you'd like to have +4 energy reg?

Teh Nox

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Jun 2007

hey
i'm just wondering how much u are bothered by the only +3 energie reg of the ranger. For myself, i sometimes really wish the ranger profession to also have +4 like assas and dervishes who are also mainly physical dmg dealing classes.
Expertise rocks if u focus on ranger only skills, no doubt, but as soon as u change ur second class to some caster like, i really regret not to have +4.
cuz assa's and dervs can have alot of fun with spells while ranger has to stay physical.
How u think about this?

Llint

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: May 2006

Play a elementist. fixed.

N1ghtstalker

N1ghtstalker

Forge Runner

Join Date: Dec 2007

E/

i don't see how a ranger has to go caster
offcourse some things do offer an advantage
you could say the ranger is between a warrior and dervish
rangers are mainly only for physical like the warriors but have a bit more energy regen but they do use more energy then a warrior
trappers use a huge amount of energy
but still
a ranger is not made for casting
sure maybe one spell or two can't hurt
but casting like an ele won't be possible
assa's have high energy regen but low armor, and a derv can hit hard but also very weakly since a scythe has 9-41 dmg
energy regen is also more based on the proffession itself
a derv has lots of enchantments and a ranger doesn't
a ranger uses preparation wich in their turn use the expertise

ZenRgy

ZenRgy

Zookeeper

Join Date: Jul 2005

Australian Discussion Posse HQ - Glorious leader

҉ ̵̡̢̢̛̛̛̖̗̘̙̜̝̞̟&#

N/E

The best skills for a ranger, are ranger skills that use expertise. I've never decided to use spells on a ranger (because it's a bad idea, because of problems you stated), aside from a few for utility.

Expertise is fine, rangers don't need +4, Assassins and dervs have +4 because they have spells and their energy management is active. Ranger strength lies in conditions and disruption. To be blunt, if you want to cast spells, create a caster class.

makosi

makosi

Grotto Attendant

Join Date: Mar 2006

"Pre-nerf" is incorrect. It's pre-buff.

Requirement Begins With R [notQ]

Me/

They'd have to nerf expertise hard to increase Rangers' energy regen by 1 pip. Expertise has been heavily criticized for being overpowered in the past because it makes Rangers spammy.

Also, Rangers have +30 armour vs Elemental damage whereas Dervishes and Assassins do not.

Siirius Black

Siirius Black

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Aug 2007

The Dragon's Lair

La Legion Del Dragon

E/

The reason you only have 2 pips in the warrior, 4 pips in the monk and so forth is because of balance. If you have 4 pips in the ranger you will have an advantage over other classes.

That's when energy management can come into play. As you said, Expertise in the ranger allows to spend less energy on skills. Or you can use mesmer skills like [Mantra of Earth], [Mantra of Flame], [Mantra of Frost], [Mantra of Lightning],

From your profession you can use [Storm Chaser] among others.

So you see, all depends on how you set up your build.
.

The Meth

The Meth

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jan 2007

R/

Having just 6 expertise gives you an effective 4 energy regen assuming you use expertise-affected skills. At a more realistic level of 12 expertise, you will have an effective 5.8 regen. And if god forbid you should ever use 16 in expertise, you will have an effective 8.3 regen when using expertise affected skills.

Don't leave expertise as the attribute you dump your last 3 points in, bump it up at least to 10+ and use skills it works on. Any caster in the game would beg to be able to use expertise on their skills, its just incredibly powerful. Rangers aren't casters, if you want a caster then make one. Your post reeks of the same ideas that w/mo's who try to heal have.

lennymon

lennymon

Forge Runner

Join Date: Nov 2005

Seattle

Odin's Hammer [OH] - Servant's of Fortuna [SoF]

R/

Ranger is already one of the only professions (adrenaline warrior, and cetera) which is extremely effective during extreme energy denial. Only 6 energy? Oh shucks I'll have to use dual/distracting instead of dual/savage....

quickmonty

quickmonty

Ancient Windbreaker

Join Date: May 2005

Rangers are fine the way they are. Any increase in energy regen would require a nerf of expertise.

Shogunshen

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Jan 2008

If you require more pips of energy regen, due to skill/profession choice or otherwise, you're doing it wrong.

Teh Nox

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Jun 2007

hehe thx for mass replies, but u missunderstood me.
As i said, no doubt, expertise is extremly effective while using ranger-only skills.
But while playing ranger u just get problems with using <5 energie cost SPELLS. So i wanted to know if u sometimes miss the chance of doing that with ranger
(like u can do it with assa/derv)

btw:k i have an effective "8.3" regen at 12 expertise, but i i have to spend a total of 97 Attribute points to Expertise just for this issue, since in MOST ranger builds (PvP and PvE) distracting shot is the only expertise skill u use in your skillbar.

lennymon

lennymon

Forge Runner

Join Date: Nov 2005

Seattle

Odin's Hammer [OH] - Servant's of Fortuna [SoF]

R/

No, looks like about everyone understood your question... expertise is the reason *why* rangers only have or need 3 regen. Any more energy regen and it would be even more unfair. So, there are alternatives for casting as an ele: use stone striker and storm chaser, or make an ele as a mesmer: the mantra stances or storm chaser (or make a mesmer duh!), as a monk: storm chaser...(see the trend?). I think this should make it pretty clear.

