Okay i just made a Paragon with Guildie of mine, And were doing this together step by step but were wanting to take it full step for Survivor. As of right now there lvl 7... And we chose to go Warrior on the 2ndary. Already grabbed max armor from Docks to extra safety us some.
Now my biggest question is what would be the best build/way setup should we go with doing this? I'm actually fairly new at the Paragons. Had NF since it came out just never really got into one enough to keep one made. Were wanting to do some if not alot of dmg output, But i understand to need to do the buffs from both sides as well. But kinda confused on what road should take to what i should be more apt to mess with and make this whole thing work out for us.
So if anybody could plz give some kind of feedback on it, I would really appreciate it. Kinda tired about time to hit the sack so if need to ask some questions help with answering me plz ask them and i will reply as soon as i can to make it easier for you guys. Thanks.
EDIT: Sorry i did forget to mention i do have ALL the Chapters & EoTN. Sorry hehe.
Need some input with Paragon Build
FreakTheMad
![[Morkai]](/static/static/../Img/avatar144860_1.gif){kind=avatar}
[Morkai]
Well for the "ultimate" "Paragod" build the usual skills are:
There's Nothing to Fear! [Sunspear Rank]
Save Yourselves! [Kurzick/Luxon Title Track]
For Great Justice [Warrior]
Other than that the rest is yours to decide, i understand you're only on Istan atm and don't have access to any Elites, but when you get chance grab Soldier's Fury or another skill that increases adren gain.
TNTF and SY! Are awesome, especially when chained on 2 para's.
As for Hench, take one Healer to be safe and an Elementalist (you have enough physical damage from you 2 Paragons)
Any questions, just ask.
Hope this helps buddy.
There's Nothing to Fear! [Sunspear Rank]
Save Yourselves! [Kurzick/Luxon Title Track]
For Great Justice [Warrior]
Other than that the rest is yours to decide, i understand you're only on Istan atm and don't have access to any Elites, but when you get chance grab Soldier's Fury or another skill that increases adren gain.
TNTF and SY! Are awesome, especially when chained on 2 para's.
As for Hench, take one Healer to be safe and an Elementalist (you have enough physical damage from you 2 Paragons)
Any questions, just ask.
Hope this helps buddy.
Tyla
What Berek said, and run atleast 10 Leadership.
But it would help alot if you stated if you have X campaign.
But it would help alot if you stated if you have X campaign.
FreakTheMad
Okay ty on the fast responce. and Tyla i edited my 1st post. I did forget to mention that sorry. I do have everything so it's not like it's a issue to get where need to.
[Morkai]
Quote:
Originally Posted by FreakTheMad
Okay ty on the fast responce. and Tyla i edited my 1st post. I did forget to mention that sorry. I do have everything so it's not like it's a issue to get where need to.
No worries, TNTF is your main skill anyway, use it upon recharge.
Good luck with your Survivor.
Good luck with your Survivor.
gw_poster
Freak, I'm was in your exact same boat...I started my paragon last weekend in NF, as soon as I got into Kamadan I ferried over to the docks (400g) and got max armor - I bought a cheap, low req max zealous spear, low req shield and did the primary quest chain till I got dunkoro (already had koss early on). I did all primaries and a few of the easy ones with just me and koss using exp scrolls the whole time. Btw: I made ranger as my secondary so I could level a pet at the same time in case I ever want a pet. As soon as level 10 (about 3-4 hours playing time as i recall) - i went to eotn to boreal station. With the buff, all of your att's are increased and hp is equivalent to level 20. Since I've been there, I've leveled to 20 just killing snow wurms - they never hit you (unless ur standing directly next to them - but with max armor they do hardly any damage anyway) and with a 10 minute 2x or 3x (twice as expensive) exp scroll I've moved to L1 survivor in about 4 hours. Slow, but absolutely safe. Also, with the ranger secondary, I charmed the level 5 polar bear right outside before u get to the wurms, and he's level 18 elder atm. The only time you'll need anyone else is when u initially accept the bounty from Thor whatever his name is...he'll fight u and u'll need a little help. For that run, however, just flag your h/h right there and they will be out of exp/loot range. There is always one or two chest on the short (10-15 min) run and usually about 12-18 wurms. Don't go past the trees over the bridge (you'll see where I mean), or you may spawn an aloe thing that does significant damage and u could possibly lose ur survivor.
