 at 15:57 - 3

Too late to edit, but think about this:

Mo/N, both Monk PvE skills, use the Necro Signet for Energy Management and the other Necro skill for damage if you really want to.

IMO: Primary class skills only! Plus... maybe limit to one PvE skill on bar only?

Neo Nugget

Site Contributor

Join Date: Jan 2006

17 Jun 2007 at 16:09 - 4

My favorite skill is the critical agility, it goes well with critical eye, critical defenses and high critical strikes. I think it benefits the assassin more than any other class by along shot. So I dont think it needs to be changed at all

Aera Lure

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Aug 2005

In Baltar's head

Bring Out Your Dead [BOYD], former officer [LBS]

Mo/

17 Jun 2007 at 16:16 - 5

Quote:

Originally Posted by Longasc

Too late to edit, but think about this:

Mo/N, both Monk PvE skills, use the Necro Signet for Energy Management and the other Necro skill for damage if you really want to.

I did.

Since I have retired all of my characters other than my monk that's the only way I would get to use any of the non-monk PvE-only skills.

Problem with Signet of Corruption used this way is its tied to the Kurzick/Luxon title line. Would have to get out into rank 7-8 I imagine for the energy return to max at around 15 or so and it has too many conditionals to be used in this way - the enemies have to be hexed or suffer from a condition and you have to be nearby a bunch of them as well. Generally not good for the monk.

Far better to simply go with Glyph of Lesser Energy or some other means of energy management.

As a necro, I dont know what I'd do with that skill. Probably absolutely nothing. As you said, an energy management skill isnt needed, its too conditional to be taken over SoLS if you did need an energy management skill, and its tied to the faction title line which means its usefulness is lower until you are quite invested in faction. This skill needs reworking.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Longasc

IMO: Primary class skills only! Plus... maybe limit to one PvE skill on bar only? I would be ok with Primary class skills only, since few really belong on a monk bar as secondary anyway. I might also be fine with only one on the bar at a time, but they would need a buff in some cases. As it is I am unlikely to use either monk PvE-only skill much at all, let alone two lol.

There are some PvE-only skills though that are amazing (Intensity, Elemental Lord, Critical Agility, "There's nothing to fear!", Eternal Aura). These skills outclass most of the others hands down. Rather than outright nerf all these I hope they buff some of the others, since wasnt that the point? Possibly Eternal Aura needs thought as if it really should give eternal Avatars, but I'm ok too if it stays that way. I'd just like to see other skills put in the same level of utility. If I was a primary of one of those skill classes, they might likely be on my bar all the time, or a significant portion thereof. Its just not true for some of the other classes.

Aera Lure

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Aug 2005

In Baltar's head

Bring Out Your Dead [BOYD], former officer [LBS]

Mo/

17 Jun 2007 at 16:43 - 6

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neo Nugget

Well, you would be competing with all the Dervishes, Elementalists and Paragons who would say otherwise.

Fishmonger

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jul 2006

P/W

17 Jun 2007 at 16:48 - 7

my opinions on these vary a lot.

Warrior: Both these skills are fairly nice. whirlwind attack is verry nice for those AoE axe slingers that needed a lil more punch to their build. Put a 16 splinter wep on them, and let's just say anything adjacent will be not doing so well =D (combine with another AoE war for more fun?). "Save Yourselves!" reminds me of a pre-nerf "incoming!." This makes a lot of places doable when one of your monks are down and you need spike prevention (I hate invoke lightning >_<)

Ranger: Let me begin with this. I. Love. These. Skills. The pure damage that can be achieved with these two skills (especially on a spirit's strength rit) is astounding! "Never Rampage Alone" makes Spirit's Strength rits (such as myself) pour on the spike damage, especially with a good pet buffing skill as well (Brutal weapon anyone?) True, this might be a little energy heavy but hey, that's what expertise is for. Triple shot is really cool for Spirit Strength's as well due to the main source of damage coming from the skill, not the arrow. This + nightmare weapon makes for a very efficient spike/ heal, so i deff reccomend it for any DPS rangers or SS rits.

