Shards of no m-orr

Winterclaw

Winterclaw

Wark!!!

Join Date: May 2005

Florida

W/

Insert random rant about this dungeon.



This one needs to be changed a little IMO. It's nuts. And it at least needs two items to drop from the last chest.

blue.rellik

blue.rellik

Forge Runner

Join Date: Feb 2007

Melbourne, Australia

None

W/

[skill]Restore Condition[/skill]
[skill]Judge's Insight[/skill]

Winterclaw

Winterclaw

Wark!!!

Join Date: May 2005

Florida

W/

One of my hero monks had restore condition. Conditions were still a problem. A ranger also had JI. Still it was a pain in the butt.

Vilaptca

Vilaptca

Pre-Searing Vanquisher

Join Date: Jun 2005

Fifteen Over Fifty [Rare]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterclaw
Insert random rant about this dungeon.



This one needs to be changed a little IMO. It's nuts. And it at least needs two items to drop from the last chest. Hi, I'm a discussion forum. To open up a thread with this...its just not right. What kind of discussion is going to come of a four sentence post?

What needs changing?

What is nuts?

Why does it need two items from the last chest?

If you can't explain your reasoning, or give anybody anything worthwhile to discuss, then we can just close this thread now, as its not going to achieve anything.

Winterclaw

Winterclaw

Wark!!!

Join Date: May 2005

Florida

W/

1a. The easing back on the conditions a little like blind would help. For example when I'm not getting blinding surged, I would wind up in an eruption. Ran out of that eruption and got hit by another. Lowering the length on blind on that second one would be nice. Either or would be okay, but not both.

1b. Having to rekill a boss is a trick that got old when fighting the lich in proph. Killing the first one and then fighting the soul is fine. But the sould disappearing, the first one coming back, and all the mobs respawning is a bit much.

2. A place to respawn if the boss wipes your party a little closer to the boss would be nice. It's not a lot but it'd help.

3. A first time run through with 4 PCs and 4 henches took over two hours. That's far too long for a dungeon. One hour maybe an hour and a half, for people who are going through it the first time should be a rule of thumb.

4a. It's a masters level dungeon yet the quest reward is little better than the Sep, which can be completed far faster. IMO if they put the masters tag on it, any dungeon should have 2 drops from the final chest.

5. Difficult doesn't always need to equate to time consuming, just in case you think 3 and 4 can't both be done.

Omega X

Omega X

Ninja Unveiler

Join Date: Jun 2005

Louisiana, USA

Boston Guild[BG]

W/Me

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vilaptca
Hi, I'm a discussion forum. To open up a thread with this...its just not right. What kind of discussion is going to come of a four sentence post?

What needs changing?

What is nuts?

Why does it need two items from the last chest?

If you can't explain your reasoning, or give anybody anything worthwhile to discuss, then we can just close this thread now, as its not going to achieve anything. Being a bit harsh eh?

Anyone who's even grazed that area knows what he's talking about. The Shards Of Orr. That area is thick with very formidable undead and for the trouble of going through that, the reward should have been a bit more worthwhile.

But after all, this is Guild Wars.

mazey vorstagg

mazey vorstagg

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Aug 2006

Nodnol

Meeting of Lost Minds

E/Mo

It took me 6 hours but I don't think it was too hard. You can pull the boss away from his spawns, so when he dies they spawn back in the room and he's on the bridge.
One of the most interesting bosses so far.

Although the damage is crazy!

Klas

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Aug 2007

Mo/

Personally, I really enjoyed this Dungeon. More so than a lot of the others. The end boss was a hoot.

I don't think it's particularly difficult. Just because you can't do it with a full team of heroes+hench doesn't mean it needs to be made any easier.

draxynnic

draxynnic

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Nov 2005

[CRFH]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Omega X
Anyone who's even grazed that area knows what he's talking about. Which is anyone who's done the Finding Gadd primary quest, since you need to go through the first level of Shards to get to his encampment.

