Ok, so I just upgraded to a 320MB 8800GTS from a 256MB 8600GT.
Now, when I stand in Kamadan D1 I get 20 FPS on the 8800GTS, but on my 8600 I always had 35 FPS minimum, it never went under that, ever.
What the hell? I updated my drivers, I did everything accordingly, but the performance of this supposedly ''Better'' video card is more of a Degrade rather than an Upgrade, the only other games it plays better is CoD4 and Crysis, but in Guild Wars it runs like crap.
Anyone have Ideas or insight? any help would be much appreciated, thanks.
EDIT: and Jumping the gun a bit, I can say this video card sucks and I'm going to send it back in and get a 512MB 8800GT.
Another note, further tests have proven that huge cluster-f*cks of people (Huge Crowds) take down my 8800 GTS, but the 8600 could handle it decently, that card performed as I expected it to, not this one.
Question: About video cards.
Brianna
moriz
the 8800GTS has a huge power draw compared to the 8600GT. it doesn't help that you got the older 8800GTS version also. the higher power consumption might be causing it to throttle back, since it might not be getting enough power.
the new 8800GTS has 512mb and the full 128(?) stream processors. if you are willing to spend the same amount of money, this version will beat the 8800GT in terms of performance.
the new 8800GTS has 512mb and the full 128(?) stream processors. if you are willing to spend the same amount of money, this version will beat the 8800GT in terms of performance.
Gorebrex
^^Agreed. You didn't mention what size/manufacturer of your power supply. That's an important factor.
Brianna
Its the EVGA version of the card, my Power supply is this http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16817371004
People say they run 8800GT cards on that power supply just fine, it has plenty enough power to run the card it seems.
Also my system has never crashed or shut down on me, so I know everything is getting enough power.
Just let me know if you don't think I am, or something, just really want to get to the bottom of this. And honestly any 8800 is better than any 8600 in respective terms, so I should see the same/if not better performance.
Note: I guess since you will probably wonder if I'm bottle necking, here is my PC specs: AMD Athlon 64 6000+, 2GB of RAM and a 7200RPM Sata HDD.
People say they run 8800GT cards on that power supply just fine, it has plenty enough power to run the card it seems.
Also my system has never crashed or shut down on me, so I know everything is getting enough power.
Just let me know if you don't think I am, or something, just really want to get to the bottom of this. And honestly any 8800 is better than any 8600 in respective terms, so I should see the same/if not better performance.
Note: I guess since you will probably wonder if I'm bottle necking, here is my PC specs: AMD Athlon 64 6000+, 2GB of RAM and a 7200RPM Sata HDD.
Blackhearted
On that power supply: 18 amps on the 12V rail is a bit weak. Especially for higher end cards. It's very possible that it could be a power issue due to that.
Brianna
Could anyone recommend a more powerful supply then? I heard this one could run the 8800 just fine, but if not then I guess I'll upgrade.
Is there any Ill effects of changing power supplies? Will I have to reformat my HDD?
Needs to be around the 60$ range preferably lower, but I don't know how much watts/power you can get for that much, I'm very tight on money right now. Honestly I can't buy one at the moment, maybe if I had to I could shoot for 80-100$ range but I don't really want to.
Is there any Ill effects of changing power supplies? Will I have to reformat my HDD?
Needs to be around the 60$ range preferably lower, but I don't know how much watts/power you can get for that much, I'm very tight on money right now. Honestly I can't buy one at the moment, maybe if I had to I could shoot for 80-100$ range but I don't really want to.
Pasha the Mighty
no, a new psu won't need any reinstalling or anything. For my new rig, which I will get in a month, Im getting the corsair 650tx psu. Its not modular, but imho that's not necessary. I was planning on getting the 8800gt, and was advised to have about 600w, so i decided on corsair's 650w psu. Also, as nvidia is going to bring out it's new gpu's soon, you might consider asking for a refund for the gts, buy a new psu from the money, wait a month or so, and then get 640 gts, cuz i think nvidia might be lowering the price with the new cards coming out and all. Also, you should never try to save on a psu by getting second hand or getting a crappy brand, cuz you risk frying your pc if you do
Brianna
Yeah, but I can care less about the new series of video cards, plus mine comes with the ''90 day step-up program''.
