Well thanks to the help I received from people on this board(Thanks alot) this is the build i made for my paragon. I seem to be running into both adrenaline and energy issues. I guess i am not using the skills in progression correctly. Any advice would be great.
Focused Anger
"Save Yourselves!"
"They're on Fire!"
"There's Nothing to Fear!"
Aggressive Refrain
"For Great Justice!"
Blazing Spear
Spear of Lightning
Attributes Leadership 12
Spear Mastery 14
Tactics 10
**also I tried to just copy and paste the build links in but that didnt work, anyone know how to do that? thanks
Energy/Adreniline issues?
miprat
Turbobusa
Try putting GftE in there replacing spear of lightning.
about adrenaline, I don't know, maybe you forgot to...attack?
about adrenaline, I don't know, maybe you forgot to...attack?
Siirius Black
Just copy the keys and in GW, use the template option
the template will dispay the build currently in use by your character, paste the new key replacing the old one, and you are ready to save it/ load it, etc.
the template will dispay the build currently in use by your character, paste the new key replacing the old one, and you are ready to save it/ load it, etc.
odly
Quote:
Originally Posted by miprat
Well thanks to the help I received from people on this board(Thanks alot) this is the build i made for my paragon. I seem to be running into both adrenaline and energy issues. I guess i am not using the skills in progression correctly. Any advice would be great.
Focused Anger
"Save Yourselves!"
"They're on Fire!"
"There's Nothing to Fear!"
Aggressive Refrain
"For Great Justice!"
Blazing Spear
Spear of Lightning
Attributes Leadership 12
Spear Mastery 14
Tactics 10
**also I tried to just copy and paste the build links in but that didnt work, anyone know how to do that? thanks Paragon's use adrenalin shouts to generate their energy. The only skill you have that does that is "Save Yourselves!". At 8 adrenaline it's not the best at the job. Without energy you won't be able to reactivate "For Great Justice!" and "Focused Anger" which serve you to generate more adrenalin.
All those are good skills, but a badly balanced build.
You have 3 skills that give great passive defense : "Save yourselves", "They're on fire" and "There's nothhing to fear". You probably won't need all three.
You'll need another adrenalin shout. Most people use either "go for the eyes" or "watch yourself!" or both. You can basiclly drop any of the other skills you want for them. Drop one of the three protection ones and keep the attack skills for more damage. Keep all three protection ones and drop an attack for max party defense buff.
ToF is only good if you have Searing Flames elementalists in your party. If you were counting on Blazing spear, that simply does not cause enough burning for ToF to be good.
Since you're build seems designed for Save Yourselves upkeep I'd drop They're on Fire and take watch yourselves (fill up the gap's when SY is down) or Go for the eyes. You'll have to take your points out of tactics and put them in command then. (remember to switch shield too.)
Focused Anger
"Save Yourselves!"
"They're on Fire!"
"There's Nothing to Fear!"
Aggressive Refrain
"For Great Justice!"
Blazing Spear
Spear of Lightning
Attributes Leadership 12
Spear Mastery 14
Tactics 10
**also I tried to just copy and paste the build links in but that didnt work, anyone know how to do that? thanks Paragon's use adrenalin shouts to generate their energy. The only skill you have that does that is "Save Yourselves!". At 8 adrenaline it's not the best at the job. Without energy you won't be able to reactivate "For Great Justice!" and "Focused Anger" which serve you to generate more adrenalin.
All those are good skills, but a badly balanced build.
You have 3 skills that give great passive defense : "Save yourselves", "They're on fire" and "There's nothhing to fear". You probably won't need all three.
You'll need another adrenalin shout. Most people use either "go for the eyes" or "watch yourself!" or both. You can basiclly drop any of the other skills you want for them. Drop one of the three protection ones and keep the attack skills for more damage. Keep all three protection ones and drop an attack for max party defense buff.
ToF is only good if you have Searing Flames elementalists in your party. If you were counting on Blazing spear, that simply does not cause enough burning for ToF to be good.
Since you're build seems designed for Save Yourselves upkeep I'd drop They're on Fire and take watch yourselves (fill up the gap's when SY is down) or Go for the eyes. You'll have to take your points out of tactics and put them in command then. (remember to switch shield too.)
