I have r8 in the Asuran title track so I'm able to get 17s of HCT on all spells from [wiki]Mindbender[/wiki]. I've been running a LoD hybrid with it, and the HCT makes it a viable elite, imo. The HCT also helps out Aegis, Dkiss, and SoA.
The 7s of downtime (soon to be 6s since I'm 1.5k away from r9) does suck but there aren't other options for hybrid.
Has anyone else tried this out? I find it to be better than the HBoon hybrid for areas with sustained degen or AoE.
LoD with Mindbender
JoeKnowMo
Stormlord Alex
It's workable, aye - and a hell of a lot better than them lame-ass Holy Haste LoDs (no prot = fail); but as always it's taking up a skillbar space just to make LoD viable. Not much of a drawback if there's nothing else you need that slot for, of course
In areas with mass degen/AoE, however, I generally stick to placing a few copies of Protective was Kaolai or put HP on an ele. It's nice to have heroes be my bitches.
In areas with mass degen/AoE, however, I generally stick to placing a few copies of Protective was Kaolai or put HP on an ele. It's nice to have heroes be my bitches.
Div
Healers boon mindbender holy haste renew life = very hawt. As long as a party member keeps dying (BIP machine?), you can get huge 3/4 second heal parties 
Grammar
Interesting idea. I'm not sure how I'd clear room on my hybrid bar for Mindbender though. Every skill is just too damn vital to drop.
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Originally Posted by Stormlord Alex
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and a hell of a lot better than them lame-ass Holy Haste LoDs (no prot = fail)
Agreed for human monks. But ever try HH+LoD on a hero monk? It's shockingly good.
Heroes suck hard with all forms of prot you can name (except maybe Aegis), and my monk has all the prot covered anyway (including Aegis), so might as well just let them rock that 1 second LoD and 1/2 second Kiss, Ethereal, and Cure.
Heroes suck hard with all forms of prot you can name (except maybe Aegis), and my monk has all the prot covered anyway (including Aegis), so might as well just let them rock that 1 second LoD and 1/2 second Kiss, Ethereal, and Cure.
Stormlord Alex
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Originally Posted by Grammar
Heroes suck hard with all forms of prot you can name (except maybe Aegis)
Actually (and strangely, as well, given how dumb AI is), they're pretty good with Spirit Bond, Guardian and Shield of Absorption (<-- I see a lot of 0s when they use this).
The only notable ones they fail horrendously with are RoF and PS; which is ok because you merely don't give them RoF, and force-cast PS if it's needed and hope they get lucky/disable it otherwise.
The only notable ones they fail horrendously with are RoF and PS; which is ok because you merely don't give them RoF, and force-cast PS if it's needed and hope they get lucky/disable it otherwise.
Grammar
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Originally Posted by Stormlord Alex
Actually (and strangely, as well, given how dumb AI is), they're pretty good with Spirit Bond, Guardian and Shield of Absorption (<-- I see a lot of 0s when they use this).
I guess my luck isn't as good as yours with those skills then.
Heroes use SoA and Shielding Hands the proper way (as a damage reduction prot), but their target selection is pretty awful 8 times out of 10 in my experience. They'll waste it on a guy who takes a few hits and then won't have it available when another guy starts getting pounded.
They use Guardian the proper way as well, and the recast is short enough so it doesn't matter as much if they waste it on a guy that doesn't need it, but I find that they spend too much time and energy casting Guardian on people that don't need it when they should be casting something else. On top of that, Guardian becomes less good if you already have Aegis, Ward against Melee, and blind in the team build (like you should ).
As for SB, I don't have much experience with SB on a hero monk (other than red-barred for my use), so I can't really say if they use it properly on their own. I just don't trust a monk hero with any 10e spell outside of Aegis, especially not one with a 2s recast. I can only see carrying SB on a hero monk if you red-bar it and control it yourself. But if you were going to do that, I'd probably rather take PS with that red-barred slot than SB a majority of the time.