Monk: Seed of Life is a skill that makes me wonder why I even use my rit to heal. SERIOUSLY! This skill + a bonder makes 9 seconds of absolute invincibility! Out of all the PvE only skills, I've never seen anything need a tweak more than this skill. Selfless spirit however could be useful for resto rits who have to heal a specific target. Except for Spirit Transfer, every rit skill heals for 5e, making selfless spirit a very nice e management skill for tight situations IMO.

Necromancer: I am only a little happy with these skills. Necrosis would be nice with a SS necro or anything in the curses line. Could also be combined with shambling horrors for a MM or maybe with Apply Poison for rangers to gank bosses? On the other hand, I see Signet of Corruption being used for trappers to pull off those few extra traps needed to finish off something. This skill could silence a few of the SR nerf criers, but only a few =P ( no offense meant)

Mesmer: Cry of Pain is amazing. Simply amazing. I see a potential spike with Arcane conundrum+ Cry of Pain+ Energy Surge If I calculated right. this would make any clumped group take just a little under 200 armor ignoring damage if your sunspear rank is high enough. Very nice indeed. Ether nightmare is very nice indeed, especially if used with mantra of recovery. But i agree with the OP, too bad its with the faction title

Elementalist: holy s***. these two skills have made their way onto every fire ele's skill bar. These two skills create total and absolute hell for any mob. The sheer DPS I see coming from the use of the skills makes DoA foes' DPS seem like a kitten pounce. Elemental Lord now makes is possible ( along with GoEP and a golden egg) to have 21 in any ele attribute. OH MA DAMN. And combined with Intensity? SF and MS now engulf foes in a firey torrent instead of just hitting for nice damage. also nice for any other casters looking for a little more DPS in PvE

Assassin: Once again, I'm thinking like a Spirit's Strength rit here. Either of these skills for very nice for SSers (or any melee class). Critical Agility reminds me of a melee class Kinetic armor. I could see critical agility making it onto a few hammer mastery bars as well. Shadow sanctuary is (with a high enough title) a free shield of regenration for Paragons, any SSers using sight beyond sight,etc. Personally, I'm going to grind my faction title just to use this effectively.

Ritualist: Now to the skills I can effectively judge. I think this was Anet's little sign that rits should stick to spirit spamming in pve. Vampirism is simply okay IMHO, but it does add another cheap, quick recharging spirit to any painful bond/ signet of ghostly might users. Summon spirits is one of the exact skills that spirit spammers ( and the now broken Defensive rit lords) have been needing. This is the only direct skill capable of healing spirits other than spirit boon strike, and the only way to effectively transport spirits. Draw spirit was WAY too clunky. The only drawback is that use of this makes you and your spirits very suceptible to AoEs. I would use this skill even if it didn't provide healing.

Paragon: These skills are exactly what I expect a paragon to have. When DoA first came out, I saw paragons being the champions of those areas, with multiple support shouts/chants/echoes that would make parties stand a chance without spells such as sepll breaker and obs flesh. It was quickly realized that the power of paragons increased in a party in PvP(that's their job). The nerfs following para exploitations have nearly ruinied their role in PvE as an offensive/defensive support role. Skills such as "there's nothing to fear!" are what paras are made for, to be able to live through the higher end locations where 2 hits can wipe almost anyone. This skill will prove invaluable since the +armor nerf. Spear of Fury is also a VERY nice skill, especially for the DPS spear wielders or the command paras using GFTE. I will be using both of these skills as much as possible. Hopefully this means that the paragon's splendid use will completely return in GW:EN.

