Why don't ppl use this for an Imbagon?

The IAS isn't there just to fuel SY, it also increases your damage output. There isn't a good reason why you wouldn't want an IAS on any kind of paragon.

Spear of Fury doesn't maintain SY as much as an IAS does, not to mention it requires a condition and takes the place of a stronger PvE skill. Well, as long as we are talking about PvE, let us be clear that highest DPS is not the point of the "imbagon". In fact, high DPS is guaranteed by the splinter rits and the curse (SS/barbs) and blood (OoP/MoF) necros, IAS or not. In places where maxing DPS actually matters in PvE (i.e., this new fascination with timed elite runs), I'd be using an Essence of Celerity instead of a precious skill slot.

Now about the condition for SoF: clearly you shouldn't throw it at anything that doesn't have a condition. Personally, I have one of the necros use Enfeebling Blood as a starter, so I have a cheap and plentiful source of conditions. If that weren't enough, there's always Anthem of Weariness (though that is a wasted skill slot IMO).

Losing AR also lets me dump TNTF! (whose sole point, as I see it, is to keep AR alive between battles) and gain a whole new PvE skill. EBSofHonor is my personal favorite (and is already enshrined in the PvXWiki version of the build).

ETA: there are nearly no paragon-usable PvE skills stronger than SoF. 1 second activation, up to +6 hits of adrenaline, 6-8 seconds of recharge, and a higher (if shallower) +damage curve than Mighty Throw. That's what the kids call "epic win" these days, I believe.

Losing AR also lets me dump TNTF! (whose sole point, as I see it, is to keep AR alive between battles) and gain a whole new PvE skill. So:
-TNTF has no value other than to keep AR up.
-Spear of Fury is better than another PvE skill.
-Maintaining SY isn't important.
-IAS isn't important.

Taking all of those into account, why are you bringing an imbagon if you aren't going to bother with the imba part?


Bringing an IAS is the single best way to increase a martial character's DPS, more than any single attack skill. That Splinter Weapon, the necro buffs - all of those get better when you add an IAS. What skills are you so desperately wanting to bring that you can't use a "precious skill slot" for an IAS?

As far as PvE skills go, "I Am The Strongest!", "Finish Him!", and "You Move Like a Dwarf!" are all stronger than Spear of Fury, if you aren't already bringing Ebon Battle Standard of Honor.

-Maintaining SY isn't important. I don't recall actually saying this. All the other points are debatable.

Why are you keeping up an IAS between battles, anyway? Call me crazy, but I like to start my battles with more than 5 energy.

I don't recall actually saying this. All the other points are debatable. Considering that your primary (only?) method of keeping SY up is via Spear of Fury, yes it's less important. If you have any other way of gaining adrenaline faster, Spear of Fury's adrenaline gain stops being important, so you have no reason to bring the skill.

Even if you do drop the IAS what are you possibly going to put in those slots that would be more useful? I have never said drop the IAS. I have said IAS is unnecessary to maintain SY!. The latter does not in any way imply the former.

FWIW, my current vanq setup is: SY!, SoF, Chest Thumper, Disrupting Throw or GftE!, AR, TNTF!, FGJ! and FA.
12+2 Leadership, 10+1 command (if bringing GftE!), 8+1 Spear Mastery.
Cracked armor and weakening supplied by an SS necro hero.
OoP, DF and MoF supplied by a blood necro (not a huge fan of your D/N ninja healing orders on heroes)
Third hero is usually a the standard GvG motigon template with Empathic Removal. Sometimes I toss in a signet smiting mesmer for the lulz (usually around undead).
Henchies are usually one healer, a KD if available, a BHA if available, or just the Sandstorm warder and Eve.

Vanqing so far has been a breeze. Joko's was pretty straightforward. Tahnnakai Temple (wihout the Meet the Emperor hack) caused one wipe because I idiotically chose to fight in an intersection of jade patrols, but was otherwise uneventful. Haven't made it to Tyria yet, but I suspect Eastern Frontier and Sacnoth Valley will require further tweaking.

It has been about 1/10th as difficult as when I got leg. vanq on my ranger, though that is also partly because I did that long before EotN.

I have never said drop the IAS. I have said IAS is unnecessary to maintain SY!. Actually you repeatedly said that IAS is unnecessary without any qualifications. Even specifying that it is not needed for SY, saying it's unnecessary is meaningless; no skill is an absolute must in PvE, and you can jump through all sorts of hoops to maintain SY without an IAS. However, paragon builds with an IAS are better than paragon builds without IAS.

So again, what is SoF doing? You get more than enough adrenaline from spear chucking, and the damage is outclassed by other PvE skills.

Actually you repeatedly said that IAS is unnecessary without any qualifications. I still don't see the difference you are trying to draw. The point of the imbagon is to maintain SY!. IAS is unnecessary for maintaining SY!. Hence, IAS is unnecessary for the imbagon. I don't see a contradiction.

SoF is an awesome spear attack which one-shots my first SY!. If that is a convoluted hoop to jump through, then this game must be easier than I thought. I wouldn't part with SoF for minor luxuries like IAS! or EBSoH. If push came to shove, I would drop AR and TNTF!, and I usually do if I'm bringing Essence of Celerity, or if I need oddball skills like Anthem of Envy and Fall Back! for their niche uses (e.g., timed and chapter-ending missions).