Weapon choices for the generic SY/TNTF Paragon?

Xue Fang

Banned

Join Date: Nov 2007

27 Jan 2008 at 23:19 - 1

Attributes:
13 Spear Mastery (11+1+1) / 12 Leadership (11+1) / 9 Command (8+1)
or
14 Spear Mastery (12+1+1) / 10 Leadership (9+1) / 10 Command (9+1)

Skills used:
[skill]Aggressive Refrain[/skill] - Aggressive Refrain
- "Save Yourselves!",
[skill]"Go for the Eyes!"[/skill] - "Go For the Eyes!"
[skill]Vicious Attack[/skill] - "Vicious Attack"
- Spear of Fury
- "There's Nothing to Fear!"
[skill]"For Great Justice!"[/skill] - "For Great Justice!"
[skill]Focused Anger[/skill] - Focused Anger

The discussion: With this type of cookie cutter build, which weapon sets would you use/suggest the use of?

Racthoh

Did I hear 7 heroes?

Join Date: May 2005

Scars Meadows [SMS], Guild Leader (Not Recruiting)

27 Jan 2008 at 23:33 - 2

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xue Fang

14 Spear Mastery (12+1+1) / 10 Leadership (9+1) / 10 Command (9+1) That split won't be able to maintain Aggressive Refrain between combat without a second paragon.

The 12+1+1/11+1/6+1 split is ideal with a req 7 15 AL shield. Clarity rune in the extra slot, reduce blind shield on one set, +10 vs. fire on the other. Vamp spear as the main set with the +10 vs. fire shield, sundering or elemental on the blind shield set. If you play with skills that trigger on physical damage (Order of Pain, etc...) use the sundering. Bow on another set for pulling, some kind of +energy weapon on the last set in case you die and need to put Aggressive Refrain back up.

John Panda

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Mar 2007

in my house

The Arctic Maruarders [TAM]

28 Jan 2008 at 00:50 - 3

furious 10/10
15^50
+30

16 com / mot
10vXX
+30

Bobby2

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jun 2007

Delayed in order to meet ANet's high standards

[MaSS]

W/E

28 Jan 2008 at 04:03 - 4

Furious Spear FTW (duh?) but have Zealous on the side

+5e, +30HP

+30HP Shield, Clarity

Akolo

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jul 2006

V??xj??, Sweden

Stop Stealing [agro]

Mo/

28 Jan 2008 at 06:11 - 5

you totally dont need furious for SY... better go with sundering. If you just raise your leadership you can keep up SY easily

blue.rellik

Forge Runner

Join Date: Feb 2007

Melbourne, Australia

None

28 Jan 2008 at 07:41 - 6

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobby2

Furious Spear FTW (duh?) but have Zealous on the side

+5e, +30HP

+30HP Shield, Clarity Why the Zealous and +5e? Are you running less thank 6 Leadership or something?

John Panda

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Mar 2007

in my house

The Arctic Maruarders [TAM]

28 Jan 2008 at 21:26 - 7

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akolo

you totally dont need furious for SY... better go with sundering. If you just raise your leadership you can keep up SY easily lol you dont need sundering either, sundering is shit. especially on a spear..

Chrono Re delle Ere

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Jul 2006

The Land of Hyrule

[GoE]

28 Jan 2008 at 22:29 - 8

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Panda

lol you dont need sundering either, sundering is shit. especially on a spear.. let's just put nothing then .-.

Furious = totally useless with already 2 +100% adrenaline gain skills

AP = useless, but still more useful than furious.

John Panda

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Mar 2007

in my house

The Arctic Maruarders [TAM]

28 Jan 2008 at 23:29 - 9

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chrono Re delle Ere

let's just put nothing then .-.

Furious = totally useless with already 2 +100% adrenaline gain skills

AP = useless, but still more useful than furious. instant SY useless k.

most of those damage mods do suck just like the shields inscription mod..

furious imo would still be better than sundering.

knives

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Jun 2005

USA

Grenths Rejects [GR]

Me/

29 Jan 2008 at 02:57 - 10

Sort of off topic question...How do you mantain AR out of battle with that bar? You only have 2 shouts that you can use out of battle, and FGJ has a 20sec duration w/ a 45 sec recharge.

