Spiteful Spirit: Quick Question

EmpressMila

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Jan 2008

15 Feb 2008 at 08:13 - 1

When using SS, can you cast it on more than one enemy in the same mob and have it effectively double, triple etc. it's damage? Each creature it's cast on that damage being spread around as well?

Not sure exactly is that's how it works (only recently started using it), but if that's indeed how it works and each creature it's cast on then damages one another, I can see why SS is such a powerful build.

Just not sure whether or not that's actually how it works, so debating on it's use for an SS build, but with so many SS builds around I'm really tempted by it's possibility.

Thanks in advance for any clarification

Jamster

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Dec 2007

Avacara Knights

N/Me

15 Feb 2008 at 08:21 - 2

Use it on one creature, every time it attacks, the bunched up group will take (37) damage.
Use it on a second while the hex is still active on the first, and either time either attacks, the group will take (37) damage. So yes, in a word

The long recharge can also be avoided by using HSR mods, and Arcane Echo, Arcane Mimicry etc., spells that could copy SS from a source, an ally or yourself.

gremlin

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Oct 2006

GWAR

Me/Mo

15 Feb 2008 at 09:04 - 3

It's quite devestating esp if the enemy remain bunched up.

I use mesmer as a secondary then I can keep ss going as long as I keep my energy pool up.
Reckless haste adds to the general mayhem and for finishing off the last few targets I use Signet of sorrow and signet of lost souls.

Autonom

Academy Page

Join Date: Jun 2007

Clades Gravior Omnibus [Nos]

N/Me

15 Feb 2008 at 11:02 - 4

I use Arcane Echoe, SS and Ebon Battle Standard of Wisdom for shorter recharge.
Works out pretty well.

the_doode

Academy Page

Join Date: Jan 2008

Croatia

15 Feb 2008 at 11:33 - 5

I usually take Arcane Echo,SS,RH,Desecrate and Defile Enchantments,Mindbender,Auscpicious Incantation and use it in following order; Mb->AI->AE->SS->SS-RH->DE->DE. They'll go down in matter of seconds

. I didn't try to use Battle Standard but it should work great with 20 or 40% hsr set and then Desecrate/Defile could be dropped. In this build my necro has about 60e and when I'm done casting all he still has about 15e (not sure about exact numbers,sorry). Note that this also works great in 55/SS since you'll deal much more damage + you'll have energy to cast 1st and 2nd visage if needed.

Trvth Jvstice

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: May 2006

HALE

15 Feb 2008 at 13:31 - 6

I use [skill]arcane echo[/skill] [skill]spiteful spirit[/skill] [skill]reckless haste[/skill] [skill]parasitic bond[/skill] [skill]spinal shivers[/skill][skill]insidious parasite[/skill] [skill]signet of lost souls[/skill] [skill]resurrection signet[/skill]

dicecube

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Apr 2007

15 Feb 2008 at 19:03 - 7

was Enfeebling Blood nerfed? i don't see why u guys would'nt use it
i still use it everytime I SS regardless

Trvth Jvstice

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: May 2006

HALE

15 Feb 2008 at 19:18 - 8

I used to use enfeebling blood, but since I added reckless haste, I felt that, along with SS and insidious parasite, I have enough anti mele to not worry about adding weakness. Of course I change my build slightly depending on where I am playing. As in adding enchant removal. I think I may have stopped using enfeebling blood because it was a higher energy skill, or the cast time was too long-I can't remember atm. The only reason I'm using parasitic bond is for an easily spammable cover hex with a little healing.

Fuzzy Taco

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Apr 2007

Level Twenty One [HAX]

15 Feb 2008 at 19:41 - 9

everyone else has duly noted that SS works independently on each target it's applied to. as far as builds go, i run this quite a bit, with a minion master / minion bomber / other physicals on my team:

12+1+X Curses
12+1 SR
3 Prot

[skill]Spiteful Spirit[/skill][skill]Enfeebling Blood[/skill][skill]Barbs[/skill][skill]Mark of Pain[/skill][skill]Rebirth[/skill] along with Air of Superiority, Ebon Vanguard Assassin Support, and "Finish Him!".

that build does require a decent rank in a few titles, as well as Eye of the North. if you want to go with something more basic and easy to get, look at the other builds posted, as they're effective.

