To Gaile: Skill Rewording - still being worked on?

Just wondering if we could get an official word on this. Are you guys still working on rewording the skill descriptions?

A couple of issues: (tons more than this though)
-"negative" conditions on certain skills
-Need to add Cracked Armor to skills like Restore Conditions
-100" on Scorpion Wire
-sensationalized skill descriptions in prophecies

Another (vaguely) related question:
Are we getting new skill icons? I noticed there is different skill icons for certain skills in the latest sealed deck cards than the ones in-game?

EDIT:
Here's a list of skill anomaly's:
* "Takes no damage" means a damage number of 0 will show up. However, "deals no damage" does not produce a damage number at all. Finally, "takes damage" (as a trigger for other effects) will count a damage number of 0.
* The use of the term "spirit" in many skill descriptions is ambiguous. The effects of these skills are limited to spirits created by rituals. For example, an Unnatural Signet will not recharge instantly if used against a Spirit of the Fallen, and you will not gain energy from Essence Strike standing near the "protective spirit" Zunraa.
* All Shadow damage skills and all Holy damage skills except for Judge's Insight, Avatar of Balthazar, Lightbringer's Gaze, and the converted weapon damage from Heart of Holy Flame ignore armor and caster level, which is not listed in their skill descriptions.
* Although not technically an anomaly, it is worth noting that the 'only recharged by Morale Boosts' effect of Resurrection Signet and Sunspear Rebirth Signet takes priority over the instant recharge effects of other skills such as Keystone Signet and Assassin's Promise.
* When a spell's description says it causes some effect every second or every N seconds, this effect is always caused at the end of the interval.
* When a skill's description says it makes a skill activate or rechange X% faster, this means that it makes the activation or recharge time X% shorter. Increases to attack speed likewise reduce the attack interval, so a 25% attack speed increase results in a ~33% attack rate increase, and a 33% attack speed increase results in a ~50% attack rate increase.
* In general, Pet Attacks will trigger effects dependent on activating attack skills, such as Anthem of Fury or Zealous Anthem, but will not trigger effects dependent on hitting or attacking with attack skills, such as Defensive Anthem.
* Resurrection skills will not work on non-fleshy creatures, such as Djinn.
* The description of "I Will Avenge You!" is misleading, as it says: For each dead ally, you gain 10 seconds of +3...6 Health regeneration and your attack speed increases by 25%. The area of this skill's effect is not infinite as the description implies, but counts fallen allies only within radar range.
* Bonetti's Defense, Defensive Stance, and Deflect Arrows block all projectile attacks, not just arrows.
* Although Dwarven Battle Stance does improve the attack speed of all weapons, the skill's description does not mention that it can only be activated while wielding a hammer.
* The skill descriptions for Eviscerate and Hamstring are redundant, describing the condition they inflict.
* Healing Signet is a healing skill, rather then a gain health skill.
* The description of Shield Stance is ambiguous: this skill will provide no deflection bonus if you are not wielding a shield, yet will still slow your movement.
* The description of Swift Chop is ambiguous: if blocked, the target takes only 1..16 damage, rather then 1..16 bonus damage as the description implies.
* The description of Yeti Smash is ambiguous: the target is struck for +5..17 damage, and foes adjacent to the target take 5..41 damage.
* Conflagration states that it only affects arrows, but it will change Spear and Bone Fiend attacks to fire damage.
* Rampage as One and Never Rampage Alone require a living animal companion or it cannot be activated.
* Whirling Defense deals physical damage that ignores armor and cannot be converted into fire damage by Greater Conflagration.
* Winter is currently inconsistent.
* Sometimes bow attack skills and normal bow attacks do not function on bridges or stairs. This is fixed by moving slightly or moving completely off the bridge/stairs.
* If you use Comfort Animal without having a pet with you, you incorrectly get the message "Your pet is out of range".
* Draw Conditions mentions "negative" conditions, which is redundant as all conditions are negative.
* Balthazar's Spirit says that the caster gains 1 energy if the target takes damage. Actually, the target merely has to be hit; the energy is gained even if the target takes 0 damage.
* Martyr says that all conditions and their durations are transferred to the caster. This is ambiguous. Experiments show that for each condition only the maximum duration is transferred to the caster, not the sum of all durations on all party members. Draw Conditions displays this behavior to a lesser extent.
* Life Attunement says that it causes the target to deal 30% less damage in combat. This is ambiguous. It appears to reduce only damage caused by weapons, but has no effect on damage from other skills, including skills that "count as" attacks such as Palm Strike.
* Protective Bond and Protective Spirit say that they limit damage only for attacks and spells. However, they also work for damage sources such as Vile Touch that are neither attacks nor spells.
