What if one or two people out of an entire Ursan group decided that they were going to take Volfen or Raven Blessing instead of Ursan? Would it be worth it?
To me, it would be the issue of defense/utility vs. damage. Volfen Blessing gives you a chance to attack faster and to apply Deep Wound. Raven would prevent KD on yourself and allow you to put Blind, Cripple, and Bleed on foes.
Would swapping one or two players for a blessing change actually be a good decision?
Ursan Runs: What if you took a different blessing?
Shayne Hawke
disaster422
I've been in a couple groups that changed one ursan for a volfen because of the volfen's ability for a constant IAS and deep wound which in turn buffs the ursans damage too. Idk about raven though, personally I see raven as a very weak blessing.
Shayne Hawke
Quote:
Originally Posted by disaster422
I've been in a couple groups that changed one ursan for a volfen because of the volfen's ability for a constant IAS and deep wound which in turn buffs the ursans damage too. Idk about raven though, personally I see raven as a very weak blessing.
Weak in offense, yes.
My only experience with Ursan is in Norn point-farming groups, and in almost every one, the monks have had major dying issues due to melee mob aggro. Raven Blessing offers Cripple and Blind, which would be great for protecting Monks.
Then again, there ought to be enough power in 5-6 Ursans that they can destroy everything else faster than anything else can destroy two Monks.
My only experience with Ursan is in Norn point-farming groups, and in almost every one, the monks have had major dying issues due to melee mob aggro. Raven Blessing offers Cripple and Blind, which would be great for protecting Monks.
Then again, there ought to be enough power in 5-6 Ursans that they can destroy everything else faster than anything else can destroy two Monks.
MisterB
I think the point of Ursan PuGs is C+Space-1-2-3 so that they don't have to think about builds.
Chrono Re delle Ere
The few guild runs we did in doa using UB were made with 4 ursan, 1 raven, worked pretty sweet, so yea, would work much better. But people just love ursan.
MasterSasori
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chrono Re delle Ere
The few guild runs we did in doa using UB were made with 4 ursan, 1 raven, worked pretty sweet, so yea, would work much better. But people just love ursan.
Pressing 12341235123423412341234 is why people love ursan.
Shayne Hawke
So it seems the opinion here is that Ursan isn't necessarily the best blessing to use all the time, but it's definitely the easiest, right?
Esan
The attack rate is immaterial. Bears excel because of the disruption caused by spamming AoE knockdowns; the only way to really improve it is to speed up skill recharge. This is why essences of celerity have such amazing synergy with bears. If a support char must be brought, bring a ranger with QZ and GC and Winter instead of wasting a party slot with a wolf or raven.
Steps_Descending
Logically, all that a wolfen would add to an ursan party would be a bit more 1target dmg(from it's deep wound skill) at the cost of a (defensively) weaker character. Doesn't sound too much of a deal for me, though I am not saying I have too much experience with Ursan(understand : not at all)
Raven would probably work better, AoE blind for attackers, cripple allowing kiting and the inate block ability covering a bit the weaker body. Probably a nice addition vs attaker heavy zones.
Raven would probably work better, AoE blind for attackers, cripple allowing kiting and the inate block ability covering a bit the weaker body. Probably a nice addition vs attaker heavy zones.
N1ghtstalker
raven is nice for it's wide blinding
crazybanshee
Have to agree with the other poster, aside from ursan being 1-2-3 easy the constant spam of aoe knockdowns will pretty much kill anything. If people liked trying new things we wouldn't see so many people running the same wiki builds for every pvp event.
snaek
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shayne Hawke
So it seems the opinion here is that Ursan isn't necessarily the best blessing to use all the time, but it's definitely the easiest, right?
no...ursan is definately more powerful than raven or volfen
i decided to try out raven in oolas lab
(enemies r melee robots that can kd+blind)
and i still felt raven was pretty useless
if raven is pretty useless in a scenario that has a lot of kd+blind and only melee monsters....
i dun think its gonna be good anywhere
i decided to try out raven in oolas lab
(enemies r melee robots that can kd+blind)
and i still felt raven was pretty useless
if raven is pretty useless in a scenario that has a lot of kd+blind and only melee monsters....
i dun think its gonna be good anywhere
Incandecree
I am always on the lookout for messing up the "status quo". Lately when I have been asked to ursan in FoW I have packed the Raven Blessing and Archane Mimicry (to grab ursan). The AoE blind is very useful. It cuts down the damage from Mark of Pain since they are missing. Yes it does cut down on the energy gain from the blessing since the AI is missing but I have noticed that it makes the monks job a little easier at the expense of 50 damage every 4 seconds to one target. Nevermind that it is 100 AoE damage every 4 seconds
Longasc
A mixed group of Ursan Blessing, Volfen Blessing and Raven Blessing would have much more tools and could be more effective, sure.