Honestly if I get a 9 series card, then I'd jut go out and buy a whole new Mobo with that, and I don't have a job at the moment so that is out of the question right now.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16817182032 what about this one? or is that not powerful enough?
I don't know where to check for ''Amps'' but this card said it recommends 26 Amps on each rail or something.
NOTE: I don't care about the stupid LED lights, I just want a cheap supply that gives enough power, that's all I care about.
Honestly if I get a 9 series card, then I'd jut go out and buy a whole new Mobo with that, and I don't have a job at the moment so that is out of the question right now.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16817182032 what about this one? or is that not powerful enough?
I don't know where to check for ''Amps'' but this card said it recommends 26 Amps on each rail or something.
NOTE: I don't care about the stupid LED lights, I just want a cheap supply that gives enough power, that's all I care about.
Pasha the Mighty
i meant an 8 series gts, they'll lower the price when the 9 series comes out right?
Admael
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Brianna
Yeah, but I can care less about the new series of video cards, plus mine comes with the ''90 day step-up program''.
Honestly if I get a 9 series card, then I'd jut go out and buy a whole new Mobo with that, and I don't have a job at the moment so that is out of the question right now. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16817182032 what about this one? or is that not powerful enough? I don't know where to check for ''Amps'' but this card said it recommends 26 Amps on each rail or something. NOTE: I don't care about the stupid LED lights, I just want a cheap supply that gives enough power, that's all I care about. |
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Pasha the Mighty
i meant an 8 series gts, they'll lower the price when the 9 series comes out right?
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Of course this could be a marketing ploy by nvidia to prevent consumers from sellign their 8 series cards too quickly.
Regardless, as of now, the 8800 GTS 512 is superior.
http://valid.x86-secret.com/show_oc.php?id=319287
Surena
I've installed several Seasonic S12II 380W PSU's with a [email protected],2/3,4/3,8Ghz (overclocked), with 4 GB Ram, 8800 GT and they all work perfectly.
The Geforce-9 series are replacing the 8 series but they're all just NVIDIA's temporal answer to ATI's threats, thus you shouldn't expect anything new.
I'd either get a 8800 GT or the "old" 8800 GTX. The G92 GTS isn't worth getting over the G92 GT since it suffers from the bandwith limitation which the G80s do not, and that is noticable above the "standard" resolution, so:
up to 1280x1024 = 8800 GT
from 1680x1050 on = 8800 GTX (280€ here)
resolutions above that = SLI =D
The Geforce-9 series are replacing the 8 series but they're all just NVIDIA's temporal answer to ATI's threats, thus you shouldn't expect anything new.
I'd either get a 8800 GT or the "old" 8800 GTX. The G92 GTS isn't worth getting over the G92 GT since it suffers from the bandwith limitation which the G80s do not, and that is noticable above the "standard" resolution, so:
up to 1280x1024 = 8800 GT
from 1680x1050 on = 8800 GTX (280€ here)
resolutions above that = SLI =D
Brianna
I'm on 1280x1024 resolution, with a DVI cable (Which I'm not happy with, having problems opposed to my VGA).
I didn't wanna spend all the cash for a 512MB one, this one cost me 200$ without the 20$ rebate, that's exactly why I bought it, and I knew it had more power than my 8600 which is all I cared about, I'm not trying to be the ''Best of the Best'' here, I just want something that can play new games and look pretty without lagging.
I didn't wanna spend all the cash for a 512MB one, this one cost me 200$ without the 20$ rebate, that's exactly why I bought it, and I knew it had more power than my 8600 which is all I cared about, I'm not trying to be the ''Best of the Best'' here, I just want something that can play new games and look pretty without lagging.