Dervish: I totally agree with the OP, eternal aura makes avatars a required now on dervs. This is the one skill I believe needs a nerf, because this makes any avatar have a 10 second downtime, or less if you remove it early! A buff from 120 seconds eh? If Anet doesn't nerf this, I will be suprised (and I see every other dervish user glaring at me for saying this =P.) Aura of Holy might is a very nice skill. That's about all I can say.

Overall skills score:

Warrior : 9.5/10
Ranger:10/10
Monk:9.0/10
Necromancer:8.0/10
Mesmer:8.0/10
Elementalist: 10/10
Assassin: 9.0/10
Ritualist: 9.5/10
Paragon: 10/10
Dervish: 8.5/10

garethporlest18

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jan 2006

[HiDe]

17 Jun 2007 at 16:54 - 8

Some skills might need a buff, but I don't think any need a nerf as they're not ruining anything. No one is forcing you to use any of these skills, if you can't defy your logic to use something else than obviously that's your problem.

If they're going to be primary only, I better see a +10-20 damage increase in my whirlwind attack, to put it up there in plus elite form. Because you do know man that these skills are suppose to be better than elites.. right? Whats' the point otherwise? These skills were suppose to be powerful hence why they're only PvE.

Oh and Eternal Aura is not a required skill. You DO NOT have to use it. How you can say oh nerf this because I'm going to use it and I don't want it to be required is beyond me. I might actually use avatars this time around, as they were skills I wasn't using because there was really no point in PvE to use them on my skill bar. Now maybe I'll give it a go every now and then.

Voltaire

Academy Page

Join Date: May 2006

Chicago-ish

Everlasting Sacred Path [ESP]

17 Jun 2007 at 18:56 - 9

Quote:

Originally Posted by Longasc on Critical Agility

IMO: A good skill, it is still up only 50% of the time, 15 seconds max with 30 recharge. The problem is that any melee class can use this! W/A, D/A, R/A… Yet another assassin skill that can be used even better by other professions? This is bad. I know that as an assassin during combat, I rarely go more than 5-10(tops) seconds without a critical hit, even in Hard Mode and especially with critical eye up. This equates to 100% coverage from critical agility. I'm not knowledable enough to judge how frequently the other melee classes crit in high-end areas, however.

Mr. G

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jul 2006

S. Wales

Mo/Me

17 Jun 2007 at 21:16 - 10

There is a major flaw in the Rit's skills - its spirits, many area of the game spirits wont get you far, and with the recent buff to SP t include Weapon spells...what do anet want!?

Sadly my rit gets no use out of either of these skills ever

Nash Vegas

Academy Page

Join Date: Jul 2006

18 Jun 2007 at 00:25 - 11

I have as of now only played with the ranger skills, as that is all I really use, just added the para shout to my bar to see what that does.

Never Rampage Alone:
Go spider go! I love playing a beastmaster role in PvE, this makes it that much easier. pet IAS plus health regen for both of us plus my elite is free for Fericous Strike or whatnot, very exciting.

Triple Shot:
my bar now currently has triple shot, dual shot, forked arrow and kindle/ignite arrows (whichever I deem more useful at the time). Oh man, the spikeage. Plus, my elite is one of my favorites, which got buffed as well, Melandru's Resiliance.

Overall, a very exciting weekend for me as a ranger.

Steps_Descending

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Apr 2007

IN my pocket plane. Obviously!

Little Tom's Pocket Plane [THom]

Me/Mo

18 Jun 2007 at 00:44 - 12

IMO : all are worthless accept Eternal Aura, Selfless Spirit, Summon spirits and maybe, MAYBE, the elem ones.

Biggest disappointment : Ether Nightmare. It does two things : energy-denial and spike degen. I've never seen energy-denial used in PvE accept for damage (energy surge) or solo farming casters. Period.

When I heard PvE only skills, I thought we'd have somethings that couldn't be made in PvP or that hadn't been made before (or made in a limited way). What do we get? Buffed up version of existing skills and down-right must-haves (elem ones) that breaks the already limited bars.