The point is that it would require some more thought than the mentioned button mashing, and this is why people love Ursan: Powerful and easy.
Otherwise they would play their real classes and own the PvE mobs harder and faster than with UB.
The point is that it would require some more thought than the mentioned button mashing, and this is why people love Ursan: Powerful and easy.
Otherwise they would play their real classes and own the PvE mobs harder and faster than with UB.
Genius Was Revrac
The best combo with ursans by far is the Raven. They can spam AoE damage and blindness with one skill. Also, they have crippling which is perfect ot get leakers that reach the back lines. This way the bears can continue with main mob and the raven can clean up. The best thing in Ursan grps is too bring 1 raven, and 1 AoE damager in the midline like a Assins Promise Nuker or a Splint/Barrager.
Rushin Roulette
Or just take one Necro with [Mark of Pain] for faster and higher AoE Damage and [Barbs] to take down vital targets fast in a full UB group.
A [Raven Blessing] player would be great to cripple anything in a mob so that they cant run out of the AoE as quickly and the blinding skill would keep the backliners safe from Foes which managed to evade and kite around the main group untill the [Ursan Blessing] players have taken care of the first group.
The only problem with Ravens blinding skill is the slower energy regen rate, but with a zealous weapon you should be getting more energy that you need from attacks anyways.
A [Raven Blessing] player would be great to cripple anything in a mob so that they cant run out of the AoE as quickly and the blinding skill would keep the backliners safe from Foes which managed to evade and kite around the main group untill the [Ursan Blessing] players have taken care of the first group.
The only problem with Ravens blinding skill is the slower energy regen rate, but with a zealous weapon you should be getting more energy that you need from attacks anyways.
jon0592
I was thinking of a team of Raven blessing. 5X Raven Blessings, 1X Mesmer, 2X HB Monks. The Mes uses Fragility and the 1st raven skill inflicts 2 conditions every 2 seconds. Now with 5 people spamming that, that's a total of 10 conditions every other second. Does this work? Haven't tried but on paper it sounds good
Carboplatin
Quote:
Originally Posted by jon0592
I was thinking of a team of Raven blessing. 5X Raven Blessings, 1X Mesmer, 2X HB Monks. The Mes uses Fragility and the 1st raven skill inflicts 2 conditions every 2 seconds. Now with 5 people spamming that, that's a total of 10 conditions every other second. Does this work? Haven't tried but on paper it sounds good
pugs make ursan teams cause its easy and requires no skills/coordination. it sounds ok, but unless u got guilides, don't count on getting a group for it.
edwinna elbert
Quote:
Originally Posted by jon0592
I was thinking of a team of Raven blessing. 5X Raven Blessings, 1X Mesmer, 2X HB Monks. The Mes uses Fragility and the 1st raven skill inflicts 2 conditions every 2 seconds. Now with 5 people spamming that, that's a total of 10 conditions every other second. Does this work? Haven't tried but on paper it sounds good
[fragility] states "new" condition.
RotteN
indeed, so [[fragility] won't trigger if you reapply the conditions.
In terms of "enhancing" Ursan groups, a R/N with [[quickening zephyr] and [[blood is power] (for the monks) would be far better than a single [[volfen blessing], as the main chunk of damage comes from the ursan skills, not the auto-attack damage.
In terms of "enhancing" Ursan groups, a R/N with [[quickening zephyr] and [[blood is power] (for the monks) would be far better than a single [[volfen blessing], as the main chunk of damage comes from the ursan skills, not the auto-attack damage.
