The added effects they inflict can be good, [card]Wanderlust[/card] is like a weaker version of [card]Water Trident[/card]. The problem is that the damage they do is lame, and you can't use Summon Spirits in PvP. Smart players will just walk away from the ghosties, anyway.
Perhaps some snares, to keep the opposition close to the spirits?
Has anyone found a use for attack spirits?
Cosmic Error
Stormlord Alex
They pretty much suck balls for everything apart from a few solo quests in EotN.
Spirits are too fragile for serious PvP use. A warrior with an axe will chew through your ghosts in a few short seconds, and any ranger who's not busy wanking will eat you alive.
And everyone else can walk away.
Which is good, because spiritspam is lame, degenerative play.
Spirits are too fragile for serious PvP use. A warrior with an axe will chew through your ghosts in a few short seconds, and any ranger who's not busy wanking will eat you alive.
And everyone else can walk away.
Which is good, because spiritspam is lame, degenerative play.
Terraban
I like Bloodsong to trigger "if a spirit is within earshot" clause. Other than that...not really.
They can be pretty brutal in RA with 3-4 of them + Painful Bond.
They can be pretty brutal in RA with 3-4 of them + Painful Bond.
randomperson
pV's new GvG build is good.
Cosmic Error
I suppose I'll just stick with Restoration/Channeling support then.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Terraban
Quote:
I like Bloodsong to trigger "if a spirit is within earshot" clause. Other than that...not really.
I use Bloodsong for that too, it's so survivable.
horseradish
Quote:
Originally Posted by randomperson
pV's new GvG build is good.
Yeah, it's frickin' crazy.
Degen out the ASS.
Degen out the ASS.
moko
as most of you probably have no clue what they say;
the build runs without physicals -- it's based on degen and hexes, yet there has to be a direct damage source. spirits take that role over. they're the last bit to push you over the edge usually.
however, they're based on a character that's not always available (flagrunner). they just come, put the flag, poop spirits and run a new one. by the time he's back, the spirits are either down and it's time to renew them. a smart way to handle their cast times and recharges, while still being effective during other times.
but yeah, overall spirits are fairly useless, suppose they only fit into gimmicks, or a single spirit on a rit's bar to suit the "spirit in earshot range" as already been posted.
the build runs without physicals -- it's based on degen and hexes, yet there has to be a direct damage source. spirits take that role over. they're the last bit to push you over the edge usually.
however, they're based on a character that's not always available (flagrunner). they just come, put the flag, poop spirits and run a new one. by the time he's back, the spirits are either down and it's time to renew them. a smart way to handle their cast times and recharges, while still being effective during other times.
but yeah, overall spirits are fairly useless, suppose they only fit into gimmicks, or a single spirit on a rit's bar to suit the "spirit in earshot range" as already been posted.
blue.rellik
but attack spiriits let me see losts of yeluw numbers 
Draginvry
Quote:
Originally Posted by Terraban
They can be pretty brutal in RA with 3-4 of them + Painful Bond.
Yeah, they can be usefull to spirit stack, particularly in maps where you know you will have environmental altitude or chokepoints.
But in general, attack spirits are useless unless you are doing something lame like choke point guarding or camping. This isn't to say that these tactics don't work, but that a "smart" opponent will just wait you out and not take the bait.
But as far as RA, I don't think you have to worry too much about smart opponents. Then again, I don't remember a match where people didn't run lame builds. So, meh. I guess attack spirits are gimmicky either way, since they usually revolve soley around [skill=text]painful bond[/skill]
But in general, attack spirits are useless unless you are doing something lame like choke point guarding or camping. This isn't to say that these tactics don't work, but that a "smart" opponent will just wait you out and not take the bait.
But as far as RA, I don't think you have to worry too much about smart opponents. Then again, I don't remember a match where people didn't run lame builds. So, meh. I guess attack spirits are gimmicky either way, since they usually revolve soley around [skill=text]painful bond[/skill]
BigDave
Alone, attack spirits are pretty bad. Stack em up, use painful bond and get em hitting the same target and they will do some massive damage. Having said that, they are very fragile, take ages to set up and are immobile (unless you use summon spirits).