Kristoff

Pre-Searing Cadet

Join Date: Sep 2007

E/

You might say it's not a "sophisticated" build, but good old SF-ele works wonders in Shards of Orr, trust me...

tmakinen

tmakinen

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Nov 2005

www.mybearfriend.net

Servants of Fortuna [SoF]

E/

Oh yeah, I do remember that. It was the first day of GW:EN and wiki didn't have any info on what to expect. Olias kept picking his nose and whining that he didn't have anything to do, and the entire H/H party though that the fetid smell of dungeons is best removed by standing around one of those air conditioning posts that emit a greenish jet of gas. Might have had a couple of casualties at some point, didn't find it that difficult. Never mind the blind, didn't have any physicals with me, besides Zho who's half-blind to begin with so one could say that she's got some practice ...

blue.rellik

blue.rellik

Forge Runner

Join Date: Feb 2007

Melbourne, Australia

None

W/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterclaw
One of my hero monks had restore condition. Conditions were still a problem. A ranger also had JI. Still it was a pain in the butt. Master Quest

fenix

fenix

Major-General Awesome

Join Date: Aug 2005

Aussie Trolling Crew HQ - Event Organiser and IRC Tiger

Ex Talionis [Law], Trinity of the Ascended [ToA] ????????????????&#

W/

All dungeons are easy, all dungeons have bad rewards. It's been like that since release. You can easily beat Shards of Orr with pulling and smart hero choice. Hell, I was owning it with just 2 Paragons and a Necro, and the blinds werent stopping me killing in the least...

I prefer paragons since they are better than every other hero combo, so you should all use them too. Try: Song of Purification, Song of Restoration, RC Monk, Earth Hench, Monk Hench, Monk Hench, Interrupt Hench. You'll win. Easily.

bungusmaximus

bungusmaximus

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jul 2006

Guild Of Handicrafted Products [MaSS]

W/Mo

[skill]recovery[/skill] helped me a great deal.

Cebe

Cebe

The 5th Celestial Boss

Join Date: Jul 2006

Inverness, Scotland

The Cult of Scaro [WHO]

E/

I found this very easy since the Undead have a wonderful habit of clumping up in nice tight groups, and as we all know: Ele + Tightly Packed Groups = gg.

I set me and Sousuke up as Earth Eles, and Ogden as a Smiter. Me and Sousuke used Dragon's Stomp at the same time, and I had Ogden use Signet of Judgment...that got most entire groups of Undead down to about one third health and the rest could just be picked off.

Giving them a massive spike of damage before we aggroed them seemed like a much easier way to complete it since you can stand *just* out of aggro range and cast, and meant they didn't mave much time to spread all their lovely conditions before they died.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Omega X
Being a bit harsh eh?

Anyone who's even grazed that area knows what he's talking about. The Shards Of Orr. That area is thick with very formidable undead and for the trouble of going through that, the reward should have been a bit more worthwhile. Harsh? Most of what the OP is talking abut has been done to death before. This is a well-ranted-about dungeon and will no doubt continue to be.

Darkhorse

Academy Page

Join Date: Feb 2006

Me/A

Ray of Judgement was horribly effective.

Dooks

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Aug 2005

Oh excel it wasn't that bad

Dr Strangelove

Dr Strangelove

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Dec 2005

Wasting away again in Margaritaville

[HOTR]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterclaw
1a. The easing back on the conditions a little like blind would help. For example when I'm not getting blinding surged, I would wind up in an eruption. Ran out of that eruption and got hit by another. Lowering the length on blind on that second one would be nice. Either or would be okay, but not both.
Bring sight beyond sight, or don't bother with direct melee at all (bear form gogo). Draw conditions or spotless soul works too.

Quote: Originally Posted by Winterclaw 1b. Having to rekill a boss is a trick that got old when fighting the lich in proph. Killing the first one and then fighting the soul is fine. But the sould disappearing, the first one coming back, and all the mobs respawning is a bit much. I thought it was fun. Ran up, killed the boss without breaking a sweat, then had a nice "oh crap" moment when he respawned and I tried to figure out what was going on. Good stuff.

Quote: Originally Posted by Winterclaw
3. A first time run through with 4 PCs and 4 henches took over two hours. That's far too long for a dungeon. One hour maybe an hour and a half, for people who are going through it the first time should be a rule of thumb. It is a master level dungeon, and it is rather long. That being said, I finished in around an hour and a half my first run through without knowing what I was up against. I also tend to spend extended periods of time standing around in dungeons typing inane comments in alliance chat, so maybe an hour total if you cut that out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterclaw
4a. It's a masters level dungeon yet the quest reward is little better than the Sep, which can be completed far faster. IMO if they put the masters tag on it, any dungeon should have 2 drops from the final chest. Agreed on this one, dungeon drops in general need looking at.

As for how to beat it, a lot of people have trouble with it because it's pretty much set up to counter the fotm warriors+eles+mm+monks group.