Longasc

Forge Runner

Join Date: May 2005

15 Feb 2008 at 19:53 - 10

Yes, the Ebon Vanguard Assassin is a the perfect buddy for Mark of Pain!

I used it with MoP to clear the large Mob before the exit in Vloxen Excavations HM. Call MoP and have some of your teammates cast EVA once you call it...^^

@EmpressMila: As people already said, yes. You can try to get a 20/20+20/20 ("40/40") set for your necro, to have a decent change for half recharge/cast time plus maybe combo it with Arcane Echo as suggested.

Fuzzy Taco

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Apr 2007

Level Twenty One [HAX]

15 Feb 2008 at 19:57 - 11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Longasc

Yes, the Ebon Vanguard Assassin is a the perfect buddy for Mark of Pain!

true. i have SS on the bar because it owns so much, but i end up getting caught up spamming Barbs, and MoP when i get the right air of Superiority bonus.

Carinae

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jun 2005

Inside

Fifteen Over Fifty [Rare]

15 Feb 2008 at 22:55 - 12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trvth Jvstice

I used to use enfeebling blood, but since I added reckless haste... Enfeebling Blood is one of the best and strongest skills available to a Curses necro. It's basically Prot Spirit for a necro. Generally speaking, it should be permanently glued on Curses bars. It certainly stomps the heck out of Reckless Haste.

Tyla

Emo Goth Italics

Join Date: Sep 2006

15 Feb 2008 at 23:31 - 13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carinae Dragonblood

Enfeebling Blood is one of the best and strongest skills available to a Curses necro. It's basically Prot Spirit for a necro. More than that!
That skills the bane of all damage!

@The OP:
It doesn't double, but it's based on the attack rate/skill use rate of enemies.

Trvth Jvstice

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: May 2006

HALE

16 Feb 2008 at 00:04 - 14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carinae Dragonblood

Enfeebling Blood is one of the best and strongest skills available to a Curses necro. It's basically Prot Spirit for a necro. Generally speaking, it should be permanently glued on Curses bars. It certainly stomps the heck out of Reckless Haste. Ok, but I wouldn't replace reckless haste with enfeebling blood-I'd replace parasitic bond. When you put SS on someone, then reckless haste, it makes them attack more yet hit less, which is the best way I can think of to buff SS, other than echoing it. I guess you're saying, if you had to choose just one of the two you would take enfeebling blood.

dicecube

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Apr 2007

16 Feb 2008 at 01:04 - 15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trvth Jvstice

Ok, but I wouldn't replace reckless haste with enfeebling blood-I'd replace parasitic bond. When you put SS on someone, then reckless haste, it makes them attack more yet hit less, which is the best way I can think of to buff SS, other than echoing it. I guess you're saying, if you had to choose just one of the two you would take enfeebling blood. say someone was using reckless haste over enfeebling blood. Sure, you make them miss 50% of the time + make them attack faster by 25%, but how about the other 50%? They'll hit you for full damage. On the otherhand, if you used enfeebling blood on attackers, the target and all nearby foes would strike for 66% less damage. Instead of 50 damage, you'd take 16.5 (17) rounded up.

Death By Ketchup

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Mar 2007

Canada

Eternal Transcendence [DRMR]

16 Feb 2008 at 01:26 - 16

I use
arcane echo
spiteful spirit
enfeebling blood
mark of pain
barbs
reckless haste
sig of lost souls
res sig
If theres not much melee damage i swap out mark of pain for desecrate or mabye blood ritual if its being demanded of me lol.