* Spirit Bond states that "whenever target ally takes more than 60 damage..." but actually heals before the damage itself is applied. i.e. it heals before target ally takes said damage.
* Animate Flesh Golem's description says that you can only have one Flesh Golem at a time. It does not mention that when the old golem is destroyed because you have a second Flesh Golem, it will leave an exploited corpse.
* Aura of the Lich says that it reduces all damage by half. Actually, it reduces both damage and life sacrifice by half.
* The descriptions of Deathly Swarm and Vampiric Swarm are misleading. Contrary to their descriptions, they are not PBAoE spells or projectile spells, and do not require line of sight to hit a target. Similar to Chain Lightning, they hit the primary target first and then move on to hit up the second and third targets, however, unlike Chain Lightning, there is a 1 second delay between each target and the next.
* Grenth's Balance also balances the health of the caster and target if the caster has more health than the target. This balancing effect does not happen if the caster has maximum health.
* Plague Touch, Plague Sending, and Plague Signet mention "negative" conditions, which is redundant as all conditions are negative.
* Rotting Flesh's description states that target fleshy creature becomes diseased and slowly loses health. This wording is redundant. Additionally, the description implies that it can target any fleshy creature, but it can only target fleshy foes.
* Taste of Pain's description states that you gain health; however unlike other health gain skills, it is affected by Life Attunement and Aura of Faith, and thus should be considered a healing skill.
* The description of Verata's Sacrifice says that it affects all undead allies. It only affects your own undead minions. It neither removes conditions from nor gives health regeneration to allied minions that you do not control.
* Taste of Death and Feast for the Dead: their descriptions say "target undead ally", but automatically act on the the nearest undead ally if the player is not targeting an undead ally.
* Rend Enchantments is health loss, not damage as specified in the description, and as such, it is not altered by Protective Spirit or Reversal of Fortune, but furthermore is not reduced by Aura of the Lich.
* Arcane Thievery, Arcane Larceny, Inspired Enchantment, Inspired Hex, Revealed Enchantment, Revealed Hex, and Simple Thievery cannot copy monster skills.
* Arcane Mimicry cannot copy Junundu Siege.
* Frustration deals damage if the target is interrupted in any way: Clumsiness, Signet of Clumsiness, or a knock down while the target casting a spell will trigger the damage.
* Illusion of Weakness subtracts 1 more life than the skill description says. In addition, the -XXX red damage number also shows a value incorrect by 1 point.
* Illusionary Weaponry says that your attacks "deal no damage" in melee; your attacks simply do not hit, yet do not trigger effects based on failing to hit.
* Mantra of Recovery does not recharge spells 33% faster, but instead reduces their recharge by 33%.
* Signet of Humility displays a message about invalid spell target when an invalid target is selected, this should be signet or skill target. Signet of Humility also actually disables all of the foe's elite skills if the target has more than one.
* While Signet of Illusions is active, spells ignore +1 Illusion Magic percentage effects. Signet of Illusions also affects spells with linked titles.
* Gale states it knocks down a target for 2 seconds; this is now redundant, as all knockdowns last 2 seconds unless stated otherwise.
* Glyph of Sacrifice actually reduces the next spell's activation time to ¼ of a second rather than making it activate instantly.
* The description of Master of Magic is ambiguous. "This Spell's attribute" refers to the attribute of the spell just cast, not the attribute of Master of Magic. Additionally, Master of Magic treats all unlinked and title-based skills as a single attribute.
* The skill description of Phoenix does not specify the projectile's blast radius. Like the PBAoE effect, the projectile explosion has a blast radius of adjacent range.
* Savannah Heat's pulses actually inflicts 5..17 damage for each second the spell has been active, rather than 5..17 damage plus an additional 5..17 damage for every second the spell has been active.
* Sliver Armor says that it strikes "one nearby enemy" with earth damage. This is somewhat ambiguous. A natural reading would assume it to mean "one random nearby enemy", but actually, given a constant set of enemies in range, it always strikes the same one. This is not necessarily the closest enemy - presumably it is the first enemy encountered in whatever data structure the game uses to determine such things.
* Stone Striker appears to convert at least some non-elemental, non-physical damage from attacks into Earth Damage.
* Aura of Displacement is ambiguous as it doesn't distinguish between shadow step and teleport. The effect is identical to a shadow step.
* Similarly, Return is a shadow step, rather than a teleport.
* Death Blossom's description says that, if it hits, it strikes for +20..40 damage and all adjacent foes take 20..40 damage. In reality, if it hits, it strikes for +20..40 damage and all other foes adjacent to the target take 20..40 damage.
* The description of Sharpen Daggers is ambiguous. Only successful hits with attack skills decrement the skill counter.