-Bring a spiky AoE, since almost all the mobs start out in neat little bunches, and the warriors like to stay bunched. Splinter barrage is nice, 3 copies of signet of judgement makes the whole dungeon stupid.

-Bring effective prot. Those eles will get some damage through no matter how much you try and kill them before they get you.

-If you have melee, deal with blind. Either stick draw on a midliner, bring recovery, or don't use melee. I ran recovery and 2 melee heroes with blind reduction runes. I didn't even notice the blind spam.

-Lern2kite. The eles and warriors can only deal the real damage when they're up in your face. Don't want to die, run away like a sissy.

Sheriff

Sheriff

Jungle Guide

Join Date: May 2006

Heroic Order of Tyria

R/W

I have a mesmer survivor who's going in that dungeon soon (en-route to Gadd's encampment). Any suggestions on a Mesmer build (secondary Ele though, sorry haven't ascended yet )?

Dr Strangelove

Dr Strangelove

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Dec 2005

Wasting away again in Margaritaville

[HOTR]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheriff
I have a mesmer survivor who's going in that dungeon soon (en-route to Gadd's encampment). Any suggestions on a Mesmer build (secondary Ele though, sorry haven't ascended yet )? FC smiting signets gogo

Carinae

Carinae

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jun 2005

Inside

Fifteen Over Fifty [Rare]

Come on people, stop beating your head against the wall on Orr. Target their weakness. Smite.

glountz

glountz

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Nov 2005

W/Mo

And Use also an earth ele with ward of stability/protection and unsteady ground + eruption. Time to blind them too.
Ward of stability is pretty mandatory to avoid instant party wipe due to some lucky timed KD chains from the Magicians. When it happens, being smite or not, you'll die your ass on the ground.
EDIT: restore conditions is a nice heal, but after that, doesn't solve at all your blind issue.

Etta

Etta

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jun 2006

Mancland, British Empire

I'm sure someone made a thread like this awhile back. What was his name? Soit..Loti...Coto or something, anyway that thread ended in pain and suffering.

So Op, are you asking for help or just ranting?

Bassu

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jan 2007

Cracow, Poland.

D/

Acolyte of Melandru + Aura of Holy Might = lawl.

Tera

Tera

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: May 2006

England

Society of Souls [Argh]

E/

i think bassu means avatar of melandru... and smite works wonders...r/d barragers, (theres a derv skill under mysticism that lasts 30 seconds and makes attacks deal holy damage) or SiJ smite monks

Charr

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jun 2007

W/A

A good tank, [skill]Blessed Aura[/skill] and somewhat neglected elite [skill]Shield of Judgment[/skill] = GG

SotiCoto

SotiCoto

Banned

Join Date: Jan 2007

Drazach Thicket

Temple of Zhen Xianren [Sifu]

Don't even get me started on that place.

My advice: find a decent PuG with a good tank... cluster the enemies together and nuke the unliving crap outta them.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Etta
I'm sure someone made a thread like this awhile back. What was his name? Soit..Loti...Coto or something, anyway that thread ended in pain and suffering. Har-de-fvcking-har.
You never forgot my name for an instant.

Just because I've been banned for the last week because so many people QQed about that thread is no excuse for pretending you don't know my name.

Phoenix Tears

Phoenix Tears

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Feb 2007

hi,

i had really long time the same problem, I personally find this dungeon impossible to make with H/H, even when your build goes very strong on Smiting and yourself are an Splitter Barrage ranger (what i am), I didn't reached never stage 2 without my team getting several times full party wiped before -.-

But then I found an awesome team of players and we made the dungeon nearly without any problem, only with the boss we had some trouble, cause of his minnions which kept respawning with him ever and ever again, but then we managed it after some deaths, but could reduce our mali too ever with the respawnings, whihc counted to the dwarfen raider buff counter, thus reducing our mali every 25 kills...
We also managed to lure the soul away sometimes from the minions to gight the soul alone, letting it stand between the 2 flame throwers, while our tank was at him ...

really ,with a very good team and with a Splitter Barrage ranger like me, most of the dungeon was very easy, even those suddenly big invasions of undeads, when you enlight all the torches, bandits were no problem and proper lure ment and preparation before fighting it was really easy.