Trvth Jvstice

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: May 2006

HALE

16 Feb 2008 at 01:36 - 17

OK [skill]arcane echo[/skill] [skill]spiteful spirit[/skill] [skill]reckless haste[/skill] [skill]enfeebling blood[/skill] [skill]spinal shivers[/skill] [skill]price of failure[/skill] [skill]signet of lost souls[/skill] [skill]resurrection signet[/skill]

EDIT: I replaced [skill]insidious parasite[/skill] with [skill]price of failure[/skill] PoF works well with reckless haste, because the extra 25% chance to miss stacks with the chance to miss that comes with reckless haste.

dicecube

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Apr 2007

16 Feb 2008 at 02:32 - 18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trvth Jvstice

OK [skill]arcane echo[/skill] [skill]spiteful spirit[/skill] [skill]reckless haste[/skill] [skill]enfeebling blood[/skill] [skill]spinal shivers[/skill] [skill]insidious parasite[/skill] [skill]signet of lost souls[/skill] [skill]resurrection signet[/skill]

Might remove [skill]insidious parasite[/skill] and take [skill]price of failure[/skill] instead. PoF would go well with reckless haste. Would the extra 25% chance to miss stack with reckless haste? Or I might take [skill]parasitic bond[/skill] It's a great cover hex and the extra healing is nice. E-management would be a huge problem for you with that build, especially with spinal shivers draining your energy everytime it triggers. Since you are using /Me secondary, try using some e-management skills from the inspiration skill line. ex AI etc.

Trvth Jvstice

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: May 2006

HALE

16 Feb 2008 at 02:52 - 19

Honestly, I rarely need to use Spinal Shivers, but the few occasions that it's needed it definitely pay off to have it in my skill bar. Most of the time I could easily do without it, but as a N/Me curse necro, I feel that I should take at least one interrupt skill. If you were gathering a pug, and someone advertised as a curse Nec, wouldn't you be surprised if they didn't have an interrupt skill?

So the energy drain from Spinal Shivers isn't much of a problem and I have 58 energy with my wand and offhand plus 15 in Soul Reaping.

Ensign

Just Plain Fluffy

Join Date: Dec 2004

Berkeley, CA

Idiot Savants

16 Feb 2008 at 04:38 - 20

If push came to shove I would drop every single skill on a PvE curse bar for Enfeebling Blood. I can't think of a single skill more valuable that I could take, let alone 8.

Yes, I'd cut Spiteful Spirit for Enfeebling Blood if I had to.

ZenRgy

Zookeeper

Join Date: Jul 2005

Australian Discussion Posse HQ - Glorious leader

҉ ̵̡̢̢̛̛̛̖̗̘̙̜̝̞̟&#

N/E

16 Feb 2008 at 06:30 - 21

Quote:

Originally Posted by dicecube

E-management would be a huge problem for you with that build, especially with spinal shivers draining your energy everytime it triggers. Since you are using /Me secondary, try using some e-management skills from the inspiration skill line. ex AI etc. Or they could just not be terrible with Signet of Lost Souls, it's one of the easiest energy management skills to use.

Osi Ri S

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jan 2006

Trinity of the Ascended [ToA]

16 Feb 2008 at 07:28 - 22

Enfeebling Blood was amazing even when weakness didnt do the -1 to all attributes, but since that change you would have to be an idiot not to bring it.

Moloch Vein

Forge Runner

Join Date: Apr 2007

Reactive Hexing Sucks

[Thay]

16 Feb 2008 at 08:29 - 23

If anyone needs Inspiration e-management on a necromancer bar, it's either the bar or the player that's at fault.

Cathode_Reborn

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Sep 2006

16 Feb 2008 at 09:46 - 24

Spinal shivers can basically turn into a hex version of Broad head arrow if enough people are doing cold damage. Good skill even though I haven't used it in months, but I think "you move like a dwarf" / Power return are more effective as interrupts.

dicecube

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Apr 2007

16 Feb 2008 at 19:17 - 25

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZenRgy

Or they could just not be terrible with Signet of Lost Souls, it's one of the easiest energy management skills to use. yes.. we all know how the enemy target always starts below 50% health

Death By Ketchup

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Mar 2007

Canada

Eternal Transcendence [DRMR]

16 Feb 2008 at 19:43 - 26

Yes because its sooo hard to get a npc below 50% health.