Btw: my skill bar consists of:
I have all my points in Spear Mastery (especially initially) and Command
Major Spear Mastery Rune
Minor Command Rune (+1 command headpiece)
Major Vigor Rune
2 Vitae Runes
Survivor and Centurion Insignias for the rest
GFTE (bought a tome)
Find Their Weakness }
Barbed Spear }
Wild Throw } Pretty much all the skills
Merciless Spear } available from Kamadan skill trainer and secondary
Spear of Lighting } profession quest
Cruel Spear (bought an elite tome)
Charm animal
The bar is probably not optimized, as I am severely limited in what skills I can get (unless I get more tomes), but it is fulfilling its purpose atm. Since I'm by myself and can't be harmed, I don't bother with motivation or healing skills at all. Initially, its kind of tough to kill a wurm before it burrows back down, but as you level you can do it. Typically, I can clear the wurms before the scroll runs out, but I'll use a cheaper one for the last couple if I don't finish in time. I'll let the pet attack until he gets to about 30 hp, then put him on heel and he's evolved into elder as a result. Depending on how you want to evolve your pet, if at all, you may want to read the other threads on pet evolution and play accordingly.
After 6 tries at doing survivor normally (by playing through the quest/mission chain), with the last one ending in my 530k exp Warrior's demise - I wanted to go the slow, but safe route. Hope this helps, and good luck!
Btw: my skill bar consists of:
I have all my points in Spear Mastery (especially initially) and Command
Major Spear Mastery Rune
Minor Command Rune (+1 command headpiece)
Major Vigor Rune
2 Vitae Runes
Survivor and Centurion Insignias for the rest
GFTE (bought a tome)
Find Their Weakness }
Barbed Spear }
Wild Throw } Pretty much all the skills
Merciless Spear } available from Kamadan skill trainer and secondary
Spear of Lighting } profession quest
Cruel Spear (bought an elite tome)
Charm animal
The bar is probably not optimized, as I am severely limited in what skills I can get (unless I get more tomes), but it is fulfilling its purpose atm. Since I'm by myself and can't be harmed, I don't bother with motivation or healing skills at all. Initially, its kind of tough to kill a wurm before it burrows back down, but as you level you can do it. Typically, I can clear the wurms before the scroll runs out, but I'll use a cheaper one for the last couple if I don't finish in time. I'll let the pet attack until he gets to about 30 hp, then put him on heel and he's evolved into elder as a result. Depending on how you want to evolve your pet, if at all, you may want to read the other threads on pet evolution and play accordingly.
After 6 tries at doing survivor normally (by playing through the quest/mission chain), with the last one ending in my 530k exp Warrior's demise - I wanted to go the slow, but safe route. Hope this helps, and good luck!
Richardt
Once you hit level 10, I would recommend hitting up EotN and farming the dwarf punchout thingy. Easy way to get rank1 survivor (I think it took me 2 hours or so with scrolls).
From EotN you can grab a couple of sweet para elites early on-HoS has Song of Restoration-not the best with the recent....change, but it'll do nicely until you can buy an elite tome or cap. Focused Anger.
Stunning Strike is also floating around in a couple easy dugeons-like Cathedral of Flames. And Cruel Spear is floating around in Rrager's. These are pretty easy to get to elites if you don't want to mess around in NF-and they're pretty good on the damage output.
As for buddying up for later pwnage, I would say one of you go with the classic "Imbagon" (note you'll need to have rank1 Kurzick/Luxon for this) and the other guy run either Cruel Spear or Stunning Strike, and set your heroes up along the Triple Necro "Sabway" and Racthoh's "Racway".
