Seperate PvE Skill Balance From PvP in GW2?

In my opinion the reason why today's Guild War's is not as balanced as it used to be has been the cause of 1 new chapters/professions and poor planning.
As we can see from the recent balances and info on GWEN it seems that Anet is trying to slowly separate PvP from PvE, from my point of view

For instance, one of the most obvious is the introduction of PvE only skills

Now, the poor planning on Anet's part is the fact that I don't think they really knew how much different skills would be used in pve and pvp or even how big pve would become.

I like to do my fair share of PvE and Hardcore PvP and Ive never been angered really towards any nerf directed towards PvE. Although I haven't many have and this leads me to my proposal for Guild Wars 2 and I want to hear your thoughts.

So my question to you guy's is would you like to see the same system we have currently for skill balances now or... the following suggestion.

No gameplay really changes from what is planned for GW2 except theres 2 totally different skill balances and PvE and PvP skill dmgs,casting times, ect are not the same for both balance purposes.

For instance if it was implemented today in GW 1, Searing flames may do more dmg in PvE with longer burning duration, while it may be reduced while playing pvp.

The two would be seperated as follows PVEOPENWORLD/world pvp VS HardcorepvpGVG/HA/orwhatever is in GW2

So what do you guy's think on this issue separate or same system right now. Lets try to point out the cons/pro's of each to see what really is best.

POLL:

1) Separate Entity's/ separate balances
2) Same system today
3) Something different ill explain in my post

Honestly I would have to go with number 2. If people were more willing to experiment with their skills, I don't think there would be a need for so much nerfing. I'm not saying that there isn't a need for nerfing at all, but seriously...everytime somebody get's owned and says "OMG! WTF! OVER POWERED! NERF NOW OR I QUIT", well that's just pathetic. Change your skills around people. There is no 100% guaranteed win for any build. Get used to it.

i would most definately have to say 1. i dont pvp much and i love pve but i see a contiunious strain on pvp vs. pve skill wise (an even weapon wise ex: the new skins u can now unlok with bathazar points) so i suggest leave pvp and pve all to themselves plz i dont like seeing all the flames form each group constantly when u guys change one skill overpowered or w/e in pvp it frustrates us pve users and vice versa applies also ...

so plz segregate the two

ty
Syn

won't matter. See pvE skill balances...Intensity anyone?

i like my idea

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10170019

I think your idea is pretty interesting, but might get confusing for devs and players, but either way I like it a lot.

The PC Gamer article said that there would be World PvP, which would be the ultimate conglomeration of PvE and PvP.

Those who have played games such as WoW will agree that World PvP isn't fair. The whining about World PvP in GW2, a game where the majoirty of players are PvErs, will be epic.

As such, since ganking appeals to the same demographic as Guild Wars currently does (i.e. teenagers), they'll have incentive to add it.

I don't think that's Anet vision or goal.

Instead I believe they want to create a stronger relationship between PvE and PvP. They want to achieve this by creating more casual versions of PvP (world PvP) that would allow PvErs to go into PvP easier without steep learning curve.

I hope this will create less PvErs and PvPer but rather more PvPvErs who enjoy both types of gameplay and roll their eyes on this whole PvP vs PvE thing.

Oh man, the issues with World PvP:

• Ugly races get boned.
• Griefing and corpse-camping
• Turtling and mobbing
• Gear and weapon differences, particularly between different levels
• Kill-stealing

I really pray that ANet knows what they're doing. I've seen all the crap in WoW. It's really screwed up how low people can go morally. One of my biggest issues with WoW is how pvp required you to farm high-level dungeons for hours on end for gear. If you didn't, you got rolled.

When I came to Guild Wars... I was like, "WOW! This pvp is actually fair! I just need to unlock a few skills." The gear had max limits, there were limited skillbars (couldn't pull every goddamn trick in the book), and there was a semblance of tactics. It was more about skill, and less about the gear. However, GW2 sounds like it may screw up some of the best things I like about GW.

Skills should be balanced for PvP

PvE should get a smaller set of PvE only skills which should be 3x more powerful than other skills.


Anyway, i hope no PvEr seriously wants skills to be balanced for PvE. If Spiteful spirit was nerfed to 25 energy and 30seconds recharge, how many threads would we see complaining about it? And yet, that's what would happen if skills were balanced for PvE.

2) Most definately. I *like* skill balances, even if they screw up from time to time. Besides, there'd still be skill balancing for PvE... look at Intensity I doubt very much the PvEers would get an 'I win!' skill, even though they seem to want it

2) Same system today and no PvE-only skills in GW2.

It's not gonna make playing the game easier to have to know two different results for each skill!

The nerfs only really hinder a(n apparently militant) minority of hardcore-PvErs, that over-specialise farming builds, to the point of inflexibilty towards balance change.

Like many, I was rather "forced" into playing more PvE than PvP: for someone who dreams of epic conquest, intrigues at the courts and machiavelistic machinations, GW1's PvP allowed none of that. Hence, I fell in the track of just pimpin' my gear through endless running farm rounds, till it bored me so much that I'm hanging around on the forum to kill time.
To say it in a short catchphrase: "I mainly do PvE, but mainly am PvP at heart".