Eldin
Lots of video cards from Nvidia, despite having higher numbers than older models, are really nothing but rehashes of the older models but with DX9/10 support.
I would simply focus on getting a better power supply instead of attempting to buy a new card, since that seems out of your league.
Also, I use a GeForce 7800 GS OC - FPS is in 40s-60s (depending on area) when just running around, it can go as low as 20 in a crowded Kamadan. Video cards work in strange ways.
I would simply focus on getting a better power supply instead of attempting to buy a new card, since that seems out of your league.
Also, I use a GeForce 7800 GS OC - FPS is in 40s-60s (depending on area) when just running around, it can go as low as 20 in a crowded Kamadan. Video cards work in strange ways.
Brianna
I know, well I'm quickly losing my patience for PC's because it's breaking my bank and every time I buy a new part it requires some other stupid part to support it.
Guess I'll have to go buy a new power supply anyways.. perhaps it was inevitable. If I do, at least I can power up my old PC with this supply.
Guess I'll have to go buy a new power supply anyways.. perhaps it was inevitable. If I do, at least I can power up my old PC with this supply.
Admael
Can you still return your 320 GTS? Also, the G80 GTX, but it, like it's older brother, runs very hot, and plus, its physically large, only barely fitting in most mid-tower cases.
Here's how my old GTX looks:
As I had to relocate my hard drives from the main bay, to a lower bay.
EDIT: Brianna, your current Antec power supply works fine, since thats 18amps PER 12v rail, there are 2 12 volt rails on that PSU, meaning totaling you at 36 amps. You do not need a new PSU.
Here's how my old GTX looks:
As I had to relocate my hard drives from the main bay, to a lower bay.
EDIT: Brianna, your current Antec power supply works fine, since thats 18amps PER 12v rail, there are 2 12 volt rails on that PSU, meaning totaling you at 36 amps. You do not need a new PSU.
Brianna
Oh thank god, I didn't want to order a new one.. then I wonder what the problem is?
I just find it comical that an 8600 plays Guild Wars better than an 8800.
My computer case has another good 4-6 inches to spare after putting the 8800 GTS in, I have a Lian Li case: http://www.newegg.com/product/produc...82E16811112099
Anyway yes I can still return it most likely, or use the step-up program to get a better card that is more suitable, I was really just thinking of the 512MB 8800 that has the normal heatsink, not the huge one.
I just find it comical that an 8600 plays Guild Wars better than an 8800.
My computer case has another good 4-6 inches to spare after putting the 8800 GTS in, I have a Lian Li case: http://www.newegg.com/product/produc...82E16811112099
Anyway yes I can still return it most likely, or use the step-up program to get a better card that is more suitable, I was really just thinking of the 512MB 8800 that has the normal heatsink, not the huge one.
Agent Mold3r
Wow, my 6800GT runs GW , BF2, CoD4, and CS:S easily. Kamadan dis 1 gives me no lag whatsoever.
Brianna
Well, more specifically I get 50-60 FPS in Guild Wars on both the cards, but in highly congested areas my 8600 produced 35 FPS minimum, 8800 makes 20 or less in high congestion.
By high congestion I mean dozens and dozens of people in one area, it would lag anyone, just shouldn't lag the 8800 as bad as it does.
By high congestion I mean dozens and dozens of people in one area, it would lag anyone, just shouldn't lag the 8800 as bad as it does.
Admael
Ah, well as you can see in my picture above, the GTX only has about 1cm headway till it hits the hard drive bays, in my case. Compare it to my GTS
As for your 8800 GTS, I'm not sure what the problem is, since you're getting 50-60, it seems your GTS is running in nominal parameters.
As for your 8800 GTS, I'm not sure what the problem is, since you're getting 50-60, it seems your GTS is running in nominal parameters.
Blackhearted
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Admael
EDIT: Brianna, your current Antec power supply works fine, since thats 18amps PER 12v rail, there are 2 12 volt rails on that PSU, meaning totaling you at 36 amps. You do not need a new PSU.