EDIT : I'd add the paragon sunspear skills to the list of worthy skills.
EDIT II : Cry of pain at least has AoE degen... Still not good enough for me. At least if I can get to friend rank max, it would be fun. Untill they decide to make allegiance title tracks easier to have.
All I have to say is... Signet of illusion still allow me to use every spell with 16 stats!

brimruk

Academy Page

Join Date: Aug 2006

Legion of Lost Spears[LOLS]

18 Jun 2007 at 00:59 - 13

The Seed of Life one will change how the Deep is played. Throwing that on one of the tanks pretty much guarantees the monks don't even need to heal them most of the time. Bringing Intensity also speeds up and makes the whole process easier. These two, IMO, will make elite missions much easier.

Div

I like yumy food!

Join Date: Jan 2006

Where I can eat yumy food

Dead Alley [dR]

Mo/R

18 Jun 2007 at 05:51 - 14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aera Lure

The recharge time kills this skill. The skill has promise in its being similar to Air of Enchantment without having the conditional on enchantments only. Similar too to Divine Spirit, but only costs 5e less and Divine Spirit isnt even an elite.

Conclusion: very limited use if at all. How is this skill an elite? It's basically a more powerful version of divine spirit that lasts up to twice as long, is cheaper to cast, and doesn't have the minimum 1 energy req. At higher luxon/kurzick ranks, this skill is insanely overpowered as it allows you to heal your team for free for almost half a minute, the most insane form of energy management.

Seed of life is also extremely powerful. At max level, it lasts as long as healing seed, heals for about the same (except basically healing the party to full health if put on a tanker), but casts twice as fast (which helps when the target is being "spiked" in PvE) and has a much faster recharge which allows it to be kept up over 50% of the time.

Racthoh

Did I hear 7 heroes?

Join Date: May 2005

Scars Meadows [SMS], Guild Leader (Not Recruiting)

18 Jun 2007 at 06:32 - 15

There's Nothing To Fear! is just nuts, replaced Shield's Up! on my warrior's Hard Mode bar and Ballad of Restoration on my Paragon since it'll dish out more healing in the same amount of time. Tried it on my monk just for a the heck of it, but I doubt I could maintain the energy upkeep on Hard Mode. Capped Focussed Anger on my Paragon to try out Save Yourselves! as well, but the bar was beyond boring so I trashed the idea.

Dragon Slash works nicely with Save Yourselves! and with some kind of adrenaline boost it can see a very long uptime. Were it not for the fact that There's Nothing To Fear! is so OP, I'd consider Critical Agility on my warrior along with a speed boost stance for fleeing mobs in Hard Mode.

Tempted to make a dervish to try out those two skills for a perma-lyssa with quick attacks for insane damage.

Longasc

Forge Runner

Join Date: May 2005

18 Jun 2007 at 08:01 - 16

Quite right. Focused Anger (double adrenaline) makes "Save Yourselves" basically a 4 adrenaline 100 AL shout.

You can funnily also use it to gain energy for "There's nothing to fear" to keep it up permanently.

Okay. 100 AL more. Then 33% damage reduction.

Do Asuras use armor penetrating rounds or missiles??? Nothing short of a nuke can stop us now.

125mm BM15 APFSDS round

Yet another example that these skills are like 2-5 Elites on the skillbar.

Steps_Descending

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Apr 2007

IN my pocket plane. Obviously!

Little Tom's Pocket Plane [THom]

Me/Mo

18 Jun 2007 at 11:27 - 17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Longasc

Okay. 100 AL more. Then 33% damage reduction. Wasn't the damage reduced by half for every 40 AL bonus?

GeniusLoci

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Jun 2007

18 Jun 2007 at 12:25 - 18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Voltaire

I know that as an assassin during combat, I rarely go more than 5-10(tops) seconds without a critical hit, even in Hard Mode and especially with critical eye up. This equates to 100% coverage from critical agility. I'm not knowledable enough to judge how frequently the other melee classes crit in high-end areas, however.