Amongst the PvErs, the majority is not "pure PvE", but rather PvE with PvP on the side. Hence PvE combined with PvP will likely be more appreciated than what PvE-purists would like to be truth.

Don't assume every adult is some PvE farm-drone of who all imagination has died off. I'm 24 old and would like the game to allow those teens to try to gank me.
It'll smell like teen spirit ...s.

Sounds delightfull ... so where are the issues?
And why shoot World PvP before it's up?

I don't mind the occasional gank.

But the epic levels it could reach were ridiculous. If you've ever played WoW, and tried to get a horde character through stranglethorn vale, you were boned from the outset. There were tons of rogues just lying in wait on the roads (and in the jungle too) just to kill a horde, regardless of level. Because the horde were ugly, fewer people played them, which made pvp incredibly tough when you were getting mobbed or when you tried to form a defense.

And the gear was just epically stupid at times. I have bad memories of being constantly spammed by moonfire from druids, when as a mage or whatever character I was on, should've been able to handle fine. Instead, when I had normall gear, and was about 3000 health, and did some pretty good damage, I was being owned because some nutjob farmed 40-man instances, who therefore had 8000 health, and did incredible damage.

So it may sound good to any true pvp-er that you can get advantages. True. It's always nice to have a foot up. But for the other guy, being punished because he doesn't like to do the same things you do is a completely unfair system.

#2

Creating PvP and PvE versions of each and every skill is a horrible misappropriation of resources, would create an even larger wall between PvE and PvP players (crossover would be nigh impossible if you had to totally relearn the game to go from one to the other) and wouldn't accomplish what you want it to anyway.

Wow, im actually quite surprised at the responses were getting. I was really expecting almost everyone to say they wanted to separate pvp and pve. judging from the amount of whines we get on forums about things like soul reaping,skills, ect.

I do see most point's though that it really makes it harder for a person to go to pvp from pve.

Even skill balancer izzy, has stated that he believes theres too many skills and professions now and even he would get rid of some if he could. Maybe, Anet will realize this time they should not introduce more skills and professions that imbalance the core game play like they did this time

wow ganking...yup. i'm of both minds on it...(and btw, try to get alliance characters through stv unscathed...we don't even have a flight path with elite guards there)

i didn't mind it so much leveling my pally since (pre-burning crusade) horde had the same unreasoned fear of pallies (for...holy-spec'd...good reason) that alliance had toward shaman (heal, drop a totem and FROSTSHOCK!).

i'm going with #2 for now. hard to really know what to think without more of the game being developed and known to the public. i think a lot of the ganking-style of world pvp in wow would turn off a lot of people in gw... certainly the "epic'd-out 60 warrior vs. the green-wearing 21 mage" level of world pvp. even playing fields would be more acceptable however...is that world pvp or "big arena" pvp?

What I would personally enjoy would be gladiator's arenas at different points in the PvE game, where there could be free-for-all, duels, RA-style, TA-Style, etc. My biggest issue with world pvp is precisely as you say -- a level 21 being ganked by a level 60... that's a major turnoff in pvp context.

Leave it as it is.

Good timing, I was thinking about this problem and was going to start a thread, but I'll just borrow this one So, #3 it is.

My thought is that they should take the basic concept that they have now, ie. a general pool of skills, with some "special" ones (PVE-only ones now). But to flip it, with a subset of the pool being marked for pvp, say 10-12 skills per attribute line. 1/4 to 1/2 of the skills would be rotated every couple months, to keep it fresh (w/ more common balances), perhaps w/ community input.

This would greatly reduce the amount of work needed to maintain balance, and with rotations could keep it from becoming too cliche. I'm going off the principle of FPS multi-player games, with the limited weapons being what allows the tight game-play/balance. I'm sure some wouldn't like the restrictions from the fewer skills, but honestly, how many of these skills see any real play today in our "Build Wars"?

Edit: To clarify a bit, the skills would be the same in pvp and pve, but only the pvp ones would be balanced w/ it in mind, and balanced more frequently; all would be available in pve, but not all in pvp. (and some re-wording for sense-making)

I don't have much problem with how it currently works; Skills are primarily balanced with pvp in mind, with some extra pve-only skills to patch over where pve is hurting because of it.

I think making separate pvp and pve skillsets would be far too confusing and hard to get your head around. You would effectively get "used to" how a skill works in pve, then hurt yourself by using it the same way in pvp, which I think would get extremely frustrating.

I never played WoW; like many others, I have no clue of what concept one is referring to, when relating to WoW!

I'm pretty sure Arenanet isn't going to copy and paste WoW's World PvP into GW2; I'm pretty sure it'll be Arenanet's concept of World PvP, not WoW's concept.

So please refrain from referring to WoW as if is the oracle of Arenanet's future GW2, simply because it's not fair to the non-WoW GW community members and GW2.

GW2 will still have instances, where one can never be ganked.
With both persistency and instancing, GW2 could offer each type of player the gameplay environment he prefers.

According to the what's been uncovered on the concept, World PvP will have it's own "world", separated from the PvE-only world.
So, where's the unfair punishment for PvE-purists, by having World PvP?

That's exactly what I meant; separating the two will hurt the majority of GW players that likes to indulge in both types of gameplay.

Option 2 since with the world pvp will add another aspect to the game. It's either going to work or fail miserably, either way it's going to be interesting to see what happens haha.