I've a great Obs flesh tank build I use in PVE, but it's even better when a monk throws Balth's Spirit on me. We're not casters, but we can do similar aoe damage with line of sight and a big group of red dots, yup splinter barrage. We have snares and energy denial, healing and condition removal... the only other profession that even comes close to this flexible is Ritualist, but they can't use a bow like we can... Yeah, we can spirit spam too (ala expertise)

Oh, the other option is [skill]Prepared Shot[/skill][skill]Read the Wind[/skill] to feed casting but that requires mass marksmanship so you may as well just go with that for damage....

Duke.07

Duke.07

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Nov 2007

W/

GAME IS TOO HARD FIX PLZ!



[/sarcasm]

fishy go moo

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Apr 2007

Mo/E

Quote:
Originally Posted by Llint
Play a elementist. fixed. Lol good post I will read a second time.

Too bad i wont /sarcasm that = horrible psot

And yes I would like them to have +4 regen.

Div

Div

I like yumy food!

Join Date: Jan 2006

Where I can eat yumy food

Dead Alley [dR]

Mo/R

I think my wammo should have 4 regen. That way I can be just as good as monks and rits!

Stormlord Alex

Stormlord Alex

Grotto Attendant

Join Date: Dec 2005

Beyond the Forest of Doom, past the Cavern of Agony... on Kitten & Puppy Island

Soul of Melandru [sOm]

W/E

Only bad players need 4 regen.

The rest of us use Expertise and don't spam like retards karate chopping their keyboards.

Amy Awien

Amy Awien

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jul 2006

R/

We can spit out a 5E ranger skill every 2 seconds while a caster needs 4 seconds to regenerate the energy for a 5E spell, the same time we need to regenerate the energy for a 10E skill.

Master Ketsu

Master Ketsu

Desert Nomad

Join Date: May 2006

middle of nowhere

Krazy Guild With Krazy People [KrZy]

R/

You do realize that having all your skills only cost half energy is the equivalent of double ( +6 ) Ereg right ?

iridescentfyre

iridescentfyre

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Mar 2006

W/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Teh Nox
cuz assa's and dervs can have alot of fun with spells while ranger has to stay physical. Is this a joke?

Generally those who want to play spellcasters make spellcasters, not rangers.

Tyla

Emo Goth Italics

Join Date: Sep 2006

....No, my ranger runs into no energy problems.
If you want to do the other classes things, play that class.

Sir Pandra Pierva

Sir Pandra Pierva

Forge Runner

Join Date: Apr 2007

Sardelec yelling at Tenshi

Angels Of Strife

E/

lets look at rangers
expertiece the best option for energy managment in my opinion.

if they had 4 regen as well can't you imangine how powerful they would be....

Physical

Physical

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Mar 2006

The Netherlands

Needs a GvG guild..

R/Mo

Quote:
Originally Posted by Teh Nox
But while playing ranger u just get problems with using <5 energie cost SPELLS.
If those spells make you run out of energy soon, then those spells just aren't meant for a ranger to use..

Quote: Originally Posted by Teh Nox since in MOST ranger builds (PvP and PvE) distracting shot is the only expertise skill u use in your skillbar. See it the same way as energy storage for an elementalist. The greatest benefit you get is from the inherit effect of it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Teh Nox
btw:k i have an effective "8.3" regen at 12 expertise, but i i have to spend a total of 97 Attribute points to Expertise just for this issue, That's why minor runes are found out, this we decrease the ap cost to 77..
And decide if you really want to spend that 5e instead of 6e on that 10e skill, because otherwise you could also use 9 expertise (8+1) which will give you 3e on a 5e skill, and 6e on a 10e skill..

(I know this maybe is a little bit less ontopic but rangers are just supposed to play physical I think)

Jetdoc

Jetdoc

Hell's Protector

Join Date: Jul 2005

The Eyes of Texas [BEVO]

D/A

If you really want that extra pip, figure out how to use Melandru's Resilience. Horrible elite, but if that's what you want...there's a way to get it.

Orange Milk

Orange Milk

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Mar 2006

Ganking, USA

Retired

R/

Yes, I live in anguish and curse ANet all day because I've only 3 pips of regen, then I log onto a warrior and slit my wrist because of only 2 pips, one with my mending up, talk about BS.