EDIT: For the record, I only use HH+LoD on a hero monk if I'm the other monk in the party. On other characters, I do give them Aegis and SoA. I just don't bother on my monk because I already have Aegis and SoA anyway, and I'm addicted to that 1 second LoD, which I'll actually force cast if it isn't being spammed enough.
Heroes use SoA and Shielding Hands the proper way (as a damage reduction prot), but their target selection is pretty awful 8 times out of 10 in my experience. They'll waste it on a guy who takes a few hits and then won't have it available when another guy starts getting pounded.
They use Guardian the proper way as well, and the recast is short enough so it doesn't matter as much if they waste it on a guy that doesn't need it, but I find that they spend too much time and energy casting Guardian on people that don't need it when they should be casting something else. On top of that, Guardian becomes less good if you already have Aegis, Ward against Melee, and blind in the team build (like you should
).As for SB, I don't have much experience with SB on a hero monk (other than red-barred for my use), so I can't really say if they use it properly on their own. I just don't trust a monk hero with any 10e spell outside of Aegis, especially not one with a 2s recast. I can only see carrying SB on a hero monk if you red-bar it and control it yourself. But if you were going to do that, I'd probably rather take PS with that red-barred slot than SB a majority of the time.
EDIT: For the record, I only use HH+LoD on a hero monk if I'm the other monk in the party. On other characters, I do give them Aegis and SoA. I just don't bother on my monk because I already have Aegis and SoA anyway, and I'm addicted to that 1 second LoD, which I'll actually force cast if it isn't being spammed enough.
Burst Cancel
I think it comes down to playing style and the type of area you're in. For instance, if you're running tank-n-spank hero prot is okay because it's hard to get wrong - they just cast everything on their bar and you stay up.
Similarly, Spirit Bond is easy to use correctly in Hard Mode - almost anyone taking damage is going to be taking it in packets of 60+. So the only time a hero can fail at Spirit Bond is if the target is degening.
The problem with SoA and Guardian really come down to the fact that you have to use them intelligently to get more mileage out of them than, say, Word. Guardian at 11 prot comes out to 6s, and heroes can't weapon swap, so assuming you're using a +60hp set on the hero instead of a casting set, you've got to get better than 200 damage prevented in 6s of Guardian for it to be a better choice than Word. That's cake for a decent human monk, but heroes ...
Similarly, Spirit Bond is easy to use correctly in Hard Mode - almost anyone taking damage is going to be taking it in packets of 60+. So the only time a hero can fail at Spirit Bond is if the target is degening.
The problem with SoA and Guardian really come down to the fact that you have to use them intelligently to get more mileage out of them than, say, Word. Guardian at 11 prot comes out to 6s, and heroes can't weapon swap, so assuming you're using a +60hp set on the hero instead of a casting set, you've got to get better than 200 damage prevented in 6s of Guardian for it to be a better choice than Word. That's cake for a decent human monk, but heroes ...
cellardweller
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Originally Posted by holymasamune
Healers boon mindbender holy haste renew life = very hawt. As long as a party member keeps dying (BIP machine?), you can get huge 3/4 second heal parties
Throw in dwayna's sorrow and a couple of minion bombers and this could get interesting 
Throw in dwayna's sorrow and a couple of minion bombers and this could get interesting
lazuli
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Originally Posted by cellardweller
Throw in dwayna's sorrow and a couple of minion bombers and this could get interesting
tried it before; having jagged MM carry DS as well) but necro heros never use it, and its terribly ineffective skill to micro with. It's hard to use in battle; who cares if it triggers outside that condition?
tried it before; having jagged MM carry DS as well) but necro heros never use it, and its terribly ineffective skill to micro with. It's hard to use in battle; who cares if it triggers outside that condition?
bhavv
First thing I were going to say is I cant use it on my heroes, but I dont use monk heroes anymore since the LoD nerf.