With GfTE I can use this with zero downtime, I guess. Quote:

Originally Posted by Steps_Descending

Wasn't the damage reduced by half for every 40 AL bonus? Yup. But you can add another skill which further reduces damage

Gregslot

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Aug 2006

Me/

18 Jun 2007 at 15:08 - 19

Cry of Pain wont make mesmer more wanted in pve, because these skills can be used for any class, wich is good AND bad. Not to mention that you need to consider how narrow-minded most of the players are, they will only want a Nuker with Meteor Shower, Intensity, Elemental Lord, Searing Flames, Glyph of Elemental Power... so mesmer will STILL be unwanted into pve... o h yea, i forgot, its an INTERRUPTING SKILL, its nearly impossible to interrupt in hard mode.

Why is it good?
Because some of these skills promotes buffs for other classes, like the Critical Agility can be used for W,D,P,R and A, and itsnt that overpowered, because if you stop hitting, you will lose it. And intensity can be used for Ritualists based on Channeling and that underused-nearly-non-existing Dervishes with AoE skills.

Why is it bad?
Because some functions designed for a class specific can be replaced for any class, like the Paragon shout can be used by any Necro or Warrior... wich, is really really bad for one class and really really good for another.

IN MY MERE OPINION, they have to rework some of these skills, like reducing the energy and recharge of the Cry of pain; Adding bonus for each rank in leadership for "There is nothing to Fear"; AND ALSO they would need to add some more skills like this to achive balance and promote different and effective builds... since we are talking about pve, you can go far!

noblepaladin

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jun 2005

18 Jun 2007 at 20:30 - 20

"There's nothing to fear" probably has the most impact in game play. All PvE teams will probably be looking for someone to spam this skill. Paragons will definitely have a better chance to get into teams now. Non-paragon classes other than Necros seem to have some problems keeping up the shout (15e every 10 sec). Even with nerfed Soul Reaping, Necros still get enough energy to keep it up. I expect to see this shout incorporated in some necro SS, MM, or BiP builds. However, I expect many groups to look for Paragons with "There is nothing to fear", "They're on fire", and "Save Yourselves".

The monk skills are done right. They are powerful if used wisely (such as with bonders), but it doesn't make monks godly on a generic skill bar or team build. And it doesn't work with 55 bot farming. Monks are already perhaps the most desired class in PvE, virtually all efficient teams need them, so they don't need a major buff.

The melee classes got some nice buffs to make up for the +25 armor cap. However, I do wonder how useful they will be with Paragons doing major damage reduction. In most parts of hard mode, you can probably go tankless and try to nuke the crap out of everything.

Mesmer skills are disappointing. Sure the Mesmer can do some minor nuking now, but who would bring a Mesmer to nuke when you can bring an Intensity+Elemental Lord nuker now? Ether Nightmare is pathetic. If a team wants degen, they will bring a Searing Flames ele (especially now with Intensity and Elemental Lord). Ether Nightmare only does the degen part, and that is if you have full alliance title.

The same is true for the Ranger and Ritualists skills. While their new skills are pretty good themselves, they are severely outclassed by the new skills of the other classes. It is hard to find a reason to take a Ranger, Ritualists, or Mesmer rather than another SF ele, monk, or necro, etc.

dsnesnintendo

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jun 2006

chinese food

N/Mo

23 Jun 2007 at 16:33 - 21

Signet of Corruption is the worst skill of the lot by far it needs to be completely redone
make it something like increases hex duration by 17-25% (PvE only so dont complain) or gives you energy for each hex you cast or have recharging(keep in mind doesnt have to be a signet names are changable

Darkpower Alchemist

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Jan 2006

NYC

The Circle Of Nine[NINE]

E/N

01 Jul 2007 at 07:53 - 22

They nerfed some of the PvE skills to high heaven, but some for better than others. Critical Agilty, tied to Critical Strikes, now makes it useless for Assassin secondaries, but as mentioned earlier, sins don't go long without a critical strike occuring, so as long as the enemies live, the enchantment will stay up unless stripped.