Skye Marin
Take out "They're on Fire" and put in "Go For the Eyes!" Or "Watch yourself!". You have no way to produce mass burning (unless you are paired with a few SF eles) and TNtF + Save Yourself is pretty good anyways.
Also, Focused Anger is bugged, so watch out. It won't go over 100% more adrenaline in-game.
Also, Focused Anger is bugged, so watch out. It won't go over 100% more adrenaline in-game.
Racthoh
Why do you have 10 tactics?
I would change Blazing Spear for an energy spear attack. I'm going to assume you're hitting Blazing Spear as it fills meaning you're not using SY as often as possible meaning you will have energy issues. You'll also want everyone in your bubble so your energy return on SY is six.
Drop They're On Fire!; even if you have a way to produce burning you don't need it with roughly 90% reduction of damage. 12 leadership is enough to maintain Aggressive Refrain with just TNTF provided to know how to hit it on recharge (which is basically the best way to use it anyway).
Quote:
Originally Posted by odly
I would change Blazing Spear for an energy spear attack. I'm going to assume you're hitting Blazing Spear as it fills meaning you're not using SY as often as possible meaning you will have energy issues. You'll also want everyone in your bubble so your energy return on SY is six.
Drop They're On Fire!; even if you have a way to produce burning you don't need it with roughly 90% reduction of damage. 12 leadership is enough to maintain Aggressive Refrain with just TNTF provided to know how to hit it on recharge (which is basically the best way to use it anyway).
Quote:
Quote:
Since you're build seems designed for Save Yourselves upkeep I'd drop They're on Fire and take watch yourselves (fill up the gap's when SY is down) or Go for the eyes.
Bringing other adrenaline skills adds to the time that SY is down. +100 AL > me getting some energy back.
miprat
I only had 10 in tactics because I had a tactics shield and had exta points.
I must say I really like playing this paragon even though of my 9 characters it seems the most complicated one I have.
Ok so let me get this straight. AF should always be my first cast to start things off then TNTF is next? At what point in my sequence should I be casting Focused Anger? I have been casting it 3rd or am I supposed to be casting attacks before i cast that?
I must say I really like playing this paragon even though of my 9 characters it seems the most complicated one I have.
Ok so let me get this straight. AF should always be my first cast to start things off then TNTF is next? At what point in my sequence should I be casting Focused Anger? I have been casting it 3rd or am I supposed to be casting attacks before i cast that?
kullwarrior
I just have this and I get too much energy mostly:
Pure support ftw!
"Fall Back!"
"Never Surrender!"
"They're on Fire!"
"Save Yourselves!"
Focused Anger
"For Great Justice!"
Aggressive Refrain
"There's Nothing to fear!"
Leadership 12+3+1
Command 12+1
Spear 3
Pure support ftw!
"Fall Back!"
"Never Surrender!"
"They're on Fire!"
"Save Yourselves!"
Focused Anger
"For Great Justice!"
Aggressive Refrain
"There's Nothing to fear!"
Leadership 12+3+1
Command 12+1
Spear 3
Deathless Anthem
Quote:
Originally Posted by kullwarrior
I just have this and I get too much energy mostly:
Pure support ftw!
"Fall Back!"
"Never Surrender!"
"They're on Fire!"
"Save Yourselves!"
Focused Anger
"For Great Justice!"
Aggressive Refrain
"There's Nothing to fear!"
Leadership 12+3+1
Command 12+1
Spear 3
That's the best build for pure support for a para imho
Pure support ftw!
"Fall Back!"
"Never Surrender!"
"They're on Fire!"
"Save Yourselves!"
Focused Anger
"For Great Justice!"
Aggressive Refrain
"There's Nothing to fear!"
Leadership 12+3+1
Command 12+1
Spear 3
That's the best build for pure support for a para imho
Arkantos
With FA and SY, you should never run into energy problems unless you're not hitting things.
Racthoh
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deathless Anthem
That's the best build for pure support for a para imho
Pretty sure 'best' and 'pure support' cannot go in the same sentence.
Ensign
I'm sure there's a best 'pure support' bar, but it's kinda like being the best daggergon - sure, you've optimized something, but does it matter at all?
Terraban
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deathless Anthem
That's the best build for pure support for a para imho
Congratulations, you just won in the Special Olympics!
blue.rellik
Quote:
Originally Posted by miprat
I only had 10 in tactics because I had a tactics shield and had exta points.