Before we fought any group, I casted ever 2 attacking ghosts at 2 sides away from each other, casted then splitter weapon on the tank (balthazar dervish) , then the spell on me, waited then until the tank lured the group and when he had then the aggro of the whole enemy group on them, than i spammed my splitter barrage, and it was somewhat of awesome, how quick the enemies died, when then the elementalists also spamed their aoe spells, with my splitter barrage i very often killed whole groups at same time.
Sometimes it happened that i killed 5 enemies at once just by spamming a double splitter barrage. through the splitter weapon on the derv, he could also make awesosome splash damage, cause of the sickle hitting multiple hits = multiple holy splitter chain react.

Team was this:

Me: Splitter Barrage Ranger with Bloodsong/Vampiristic, Sun Spear Signet, Wild Shot, Troll ...

1 Balthazar Dervish with full set of Skills with do aoe holy damage with Eternal Aura to keep perma balthazar avatar up (tank)

2 monks (heal/prot) (1 was hero, tahlkora XD) more hard heal then regenerations, with condition remove skills that heal also

1 SS Necro with blood ritual

2 Elementalists, one or i believe both with Savannah Heat and echo, so echo nukers at all, when 2nd was not savannah, then it was SF ...

and 1 Mesmer.

team had no holy weapon buff for me, when a monk would have cast on my a buff that lets me do holy damage, killing stuff there with splitter barrage spammigns is double easy, when you have a good tank that gets all aggro on hisself for some seconds, until the splitter barrage ranger can start spamming with holy buff.

for more easier part, i would prefer exchanging mesmer with 2nd splitter barrage ranger.

the whole team alone rocked alone with 1 splitter barrage like me, with a 2nd one its surely really easy to make this dungeon.


gl

SotiCoto

SotiCoto

Banned

Join Date: Jan 2007

Drazach Thicket

Temple of Zhen Xianren [Sifu]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phoenix Tears
Me: Splitter Barrage Ranger with Bloodsong/Vampiristic, Sun Spear Signet, Wild Shot, Troll ... Splinter Barrage without Edge of Extinction?
EoE Splinter Barrage = total cluster-rape.

zknifeh

zknifeh

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Feb 2006

Kamadan

Acolites of Anguish [aOa]

A/

me and my guildie and 6 hero/hench did that dungeon a few times... usually takes us about 1 hour
end boss = a breese
our only tank is me 99% of a time and i am an assassin and no shadow forming crap or anything... pure damage
broadhead epidemic = bye bye sod spammers
smite + minions is pretty good in there
imo the dungeon is fine... just the poison fart traps are a lil annoying since hench cant walk around then or walk away while its activated

Phoenix Tears

Phoenix Tears

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Feb 2007

yo, not with edge, just barrage + splitter weapon

but when the combination is with this skill more effective, than thx for information ^^, didn't know it, I'll test it ^^, so much skills, takes so long to test them to see, which skills are with which skills good combinations XD

however, it really worked with splitter weapon and barrage alone very well.
Made the dungeon with this team build on Wednessday and we really rocked.
After like 15 minutes after beginning , the whole team had direct +10% morale just by killing monsters and getting dwarven raider boni and I had my 10% till we reached the boss, nothing killed us fully until we got to the boss, only sometimes, single ones of our groups were killed once, but through dwarven raider the mali was again quick away and at 10% before we reached the boss XD

wednessday was really awesome for me with this team, we made this dungeon look like childsplay, and when i tried before this dungeon with H/H, it ended up ever only in big frustration, because the dumb henchs and heroes were ever nuked away so quick by bandits or the necromancers...

As said, only the boss then was a real challenge ^^, cause I at least expected, that the boss comes alone and has not respawning minions with him (was naturally my first time I made this dungeon on wednesday)

SotiCoto

SotiCoto

Banned

Join Date: Jan 2007

Drazach Thicket

Temple of Zhen Xianren [Sifu]

Quote:
Originally Posted by zknifeh
imo the dungeon is fine... just the poison fart traps are a lil annoying since hench cant walk around then or walk away while its activated The primary reason why I failed to herohench it.

Glad to see I wasn't totally losing my mind.

Antheus

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jan 2006

Quote:
Anyone who's even grazed that area knows what he's talking about. The Shards Of Orr. That area is thick with very formidable undead and for the trouble of going through that, the reward should have been a bit more worthwhile. I don't know what this is about. A group of 5 players and 3 heroes I was in had moderate fun there. And no uber gimmicky build with 7 healers or something like that. Just the regular balanced group.

Oh, right... It's hard with heroes. Yep, that's true. But that doesn't make the dungeon hard.

