this hero team is designed specifically to tailor melee characters, such as warriors, assassins, etc. note that the gwBBcode is not updated, so check out the actual skill descriptions in game.
[build name="melee support" prof=N/Rt restoration=10 channeling=11 soul=9+1+1 curse=4+1][foul feast][plague signet][protective was kaolai][soothing memories][signet of lost souls][splinter weapon][ancestor's rage][death pact signet][/build]
[build name="rit bomber" prof=Rt/N death=12 spawning=12+1+1 restoration=3][boon of creation][spirit's gift][explosive growth][animate bone minion][animate shambling horror][death nova][reclaim essence][death pact signet][/build]
[build name="bomber support" prof=N/Mo death=10+1+1 soul=11+1 heal=10][dwayna's sorrow][jagged bones][death nova][signet of lost souls][taste of death][blood of the master][restore life][cure hex][/build]
the player should be using a melee character with a lot of offensive power, such as a dragonslasher or moebius sin. it's strongly recommended that the player bring [[save yourselves], as well as two monks, a mesmer, and an earth ele as the henches.
sabway variant
moriz
distilledwill
Nice idea using Reclaim essense to fuel the Rit bomber.
DarkSpirit
I have tried a Rit bomber before and it didn't seem to work out as well as a necro MM due to the lack of soul reaping. How well does the hero use Reclaim Essence?
You have 50% failure on your Plague Signet? Have you tested the build yourself?
You have 50% failure on your Plague Signet? Have you tested the build yourself?
miskav
Dark, the failure rate isn't all to terrible on the signet, it seems to trigger more often then not (Though the chance is 50% >_>
DarkSpirit
Quote:
Originally Posted by miskav
Dark, the failure rate isn't all to terrible on the signet, it seems to trigger more often then not (Though the chance is 50% >_>
Besides that, I remember that Reclaim Essence wasn't used well by heroes (if they use it at all), but I have not tried it after the AI update. Hero usage for some skills have been improved even though they were not documented in the game update.
Edit: Reclaim Essence seems to work now after the AI update. Nice.
Besides that, I remember that Reclaim Essence wasn't used well by heroes (if they use it at all), but I have not tried it after the AI update. Hero usage for some skills have been improved even though they were not documented in the game update.Edit: Reclaim Essence seems to work now after the AI update. Nice.
Super Igor
why rit bomber in the first place?
Ben-A-BoO
Looks interesting ... I sure gonna give it a whirl.
Although two questions in advance:
1). Why this instead of the original Sabway? or Ractoth's way?
2). Why two death nova?
Thanks for sharing.
Although two questions in advance:
1). Why this instead of the original Sabway? or Ractoth's way?
2). Why two death nova?
Thanks for sharing.
BLOODGOAT
I have a question. Why have a support bomber when one is enough and not a N/Rt healer just because they're better than any henchman ever will be?
I understand you're probably trying to break free of the cookie-cutter mold, but god damn, N/Rt just saves your team because Alesia is terrible.
I understand you're probably trying to break free of the cookie-cutter mold, but god damn, N/Rt just saves your team because Alesia is terrible.
Magikarp
when i play monk, i play something almost identical to this, except for the fact your bomber is waaaay better, so ty very much for the build set-up Moriz.
DarkSpirit
I just tried it out in HM and compare its strength against sabway but sorry it doesn't work as well as sabway.
1. Not enough healing.
2. Rit low level minions are not strong enough and doesn't have the "staying power".
3. Not enough minions at level 12 Death
Your Bomber support N/Mo tend to be the first one to die. Your Plague Signet does fail sometimes due to low level Curse, leaving your melee support N/Rt with the conditions, but you can adjust your attributes for that if you wish.
1. Not enough healing.
2. Rit low level minions are not strong enough and doesn't have the "staying power".
3. Not enough minions at level 12 Death
Your Bomber support N/Mo tend to be the first one to die. Your Plague Signet does fail sometimes due to low level Curse, leaving your melee support N/Rt with the conditions, but you can adjust your attributes for that if you wish.
