Is there any reason to run Tactics anymore?
Draiyne Valure
Quote:
Originally Posted by blue.rellik
I've had necros cast Insidious Parasite and Empathy on me when I'm a elementalist with a wand.
I've lost all faith in the intelligence of reguler ABers Interestingly, I've seen casters wand themselves to death through Insidious Parasite and Empathy.
I've lost all faith in the intelligence of reguler ABers Interestingly, I've seen casters wand themselves to death through Insidious Parasite and Empathy.
Longasc
Quote:
Originally Posted by LifeInfusion
It seems sort of frivolous to run Tactics now even in PvE.
(...)
the last reason to use Tactics (Watch Yourself) on a warrior disappeared I think. Yes, we could discuss if it is dead or if it just got kicked in the balls till only a bloody mass was left, but well...
The whole "Soldier's" line was killed. I really liked Soldier's Defense. Now there is no longer any shout besides "For Great Justice" that warrior can reasonably maintain to meet the "under a shout" mechanics of these skills.
Healing Signet maybe the last reason this line exists at all.
I still do not get it that after that many years Watch Yourself becomes such a problem.
Furthermore, the way it got nerfed does not affect paragons so much, they still get energy and can make use of some more armor, but it kills it for warriors. DOH.
Please nobody crawl along and tell me I should use SY anyways, I do not want to complain about the questionable implementation and power of some PvE skills, too.
(...)
the last reason to use Tactics (Watch Yourself) on a warrior disappeared I think. Yes, we could discuss if it is dead or if it just got kicked in the balls till only a bloody mass was left, but well...
The whole "Soldier's" line was killed. I really liked Soldier's Defense. Now there is no longer any shout besides "For Great Justice" that warrior can reasonably maintain to meet the "under a shout" mechanics of these skills.
Healing Signet maybe the last reason this line exists at all.
I still do not get it that after that many years Watch Yourself becomes such a problem.
Furthermore, the way it got nerfed does not affect paragons so much, they still get energy and can make use of some more armor, but it kills it for warriors. DOH.
Please nobody crawl along and tell me I should use SY anyways, I do not want to complain about the questionable implementation and power of some PvE skills, too.
isamu kurosawa
Quote:
Originally Posted by Draiyne Valure
Interestingly, I've seen casters wand themselves to death through Insidious Parasite and Empathy.
Same here.
Although i've had a mesmer use guilt/shame/mistrust/backfire all at once on me while im playing a cripshot ranger.
Although i've had a mesmer use guilt/shame/mistrust/backfire all at once on me while im playing a cripshot ranger.
Trvth Jvstice
Back to the tactics discussion: It'll take a while to get all of my warrior heroes a strength shield. I have 7 characters and a ton of heroes, so that's quite a few shields. If someone (like myself) were strapped for cash, would you suggest continuing with tactics until enough strength shields are attained? Or, as I've done so far- give them hammers and go hammer/strength attribute? Jora's doing a pretty good job with Earth shaker.
I plan on eventually getting them all strength shields and use the W/P D Slash build. So far only 2 of my Koss's have strength shields. I suppose I could just get collector shields until I get good shields.
I plan on eventually getting them all strength shields and use the W/P D Slash build. So far only 2 of my Koss's have strength shields. I suppose I could just get collector shields until I get good shields.
Stormlord Alex
Just keep on with the Tactics shields and take that 8 armour loss for not meeting the req for now - it won't make much of a difference, really.
kazjun
Just use collector shields. Not like your heroes are going to care if the shield isn't green or gold.