Links for both are:
Racway: http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10254869
Sabway: http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10200851
Those however will be more for later on when you guys get more heroes though. For more immediate usage, run the N/Rt healer from Sabway, the Orders derv from Racway (should already have Mel.) and the SoP from Racway. For the healer and SoP, you'll need to do the Asuran side....but the only problem with that is getting there (for safety I would recommend going to Gad's via HoS).
I'll stop rambling now XD
From EotN you can grab a couple of sweet para elites early on-HoS has Song of Restoration-not the best with the recent....change, but it'll do nicely until you can buy an elite tome or cap. Focused Anger.
Stunning Strike is also floating around in a couple easy dugeons-like Cathedral of Flames. And Cruel Spear is floating around in Rrager's. These are pretty easy to get to elites if you don't want to mess around in NF-and they're pretty good on the damage output.
As for buddying up for later pwnage, I would say one of you go with the classic "Imbagon" (note you'll need to have rank1 Kurzick/Luxon for this) and the other guy run either Cruel Spear or Stunning Strike, and set your heroes up along the Triple Necro "Sabway" and Racthoh's "Racway".
Links for both are:
Racway: http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10254869
Sabway: http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10200851
Those however will be more for later on when you guys get more heroes though. For more immediate usage, run the N/Rt healer from Sabway, the Orders derv from Racway (should already have Mel.) and the SoP from Racway. For the healer and SoP, you'll need to do the Asuran side....but the only problem with that is getting there (for safety I would recommend going to Gad's via HoS).
I'll stop rambling now XD
MercenaryKnight
If you guys want to both get legendary survivor (I think that's what you want). Once your able to go to eotn and kill the wurms outside of boreal station together. They are melee range so they can never hit you, once you both reach level 20 turn on hard mode and farm them some more. It's better than the punchout because if you lag their's no worry about a death unless you run into melee range.
FreakTheMad
Okay, Really appreciate the replies everyone. now that i got a nice base plan to work around 
Mr. Undisclosed
Two SY/TNTF builds chanining their skills is epic, your survival is pretty much guarenteed.
blue.rellik
[skill]Aggressive Refrain[/skill]
If anyone tells you not to use that then they are bad players. NEVER take that off your skill bar
If anyone tells you not to use that then they are bad players. NEVER take that off your skill bar
MMSDome
Quote:
Originally Posted by blue.rellik
[skill]Aggressive Refrain[/skill]
If anyone tells you not to use that then they are bad players. NEVER take that off your skill bar Take AR of your skill bar if your party is using an essence of celerity and you have an extra pve slot to use up and put in drunken master.
If anyone tells you not to use that then they are bad players. NEVER take that off your skill bar Take AR of your skill bar if your party is using an essence of celerity and you have an extra pve slot to use up and put in drunken master.
samcobra
I generally use drunken master as my all-purpose PvE IAS
blue.rellik
That's assuming you have the beer lying around
Cathode_Reborn
"TNTF" + "SY" are always on my bar. Not gonna waste my 3rd pve skill on an ias. I switch between Spear of fury, "I am the strongest", and the ebon honor ward.
For a survivor though, maybe Aggressive refrain isn't the best choice.
For a survivor though, maybe Aggressive refrain isn't the best choice.
blue.rellik
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cathode_Reborn
"TNTF" + "SY" are always on my bar. Not gonna waste my 3rd pve skill on an ias. I switch between Spear of fury, "I am the strongest", and the ebon honor ward.
For a survivor though, maybe Aggressive refrain isn't the best choice. You are wrong
For a survivor though, maybe Aggressive refrain isn't the best choice. You are wrong
Cathode_Reborn
Quote:
Originally Posted by blue.rellik
You are wrong
.........no u
.........no u
Fantus
Quote:
Originally Posted by blue.rellik
You are wrong
Funny, I just had a similar debate on AR in another thread here....
My Paragon doesn't use AR under normal circumstances since the very last thing you want on a Survivor char is a permanent armor penalty. Oh, well, except you're getting your survivor title with Lutgardis FFF run like most other so-called "Survivors" do ....