SotiCoto

SotiCoto

Banned

Join Date: Jan 2007

Drazach Thicket

Temple of Zhen Xianren [Sifu]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Antheus
Oh, right... It's hard with heroes. Yep, that's true. But that doesn't make the dungeon hard. If A-Net would care to be consistant about making the game herohenchable or not.... it would be appreciated.

As it stands though, some parts of the game are much better off done with herohench while others are much better with humans (even PuGs)... and there is little consistancy in that.

fenix

fenix

Major-General Awesome

Join Date: Aug 2005

Aussie Trolling Crew HQ - Event Organiser and IRC Tiger

Ex Talionis [Law], Trinity of the Ascended [ToA] ????????????????&#

W/

Quote:
Originally Posted by SotiCoto
If A-Net would care to be consistant about making the game herohenchable or not.... it would be appreciated.

As it stands though, some parts of the game are much better off done with herohench while others are much better with humans (even PuGs)... and there is little consistancy in that. ...I hero/henched it... So basically, once again, you are doing it wrong. The game IS hero/henchable, because I did the whole thing with H+H. So either I am an exception to the human race and am on a skill level so far above everyone else that I cannot lose, or you are all failing because you are doing it wrong. I vote option two. As much as I'd like it to be option one...

darktyco

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Nov 2006

I had fun in this one. 3 smite monk heroes (using signet of judgement as their elite), 2 healer henchies, herta, and zho. Myself as a necro also ran smiting. The whole thing was cake until I got to the boss.

I agree it would be better if the chest dropped 2 items, or 1 item and a few plat.

SotiCoto

SotiCoto

Banned

Join Date: Jan 2007

Drazach Thicket

Temple of Zhen Xianren [Sifu]

Quote:
Originally Posted by fenix
...I hero/henched it... So basically, once again, you are doing it wrong. The game IS hero/henchable, because I did the whole thing with H+H. So either I am an exception to the human race and am on a skill level so far above everyone else that I cannot lose, or you are all failing because you are doing it wrong. I vote option two. As much as I'd like it to be option one... Telling people they're doing it wrong <<< Telling people how to do it better.

And once again I note the issue was less with the skills and more with AI behaviour. Herohench fail at avoiding Poison-Jets... and certainly fail at battle-positioning for optimum effect. If you'd care to go into detail (and I mean DETAIL) regarding how you managed to avoid H/H rampaging repeatly through streams of constant poison + damage... then it would be appreciated, as I sure as hell couldn't figure it out in at least one area.

(And on the same note... this one feature also makes beating the boss a bit of a joke, as mr Fendi Nin will quite happily stand inbetween two flame-thrower traps and take it like a b!tch)...

Painbringer

Painbringer

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jun 2006

Minnesota

Black Widows of Death

W/Mo

Personally I think the way to the boss is difficult which is fine! It is the End Boss that needs looking at 5 minutes to run from a rez shine is ridiculous. I do not like the 40 seconds you have to damage it should be increased IMO or lower his armor a bit to compensate. Or the spirits that spawn should not have all there precasted spirits let them cast them like the rest of us. With the current set up DP of any sort will really screw you since he can do tremendous dmg with his FoC.

wilebill

wilebill

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Dec 2005

Mt Vernon, Ohio

Band of the Hawk

W/Mo

Flag party 1.5 aggro diameters away from stationary groups or a tad more, pull, get part of the group to come to your party, repeat until remainder is small enough to wipe easily. Mobile groups, have a long run planned. At least you can string them out and get the melee guys down quickly.

End Boss is not fun. Did this dungeon once, unlikely to go back. Get nothing out of Chests much anyway.

Horseman Of War

Horseman Of War

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jun 2006

The Cult of Doom

P/

I completely agree that Masters' dungeons should drop 2 (i thought they did til I completed this one with guildies the other day - havent done Cold Vengeance sinec the preview-weekend)

I used my command paragon, with general morgann as Anthem of Purification, Vekk is set as Master of Magic smiter...

wasnt too big an issue- 1 hour to get to the boss level; an hour and a half ON the boss level. gets annoying finishing the boss off- just dont attack the glaive-dropping ghosts- stick to the soul and the wont bother you. try pulling him into the flame trap.


edit- any other dungeon is fine- but I dont plan on returning to this one with my other chars... except maybe my monk or rit for possible farming (if dead items were worth the time that is)

and btw @phoenix tears= its called SPLINTER not SPITTER :P