In situations where there are bottle-necks and you're going to be there a while they can be devastating. I use an offensive spirit build on my rit when i do the G.O.L.E.M quest in EotN. The destroyers are forced into a narrow space at the beginning and the spirits tear them up very nicely, and i can drop spirits on both sides to add more damage. I wouldn't use it anywhere else though really. Maybe for eternal grove (bottle-neck again). If you need to be mobile as in 99% of the things you do there are better options available.
In situations where there are bottle-necks and you're going to be there a while they can be devastating. I use an offensive spirit build on my rit when i do the G.O.L.E.M quest in EotN. The destroyers are forced into a narrow space at the beginning and the spirits tear them up very nicely, and i can drop spirits on both sides to add more damage. I wouldn't use it anywhere else though really. Maybe for eternal grove (bottle-neck again). If you need to be mobile as in 99% of the things you do there are better options available.
spirit of defeat
I Love attack spirits,
It's the build I use the most,
[skill]pain[/skill][skill]bloodsong[/skill][skill]Anguish[/skill][skill]Painful Bond[/skill][skill]Offering of Spirit[/skill]([skill]Ancestors' Rage[/skill] / [skill]Splinter Weapon[/skill] / )
Atributes al round 10-12
Communing
Channeling
Spawning
It's quite easy to use, set up and siply draw the spirits into battle, painful bond, cast the weapon skill, or rage on your frontliners.
And it's powerfull.
In RA you need a diffrent one:
[skill]Boon of Creation[/skill][skill]pain[/skill][skill]Dissonance[/skill][skill]Wanderlust[/skill][skill]Shadowsong[/skill][skill]Serpent's Quickness[/skill][skill]Troll Unguent[/skill][skill]Resurrection Signet[/skill]
at least 6 wildersness the rest as you see fit.
Just set up and avoid damage, if danger comes near use Troll.
Just try these and you will see Attack spirits still work
It's the build I use the most,
[skill]pain[/skill][skill]bloodsong[/skill][skill]Anguish[/skill][skill]Painful Bond[/skill][skill]Offering of Spirit[/skill]([skill]Ancestors' Rage[/skill] / [skill]Splinter Weapon[/skill] / )
Atributes al round 10-12
Communing
Channeling
Spawning
It's quite easy to use, set up and siply draw the spirits into battle, painful bond, cast the weapon skill, or rage on your frontliners.
And it's powerfull.
In RA you need a diffrent one:
[skill]Boon of Creation[/skill][skill]pain[/skill][skill]Dissonance[/skill][skill]Wanderlust[/skill][skill]Shadowsong[/skill][skill]Serpent's Quickness[/skill][skill]Troll Unguent[/skill][skill]Resurrection Signet[/skill]
at least 6 wildersness the rest as you see fit.
Just set up and avoid damage, if danger comes near use Troll.
Just try these and you will see Attack spirits still work
Painbringer
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cosmic Error
Smart players will just walk away from the ghosties, anyway. Perhaps some snares, to keep the opposition close to the spirits?
And a smart Allied group will stay in range of the spirits drawing the opposition into range. The constant knockdown and interuption is one heck of an aggrevation for the opposing team. I can only speak for RA on this, but Rit's are powerful if they have an army set up. I personnally set anguish pain blood song wonderlust and Gaze of fury one of my fast recharged spirits so i have 4 at least set up at a time. Then I hex like crazy with [skill]painful bond[/skill] if someone solo walks into range they will cut them down rather quick. If the whole group runs in the effect is less but the knockdown and damage is still happening leaving me to hex heal or rez etc.
street peddler
theyre fun sometimes in pve
Jetdoc
In PvP, I agree that they aren't too great due to their immobility/fragility.
In PvE, however, my ritualist is probably my most powerful character due to her attack spirits (especially when playing solo without heroes or henchmen).