The Paragon shout seems to be bugged, not giving back energy when used by a paragon, but linked to both SS title track and Leadership it can't be used well by anyone not a primary Paragon.

Eternal Aura is awesome, nuff said. Intensity got nerfed to the point that it can't pay to be on any of my bars now.

Never Rampage Alone!- beats all the IAS a ranger can use. Packhunters rejoice. It is awesome with that type of build. The Whirlwind attack is cool.

Haven't used the others yet, so I can't put my opinion to those. yet, I've heard good things about the SS monk skill.

Gaidax

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Jun 2007

01 Jul 2007 at 14:14 - 23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darkpower Alchemist

The Paragon shout seems to be bugged, not giving back energy when used by a paragon, but linked to both SS title track and Leadership it can't be used well by anyone not a primary Paragon. Hmm? It does give you energy back as just any other leadership fueled shout does.

Anet did an excellent change to this skill, linking it to Leadership and thus making it pointless to use by any, but a primary paragon.

I guess too much trash talking by some elementals and necros about how they could easily spam it pre-"nerf" and how paragons would still be useless because of that got on some dev nerves

I think they should somehow link save yourselves to primary warriors here, paragons exploit the point of rediculousness, being able to use it better than most warriors ever can hope to, while stacking it with already imba TNtF + AR + AF combo. Linking it to strength though will be quite a nerf to warriors themselves, as strength is quite a crappy primary skill, unlike the amasing leadership.

yesitsrob

Elite Guru

Join Date: Sep 2005

Manchester, England

SMS/Victrix

09 Jul 2007 at 11:11 - 24

There's Nothing To Fear is by far the best of the new skills, that said some of the others are ridiculous too. But 35% Party Reduction at r10 SS... wow. Way to make Hard Mode become Normal Mode by smashing one button.

Seed of Life is also on crack too. Yes it's similar to Healing Seed except for the fact it doesn't completely blow and isn't 100% outclassed by Shield of Absorbtion. Actually it works pretty amazingly alongside SoA - making all the damage numbers on your focused tank 0 while healing the minor damage the party may take _very_ quickly. Interesting bug with the skill - it stacks with other copies. Works amazingly if you run a bonder.

Whirlwind attack has a 1 second recharge so you don't instantly fill adrenaline for it just by using it - that would be completely sick.

Muk Utep

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Dec 2006

10 Jul 2007 at 23:08 - 25

Quote:

Sunspear Skill "Critical Agility"

IMO: A good skill, it is still up only 50% of the time, 15 seconds max with 30 recharge. The problem is that any melee class can use this! W/A, D/A, R/A… Yet another assassin skill that can be used even better by other professions? This is bad.

It's up pretty much always unless stripped. Like Critical Defenses, this skill refreshes every time you score a critical hit, and it's damn near impossible for an assassin not to crit at least once in 10+ seconds unless they're being kited the whole time.

Quote:

Sunspear Skill "Eternal Aura"

IMO: You love it? I hate it. It promotes the use of Avatars even more. I will never see the pretty arse of my Dervish again, but that of Melandru and Balthazar most of the time. The skill name is quite fitting. Nothing wrong with this skill… but as I stated above, it is a love-hate relation for me. Avatar skills are disabled for 120 seconds after use. Recharging them is pointless, you don't get to use them any more frequently.

Here's my take on some of the skills:

The caster spells all look much like stuff they already had to begin with. New packages with the same contents, a few exceptions being the elementalist skills that just yield more damage. Not particularly versatile, but if all you want is high numbers, go for it.

The warrior skills are alright. Whirlwind Attack could be used in an AoE axe build without crippling energy management, although I don't think it'll ever become a staple in any build. Save Yourselves! looks like fun, I haven't had time to try it yet but it might fit into certain builds. Not really a staple skill either.