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Brianna
Ok, so do I need a new Power Supply or not? Getting a little bit confused.
Any other hypothetical explanations for the bad card performance? I noticed white artifacts in Guild Wars with both Video Cards, figured It's something I had to live with but maybe that is bad too?
Any other hypothetical explanations for the bad card performance? I noticed white artifacts in Guild Wars with both Video Cards, figured It's something I had to live with but maybe that is bad too?
Admael
No you don't need a new PSU, multiple rails are just +12v outputs that come from the same +12v source. (not to mention the MAXIMUM amps per +12v rail on a multiple 12v rail PSU is 20.)
Pasha the Mighty
Brianna, what i was trying to say is, the moment those 9 series cards come out, they'll probably lower the prices of the 8 series ones. That's why, if you just ask for a refund for your 320mb gts and wait till the new ones come out, you can probably afford a better 8 series card with the same amount of money. I'm not telling you to get a 9 series card, cuz they just suck (cooling wise, anyway)
kvndoom
Nobody's asked yet... Are all your 3D settings exactly the same as when you ahd the 8600, or did you bump up the eye candy in the Nvidia driver panel? I know I typically crank up the AA, AF, and all that good stuff when I get a faster card, by habit. That's why we upgrade, right? 
It looks better (just went from a 7900GT to a 8800GT 512), but does bog down in some places because I've got the image quality up fairly high.
If you've upped any IQ settings in the drivers, that could very well make your faster card slower than the old one, under certain circumstances. If, however, all your driver settings are exactly the same as with the 8600, then you shouldn't be getting any slowdown.
A quality 500W power supply is more than enough for a single video card. I'm using a 500W Thermaltake on my system and it runs 24/7 and is at 100% CPU load probably half the time it is on. So unless your PSU is actually bad (doubtful, from what you've said so far), you're fine.
If you can return the card and get an 8800GT 512, I'd strongly suggest it, though. It's better in every conceivable way.
It looks better (just went from a 7900GT to a 8800GT 512), but does bog down in some places because I've got the image quality up fairly high.If you've upped any IQ settings in the drivers, that could very well make your faster card slower than the old one, under certain circumstances. If, however, all your driver settings are exactly the same as with the 8600, then you shouldn't be getting any slowdown.
A quality 500W power supply is more than enough for a single video card. I'm using a 500W Thermaltake on my system and it runs 24/7 and is at 100% CPU load probably half the time it is on. So unless your PSU is actually bad (doubtful, from what you've said so far), you're fine.
If you can return the card and get an 8800GT 512, I'd strongly suggest it, though. It's better in every conceivable way.
Brianna
All my settings are ''Application Controlled'' cause forcing on like X4/X8 AA did nothing in video games, it only ever works if I turn the feature on in game. Was the same with the other card, so nothing changed no.
Also I've had my power supply for over 1 year and it runs my PC 24/7 with no problems, so I don't think its bad.
And about the 512MB 8800GT, that's what I'm thinking of getting actually, it seems to be better, and from what I've heard a lot of people say, it is.
I am strongly disappointed in this card, Guild Wars should not be able to take it down like it does, I've ran Guild Wars better on older systems.
And Pasha, they might lower the prices on 8800's but I don't think it will get much lower than the 150$ range (For say an 8800GT 512mb) for a long time, and I just want to play my games now, I have 90 days to ''Step-Up'' to a new video card, so It's no problem.
This is the one I wanted: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814130318
Also I've had my power supply for over 1 year and it runs my PC 24/7 with no problems, so I don't think its bad.
And about the 512MB 8800GT, that's what I'm thinking of getting actually, it seems to be better, and from what I've heard a lot of people say, it is.
I am strongly disappointed in this card, Guild Wars should not be able to take it down like it does, I've ran Guild Wars better on older systems.
And Pasha, they might lower the prices on 8800's but I don't think it will get much lower than the 150$ range (For say an 8800GT 512mb) for a long time, and I just want to play my games now, I have 90 days to ''Step-Up'' to a new video card, so It's no problem.