In PvE, however, my ritualist is probably my most powerful character due to her attack spirits (especially when playing solo without heroes or henchmen).
Sir Pandra Pierva
i never found spirit spamming to ever be that great.
cept maybe in the good old days of factions and THK.
but the faction spirits can't move makes em useless
now if spirits could move. People would want rits and not necs for MMing
and did they make it so that spirits can now actually attack the same target or do they still just randomly attack opposition?
cept maybe in the good old days of factions and THK.
but the faction spirits can't move makes em useless
now if spirits could move. People would want rits and not necs for MMing
and did they make it so that spirits can now actually attack the same target or do they still just randomly attack opposition?
Cosmic Error
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Pandra Pierva
and did they make it so that spirits can now actually attack the same target or do they still just randomly attack opposition?
I'm pretty sure they prioritize targets. Might be wrong, all I know is that spirits seem to attack those hexed with painful bond first. I know this because I was screwing around in RA, the enemy rit decided to hex me, and the spirits focused their fire on me. I just walked away.
Lhim
In my experience they attack the enemy that's first in their range (obviously), but even when you cast Painful Bond on another (let's say a backliner) they'll keep attacking their initial target most of the times. Using Summon Spirits helps sometimes to sync their attacks on one target. But still sometimes each spirit is just attacking a different enemy.:/
For me it works best to have my spirits just within range and aggro the enemies with Painful Bond myself. Then the spirits will most likely all attack the same chosen target hexed with Painful Bond.
For me it works best to have my spirits just within range and aggro the enemies with Painful Bond myself. Then the spirits will most likely all attack the same chosen target hexed with Painful Bond.
Hugh Manatee
Spirit attack AI is a little wonky, but the new skill, summon spirits can sometimes be used to wrangle their fire onto one target. Things I've noticed about spirit AI:
1: If you drop one down and there's nothing in it's agro radius, it will just sit their. If you attack something that it can hit, it will start shooting at the target you've wanded. Occasionally they will idle even if something is in your radius and you'll need to 'mark' a target with your wand.
2: When that target dies or if there are enemies already attacking you, the spirits will choose a random target in their 'agro zone' and start firing.
3: Summon Spirits(very valuable skill to have for a pve rit lord) will interrupt their firing pattern, the next target you attack they will focus all their fire as if they have just been summoned fresh, unless something is closer and/or already attacking you.
Turret spirits are like backfire, empathy or spiteful, AI don't always know how to handle them, especially if you keep em out of AoE, so they can steamroll a lot of PvE areas, but human players know what's going on and how to beat em.
1: If you drop one down and there's nothing in it's agro radius, it will just sit their. If you attack something that it can hit, it will start shooting at the target you've wanded. Occasionally they will idle even if something is in your radius and you'll need to 'mark' a target with your wand.
2: When that target dies or if there are enemies already attacking you, the spirits will choose a random target in their 'agro zone' and start firing.
3: Summon Spirits(very valuable skill to have for a pve rit lord) will interrupt their firing pattern, the next target you attack they will focus all their fire as if they have just been summoned fresh, unless something is closer and/or already attacking you.
Turret spirits are like backfire, empathy or spiteful, AI don't always know how to handle them, especially if you keep em out of AoE, so they can steamroll a lot of PvE areas, but human players know what's going on and how to beat em.
jimmyboveto
Attack spirits can be mean in PvE. If you want to be lazy, its a good option from SS.
spirit of defeat
about spirit targeting:
-the attack random
-if you call your target, they will target that target
-spirits will defend them self, to death
-the attack random
-if you call your target, they will target that target
-spirits will defend them self, to death
Antithesis
Spirit spam > Norn tournament. Other than that i haven't run them at all during general PvE.
G.O.L.E.M and Eternal Grove are both good ideas - I wish i thought of that yesterday instead of running a Rt/N Minion Bomber on Xandra in the grove...d'Oh! Still worked but spirits would have been more fun.