Never Rampage Alone is nice but doesn't make up for the loss of RaO, in my opinion. That nerf put a brutal end to a very popular build and this won't revive it. Useful for beastmasters, but do they have a place in the serious world of cookie-cutters and flavor-of-the-months?

Triple Shot is fun and has some potential. Unfortunately, if physical damage is your goal, it won't likely beat Barrage. Has some obvious synergies with bonus-damage-on-hit applications, and it's just plain neat to shoot three arrows at once.

Critical Agility will find its permanent home in many mêlée assassin bars. It's just too good to pass up. There's nothing really new about Shadow Sanctuary, it's a slight twist on Feigned Neutrality and Dark Escape. Not useless, not impressive.

I never played a ritualist and have no idea how they work, so I won't try to talk about their skills.

There's Nothing To Fear! is pretty damn good, anyone can see that. Its potential is obvious and this skill alone can make paragons worth it. If it wasn't because paragons desperately needed some serious loving, I'd say that this skill went over the line. I'm just glad the costis energy and not adrenaline. Spear of Fury looks nice, nothing amazing but definitely not bad.

Eternal Aura looks great on paper, but I've never needed it on my dervish. There just aren't that many builds that will benefit greatly from a 30 second cooldown all-refresher. Aura of Holy Might is pretty nice if you really need to push that damage through the roof.

Razz Thom

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Apr 2007

Three Feet Below Sea [LevL]

D/Mo

11 Jul 2007 at 21:50 - 26

i was running a avatar of balth/eternal aura build from the day i heard about the ss skills. it seemed great at first but it quickly looses something in the long term. i even embarrassed myself a little bit defending my build recently. however since that time i have removed it from my skill bar along with EA. they work very well together for farming undead. no question. but for most areas it is better to run more attack skills and deal faster damage. the lux/kurz skill looks interesting but i don't have enough faction to get it yet to test it out

but eternal aura isn't overpowered in use as much as it looks on paper, because in PvE it is very constricting to lose 2 slots for very conditional uses when there are so many good attack skills available to the Derv which are useful everywhere. and most have less than 10 sec recharge.

Turbobusa

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jan 2006

By the Luxon Scavenger

The Mentalists [THPK]

13 Jul 2007 at 11:59 - 27

just a thought, why isnt sunspear rebirth signet listed in sunspear title track?

dargon

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: May 2005

The Seraphim Knights [TSK]

13 Jul 2007 at 17:43 - 28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muk Utep

Avatar skills are disabled for 120 seconds after use. Recharging them is pointless, you don't get to use them any more frequently. Uhm, you might want to check out the skill before you say it doesn't do something, because it does recharge avatars, allowing them to be up 100% of the time.

Snow Bunny

Alcoholic From Yale

Join Date: Jul 2007

Strong Foreign Policy [sFp]

13 Jul 2007 at 20:27 - 29

Ether Nightmare is fun to use. Maybe not the most dramatic skill, but it's pretty fun. Helps that I'm high kurzick rank though.

legacyofkain85

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Sep 2006

Lady Ainowa

17 Jul 2007 at 17:37 - 30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muk Utep

Avatar skills are disabled for 120 seconds after use. Recharging them is pointless, you don't get to use them any more frequently.

Please try the skill before posting about it,it does in fact recharge avatar skills

makosi

Grotto Attendant

Join Date: Mar 2006

"Pre-nerf" is incorrect. It's pre-buff.

Requirement Begins With R [notQ]

Me/

17 Jul 2007 at 22:29 - 31

I'm not so fond of Intensity anymore. It's a nuisance on a SF bar because the duration is poor an dthe recharge is lengthy. I'd prefer if they halved the damage percentage and doubled the duration.

Saying that, it's great for Sliver Armor farming which is always in short bursts of 10-20 seconds so it's not quite as annoying.

Seed of Life is awesome.