Or you could just use thumpers
Or you could just use thumpers
Beomagi
Is SY really all that? from reading the "official" wiki, it wont add 100 armor, but set all allies to 100 armor.
if that's true, it's not nearly as cracked up as it could be.
if that's true, it's not nearly as cracked up as it could be.
isamu kurosawa
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beomagi
Is SY really all that? from reading the "official" wiki, it wont add 100 armor, but set all allies to 100 armor.
if that's true, it's not nearly as cracked up as it could be. Gain as in additional. If it worked the way you think it would say "set" or "becomes". In total its a near 85%damage reduction so yes it is all that.
if that's true, it's not nearly as cracked up as it could be. Gain as in additional. If it worked the way you think it would say "set" or "becomes". In total its a near 85%damage reduction so yes it is all that.
Arkantos
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beomagi
Is SY really all that? from reading the "official" wiki, it wont add 100 armor, but set all allies to 100 armor.
if that's true, it's not nearly as cracked up as it could be. For (3..6) seconds, all other party members gain +100 armor.
Notice the + in front of the 100.
if that's true, it's not nearly as cracked up as it could be. For (3..6) seconds, all other party members gain +100 armor.
Notice the + in front of the 100.
Trvth Jvstice
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beomagi
Is SY really all that? from reading the "official" wiki, it wont add 100 armor, but set all allies to 100 armor.
if that's true, it's not nearly as cracked up as it could be. The wiki says: "An armor bonus of 100 reduces armor-affected damage by 82.32%." That's a BONUS of 100 armor, so for a few seconds Olias has 160 armor,
if that's true, it's not nearly as cracked up as it could be. The wiki says: "An armor bonus of 100 reduces armor-affected damage by 82.32%." That's a BONUS of 100 armor, so for a few seconds Olias has 160 armor,
Luminarus
Tactics is dead due to overabuse by paragons... my suggestion put all warrior shouts into the strength attribute with links to tactics:
EG:
Watch Yourself
4 Adrenaline
10 Seconds you and you're party gain +5-21 armor. This skill has 50-100% failure with Strength 4 or less.
As good as it used to be for warrior primary's (who doesnt use 5 strength) whilst it sucks for paragons, because it will simply fail (no leadership abuse). Also this skill now doesnt need the 4 recharge because paragons cant use it.
Do similar concepts to all the tactics skills, giving them a fail chance to prevent paragon abuse. Then unnerf them so that they are good again and tactics is back.
EG:
Watch Yourself
4 Adrenaline
10 Seconds you and you're party gain +5-21 armor. This skill has 50-100% failure with Strength 4 or less.
As good as it used to be for warrior primary's (who doesnt use 5 strength) whilst it sucks for paragons, because it will simply fail (no leadership abuse). Also this skill now doesnt need the 4 recharge because paragons cant use it.
Do similar concepts to all the tactics skills, giving them a fail chance to prevent paragon abuse. Then unnerf them so that they are good again and tactics is back.
Trvth Jvstice
Before SY, the only Tactics skill I used was Watch Yourself, unless I was running or soloing in some areas. I'm sure we'll get an update soon that will make some Tactics skills usable. Looking at the Tactics line, it wouldn't take much to make several of the skills quite usable.
Eldin
[skill]Healing Signet[/skill]
Sole reason I still play Tactics, not to mention my shields. Most of my builds focus primarily on Axe Attacks and Adrenal Buildup (though I find Lion's Comfort stupid, you don't always have adrenaline when you need to heal yourself, what about those UW encounters where the foes are dead, you have no monk around, and all you can do is stand there and degen to death after the bleeding they just did on you?).
I have always put about 5 points into Strength just for additional Sprint, though. :P
Sole reason I still play Tactics, not to mention my shields. Most of my builds focus primarily on Axe Attacks and Adrenal Buildup (though I find Lion's Comfort stupid, you don't always have adrenaline when you need to heal yourself, what about those UW encounters where the foes are dead, you have no monk around, and all you can do is stand there and degen to death after the bleeding they just did on you?).