My Paragon doesn't use AR under normal circumstances since the very last thing you want on a Survivor char is a permanent armor penalty. Oh, well, except you're getting your survivor title with Lutgardis FFF run like most other so-called "Survivors" do ....
Tyla
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fantus
Funny, I just had a similar debate on AR in another thread here....
My Paragon doesn't use AR under normal circumstances since the very last thing you want on a Survivor char is a permanent armor penalty. Oh, well, except you're getting your survivor title with Lutgardis FFF run like most other so-called "Survivors" do .... Just get a Motivation Shield r7/15AL, mod it up, use Purifying Finale.
Presto, no Cracked Armour -- either way, it shouldn't make a difference on getting survivor or not anyway...
My Paragon doesn't use AR under normal circumstances since the very last thing you want on a Survivor char is a permanent armor penalty. Oh, well, except you're getting your survivor title with Lutgardis FFF run like most other so-called "Survivors" do .... Just get a Motivation Shield r7/15AL, mod it up, use Purifying Finale.
Presto, no Cracked Armour -- either way, it shouldn't make a difference on getting survivor or not anyway...
Fantus
Quote:
Originally Posted by tyla salanari
Just get a Motivation Shield r7/15AL, mod it up, use Purifying Finale.
Presto, no Cracked Armour -- either way, it shouldn't make a difference on getting survivor or not anyway... You also could use three Monk Heroes and stuff mass condition removal on them so they get rid of Cracked Armor for you...
Seriously: In case you missed the point of a Survivor char: The point is not tossing one extra spear at your enemies every now and then, the point of a Survivor char is not dying...
Presto, no Cracked Armour -- either way, it shouldn't make a difference on getting survivor or not anyway... You also could use three Monk Heroes and stuff mass condition removal on them so they get rid of Cracked Armor for you...
Seriously: In case you missed the point of a Survivor char: The point is not tossing one extra spear at your enemies every now and then, the point of a Survivor char is not dying...
Tyla
...I think I know...
Cracked Armour won't make a difference, and an IAS could = MORE adrenaline, MORE damage, and LESS "oshi a monster killed me".
That -20 Armour will NOT make a difference in a near-wipe situation anyway.
And besides, your Monks (Hero OR Hench) should have all the energy in the world if you're running an Imbagon...
Cracked Armour won't make a difference, and an IAS could = MORE adrenaline, MORE damage, and LESS "oshi a monster killed me".
That -20 Armour will NOT make a difference in a near-wipe situation anyway.
And besides, your Monks (Hero OR Hench) should have all the energy in the world if you're running an Imbagon...
Res Ipsi
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fantus
You also could use three Monk Heroes and stuff mass condition removal on them so they get rid of Cracked Armor for you...
Seriously: In case you missed the point of a Survivor char: The point is not tossing one extra spear at your enemies every now and then, the point of a Survivor char is not dying... I've seen you throw plenty of spears! Remember that all-para FoW trip we took? You were up in the front tossing spears like no one's business. Had to weld a leash on your armor ^^
Seriously: In case you missed the point of a Survivor char: The point is not tossing one extra spear at your enemies every now and then, the point of a Survivor char is not dying... I've seen you throw plenty of spears! Remember that all-para FoW trip we took? You were up in the front tossing spears like no one's business. Had to weld a leash on your armor ^^
Stormlord Alex
*insert convenient LOLcat*
/thread
/thread
Res Ipsi
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stormlord Alex
*insert convenient LOLcat*
/thread Go play the game if you're bored.
/thread Go play the game if you're bored.
Pyro maniac
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fantus
You also could use three Monk Heroes and stuff mass condition removal on them so they get rid of Cracked Armor for you...
Seriously: In case you missed the point of a Survivor char: The point is not tossing one extra spear at your enemies every now and then, the point of a Survivor char is not dying... dead enemies won't kill you tho
Seriously: In case you missed the point of a Survivor char: The point is not tossing one extra spear at your enemies every now and then, the point of a Survivor char is not dying... dead enemies won't kill you tho
Fantus
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pyro maniac
dead enemies won't kill you tho
Unfortunately their default state is "alive".