This is the one I wanted: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814130318
Admael
The 8800 GT is a very good card, probably doesn't help that I'm EVGA bias also. That's actually the card I was planning to get around December, but it was sold out for almost 2 months, and by then the G92 GTS came out.
Plus with EVGA, just remember you're "borrowing" the card. In 90 days or less, if a new card intrigues you, you can upgrade for the price of the difference + shipping.
With that said, if you can return the G80 GTS 320, do so now. The G92 GT 512 is superior to the G80 GTS 320 in everyway, including lower power consumption and clock, memory, and shader speeds.
There's something you need to know about power supplies. It's referred to as electrolytic capacitor aging, or just "capacitor aging". A PSU will lose some of its initial wattage capacity when heavily used, or used over an extended period of time.
Plus with EVGA, just remember you're "borrowing" the card. In 90 days or less, if a new card intrigues you, you can upgrade for the price of the difference + shipping.
With that said, if you can return the G80 GTS 320, do so now. The G92 GT 512 is superior to the G80 GTS 320 in everyway, including lower power consumption and clock, memory, and shader speeds.
There's something you need to know about power supplies. It's referred to as electrolytic capacitor aging, or just "capacitor aging". A PSU will lose some of its initial wattage capacity when heavily used, or used over an extended period of time.
Brianna
Yeah, I know. I'm EVGA Biased too as well. But I might go with a BFG tech card in the future.
Step-Up program by EVGA is Ftw though.
So what do you recommend more, the 512MB (G92) GTS or the 512MB GT?
Step-Up program by EVGA is Ftw though.
So what do you recommend more, the 512MB (G92) GTS or the 512MB GT?
Admael
For the money, The G92 GT 512 is much more of a deal. But the G92 GTS 512 is essentially a better card, because of its dual-slot nature, the G92 GTS has better cooling.
I recommend the G92 GTS 512 *only* if you can afford it. Given it's nature, it has the potential to outbench a 8800 Ultra stock, and match a 8800 Ultra OC'ed.
I recommend the G92 GTS 512 *only* if you can afford it. Given it's nature, it has the potential to outbench a 8800 Ultra stock, and match a 8800 Ultra OC'ed.
Pasha the Mighty
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Admael
For the money, The G92 GT 512 is much more of a deal. But the G92 GTS 512 is essentially a better card, because of its dual-slot nature, the G92 GTS has better cooling.
I recommend the G92 GTS 512 *only* if you can afford it. Given it's nature, it has the potential to outbench a 8800 Ultra stock, and match a 8800 Ultra OC'ed. |
Admael
At stock/factory OC speeds? Ultra kills G92 GTS hands down.
I know I'm totally hijacking this thread by answering your question;
But look at the potential of a G92 GTS. Nvidia left us with so much headroom with a G92 GTS, and a little overvolting can do wonders to the that card (my G92 GTS). And I know, my puny 70 GB/s memory bandwidth can't compare with Ultra's 108 GB/s, but that only _really_ matters for higher resolutions, right?
The advantage that the Ultra has over the GTS? It runs hotter, slower, and has bigger pipes (larger bus width, resulting in more memory bandwidth).
If you get an Ultra, you'll not only be paying more now, but what of the energy consumption?
I know I'm totally hijacking this thread by answering your question;
But look at the potential of a G92 GTS. Nvidia left us with so much headroom with a G92 GTS, and a little overvolting can do wonders to the that card (my G92 GTS). And I know, my puny 70 GB/s memory bandwidth can't compare with Ultra's 108 GB/s, but that only _really_ matters for higher resolutions, right?
The advantage that the Ultra has over the GTS? It runs hotter, slower, and has bigger pipes (larger bus width, resulting in more memory bandwidth).
If you get an Ultra, you'll not only be paying more now, but what of the energy consumption?