I have always put about 5 points into Strength just for additional Sprint, though. :P
JDRyder
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stormlord Alex
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Eldin
[skill]Healing Signet[/skill]
Sole reason I still play Tactics all war heals suck imo, i find it better not take a heal, when do you not have a monk/healer? D: [skill]Signet of Pious Light[/skill][skill]Vital Boon[/skill] > all warriors heals as for tactics they always sucked. nothing but blocking skills for the most part, fear me was the only reason i used tactics, that and dual chage war set ups when i get lazy and just want to run the mission/quest :P yes watch youself was nice but i didnt find it worth the points in tactics for 1 skill
MasterSasori
For fun and originality. The only reason I can possibly think of.
]SK[
WY was the only tactics skill I used. I've been running Item + Strength for a long time now. Shame really.
klownbobo
Quote:
Originally Posted by LifeInfusion
Auspicious Parry - doesn't work against caster groups
i think Auspicious Parry works against any attack now
Marty Silverblade
Quote:
Originally Posted by klownbobo
|
If the enemy casters are trying to kill you by wanding you then you may as well not bother using skills. If thay target you with spells, AP won't do a thing.
![]SK[](/static/static/../Img/avatar57917_6.gif){kind=avatar}
|
[card]Signet of Pious Light[/card][card]Vital Boon[/card] > all warrior heals
Hqlf the plqyers donùt run q selfheql qt qll: Zhy spec into qnother qttribute line qnd use é slots: Dammit Guru hates me again and wants to replace my characters. Beomagi
http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Save_yourselves
did anyone actually check the official wiki before commenting? see point 3 "This skill does NOT give +100 but 100 armor (as if all affected party members have 100 AL)." I don't have much faith in what I read on most games. if anyone here ever played diablo 2, that should be instinct.
Stormlord Alex
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beomagi
Coloneh
Quote:
Originally Posted by JDRyder
all war heals suck imo, i find it better not take a heal, when do you not have a monk/healer? D:
the monk is not your bitch. be a team player.
Winterclaw
Quote:
Originally Posted by Luminarus
Tactics is dead due to overabuse by paragons... my suggestion put all warrior shouts into the strength attribute with links to tactics:
My suggestion is to nerf paragons such that they can't gain energy from warrior shouts.
And as others have said, I only bring along tactics so I can use my shield and use heal sig... though I feel like I'd almost be better off putting the points into my secondary class instead.
Eldin
Quote:
Originally Posted by JDRyder
all war heals suck imo, i find it better not take a heal, when do you not have a monk/healer? D:
[skill]Signet of Pious Light[/skill][skill]Vital Boon[/skill] > all warriors heals as for tactics they always sucked. nothing but blocking skills for the most What if I have reasons not to go /D? Also, I like to hold my own as much as I can (I AM supposed to be the tank, or did Terratanking and Dervishes steal that from me?) without putting a load on the monk.
Racthoh
Quote:
Originally Posted by JDRyder
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Coloneh
the monk is not your bitch. be a team player.
Yes the monks should spec into smiting and deal damage like the warriors too.
Arkantos
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coloneh
the monk is not your bitch. be a team player.
No, the monk is the teams bitch as long as players aren't retarded and try to aggro the whole area. It's their job to keep everyone alive, just like it's a warriors job to do damage (or to tank if your team fails).
Murmel
Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterclaw
And as others have said, I only bring along tactics so I can use my shield and use heal sig... though I feel like I'd almost be better off putting the points into my secondary class instead. Exactly the same for me. First when I tried out warrior I went straight for tactics. Now I'd rather not even touch the attribute... So, for me there's only 2 reasons for using tactics: Heal Signet and a cool shield  But mostly I still go strength (as I'm more of a spiking type than a tank :P) So no, nor in pve nor pvp, I see no REALLY good reason for using tactics. Other than Gladiators Defense as it can be usefull when tanking 4 Luxon sins
Accursed
I only use Tactics for the shield and [skill]Healing Signet[/skill].