Shaz
Quote:
Originally Posted by blue.rellik
[skill]Aggressive Refrain[/skill]
If anyone tells you not to use that then they are bad players. NEVER take that off your skill bar lol, so true. I'd listen to this advice if I were you.
If anyone tells you not to use that then they are bad players. NEVER take that off your skill bar lol, so true. I'd listen to this advice if I were you.
angmar_nite
Quote:
Originally Posted by Res Ipsi
Go play the game if you're bored.
thou shalt not silence stormlord's lolcats.
FreakTheMad
Well i can see the topic turn for the worst.
/sigh
/sigh
blue.rellik
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fantus
Unfortunately their default state is "alive".
Throwing lots of spears quickly at them will turn them off
Fantus
Quote:
Originally Posted by FreakTheMad
Well i can see the topic turn for the worst.
The problem with the advice some people give here is that it violates some basic principles of playing a Survivor char. With a Survivor character you always want to have high armor and high health at all times. You might also try not to be the first one to run in and catch aggro. With the way the AI sometimes behaves, you even might not want to be the one having the highest damage output in the party in general.
Paragons make great Survivor chars because they
a) Have high armor
b) Are ranged/utility characters who can stay in the midline/backline of the party.
c) Have lots of skill to mitigate/reduce damage impact on your group
Whether or not AR is generally a good skill or not isn't the question here, the question here is what it's best to bring on a Survivor char to ensure success and lowering your armor does the opposite of that. In my humble opinion the best approach for a Survivor Paragon is to set up your build defensively. Your job in that picture is not to kill things but to keep pressure off your party and a Paragon can do that better than any other class in the game. The greatest skill to bring is TNTF, hands down, particularly since Elonian born chars get decent Sunspear rank very early in their life. For a low level Survivor Paragon with no Elite skill available I would recommend also bringing Stand Your Ground and interchange those two skills (SYG isn't available at skill trainers until Realm of Torment, but you can use a Cap Sig at the Para boss in Jahai Bluffs to get it early).
Assuming you play with heroes a lot (like most Survivors), take a Minion Master and bring Go for the Eyes (which is also good energy management for you). "They are on Fire" goes well with an SF ele and further reduces damage intake to your group. "Save Yourselves" is a good skill to bring to boost your party mates's AL but keep in mind it doesn't affect YOU (which is a little disadvantage since you're the one who doesn't want to die, but it still keeps pressure of your group as a whole). Also, obviously there is no point in using both Stand Your Ground and SY at the same time, since the maximum AL bonus is capped. Use them alternatively. SY is not that great if your Allegiance Rank is lower than 3, btw.
So, here goes. These skills will greatly help your party's survival capability at lower levels without actually lowering your own defenses. I used them on my Survivor Paragon for a long time, until I got enough caps etc. to make more powerful bars. TNTF is still in pretty much every bar I run.
Paragons make great Survivor chars because they
a) Have high armor
b) Are ranged/utility characters who can stay in the midline/backline of the party.
c) Have lots of skill to mitigate/reduce damage impact on your group
Whether or not AR is generally a good skill or not isn't the question here, the question here is what it's best to bring on a Survivor char to ensure success and lowering your armor does the opposite of that. In my humble opinion the best approach for a Survivor Paragon is to set up your build defensively. Your job in that picture is not to kill things but to keep pressure off your party and a Paragon can do that better than any other class in the game. The greatest skill to bring is TNTF, hands down, particularly since Elonian born chars get decent Sunspear rank very early in their life. For a low level Survivor Paragon with no Elite skill available I would recommend also bringing Stand Your Ground and interchange those two skills (SYG isn't available at skill trainers until Realm of Torment, but you can use a Cap Sig at the Para boss in Jahai Bluffs to get it early).