* Attacks with Shattering Assault use the skill's listed damage in place of base weapon damage. This damage is affected by Dagger Mastery, critical hits, armor penetration, inscription and inscription-equivalent weapon damage bonuses and the target's armor, but does not benefit from the customization damage bonus.
* Bloodsong summons a spirit called "Spirit of Blood Song". This was apparently not updated after the FPE, when this skill was named Blood Song.
* Although Destructive was Glaive is classified as a Spell, it is functionally indistinguishable from an Item Spell.
* Ritual Lord actually reduces recharge time by 15..51% rather than increasing recharge speed by 15..51%.
* The skill description of Shadowsong does not list the spirit's damage.
* Weapon of Quickening reduces the recharge of spells and binding rituals by 33% rather than increasing recharge speed by 33%.
* The duration bar under a Binding Rituals icon on the Effects Monitor has no functionality.
* Because Energizing Chorus reduces cost at the beginning of skill activation and doesn't end until activation is completed, using a Shout in the middle of a Chant's activation will allow both skills to benefit from this Chant.
* Mighty Throw and Unblockable Throw have activation times of 2 seconds and not 3 seconds reported by the skill description.
* Pet Attacks are not considered Attack Skills by many Paragon Chants.
The description of Chilling Victory says that it inflicts extra cold damage whenever it strikes a foe with less health than you, however the attack does not need to hit to trigger the bonus effect and will only trigger once, even if multiple targets have less health than you.
* When used against an invalid target, Resurrection Signet incorrectly gives the "Invalid spell target." message rather than the generic "Invalid target." message.
* Although the description says "nearby", the actual range of Signet of Capture is significantly larger than earshot. Furthermore, Signet of Capture cannot be used to capture the elite skills of some bosses in Istan, which is suspected to be related to boss level.
* Sunspear Rebirth Signet can only resurrect dead party members, rather than being able to resurrect any dead ally as the description indicates.
* Although it is omitted from their descriptions, celestial skills cannot be recharged by anything other than Morale Boosts.
* Celestial Storm says that it strikes for 40 damage per second, and implies the damage is armor-ignoring; actually, the skill strikes for 40 damage four times every second, one each of Lightning damage, Cold damage, Fire damage, and an unknown Elemental damage, presumed to be Earth damage.
* Creatures summoned with Call to the Torment are not considered summoned creatures by other skills, such as Banish and Unnatural Signet.
* Dark Chain Lightning deals 300 damage to the first target and 10% less to each subsequent target, not 200 as the description states. Also, the damage is not Lightning Damage in spite of the description.
* Enchantment Collapse triggers every time the target foe loses an enchantment, lasting until it is removed, Rather than only triggering the next time the target loses an enchantment as the description implies.
* Impossible Odds does not mention that all conditions on Shiro are transferred to those he strikes when under this effect.
* Meditation of the Reaper has an inconsistent damage absorption figure. The tooltip on the skill activation icon display 700 damage, whereas the Effects Monitor displays the correct figure of 500 damage. Also, the description does not mention that reaching the damage cap will end the Meditation early.
* Splinter Mine has an inaccurate description. This effect inflicts Bleeding rather than Burning, and inflicts 0 damage.
*When used against Zhu Hanuku while fully charged, the Spear of Archemorus deals 1900 damage, rather than the 235 damage listed in its description.
* Disarm Trap is easily interruptable although it is not mentioned in the skill description.
* Snowball, Mega Snowball and Flurry of Ice are called spells in their descriptions, however other skills and effects treat them as both spells and attack skills. Because of this, there are numerous instances that have redundant effects, and therefore do not work when these three skills are applied. These instances are; the mesmer's blinding effect from Blinding Snow and the easily interrupted effect caused by Daze
* Ice Fort does not block incoming projectiles. Instead, it reduces damage from all sources including the non-projectile Icicles hex to 0 and prevents projectiles from inflicting conditions and knockdowns. It is currently not known if Ice Fort prevents knockdowns from Ice Breaker.
* Because of it's long skill animation, Leave Junundu actually takes significantly longer to activate than its listed 1/4 second activation time.
* The descriptions of Rollerbeetle Dash, Harden Shell, and Ram omit the fact that they can only be recharged by reaching a checkpoint.
* The descriptions of Distracting Lunge, Spit Rocks, Rollerbeetle Echo, Rollerbeetle Blast, and Super Rollerbeetle omit the facts that these skills are not charged by default, and can only be charged by touching a bonus power box, which randomly charges one of them.
* Ram has the undocumented effect of providing a brief speed boost.
* Although the description does not mention it, Vial of Purified Water fires a projectile which inflicts 50 damage if it hits.
* Ursan Strike deals armor-ignoring damage, but Ursan Rage does not, even though they have similar descriptions.