Super Igor
50% failing chance is bad, and again, why rit? Oo
Jenn
rit = spawning power = explosive growth = gg
MercenaryKnight
Rit bombers do work, but never will be as good. Too many enchants and the heroes won't keep them up all the time. Waste of time to make them use enchants just so they can keep summoning minions as fast as a necro can with soul reaping.
DarkSpirit
Quote:
Originally Posted by Illfated Fat
rit = spawning power = explosive growth = gg
Yes a Rt/N MM is fun and different and believe me, I am the kind of person that loves supporting build concepts that are not really mainstream (e.g. using Vengeance and posting signet builds for mesmers).
Unfortunately, I have yet to find a Rt build, for heroes, that work well enough to my satisfaction and a Rt/N MM is one of the first Rt builds that I have tried on my Rt hero. It wasn't enough to convince me that a Rt hero plays a better MM than a Necro hero.
Unfortunately, I have yet to find a Rt build, for heroes, that work well enough to my satisfaction and a Rt/N MM is one of the first Rt builds that I have tried on my Rt hero. It wasn't enough to convince me that a Rt hero plays a better MM than a Necro hero.
Super Igor
Sorrow Bomber Nec > Rit
AOD_EaSyKiLL
The condition transfer skills on the first Necro seems useless to me since there are no skills that cause conditions on himself or pull them from other players in that build.
Super Igor
play and read in game description, wiki section named "game updates2 is ftw too.
shanaya
Rit bomber works very well.
I've been using this Rit/N for a while and it is very, very good:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Balian
I've been using this Rit/N for a while and it is very, very good:
Quote:
Rt/N
[skill]Boon of Creation[/skill][skill]Explosive Growth[/skill][skill]Animate Bone Minions[/skill][skill]Jagged Bones[/skill][skill]Death Nova[/skill][skill]Blood of the Master[/skill][skill]Signet of Creation[/skill][skill]Flesh of My Flesh[/skill]
Spawning 12 + 2 +1
Death Magic 12
Rune of vigor
Survivor Insignias
Runes of attunement (get energy to about 47 or so for best results with the runes and staff) and Runes of Vit
Put that on Razah in place of the MM Necro for better results... No energy problems whatsoever and always the last char to die (on the rare occassion it does happen)
and before you say anything, yes the hero will upkeep the enchantments you will not have to do it manually ever
[skill]Boon of Creation[/skill][skill]Explosive Growth[/skill][skill]Animate Bone Minions[/skill][skill]Jagged Bones[/skill][skill]Death Nova[/skill][skill]Blood of the Master[/skill][skill]Signet of Creation[/skill][skill]Flesh of My Flesh[/skill]
Spawning 12 + 2 +1
Death Magic 12
Rune of vigor
Survivor Insignias
Runes of attunement (get energy to about 47 or so for best results with the runes and staff) and Runes of Vit
Put that on Razah in place of the MM Necro for better results... No energy problems whatsoever and always the last char to die (on the rare occassion it does happen)
and before you say anything, yes the hero will upkeep the enchantments you will not have to do it manually ever
Tyla
I would prefer Plague Sending over Plague Signet, since this is PvE we're talking about.
DarkSpirit
Quote:
Originally Posted by shanaya
Rit bomber works very well.
I've been using this Rit/N for a while and it is very, very good: That is similar to what I settled on for my Rit/N bomber after testing many build configuration on Xandra. Which is quite different from the OP's build.
The main problem I find, with that build, is the lack energy sometimes. Now that heroes use Reclaim Essence on minions after the DS AI update, it maybe worth revisiting Rt/N MM builds but I would hate replacing Jagged Bones. A necro MM bomber can just rely on soul reaping rather than waste his elite slot for energy management.
A build that although weaker, can be made to work, doesn't justify replacing the better alternative unless it provides some other significant advantage.
I've been using this Rit/N for a while and it is very, very good: That is similar to what I settled on for my Rit/N bomber after testing many build configuration on Xandra. Which is quite different from the OP's build.