Mr Pink57

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Apr 2007

a van down by the river

iBench

P/W

29 Jan 2008 at 03:08 - 11

I do not take FGJ on the bar I take Anthem of Weariness usually because weakness wins HM vs burning. Usually I just sit on a furious spear that is still a numerical adren bonus or if I have a mot hench and I get Mending Refrain on me I swap to a vamp set, then swap to furious when Anger dies.

pink

Racthoh

Did I hear 7 heroes?

Join Date: May 2005

Scars Meadows [SMS], Guild Leader (Not Recruiting)

29 Jan 2008 at 03:40 - 12

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Panda

instant SY useless k.

Unless your party is dying before the first Save Yourselves! then yes instant Save Yourselves! is useless. Furious is only useful if you only have rank 2 or lower in your faction when you can't maintain the +100 AL constantly. Even then I wouldn't want to gamble the party's safety on the 10% hitting at the right time.

Vampiric and Sundering do more damage, you have spear mastery, you're there to do damage.

Quote: Originally Posted by Mr Pink57 I do not take FGJ on the bar I take Anthem of Weariness usually because weakness wins HM vs burning. Weakness doesn't do anything to burning, I'm not sure what you mean by that statement. Not carrying both For Great Justice! and Focused Anger is foolish; why would you deny yourself a constant 100% adrenaline gain especially considering +100 AL provides more damage reduction than weakness?

Quote:

Originally Posted by knives

Sort of off topic question...How do you mantain AR out of battle with that bar? You only have 2 shouts that you can use out of battle, and FGJ has a 20sec duration w/ a 45 sec recharge. There's Nothing To Fear! at 12 leadership or higher gives you a 1 second window to maintain Aggressive Refrain.

Mr Pink57

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Apr 2007

a van down by the river

iBench

P/W

29 Jan 2008 at 04:16 - 13

Quote:

Weakness doesn't do anything to burning, I'm not sure what you mean by that statement. Not carrying both For Great Justice! and Focused Anger is foolish; why would you deny yourself a constant 100% adrenaline gain especially considering +100 AL provides more damage reduction than weakness? What I mean by that is a lot of people take Anthem of Flame for in between time to keep up AR I usually just take Anthem of Weariness. Since you cannot go wrong with +100AL 35% reduction and weakness to top it off. Also since I put Focused Anger up at the beginning of a fight as it is most battles dont last over a minute as is or even the 45sec (I've vanquished most of Elona so far) so FGJ isnt doing anything for me.

Also I do not take Spear of Fury or Vicious just Spear of Lightning and GFTE! as my free energy management, it does plenty of damage as it is since I mainly run sabway so combined with barbs im doing fine (barbs does not trigger on SoL I believe since its ele dmg).

pink

Darkside

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Dec 2006

Chantry of Secrets

[Angl]

29 Jan 2008 at 04:16 - 14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Racthoh

Unless your party is dying before the first Save Yourselves! then yes instant Save Yourselves! is useless. Furious is only useful if you only have rank 2 or lower in your faction when you can't maintain the +100 AL constantly. Even then I wouldn't want to gamble the party's safety on the 10% hitting at the right time.

Vampiric and Sundering do more damage, you have spear mastery, you're there to do damage.

Weakness doesn't do anything to burning, I'm not sure what you mean by that statement. Not carrying both For Great Justice! and Focused Anger is foolish; why would you deny yourself a constant 100% adrenaline gain especially considering +100 AL provides more damage reduction than weakness?

There's Nothing To Fear! at 12 leadership or higher gives you a 1 second window to maintain Aggressive Refrain.

I personally use a furious just like to get that extra adren whenever possible but I wouldn't fault anyone for using anything else since the adren gain from focused anger and for great justice is enough to keep SY up almost all the time.