I must say I really like playing this paragon even though of my 9 characters it seems the most complicated one I have.
Ok so let me get this straight. AF should always be my first cast to start things off then TNTF is next? At what point in my sequence should I be casting Focused Anger? I have been casting it 3rd or am I supposed to be casting attacks before i cast that? Why do you have a tactics shield?
Are you too good for a Command one?
I must say I really like playing this paragon even though of my 9 characters it seems the most complicated one I have.
Ok so let me get this straight. AF should always be my first cast to start things off then TNTF is next? At what point in my sequence should I be casting Focused Anger? I have been casting it 3rd or am I supposed to be casting attacks before i cast that? Why do you have a tactics shield?
Are you too good for a Command one?
ShadowbaneX
my para build is something like this
[skill]Spear of Lightning[/skill][skill]Barbed Spear[/skill][skill]Cruel Spear[/skill][skill]Anthem of Flame[/skill][skill]"There's Nothing to Fear!"[/skill][skill]"Watch Yourself!"[/skill][skill]Aggressive Refrain[/skill][skill]Sunspear Rebirth Signet[/skill]
Leadership 11+1
Spear Mastery 10+1+1
Tactics 10
I've found that for proper energy maintenance on a paragon you need either "Watch Yourself!" or "Go for the Eyes!" (there's a reason why these skills were recently given a recharge). With 12 Leadership (and enough people nearby) you get 6 energy back every time you use it, which is, rather often. You only need energy for Anthem of Flame, "TNtF!" and Spear of Lightning as Aggressive Refain is fairly easy to keep up (although damn it's cracked armour). Given that you gain energy on Anthem of Flame, that's pretty much a non-isses. "TNtF!" is only used every 20 seconds or so, in combat, so that's no problem. Which just leaves you tossing away 5 energy every once in a while for Spear of Lightning.
[skill]Spear of Lightning[/skill][skill]Barbed Spear[/skill][skill]Cruel Spear[/skill][skill]Anthem of Flame[/skill][skill]"There's Nothing to Fear!"[/skill][skill]"Watch Yourself!"[/skill][skill]Aggressive Refrain[/skill][skill]Sunspear Rebirth Signet[/skill]
Leadership 11+1
Spear Mastery 10+1+1
Tactics 10
I've found that for proper energy maintenance on a paragon you need either "Watch Yourself!" or "Go for the Eyes!" (there's a reason why these skills were recently given a recharge). With 12 Leadership (and enough people nearby) you get 6 energy back every time you use it, which is, rather often. You only need energy for Anthem of Flame, "TNtF!" and Spear of Lightning as Aggressive Refain is fairly easy to keep up (although damn it's cracked armour). Given that you gain energy on Anthem of Flame, that's pretty much a non-isses. "TNtF!" is only used every 20 seconds or so, in combat, so that's no problem. Which just leaves you tossing away 5 energy every once in a while for Spear of Lightning.
odly
Quote:
Originally Posted by Racthoh
8 adrenalin for SY.
1 attack --> 1 adrenalin
1 attack under FA --> 2 adrenalin.
1 attack under FA and FGJ --> 4 adrenalin.
2 attacks should be enough to fill SY. But it certainly feels longer to me.
Doesn't FGJ double the adrenalin from FA ?
[note to self]I must go test this on Isle of the nameless when I get home this evening.[/note]
But since both have downtime is it better to alternate them instead of overlapping them ?
Has anyone tried the asuran benefits skill on this to get faster skill recharge on FGJ and FA ?
Quote:
Bringing other adrenaline skills adds to the time that SY is down. +100 AL > me getting some energy back.
Yes I stand corrected.
If I don't use SY all the time, it's exactly because of this. I feel it limits me too much in what other skills I can bring. Any adrenalin skill will add to SY downtime. Any skills with activation time (songs/anthems...) also add to SY downtime because you're not attacking. So basically I'm reduced to a couple (low) energy (instant activation) shouts and energy attacks. But SY doesn't give enough energy to hit multiple energy attacks on recharge. It pays for just one. Well maybe 2 if you use spear of fury under FA and FGJ the adrenalin gain wil pay back for the energy cost.