Cite your sources.

And yes, Anet is aware of it.

I don't know linking rules on this forum you can't link to that wiki on GWO so.

Yeah but Guru >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>GWO

You can link to any site, as long as it has a bearing on your topic, and isn't anything rated 18+

GWO doesn't allow links to Wiki because Wiki has ads for selling gold.

oh, alright. Cool.


I hope Gaile replies, I was really looking forward to a skill rewording.

The anomalies are not the only thing that should be brought up. Inconsistencies & poor templating also needs to be worked on. Example:

Life Transfer
Elite Hex Spell. For 6...11...12 seconds, target foe suffers -3...7...8 Health degeneration, which you gain as Health regeneration.
Life Siphon
Hex Spell. For 12...22...24 seconds, target suffers -1...3...3 Health degeneration, and you gain +1...3...3 Health regeneration.

Same effect, different descriptions. In this case, they should both use the Life Siphon template.

Searing Flames
Elite Spell. Target foe and all nearby foes are struck with Searing Flames. Foes already on fire when this Skill is cast are struck for 10...82...100 fire damage. Foes not already on fire begin Burning for 1...6...7 seconds.

No shit... That was redundant. Excluding the bolded part, the skill still has a poor description.

There are quite a few others, and I don't feel like going through and listing them at the moment.

The only skill description that bothers me is Lightbringers Gaze

Skill. Target demonic servant of Abaddon takes 100 holy damage and is interrupted. This skill strikes one additional foe in the area for each rank of Lightbringer you have attained. This skill is disabled for 15 seconds after it is used.

The fact that it's disabled for 15 seconds after use is what i thought was the recharge time and didn't actually NEED to be in the description. I'm glad they don't add the recharge time to every skill description. I know they do in the Dervish avatars as well. Are these skills not affected by skill recharges and have a consistant recharge time regardless ?

Disable =/= recharge.

Well, "disable" is kinda misleading because disabled skill is treated as recharging skill by game mechanics (prone to instant recharge effects, triggering recharging skill clauses in insignias and other skills).