G.O.L.E.M and Eternal Grove are both good ideas - I wish i thought of that yesterday instead of running a Rt/N Minion Bomber on Xandra in the grove...d'Oh! Still worked but spirits would have been more fun.
Bowstring Badass
I heard atck spirits in ra was cool...
Cosmic Error
Thanks for the input, guys. The reason I posted this topic was because I accidentally blew all my money on a Communing ritualist headwrap instead of a Channeling one.
Since I don't feel like farming for ages to afford another headwrap, I decided to try and incorporate Communing into my build. The results:
Communing: 11+1
Channeling: 12+2
Spawning Power: 4
[card]Essence Strike[/card]
[card]Spirit Rift[/card]
[card]Ancestors' Rage[/card]
[card]Cruel Was Daoshen[/card]
[card]Bloodsong[/card]
[card]Splinter Weapon[/card]
[card]Mighty was Vorizun[/card]
[card]Weapon of Quickening[/card]
Not the best build, but it works.
Since I don't feel like farming for ages to afford another headwrap, I decided to try and incorporate Communing into my build. The results:
Communing: 11+1
Channeling: 12+2
Spawning Power: 4
[card]Essence Strike[/card]
[card]Spirit Rift[/card]
[card]Ancestors' Rage[/card]
[card]Cruel Was Daoshen[/card]
[card]Bloodsong[/card]
[card]Splinter Weapon[/card]
[card]Mighty was Vorizun[/card]
[card]Weapon of Quickening[/card]
Not the best build, but it works.
spirit of defeat
ages? a head piece cost 1,5K unles it's a elite.
Keira Nightgale
I have fun with Anguish, painful bond, signet of ghostly might, 150 armor ignoring dmg form a single spirit is always fun in RA.
spirit of defeat
Quote:
Originally Posted by Keira Nightgale
I have fun with Anguish, painful bond, signet of ghostly might, 150 armor ignoring dmg form a single spirit is always fun in RA.
far to unreliable beside your spirit will die very quickly because of the signet, what's the use of that :S.
Zahr Dalsk
I would use spirits if they either could move, were level 20, or could be cast quickly, or a combination thereof. As it is I find them too cumbersome and fragile to use as more than triggers.
Trylo
[skill]Weapon of Quickening[/skill] + Energetic was Lee Sa + 4/5 Attack/Resto spirits of choice (can handle two 25 energy ones) + [skill]Spirit Light[/skill] or [skill]Mend Body and Soul[/skill]
anyways i find it fun...
anyways i find it fun...
Tyla
None. It's not good. Channeling / Restoration hybrid beats the living crap out of offensive spirits. Defensive spirits are rockage.
spirit of defeat
attack spirits can be nice just bring "summon spirit's"
zling
since this is the Campfire forum I'll focus on the PvE aspect of this...
with the introduction of the PvE only skill: Summon Spirits they became a lot more effective. now you dont need to keep spamming them with a Ritual Lord+Boon of Creation spammer but can rather invest in better spirits like the elite Wanderlust and just move it from place to place. lay your spirits, go in an area, cast vengful bond and than summon spirits and watch the show... best areas for this are obviously the Eternal Grove and norn tournament(as others here say, dont have gwen myself) but Summon Spirits itself lets you use them for more than just these 2 areas.
in PvP its a different issue, RA has its share of offensive spirit spammers and also the idiots who just run into them... AB also has the same issues as RA for obvious reasons, and with the added bonus of shrine defense with spirits...
more organized PvP just chews on spirits and renders that kind of ritualist useless.
with the introduction of the PvE only skill: Summon Spirits they became a lot more effective. now you dont need to keep spamming them with a Ritual Lord+Boon of Creation spammer but can rather invest in better spirits like the elite Wanderlust and just move it from place to place. lay your spirits, go in an area, cast vengful bond and than summon spirits and watch the show... best areas for this are obviously the Eternal Grove and norn tournament(as others here say, dont have gwen myself) but Summon Spirits itself lets you use them for more than just these 2 areas.
in PvP its a different issue, RA has its share of offensive spirit spammers and also the idiots who just run into them... AB also has the same issues as RA for obvious reasons, and with the added bonus of shrine defense with spirits...
more organized PvP just chews on spirits and renders that kind of ritualist useless.
spirit of defeat
Quote:
Originally Posted by zling
, cast vengful bond and than summon spirits
What do you mean with vengefull bond? If you mean vengefull weapon , it still makes no sense.
randomperson
Painful Bond.