Hmm, if I'm totally honnest with myself, I must admit that I don't use SY because I have just a lowly rank 1 allegiance and I hate the fact that my skill is sub-optimal because I refuse to grind for it. But the above statement is part of the reason too. :-)
What does your basic SY skill bar look like these days Racthoh ?
If I don't use SY all the time, it's exactly because of this. I feel it limits me too much in what other skills I can bring. Any adrenalin skill will add to SY downtime. Any skills with activation time (songs/anthems...) also add to SY downtime because you're not attacking. So basically I'm reduced to a couple (low) energy (instant activation) shouts and energy attacks. But SY doesn't give enough energy to hit multiple energy attacks on recharge. It pays for just one. Well maybe 2 if you use spear of fury under FA and FGJ the adrenalin gain wil pay back for the energy cost.
Hmm, if I'm totally honnest with myself, I must admit that I don't use SY because I have just a lowly rank 1 allegiance and I hate the fact that my skill is sub-optimal because I refuse to grind for it. But the above statement is part of the reason too. :-)
What does your basic SY skill bar look like these days Racthoh ?
Arkantos
Adrenaline cap is 100%, FA and FGJ don't stack. FGJ is used when FA is down.
odly
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arkantos
Adrenaline cap is 100%, FA and FGJ don't stack. FGJ is used when FA is down.
Does that mean using a furious spear mod with one these skills active is absolutelly useless ?
Arkantos
Quote:
Originally Posted by odly
Does that mean using a furious spear mod with one these skills active is absolutelly useless ?
FA/FGJ give xxx% more adrenaline, while the effect of furious is double adrenaline. I think they do, but I may be wrong.
Racthoh
Quote:
Originally Posted by odly
Quote: Originally Posted by odly I feel it limits me too much in what other skills I can bring. Somewhat. The first five skills are basically set in stone; Aggressive Refrain, "Save Yourselves!", Focused Anger, "There's Nothing To Fear!", For "Great Justice!". You have three slots left. Most players will take Signet of Return so we're down to two. Fill them with attack skills. At this point you're limited in general as paragons do not have many decent attack skills to choose from. Vicious Attack and Spear of Lightning are going to be your best route.
Quote:
Well maybe 2 if you use spear of fury under FA and FGJ the adrenalin gain wil pay back for the energy cost.
This is another option of course. Spear of Fury + one other energy attack skill should allow you to just mash on recharge. It really isn't needed though unless there is a target that has to die you should be able to just pace your usage.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by odly
What does your basic SY skill bar look like these days Racthoh ?
Basically what I wrote above:
Aggressive Refrain Save Yourselves! Focused Anger {E} There's Nothing To Fear! For Great Justice! Vicious Attack/Wild Throw Spear of Lightning/Swift Javelin Ebon Battle Standard of Honor/I Am The Strongest! Spear Mastery: 12 + 1 + 1 Leadership: 11 + 1 Motivation: 6 + 1 (I have a req 7 15 AL shield) If I'm playing hero hench I have a hero that maintains Dark Fury and Order of Pain a lot resulting in an SY every two attacks. It results in a lot of energy so I can hit my energy attacks as often as I want. When I have this hero I use Swift Javelin as Spear of Lightning does not benefit from Order of Pain (it converts all the damage to elemental). I will bring Wild Throw in an instance where I am with a full to near-full human group, that is heavy on physicals, and we're expecting a good number of enemies with an evasion stance to speed up the killing. Otherwise I stick with Vicious Attack and give both my paragon heroes Wild Throw microing as necessary. I take "I Am The Strongest!" again when in those full to near-full human situations. Without the Dark Fury spamming hero the energy becomes a little tighter when dropping a 10 energy spell on recharge. With the Dark Fury hero it creates a large enough window to drop the ward, and maintain SY with no downtime. My typical H/H setup is all ranged making Ebon Battle Standard of Honor a very powerful skill (+15 damage to everything). There is no res on my bar for the same reason a monk shouldn't carry a res. If I am using an Essence of Celerity however I will drop For Great Justice! for Signet of Return because I can't think of anything else to bring. odly
Thanks a lot.
Having an explantion like this does add a lot to understanding the build. I'll give it a try again and see how it feels to me now.
zwei2stein
Just question: why don't you use kurz/lux attack skill? Extra adrenaline for condition likely to be met by physical team, nice +damage ...
miprat
you guys have all been very helpful thanks
 I have been making my way thru GWEN so I could get Hayda. I really want to try a 3 paragon and Nec combo to see how that works.