Assuming you play with heroes a lot (like most Survivors), take a Minion Master and bring Go for the Eyes (which is also good energy management for you). "They are on Fire" goes well with an SF ele and further reduces damage intake to your group. "Save Yourselves" is a good skill to bring to boost your party mates's AL but keep in mind it doesn't affect YOU (which is a little disadvantage since you're the one who doesn't want to die, but it still keeps pressure of your group as a whole). Also, obviously there is no point in using both Stand Your Ground and SY at the same time, since the maximum AL bonus is capped. Use them alternatively. SY is not that great if your Allegiance Rank is lower than 3, btw.
So, here goes. These skills will greatly help your party's survival capability at lower levels without actually lowering your own defenses. I used them on my Survivor Paragon for a long time, until I got enough caps etc. to make more powerful bars. TNTF is still in pretty much every bar I run.
Shaz
Quote:
Fantus
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaz
If you're not going to play as you normally would then you should just go HFFF or boxing for Survivor if you're so afraid of losing that title so much tbh.
Disregarding that flamebait comment about HFFF for a sec - The key to play a successful survivor is neither leeching your way to the title (XP Farming or getting runned through missions etc. is not survivoring at all...) NOR taking unnecessary risks. I would qualify intentionally lowering a Survivor char's AL to be an unnecessary risk and thus extremely bad advice. In a Survivor char's life, particularly if you play them normally, there will be situations where those 20 AL will make the difference between success and failure (and even if it's only because of "subtle" things like your trusted henchie monk using futile Condition Removal on you in the very moment he rather should heal the frontline). Why some people insist that running around with Perma-Cracked Armor on a Survivor char would be a good idea is beyond me, particularly since there are great skill options for a Paragon that will enhance your survival chances instead of lowering them.
blue.rellik
Well that's the difference between you and me. I'm a good enough player that I use skills that lower my armour 99% of the time and I still win and kill things
I'm elitist
I'm elitist
Shaz
lol it wasnt flamebait, I don't see how it is. But I see no differences between a survivor who got it with HFFF/boxing or one who get it with overly defensive build or quit if they're about to die, etc. Except for the fact that the one HFFF/boxing will get it faster and safer. There more glory to the title when you play it as you normally would and get it, that's a true survivor. That said though, I don't really care how people get it, survivor title is survivor title to me.
Edit: lol <3 blue's posts
Edit: lol <3 blue's posts
Fantus
Quote:
Originally Posted by blue.rellik
I'm elitist
If you have something useful to add to this discussion, go ahead. If not, I would suggest go troll somewhere else.
blue.rellik
Telling someone to use AR is the best advice for a paragon
Stormlord Alex
this thread still needs moar LOLcats... =[
Fantus
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaz
lol it wasnt flamebait, I don't see how it is. But I see no differences between a survivor who got it with HFFF/boxing or one who get it with overly defensive build or quit if they're about to die, etc. Except for the fact that the one HFFF/boxing will get it faster and safer. There more glory to the title when you play it as you normally would and get it, that's a true survivor. That said though, I don't really care how people get it, survivor title is survivor title to me.
It's a matter of taste in the end whether go offensively or defensively. If you want to be a hardcore survivor, go make an Assassin and tank the Searing Flames boss while not wearing armor. The other extreme is HFFF where you can get a "Survivor" title without even fighting. I prefer the middle ground I guess. I have used AR on my Survivor Paragon a few times myself, although not while I was less experienced with it. It's ok to do if you know your Paragon AND how to play a Survivor AND if it fits into the teambuild. This thread is not about how you or I would play their Paragons, though - it is for a person NEW to the class (except for some obvious trolls we're trying to help the OP here, right?). Intentionally lowering the AL on a Survivor is nothing I would recommend doing to a person who isn't yet really used to this class.
Oh well, I guess the OP can tell for him-/herself now what they want to do. *shrug*
Oh well, I guess the OP can tell for him-/herself now what they want to do. *shrug*
Res Ipsi
The OP requested info on the best build to run to get his para to survivor (assuming he intends to actually play and not leech). Given that, I'd think anyone who *has* gotten this title would have better insights into how to go about it. I'd put my money on Fantus in this regard.