Sir Pandra Pierva
i was watching my rits last attempt to bring life back into the class for PVE for me. I used a spirit spammer for fun and tried calling a target they woudlnt' attack him instead they ignored him and just attacked willy nilly.
So as far as i am concerned in PVe spirits are cannon fodder for enimies to attack if you need to beat a hastey retreat
So as far as i am concerned in PVe spirits are cannon fodder for enimies to attack if you need to beat a hastey retreat
Cosmic Error
Alright I've concluded that attack spirits are indeed crap. I recently tried out a Spirit Spam build for myself. It was like a weak nuke, except it used up six skill slots...
spirit of defeat
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cosmic Error
this one works fine, just need max sunspear.
communing, chaneling and spawning all round 10-12. take a chaneling wand and a Jedeh's Artifact
[skill]pain[/skill]
[skill]bloodsong[/skill]
[skill]anguish[/skill]
[skill]painful bond[/skill]
[skill]offering of spirit[/skill]
[skill]splinter weapon[/skill]/[skill]ancestors' rage[/skill]/Dwarf weapon
Sir Pandra Pierva
meh i wish spirits could be moved around nicely in pvp
Deadshot Seven
The only PVP that spirit's are actually good in is alliance battles.
You just have to know where to place the spirits.
I.E on Grenz frontier you can place your stack of spirits above the kurzick teleporter, then hexing anybody with painful bond as they come through...
Then watching them try to either run away or attack...and fail.
Ahh, good times.
You just have to know where to place the spirits.
I.E on Grenz frontier you can place your stack of spirits above the kurzick teleporter, then hexing anybody with painful bond as they come through...
Then watching them try to either run away or attack...and fail.
Ahh, good times.
Rasaek
Assuming someone wanted to make a build with offensive spirits, I'd probably have these suggestions. (Ignoring the painful bond build which is pretty straightforward...)
1. Find a support type build that takes up all your time spamming. [skill]Splinter weapon[/skill] [skill]ancestor's rage[/skill] [skill]spirit rift[/skill] [skill]channeled strike[/skill] [skill]spirit burn[/skill] [skill]essence strike[/skill] [skill]offering of spirit[/skill] etc. One benefit of offensive spirits is that they do their thing all on their own - set them up and then focus on doing whatever it is you do. They'll be added dps while you devote your time to whatever else it is you do. Using [skill]spirit siphon[/skill] along with 2 or three spirits can also be handy, as they're created with full energy bars, and refill in maybe 20 seconds or so.
2. It's probably not worth it to work in attribute points so you can do offensive spirits along with a, say, resto/spawning build. Consider it if you're already putting a lot of points in channeling or communing.
3. Consider taking one or two skills from spawning power that sacrifice spirits in exchange for effects. [skill]Rupture soul[/skill] for enemy melee ganking spirits - sure, let them have the spirit, but punish them with damage and blind. (Wonderful with [skill]destruction[/skill].) And there are several spawning power skills that allow you to do area heals or regain energy in return for sacrificing a spirit, a better choice if ranged attackers start focusing on your spirits. [skill]consume soul[/skill] [skill]feast of souls[/skill] [skill]reclaim essence[/skill] [skill]spirit to flesh[/skill]
4. If rangers are the ones molesting your spirits, that's actually the one time I find [skill]binding chains[/skill] to be semi-useful: rangers tend to be in the back away from your team, and often your team won't focus on them first anyway, assuming they'll be tough to kill, so you can often have them in binding chains for it's full duration. (If you want to be evil, run echo binding chains with a cooperative team... high communing and cover hexes can result in 100% threat removal of a melee/ranged enemy.)