Antithesis
Quote:
Originally Posted by miprat
Well thanks to the help I received from people on this board(Thanks alot) this is the build i made for my paragon. I seem to be running into both adrenaline and energy issues. I guess i am not using the skills in progression correctly. Any advice would be great.
I run almost the same bar (different attacks, no tactics) with no energy or adrenaline problems. It's also probably the easiest bar of any class i've ever run...just silky smooth, particularly when combined with an Orders N/Rt or D/N running [skill=text]Order of Pain[/skill] and [skill=text]Dark Fury[/skill]. Check out Racthoh's post for the builds.
If you're struggling for Adrenaline, try Spear of Fury instead of Spear of Lightning. If you're struggling for energy try pumping more points into Leadership, wear Radiant insignia and remember to take a full party for maximum energy benefit from shouts. Or you could take [skill=text]Zealous Anthem[/skill] or [skill=text]Energizing Chorus[/skill] (don't waste the energy benefit on "Save Yourselves!", save it for "They're on Fire!"). xDusT II
Quote:
Originally Posted by zwei2stein
Just question: why don't you use kurz/lux attack skill? Extra adrenaline for condition likely to be met by physical team, nice +damage ...
It uses up a valuable PvE only skill spot which could be better used for something else. The adrenaline gain is not really necessary and the damage can be more than made up with with "I am the strongest" and Ebon Vanguard Standard of Honor
Yichi
Quote:
Originally Posted by Terraban
Congratulations, you just won in the Special Olympics!
This is epic....
Antithesis
Quote:
Originally Posted by xDusT II
It uses up a valuable PvE only skill spot which could be better used for something else. The adrenaline gain is not really necessary and the damage can be more than made up with with "I am the strongest" and Ebon Vanguard Standard of Honor
He's right - you don't need Spear of Fury, any two low cost fast recharge energy-based spear attacks will do. Save Adrenaline for "Save Yourselves!" which will take care of energy problems. I haven't got "I am the Strongest" nor Ebon Honor, i'll definitely use them when i pick'em up in a physical heavy team.
xDusT II
Quote:
Originally Posted by Antithesis
He's right - you don't need Spear of Fury, any two low cost fast recharge energy-based spear attacks will do. Save Adrenaline for "Save Yourselves!" which will take care of energy problems. I haven't got "I am the Strongest" nor Ebon Honor, i'll definitely use them when i pick'em up in a physical heavy team.
Ebon Vanguard Standard of Honor is not just for physical heavy teams, the damage bonus is applied to all damage sources, including spells, meaing it's a pretty amazing AoE damage buff.
blue.rellik
Quote:
Originally Posted by xDusT II
Ebon Vanguard Standard of Honor is not just for physical heavy teams, the damage bonus is applied to all damage sources, including spells, meaing it's a pretty amazing AoE damage buff.
Holy crap! Are you serious? That makes it like one of the best skills in the game!
kobey
Quote:
Originally Posted by blue.rellik
Holy crap! Are you serious? That makes it like one of the best skills in the game!
but u need to be within the ward to get its effect
usually, warriors and minions gets out of the wards range for me
Racthoh
Every tick of an AoE gets the bonus damage. Pretty good for H/H when Herta's stone daggers have +30 damage and Sandstorm can do upwards of +150 damage.
Antithesis
Quote:
Originally Posted by xDusT II
Ebon Vanguard Standard of Honor is not just for physical heavy teams, the damage bonus is applied to all damage sources, including spells, meaing it's a pretty amazing AoE damage buff.
Sweet!
 By physical heavy i mean my Para, Hayda, Morgahn and Melonni or Olias (Orders). The rest are casters (i hate H/H Warrior AI, rarely use Rangers) so all will be in the ward. Sounds like hench Monks can do some useful wanding damage and contribute more than just defense.
blue.rellik
Quote:
Originally Posted by kobey
but u need to be within the ward to get its effect
usually, warriors and minions gets out of the wards range for me That's cool, I mainly play with H/H and they enjoy bunching up
kobey
its good enuf on its own.
if u r using it as a paragon character, other eles, paragons, ranger and fiend minions usually get affected by it. As for warriors and horrors/minions, you might need to get closer to affect them. |