Only thing disable is different in is that it ignored HSR weapon mods and other similar effects.

They haven't fixed them for nearly three years... they aren't going to start caring now, at a point where they've started working on GW2. Sorry, but honestly, it kind of... isn't important. =/

Gaile said they were working on this.

EDIT: Rewording skills that is.

re word


farm loot too ......

As long as people note them in the official wiki, they will look onto the matter.

That's why it's there.

I think maybe Gaile should reply to the Xunlai Marketplace thread as well, considering she's viewing this thread right now.

C'mon.

Umm... that is actually in there for a purpose. It means it won't get recast faster due to skills like serpents quickness, and is designed deliberately to prevent abuse.
That is the same reason why Dervish Arvatars say the same thing. They are disabled for 120 seconds, but there recharge is 30 seconds.
As people have said, disabling is not equal to (=/=) recharging.

One or two of the game developers have subpages of their user pages set aside for text bugs and skill anomalies - feel free to post them there (although you'll probably find thay already have been and have status updates)

Can't link - no access to wiki.guildwars.com at work

Ya, it's pretty funny when you look at things like Axe Rake vs Axe Twist, Drunken Blow vs Desperation Blow, etc. Very similar skills that don't really match up the same.

Bugs and stuff are being tracked on the official wiki as Snograt says.

Bobby Stein collects information on text bugs and text inconsistencies in game. Make sure you check his archive before you list all of the issues you posted because I'm fairly sure many of them have already been fixed or at least submitted.

Mike Zadorojny collects AI, Quest, Art and miscellaneous issues. Generally the complicated sort of bugs end up with him.

These pages are pretty regularly updated so it seems the folks at ArenaNet are actively working through the issues.

need to remove the fluff like listing all the conditions if you ask me...

they should probably have roleplay/flavor text descriptions in that line of thought...but it is too much work.

a good read: http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=mtgcom/daily/mc1

Never effected me I use my bars and if something is wrong check wiki.
So it is not high on my priority list.

My only gripe is when skills use double negatives:

"target foes loses -4 health per second" - you can't lose a negative, as you would actually gain a positive. It should be "target foe loses 4 health per second" and just leave it at that.

Along the same lines are skills that say "target foe suffers -4 health degeneration per second" - its the same as above - "degeneration" means a loss or lowering, so no need the -4.

Actually, it should be "target foe loses 8 Health per second" in your first example.

...

......

You know what the skills mean right? The added flavor like "Is struck with Searing Flames" is to keep with the roleplay. Otherwise it would be dry..."Cause burning on target foe for 7 seconds. If target foe is already burning, cause X...XX damage to target foe. All your base are belong to us." So very dry, I like the way some skill descriptions are worded. "Send out a lightning javelin that strikes target foe...." rather than "deal X damage to target foe, this effect counts as a projectile".

Lemme know when people roleplay this and I throw a Lightning Javelin at someone and they go "you sent out your mighty lightning javelin and hit me in the face" in the midst of combat


not going to happen

Ok so you'd rather have a cut and dry game with no flavor at all?

Why not just skip the storylines and just go straight to level 20, all skills and max attributes in everything, add in a God Mode code and get every title maxed after 10 minutes of trying.

Why don't we just cut out all the fluff? SF: "apply burning to target enemy. if burning, deal XX damage." Life Siphon: "Target enemy gets -X heath regen. Gain +X health regen." Ursan Blessing: "you win"

Yeah, because all of that related to concise skill descriptions right?

ITT: A11Eur0 wants this:
Fire Storm
You call upon the almighty god, Balthazar, to reign down streams of molten flame upon foes at targeted locale. For 10 Earth seconds, foes adjacent to the targeted locale take 2+3...(30x5)-131 Flaming damage each passing Earth second, causing severe burns and flesh to be slowly burned off of their bodies.