Incandecree
I too do not like the status quo on team builds. I have experimented with running a Raven with 5 Ursans and 2 monks in FoW. It worked very well. One of the biggest damage sources is Mark of Pain. In a perfect group sure you are going to have the physical damage dealers on their butts all the time but in a PUG it is sub-optimal at times. One of those warriors with Hundred Blades hits an Ursan with Mark of Pain on him in the middle of the Ursanball and all of them are in for a serious hurt. Blind that same warrior and you have essentially nullified the threat while the Ursanball takes them down. Raven does not have the health or armor bonus that Ursan does but that is why the main attack is at range.
MisterB
No need for Raven because of Mark of Pain from the Shadow Beasts. Ursans can just AoE KD everything so nothing ever hits them, hence it shouldn't trigger. Or the monks could, I don't know, remove Mark of Pain?
Incandecree
I never thought of removing a hex. Wow a great idea. 2 monks with Cure Hex and oh say half of the Shadow Beasts all casting Mark of Pain and covering it with with SS. 2 Cure Hex's every 9 seconds and you may catch a couple hexes. You know that in an ideal world they will be on their collective butts all the time but PUGs are not the ideal world.
As I said I like to buck the status quo and try different things. Raven does become viable when the Ursanball gets the melee grouped up. You can hit them with 100 damage AoE and blind them. Seems a reasonable alternative but I wouldn't run all Ravens because of the knockdown from Ursans. One Raven in a group of Ursans is a good option.
As I said I like to buck the status quo and try different things. Raven does become viable when the Ursanball gets the melee grouped up. You can hit them with 100 damage AoE and blind them. Seems a reasonable alternative but I wouldn't run all Ravens because of the knockdown from Ursans. One Raven in a group of Ursans is a good option.
kev read
[skill]Divert Hexes[/skill]
Clunky, but it workes well...
Clunky, but it workes well...
Incandecree
Funny that you should mention that. I have a N/Mo build built around Divert Hexes. If she is in the group she usually makes the monks bored. with 3 hexes on someone when I use Divert Hexes it is a 201 point heal.
I Can Cure Cancer
Ursan has amazing damage while disabling the enemy at the same time with AoE knockdowns and weakness. It outclasses the other blessings and not to mention it's easier to use.
Miss Puddles
i was doing a quad run in doa with my alliance, but had low rank in norn at the time.
i ran with raven blessing instead of ursan, and it worked fine. the block chance helped us take on bigger groups than usual, so it actually went faster than normal. the only thing i didn't like was that i didn't have an armor boost so i died a few times at the end in foundry.
would like to try volfen sometime though. mix it up a bit.
i ran with raven blessing instead of ursan, and it worked fine. the block chance helped us take on bigger groups than usual, so it actually went faster than normal. the only thing i didn't like was that i didn't have an armor boost so i died a few times at the end in foundry.
would like to try volfen sometime though. mix it up a bit.
Arutima
Quote:
Originally Posted by kev read
[skill]Divert Hexes[/skill]
Clunky, but it workes well... unfortunatly, ub groups usually take two hb monks instead of one healing monk and one prot monk
Clunky, but it workes well... unfortunatly, ub groups usually take two hb monks instead of one healing monk and one prot monk
Randvek
Raven and Volfen aren't serious competitors with Ursan, but I could see maybe taking one in an Ursan team.
Raven is decent, but geared towards fighting against melee, which isn't particularly great. How often do you have trouble with melee groups, even without blessings? The block chance is miserable, even at r10, and the damage output is good, but not what we have come to be used to.
Volfen's inherent buffs are the weakest of the three, with only health regen. The skills are respectable damage, again way below Ursan, but respectable. The trick with Bloodlust is that it's pretty sweet, but one Volfen at high rank can keep it up near constantly with Agility, so I can't really fathom taking more than one wolf.
Raven is decent, but geared towards fighting against melee, which isn't particularly great. How often do you have trouble with melee groups, even without blessings? The block chance is miserable, even at r10, and the damage output is good, but not what we have come to be used to.
Volfen's inherent buffs are the weakest of the three, with only health regen. The skills are respectable damage, again way below Ursan, but respectable. The trick with Bloodlust is that it's pretty sweet, but one Volfen at high rank can keep it up near constantly with Agility, so I can't really fathom taking more than one wolf.