The main problem I find, with that build, is the lack energy sometimes. Now that heroes use Reclaim Essence on minions after the DS AI update, it maybe worth revisiting Rt/N MM builds but I would hate replacing Jagged Bones. A necro MM bomber can just rely on soul reaping rather than waste his elite slot for energy management.
A build that although weaker, can be made to work, doesn't justify replacing the better alternative unless it provides some other significant advantage.
AOD_EaSyKiLL
Quote:
Originally Posted by Super Igor
play and read in game description, wiki section named "game updates2 is ftw too.
Correct skill descriptions are FTW lol
moriz
Quote:
Originally Posted by moriz
note that the gwBBcode is not updated, so check out the actual skill descriptions in game.
one more comment about foul feast and plague signet, and i will punch someone.
the main advantage of this setup is offense. the sabway build is built more for defense in mind. the necro MM essentially pumps out a bunch of minions that act as meatshields, while the rit bomber uses them as bombs. the two copies of death nova is to ensure that every minion will have death nova at all times.
paired up with something with a lot of offensive punch, such as a moebius sin (which this is originally designed for, btw), you'll have the moebius sin supplying a constant stream of corpses, while the bomber animates a bunch of throwaway minions (healing for 90ish hp and removes 2 conditions, dealing out some nice AoE damage all at the same time), then blow them up for more damage, which in turn triggers the healing from dwayna's sorrow. it all adds up to a lot of damage, which generates more corpses and more damage and more corpses and so on.
yes, defensively this build is weaker than the original sabway, but makes up for in in pure damage output.
EDIT: readjusted the support necro's attributes.
the main advantage of this setup is offense. the sabway build is built more for defense in mind. the necro MM essentially pumps out a bunch of minions that act as meatshields, while the rit bomber uses them as bombs. the two copies of death nova is to ensure that every minion will have death nova at all times.
paired up with something with a lot of offensive punch, such as a moebius sin (which this is originally designed for, btw), you'll have the moebius sin supplying a constant stream of corpses, while the bomber animates a bunch of throwaway minions (healing for 90ish hp and removes 2 conditions, dealing out some nice AoE damage all at the same time), then blow them up for more damage, which in turn triggers the healing from dwayna's sorrow. it all adds up to a lot of damage, which generates more corpses and more damage and more corpses and so on.
yes, defensively this build is weaker than the original sabway, but makes up for in in pure damage output.
EDIT: readjusted the support necro's attributes.
AOD_EaSyKiLL
Usually you dont expect a skill to be the total opposite of what it is. Instead of just saying "check skills in game" you should say "Foul Feast transfers conditions from party member to self"
JONO51
Are you sure the heroes can use [[reclaim essence] right? i've been trying it to fuel a channeling build for razah, with olias as bomber, but he rarely seems to use it. Does he only use it right when he is the one controlling the minions rather than another hero? Otherwise i dont see how this build would work.
DarkSpirit
Quote:
Originally Posted by JONO51
Are you sure the heroes can use [[reclaim essence] right? i've been trying it to fuel a channeling build for razah, with olias as bomber, but he rarely seems to use it. Does he only use it right when he is the one controlling the minions rather than another hero? Otherwise i dont see how this build would work.
Did you try it after the recent AI update? I know they didnt use it right before but after the update, they seem to.
JONO51
yeah, I was just trying it about 5 mins ago. Is there some trick I'm missing or something?
DarkSpirit
Quote:
Originally Posted by JONO51
yeah, I was just trying it about 5 mins ago. Is there some trick I'm missing or something?
They only use it when they they dont have enough energy to cast the next skill that they want to cast.
moriz
keep in mind that the bomber support has [[taste of death] as well, so getting minions to go boom is generally not a issue.
JONO51
Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkSpirit
They only use it when they they dont have enough energy to cast the next skill that they want to cast.
Ah, thats probably what it is then. the gights were over by the time he hit 20en, so he wouldnt need to use it. Was just expecting him to use it mid battle. Thanks for a quick answer!