Not to that degree...no. But cutting it down to bare minimum would make this game boring. What if all of Rurik's speeches were just "We gotta get out of here. Let's go over those mountains. Maybe the Krytans will help us. Let's go!" White mantle: "those Shining Blade are kidnappers. Go kill them." Shining blade: "The white mantle are the killers. Go kill them." Vizier Khilbron: "Get me the scepter and I'll help you win." Glint: "Kill the mursaat and you'll win, gogo"

Do you even read the skill descriptions more than once? Please...if this bugs you that much, you need to go out and re-discover that thing called the Sun. This is a Game. Not a fantasy world simulator. It's got flavor. Leave that flavor alone.

CUTSCENES AND STORY DO NOT RELATE TO SKILL DESCRIPTIONS AT ALL, STOP BEING DUMB.

Seriously.

I'VE TOUCHED ON SKILL DESCRIPTIONS AND AM TAKING THE DISCUSSION FURTHER. It's called using a parallel in a debate. It's called making my point and illustrating it further. Stop being ignorant.

This topic is about rewording skill descriptions.

I agree. Reword please, it'd be helpful. Fluff, destroy it!

I would have loved two different descriptions: one more narrative, the other more precise like we have now. Maybe an option to toggle either, too. Too late now, though, it would simply take too long to come up with 1200+ new skill descriptions to fit them in, but it's something to hope for in GW2.

You fail at the game, and then some.

In Magic, flavor is given through different methods, but not through the actual skill description text. That is where Magic is serious. Every word must be precise as to what the skill does. Guild Wars needs to learn that caliber, too. Every single thing needs to be precise.

Searing Flames - the flavor and RPG-type quality of it is in the art, the name of the skill, the skill tree name, the method of acquisition - but NOT the text. The text is serious, because who the HELL cares about what the text says? When you want to read the text you want to know what it does, not some 200-word long explanation full of redundancies.

That being said, nobody really cares. You know what the skills do, so bother arguing?

Yes, this exactly.

not just every word, every comma, colon and period changes the way a skill will work.

every creature, spell type, land artifact EVERYTHING in MTG is worded and named following a precise convention. It saves a LOT of hassle and debate.

there is everything to be gained using precise wording, flavor text can be added for impact no problem (in the skill descriptions) heck the toons already shout some of it out when they use the skill.

Fail.
Exactly. Flavor is currently placed in the skills with the icon art, & the skill name. If more flavor is needed, it can be added after the mechanical description of the skill - a small piece of lore/history/origin, saying/quote, ect. that has relevance to the skill.

Example:
Using a period between the two means they are seperate effects - removing the hex would not stop the regeneration for the caster - hence why it is currently worded with a comma, meaning they are part of the same effect, and rightly so.

For those of you who don't understand, I will give a brief example from M:tG

"Target creature takes X damage, and you gain X life."
If the target creature is made an illegal target before the spell resolves (think spellbreaker to interrupt someone's spell), the damage and life gain are canceled, as they are part of the same effect.
vs.
"Target creature takes X damage. You gain X life."
If the target creature is made an illegal target before the spell resolves, the damage is canceled, but the life gain still resolves, as it is a separate effect of the same spell.

Very very true, and this is why some skills need reworded...they don't follow standard conventions.

Like Judge's Insight/AoB/Lightbringer's Gaze not ignoring armor even though all other Holy sources do. Why?

Ultimately though, virtually all of these effects can be 100% confirmed by simply testing them.

Once, usually.

Unlike M:TG (where two players may otherwise have a tendency to argue ad infinitum about the precise interpretation of a given card), there is zero ambiguity here. The skill works AS IT IS CODED, no arguments given. It's essentially irrelevant what the skill description is. It's nice if it's helpful, sure, but there really is no desperate need to make everything 100% crystal clear.

I mean, if you're in doubt as to whether the regen and degen are linked in Life siphon or life transfer, you can go out and test it. If you regularly use the spell, you're unlikely to need to regularly reconfirm how it works. Of course, the fact that they're called "siphon" and "transfer" pretty much implies reciprocity anyway

So yeah: it's nice to have the descriptions as slightly more than "bare bones", since it's really not essential to "resolving skill behaviour" to have a 100% unabiguous skill description: the skill does as it's coded, and if you haven't worked out exactly how that works before using the skill at a critical moment, you're a bit stupid, really.