Surena
Standard resolution, no AA/AF, and the G92 GTS is a winner, you could call it the fastest single-gpu card to some extent. Once you start using 4AA/16AF/quality features and go beyond the standard resolution (let's start at 1680x1050) the performance drop is pretty epic. The lack of bandwith blows and then there's the VRAM limit.
There is no way a G92 GTS could be considered as an alternative to the 8800 Ultra, performance-wise.
There is no way a G92 GTS could be considered as an alternative to the 8800 Ultra, performance-wise.
Pasha the Mighty
He was right about hijacking the thread allright XD.
Now back on topic: I would say, go with the GT, unless you can justify the 70 bucks extra you're paying for the gts, just to get a little bit more performance, which according to this review: http://www.tweaktown.com/articles/12...512/index.html
can totally be achieved by the gt, if you overclock it. I'm not sure wether you would do that though, and I'm not sure either wether the EVGA warranty covers overclocking. Do any companies cover that?
Now back on topic: I would say, go with the GT, unless you can justify the 70 bucks extra you're paying for the gts, just to get a little bit more performance, which according to this review: http://www.tweaktown.com/articles/12...512/index.html
can totally be achieved by the gt, if you overclock it. I'm not sure wether you would do that though, and I'm not sure either wether the EVGA warranty covers overclocking. Do any companies cover that?
Admael
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Pasha the Mighty
He was right about hijacking the thread allright XD.
Now back on topic: I would say, go with the GT, unless you can justify the 70 bucks extra you're paying for the gts, just to get a little bit more performance, which according to this review: http://www.tweaktown.com/articles/12...512/index.html can totally be achieved by the gt, if you overclock it. I'm not sure wether you would do that though, and I'm not sure either wether the EVGA warranty covers overclocking. Do any companies cover that? |
Remember that article was written just as the GTS was launched over 3 months ago :P
Pasha the Mighty
nope, on newegg evga's 512 gts is 300 bucks http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814130312
while the gt 512 is 230 bucks http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814130318
while the gt 512 is 230 bucks http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814130318
Brianna
I can't spend that much cash, so the 512 GTS is out of the question, next best thing for me is the 512 8800GT.
Also I have no idea how to over-clock things, and when I installed nTune it kept giving me all sorts of errors so I uninstalled that.
Mainly I don't know what to expect when I over clock, I don't know what to look for so I don't know if it worked or not. All I really wanted to do was boost the cards fan speed up so it runs cooler, as people say.
Also I have no idea how to over-clock things, and when I installed nTune it kept giving me all sorts of errors so I uninstalled that.
Mainly I don't know what to expect when I over clock, I don't know what to look for so I don't know if it worked or not. All I really wanted to do was boost the cards fan speed up so it runs cooler, as people say.
Pasha the Mighty
I can't overclock either (yet), mainly cuz my system will still be crap even after I spend hours on that. When I upgrade my sys though, I will, but there are probably millions of guides out there which explain how it works. And dont use nTune, it sucks, or so i've read...
illmatic89
Get Rivatuner, great program for graphics cards. Lots of options to tweak. You can download it from guru3d.com.
Admael
nTune is garbage, I agree with Rivatuner being one of the best.
But if you're just trying to play Guild Wars with some decent frames, I'm sure the 8800 GT 512 will get you you what you need, even at stock speeds.
But if you're just trying to play Guild Wars with some decent frames, I'm sure the 8800 GT 512 will get you you what you need, even at stock speeds.
Brianna
Ok well I just installed RivaTuner, just by starting it up I can't mess anything on my PC up right?
I'm very paranoid about messing with my hardware's settings, I don't want my computer to fry out.
I'm very paranoid about messing with my hardware's settings, I don't want my computer to fry out.
illmatic89
Your fine if you just start it up to check some options out. Try not to mess with the registry though, which is under the power user tab. To overclock your gpu there is a tiny arrow beside forceware detected on the main tab, click on it and go to system settings. You can do a lot of stuff under system settings like overclocking your gpu and changing the fan speed.