Also agree that there is no reason not to carry both For Great Justice and Focused Anger...that way you can have 100% adren gain with no down time. Which means more SY and GftE. I was reluctant at first to carry both but after putting them on my bar for a while I wouldn't ever wanna take either of them off.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Pink57

What I mean by that is a lot of people take Anthem of Flame for in between time to keep up AR I usually just take Anthem of Weariness. Since you cannot go wrong with +100AL 35% reduction and weakness to top it off. Also since I put Focused Anger up at the beginning of a fight as it is most battles dont last over a minute as is or even the 45sec (I've vanquished most of Elona so far) so FGJ isnt doing anything for me.

pink It's not a big deal in a sort fight but if you end up in a long battle with a group that has multiple monks or something the adren gain from focused anger will run out and then you can't cast SY as much to protect the party.

Xue Fang

Banned

Join Date: Nov 2007

29 Jan 2008 at 04:59 - 15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darkside

I personally use a furious just like to get that extra adren whenever possible but I wouldn't fault anyone for using anything else since the adren gain from focused anger and for great justice is enough to keep SY up almost all the time. According to wiki (here), adrenaline does not stack beyond 100%, so wouldn't a Furious mod be redundant while you have a constant +100% from Focused Anger and "For Great Justice!"?

Darkside

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Dec 2006

Chantry of Secrets

[Angl]

29 Jan 2008 at 05:06 - 16

If that's true then why does focused anger go beyond 100%?

Xue Fang

Banned

Join Date: Nov 2007

29 Jan 2008 at 05:10 - 17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darkside

If that's true then why does focused anger go beyond 100%? The use of FA! is not stacking more than one source.

Stacking involves more than one source, similarly, stacking snares can not pass -50% move speed, skill recharge cannot stack to less than 50% (it used to be possible to get a 75% skill recharge reduction using two 20/20 weapons, this was changed).

Racthoh

Did I hear 7 heroes?

Join Date: May 2005

Scars Meadows [SMS], Guild Leader (Not Recruiting)

29 Jan 2008 at 05:14 - 18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Pink57

Also since I put Focused Anger up at the beginning of a fight as it is most battles dont last over a minute as is or even the 45sec (I've vanquished most of Elona so far) so FGJ isnt doing anything for me.

Quote: Originally Posted by Darkside It's not a big deal in a sort fight but if you end up in a long battle with a group that has multiple monks or something the adren gain from focused anger will run out and then you can't cast SY as much to protect the party. Well Darkside basically covered it all there. A fight that doesn't last the full duration of Focused Anger is an encounter you were probably going to win, even without SY there. Then there are the other kinds of fights, the ones that matter. Those are the ones where having that constant +100% adrenaline gain is useful.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darkside

If that's true then why does focused anger go beyond 100%? Soothing.

knives

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Jun 2005

USA

Grenths Rejects [GR]

Me/

29 Jan 2008 at 05:32 - 19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Racthoh

There's Nothing To Fear! at 12 leadership or higher gives you a 1 second window to maintain Aggressive Refrain. Thanks, didn't think I could spam it outside of battle, but I guess I'll try now. :O

Bobby2

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jun 2007

Delayed in order to meet ANet's high standards

[MaSS]

W/E

29 Jan 2008 at 15:18 - 20

Quote:

Originally Posted by blue.rellik

Why the Zealous and +5e? Are you running less thank 6 Leadership or something? atm I run Ld12. I'm just a sucker for big bars

Prof Of Black

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Nov 2006

@ Sensation Black

Death is Energy [DIE] ~ Raining fame alliance

29 Jan 2008 at 16:11 - 21

Vamp + zealous + elemental gogogo

~Prof.

blue.rellik

Forge Runner

Join Date: Feb 2007

Melbourne, Australia

None

30 Jan 2008 at 03:24 - 22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobby2

atm I run Ld12. I'm just a sucker for big bars

Then why the zealous and +5 mod? Are you even running any shouts or chants?

Bobby2

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jun 2007

Delayed in order to meet ANet's high standards

[MaSS]

W/E

30 Jan 2008 at 04:31 - 23

GFTE!, FGJ!, AoF, TNTF!. Gotta get up to lv20 for SY!, current Para's only 16 yet.

On the Furious spear: it's what I start out with. As soon as the adren process has set in (eg it will be on the first SY!) switching to Zealous provides me with damn near endless energy - but I consider SY! ASAP more important.

I don't stress damage, either. Always having resources available is more important to me.