Trvth Jvstice

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: May 2006

HALE

17 Feb 2008 at 00:06 - 27

[skill]arcane echo[/skill] [skill]spiteful spirit[/skill] [skill]reckless haste[/skill] [skill]enfeebling blood[/skill] [skill]spinal shivers[/skill] [skill]price of failure[/skill] [skill]signet of lost souls[/skill] [skill]resurrection signet[/skill]
Alright, with this bar I would arcane echo SS then place Reckless haste, then place the 2nd SS and place PoF. Question is, since SS's best use in a mob is for it's AoE, If PoF is placed over SS (since the one with PoF would die faster) would it cause less overall dmg to the mob?
Would it better to use [skill]Mark of Pain[/skill] instead of PoF?

I haven't tried this yet, I imagine the mob would be mostly dead before I could place PoF. I'm sure some of you have messed around with PoF on a curse Nec, what's your opinion about that skill? Or the skillbar?

Biostem

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Oct 2007

17 Feb 2008 at 00:19 - 28

I use:

Curses: 12 + 1
Soul Reaping: 12 + 2 + 1

[skill]parasitic bond[/skill][skill]spiteful spirit[/skill][skill]reckless haste[/skill][skill]barbs[/skill][skill]enfeebling blood[/skill][skill]mark of pain[/skill][skill]resurrection signet[/skill][skill]hexer's vigor[/skill]

having 15 in soul reaping provides all the energy management I need, and between hexer's vigor and parasitic bond, (which also doubles as a quick-charging cover hex), I never have to worry about my health.

blue.rellik

Forge Runner

Join Date: Feb 2007

Melbourne, Australia

None

17 Feb 2008 at 04:57 - 29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Death By Ketchup

Yes because its sooo hard to get a npc below 50% health.

If you're running low on energy and there aren't any enemies below 50% health then a necromancer (or any damage-dealing caster) are not for you

NamelessBeauty

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jan 2008

Michigan State University, East Lansing, MI

Mo/

19 Feb 2008 at 00:32 - 30

Yes it's exactly how it works.

But you need to be careful. The mob NEED to ball up else it won't be that effective. Thats is why you need 2 person for this build to work. 1 ball up the mob, the other kill. Because of its ineffectiveness when enemy is spreading out. SS isn't that powerful in PvP. Though some builds have SS in their build mostly for defensive purpose. SS > Melee attack less > Your team take less dmg.

Note: Attack does not need to hit for you to trigger the dmg. So combine it with blind or missing hexes will be the best.

Deadly Chaos

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Feb 2008

The X Viles

N/Me

27 Feb 2008 at 14:39 - 31

I always use SS when playing on my PvE Necro

Most of the time i use these skills:

Arcane Echo
Spitefull Spirit
Insidious Parasite
Blood ritual (for supporting monks)
Pain inverter (love this on AoE eles, this is a bosskiller)
"You move like a dwarf" (lovely kd and snare)
Barbs (if i' m with a MM)
Sunspear Rebirth signet

Use that alot, and always test it with different skills but most of the time i come back to this 1

Just cast SS on 2 targets and insidious on the target which is forming the most danger to your monks.

Or echo Pain inverter if ur dealing with 2 strong enemys.

Trisalim

Pre-Searing Cadet

Join Date: Jan 2008

Cleveland

28 Feb 2008 at 23:42 - 32

Still a newb to this game, but for hero/henching I could live without SS. I feel that mobs scatter too much for it to be a tide turner in all but the largest charlie-foxtrots. Maybe I'm not using it right.

Here is my usual bar:

[skill]Barbs[/skill][skill]Enfeeble[/skill][skill]Enfeebling Blood[/skill][skill]Insidious Parasite[/skill][skill]Mark of Pain[/skill][skill]Spiteful Spirit[/skill][skill]Signet of Lost Souls[/skill][skill]Arcane Echo[/skill]

EB and Barbs/MoP are my bread and butter. Again this is solo hero/hench ,physicals of course.

I rarely see Enfeeble listed on these forums but I like it. I don't rely on it by any means, but it is nice for stray physicals that chase me or my monks, /edit it's not a hex nevermind.