/end sarcasm

Rangers have no spells becasue Rangers are not ment to be spell casters, hence the reason you've energy trouble when casting spells. Try playing a Monk with some adrenilin skills added on, you don't attack enough to build up the adreniline fast enough, hence the reason Monks have no Adreniline skills to begin with.

R A C

R A C

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Sep 2005

In my parent's basement

R/Mo

Rangers don't need spells and are designed that way. If either they had 4 pips or expertise affected spells, they'd be way over powered and a lot of casters would go ranger for the armor or expertise. Rangers can already spread tons of conditions and interupt like crazy. Do you want them to throw around hexs and knockdowns too?

AshenX

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jan 2008

Orange County, CA.

Black Flag

R/

I agree that Assassins and Dervishes in general will use more spells than a ranger...It is part of their basic design. They are built around the use of spells to compete. An assassin does not make any better a nuker than a ranger does. The same is true of a Dervish. None of them are really effective healers. Rangers use preparations, spirits, attack skills, etc to achieve the same thing (character utility and balance) that Sins and Dervs do with their skills.

When deciding which profession to play you must consider what you want to do with the charater. Then choose the profession whose attributes most closely match your preference for playing style for that character. In general you will be less effective in using your secondary profession skills than a character who has that as their primary profession. Play to your strengths.

Energy management is one of the great profession balancing tools. A ranger with as much energy regen as an ele plus half energy cost on all ranger skills would be very inappropriately buffed compared to other professions.

As regards to the comment that in eithr PVP or PVE the only expertise skill that gets used is D-shot....I am very sorry to disagree but you are quite mistaken. I wont go into a list of all of the experise skills that could have a place on your skil bar along with the reasons they shouldnt be overlooked. Instead I shall ask you to re-examine those skills and think of how each of them might make your character more effective with the right build.

Magic Wut Huh Asdf

Magic Wut Huh Asdf

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Oct 2006

Our Peaceful Aria [Live]

R/Me

Most of the spells you will want to cast as a ranger would be ones to benefit your physical attacks, anyhow, which are generally balanced.

For example, in a glass arrows build, you use [skill]Conjure Frost[/skill] or likewise from the elementalist line. It costs 10e, but lasts for a full minute without an enchantment mod before you have to re-cast it. That's 1e every six seconds, or half a pip of energy regen to maintain it.

Others, like a ranger build using [skill]Ebon Dust Aura[/skill] to blind, will need to re-cast their spells more often... 10e every 21 seconds at 8 earth prayers. This is still not outrageous considering the powerful effects of blind, especially when combined with a cheap skill like [skill]Called Shot[/skill], which costs a measely 3e as low as 8 expertise and can be spammed to hit all enemy melees.

So other than spells like these that will compliment your already melee-focused build, there's no real reason for a ranger to carry spells.

Tantra Existantance

Tantra Existantance

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Jun 2006

Ireland

W/

Maybe your using too much 10 energy skills & not letting yourself regain the energy to use it often, leading to bad energy management. As people said before, if you want to cast, be a spellcaster. If you're running Conjure X then just watch the energy cost of the other skills you put into the build.

killing fr fun

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Jan 2008

Sodality of Syon [SoS] (always recruiting)

R/Mo

i have found that while playing this game, as a ranger, in the first few levels it was really hard to successfully cast more than about 2 ranger skills. but as i started to get higher, i found it much easier. now being a level 20 and max expertise it is well easy to use the spells that you once dared to use because of whiping your energy bar.

also i found that the zealous bowstring mod with +1 energy on each hit helped with bringing back energy much faster.

it all depends on your build as many others have quoted and an optional maxing out of expertise. +4 energy regen will just mean that the balance has been broken and rangers will just dominate. you dont want a ranger outcasting an ele do you??

Wakka

Wakka

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Sep 2006

Northern Ireland

R/

Quote:
you dont want a ranger outcasting an ele do you?? Expertise doesn't effect spells so its not going to happen lol

And Zealous is only really useful if your using a skill like Barrage or Volley. Otherwise I don't really find it worth the -1 degen.

Tyla

Emo Goth Italics

Join Date: Sep 2006

Wow, this thread continues?
WTF?

yum

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Sep 2007

W/E

No other class has an odd number of e-regen!!
/signed

Div

Div

I like yumy food!

Join Date: Jan 2006

Where I can eat yumy food

Dead Alley [dR]

Mo/R

Quote:
Originally Posted by tyla salanari
Wow, this thread continues?
WTF? Point got across. Nothing more to discuss. Time to abuse powers to close.

Silly Warrior

Silly Warrior

Hold it!

Join Date: Jul 2006

In your local courthouse.

The Arctic Marauders [TAM] (elite PvE, PM)

Ahh, its great having more moderators now.