Nontheless, my advice is not to rely on offensive spirits as your main selling point. Take a skill or two that synergizes well with having spirits, take a few offensive spirits, but run something else in the offensive spirit attribute line as your primary "build" and use the spirits to compliment dps and support along with other skills that need spirits.
1. Find a support type build that takes up all your time spamming. [skill]Splinter weapon[/skill] [skill]ancestor's rage[/skill] [skill]spirit rift[/skill] [skill]channeled strike[/skill] [skill]spirit burn[/skill] [skill]essence strike[/skill] [skill]offering of spirit[/skill] etc. One benefit of offensive spirits is that they do their thing all on their own - set them up and then focus on doing whatever it is you do. They'll be added dps while you devote your time to whatever else it is you do. Using [skill]spirit siphon[/skill] along with 2 or three spirits can also be handy, as they're created with full energy bars, and refill in maybe 20 seconds or so.
2. It's probably not worth it to work in attribute points so you can do offensive spirits along with a, say, resto/spawning build. Consider it if you're already putting a lot of points in channeling or communing.
3. Consider taking one or two skills from spawning power that sacrifice spirits in exchange for effects. [skill]Rupture soul[/skill] for enemy melee ganking spirits - sure, let them have the spirit, but punish them with damage and blind. (Wonderful with [skill]destruction[/skill].) And there are several spawning power skills that allow you to do area heals or regain energy in return for sacrificing a spirit, a better choice if ranged attackers start focusing on your spirits. [skill]consume soul[/skill] [skill]feast of souls[/skill] [skill]reclaim essence[/skill] [skill]spirit to flesh[/skill]
4. If rangers are the ones molesting your spirits, that's actually the one time I find [skill]binding chains[/skill] to be semi-useful: rangers tend to be in the back away from your team, and often your team won't focus on them first anyway, assuming they'll be tough to kill, so you can often have them in binding chains for it's full duration. (If you want to be evil, run echo binding chains with a cooperative team... high communing and cover hexes can result in 100% threat removal of a melee/ranged enemy.)
Nontheless, my advice is not to rely on offensive spirits as your main selling point. Take a skill or two that synergizes well with having spirits, take a few offensive spirits, but run something else in the offensive spirit attribute line as your primary "build" and use the spirits to compliment dps and support along with other skills that need spirits.
Kwan Xi
I guess I'm a little late jumping into the Spirit Spammer discussion.... but this is usually what happens to me in RA.
Me playing as a spirit spammer:
Me: Please stay near spirits.
Dumbass X: F-You! Spirits are useless they won't run into them!
*Dumbass X runs all the way across the map and is cut down by the enemy.*
Me playing against a spirit spammer:
Me: Stay away from Spirits wait for them to run out of range.
Dumbass Y: F-You! I'm not going to wait for them to come out!
*Dumbass Y runs into Spirits and is blinded by Shadowsong, knocked down by Wanderlust, and killed by surrounding spirits+enemy team.*
Yeah..... as long as there are impatient idiots playing the game Spirit Spamming IMHO are is still viable in PvP
PvE the build is viable using this skill [skill]Summon Spirits[/skill]
Me playing as a spirit spammer:
Me: Please stay near spirits.
Dumbass X: F-You! Spirits are useless they won't run into them!
*Dumbass X runs all the way across the map and is cut down by the enemy.*
Me playing against a spirit spammer:
Me: Stay away from Spirits wait for them to run out of range.
Dumbass Y: F-You! I'm not going to wait for them to come out!
*Dumbass Y runs into Spirits and is blinded by Shadowsong, knocked down by Wanderlust, and killed by surrounding spirits+enemy team.*
Yeah..... as long as there are impatient idiots playing the game Spirit Spamming IMHO are is still viable in PvP
PvE the build is viable using this skill [skill]Summon Spirits[/skill]