Abedeus

Grotto Attendant

Join Date: Jan 2007

Niflheim

29 Feb 2008 at 10:53 - 33

Enfeeble AND Enfeebling Blood is useless. You want AoE weakness - swap EB for Epidemic. Less energy, no energy sacrifice, faster cast.

Oh, and Reckless Haste + SS = win.

Alicendre

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Apr 2006

29 Feb 2008 at 11:12 - 34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Abedeus

Oh, and Reckless Haste + SS = win. In NM, yup. In HM it's useless since mobs attack faster.

Also, if you feel that mobs scatter, you should take a water Ele with slowing spells.

Moloch Vein

Forge Runner

Join Date: Apr 2007

Reactive Hexing Sucks

[Thay]

29 Feb 2008 at 12:42 - 35

In HM it's useless because then it only provides 50% miss rate?

Osi Ri S

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jan 2006

Trinity of the Ascended [ToA]

29 Feb 2008 at 21:18 - 36

50% miss rate is good, but when they do hit its going to be for 80+dmg and will be harder for your monks to handle than say if you were using enfeebling blood, which cuts dmg down to around 20-40s ive noticed which is much easier on the monks...

Plus 50% miss rate is bad for synergy with Insidious Parasite since you need a hit for Insidious to steal the health. So if you use RH youre basically cutting down IP to stealing health 50% of the time which isnt as good.

dicecube

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Apr 2007

01 Mar 2008 at 00:37 - 37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Abedeus

Enfeeble AND Enfeebling Blood is useless. You want AoE weakness - swap EB for Epidemic. Less energy, no energy sacrifice, faster cast.

Oh, and Reckless Haste + SS = win. stop lying to everyone

Trvth Jvstice

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: May 2006

HALE

01 Mar 2008 at 01:51 - 38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alicendre

In NM, yup. In HM it's useless since mobs attack faster.

Also, if you feel that mobs scatter, you should take a water Ele with slowing spells. What am I missing here? With [skill=text]spiteful spirit[/skill] applied, don't you want your enemies to attack faster? And, with [skill=text]reckless haste[/skill] applied enemies will attack even faster, therefore killing themselves even faster.

And in PVE [skill=text]enfeebling blood[/skill] is the most important curse skill you can take. How does Hard Mode negate the use of these essential curse skills?

blue.rellik

Forge Runner

Join Date: Feb 2007

Melbourne, Australia

None

01 Mar 2008 at 02:50 - 39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Abedeus

Enfeeble AND Enfeebling Blood is useless. You want AoE weakness - swap EB for Epidemic. Less energy, no energy sacrifice, faster cast.

Oh, and Reckless Haste + SS = win. What the? How is using two skills for one better?

Osi Ri S

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jan 2006

Trinity of the Ascended [ToA]

01 Mar 2008 at 03:07 - 40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trvth Jvstice

What am I missing here? With [skill=text]spiteful spirit[/skill] applied, don't you want your enemies to attack faster? And, with [skill=text]reckless haste[/skill] applied enemies will attack even faster, therefore killing themselves even faster.

And in PVE [skill=text]enfeebling blood[/skill] is the most important curse skill you can take. How does Hard Mode negate the use of these essential curse skills? In Hard Mode the monsters automatically have a attacking speed buff of i think 50% so since their attack speed is already increased the cap wont allow them to attack any faster with RH on them. so using RH for just the speed buff is useless.

Enfeebling Blood is even more important in HM.

Since everyone is posting theirs ill post my build that i use almost exclusively:

[card]Spiteful Spirit[/card][card]Insidious Parasite[/card][card]Enfeebling Blood[/card][card]Signet of Lost Souls[/card][card]Defile Enchantments[/card][card]Barbs[/card]Necrosis, Sunspear Rebirth Signet

Sometimes ill switch out Barbs with Desecrate Enchantments or BR depending on what is needed. I use barbs for when i have a MM or alot of physicals of course.

Granted i got EOTN so i havent had most of the new skills to play around with.