Coloneh
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arkantos
No, the monk is the teams bitch as long as players aren't retarded and try to aggro the whole area. It's their job to keep everyone alive, just like it's a warriors job to do damage (or to tank if your team fails).
the monk is along to heal the damage mobs throw at you. if the warrior dosnt take any sort of slef-preservation skills and aggros quite a few mobs they can expect to die.
Savio
The monk is there to preserve the team, whether it be through healing or through protection. Monks using prot as well as midliners using defensive skills mean warriors don't have to bring shitty self-defensive skills.
Arkantos
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coloneh
|
Quote:
|
No, the monk is the teams bitch as long as players aren't retarded and try to aggro the whole area
in my last post.
samcobra
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coloneh
the monk is not your bitch. be a team player.
Are you joking? Yes he RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing is my bitch! The whole point of a monk is to keep the party alive longer than the others so that the warriors can kill stuff. If the monk wasn't doing that and 'being my bitch,' then he serves no use and you might as well take another damage character.
The monk definitely needs to cater to the warrior, removing his blind, hexes, etc. The warrior in a build is the number one priority for the monks, aside from themselves, since the warriors are the actual damage dealers and accomplish the ultimate goal of the game.
Crom The Pale
Off topic but here is a priority list for a monk in most any party.
1: Himself, if he dies he can't very well heal anyone else now can he? 2: The party members most likely to die first from the next dmg taken. 3: Party members with a hard res, no point saving a war with a used signet and letting the hard res die. 4: The war, unless he qualifies as #2 or has done an excelent pull and is taking 75%+ of the dmg from mob. If a party member must be sacrificed to keep the rest of the party alive, then it MUST be the warrior. Back on topic, there will always be a reason to use tactics, just not a good one. Variety of builds to keep the game from getting to static, however you will be sacrificing efficiency and effectiveness to use tactics.
Trvth Jvstice
Trust me -there will be an update to Tactics soon--ANet wouldn't really make and keep an entire attribute unusable... would they?
Survey says: NO
Winterclaw
Quote:
ANet wouldn't really make and keep an entire attribute unusable... would they?
Yeah they would if another class could exploit that line or the line is one where it is either overpowered or underpowered with no space in between. | Or if, you know Izzy doesn't want to bother with fixing it.
Eldin
My build primarily focuses on Axe Mastery:
[skill]Eviscerate[/skill][skill]Executioner's Strike[/skill] Muahahahahaha. I still use Tactics somewhat JUST for: [skill]Healing Signet[/skill] Still OWNS Lion's Comfort, at least in my opinion. Though I'm not all Tactics, I put remaining points in Strength for: [skill]Sprint[/skill] What a lazy fiend I am. Methinks my farming builds are null now though. Chthon
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trvth Jvstice
ANet wouldn't really make and keep an entire attribute unusable... would they?
Hello? Beast Mastery? Blood Magic? You bet they would.
Tyla
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chthon
Hello? Beast Mastery? Blood Magic? You bet they would.
You forgot gimmicks there.
(PvP-ish, but still, Tactics is useless in both now apart from Paragons, which use 1 skill of the line.) Bloodspike and Bunny Thumper, Packhunter. Outside of that....100% useless.
Arkantos
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trvth Jvstice
Trust me -there will be an update to Tactics soon--ANet wouldn't really make and keep an entire attribute unusable... would they?
Survey says: NO There's still a few quite useless attributes in the game right now. So yes, they would keep tactics useless. They're most likely going to keep it useless until they do something about paragons. Tyla
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arkantos
There's still a few quite useless attributes in the game right now. So yes, they would keep tactics useless. They're most likely going to keep it useless until they do something about paragons.
And I think Izzy is a bit concious on that because he doesn't want to *completely* destroy a class, I think.
Mind you that's the only true way to sort some classes out, Assassins for instance... Zahr Dalsk
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trvth Jvstice
Trust me -there will be an update to Tactics soon--ANet wouldn't really make and keep an entire attribute unusable... would they?
Spawning Power
Anyways... yeh. Spawning Power needs reworking. |