DarkSpirit
Quote:
Originally Posted by moriz
keep in mind that the bomber support has [[taste of death] as well, so getting minions to go boom is generally not a issue.
The weakness of the build is not the inability to kill a minion, the Rt would use Reclaim Essence, to kill an existing minion, if she needs the energy to create a new minion but doesn't have enough energy. The problem comes if there are no more minions to reclaim and your Rt/N is low on energy, she has to stop creating new minions.
She has difficulty sustaining the low level minions, long enough, during a HM battle in high level areas. Maybe add [[Feast for the Dead] or [[Verata's Sacrifice]?
She has difficulty sustaining the low level minions, long enough, during a HM battle in high level areas. Maybe add [[Feast for the Dead] or [[Verata's Sacrifice]?
moriz
keep in mind that boon of creation triggers twice for animate bone minion. as a result, animate bone minion is essentially a free spell. therefore, there's really nothing weighing heavily on the rit's energy pool, as it can easily maintain the enchantments and cast animate shambling horror with little problem.
the whole point of the rit bomber is not to keep minions around forever. instead, the whole purpose of the bomber is to create walking bombs, as well as the AoE damage per creation and healing+condition removal. it doesn't matter if the minions die in 4 seconds. in fact, you WANT them to die quickly for more damage. as long as the bomber and support necro can put up death nova and maybe jagged bones before the minion dies, then it lasts long enough.
after all, it's not like there's ever a shortage of corpses in HM. if it ever runs out of corpses, it's pretty easy to create new ones.
the whole point of the rit bomber is not to keep minions around forever. instead, the whole purpose of the bomber is to create walking bombs, as well as the AoE damage per creation and healing+condition removal. it doesn't matter if the minions die in 4 seconds. in fact, you WANT them to die quickly for more damage. as long as the bomber and support necro can put up death nova and maybe jagged bones before the minion dies, then it lasts long enough.
after all, it's not like there's ever a shortage of corpses in HM. if it ever runs out of corpses, it's pretty easy to create new ones.
deluxe
Not that I want to run "sab"way or a build like this, but looking at necro nr 3 he will be absolutely drowning in energy thanks to soulreaping, signet and only 5e skills. I would add something expensive to it. [animate bone fiend] or something. (dont underestimate the dps of some bone fiends, they dont work well with bombing though ;p)
DarkSpirit
Quote:
Originally Posted by deluxe
Not that I want to run "sab"way or a build like this, but looking at necro nr 3 he will be absolutely drowning in energy thanks to soulreaping, signet and only 5e skills. I would add something expensive to it. [animate bone fiend] or something. (dont underestimate the dps of some bone fiends, they dont work well with bombing though ;p)
That is a good point. Maybe it is just me, that I wish it has more defensive elements in it for the non-melee players.
Perhaps add Aegis or Protective Spirit?
Perhaps add Aegis or Protective Spirit?
Cathode_Reborn
Would heroes use Taste of Death for bombing? I've seen enemy AI use it for the health gain only...
RavagerOfDreams
i might suggest squeezing enfeebling blood in there somewhere as weakness pritty much says gg melee.
moriz
they do. the last update improved the AI using taste of death, so they will use it to bomb.
i've been thinking about using [[putrid flesh] instead of taste of death on the necro. i wonder if the AI will use it the same way.
i've been thinking about using [[putrid flesh] instead of taste of death on the necro. i wonder if the AI will use it the same way.
distilledwill
I like the builds, my only gripe is that the third player is essentially useless without the Rt. Sure, the team should have synergy and work well as a unit, but if you lose the MM its essentially like losing that player aswell. This, coupled with the fact that you have 2 DPSs in there, I can see that if one player goes down things may get very hairy.
Nevertheless, i like the build. I tried a Rt bomber early last year and it was good fun to roll with.
Nevertheless, i like the build. I tried a Rt bomber early last year and it was good fun to roll with.
Super Igor
I think Rt bomber should be Nec bomber....etherithing else is quite decent....
moriz
rit bomber can use explosive growth and spirit's gift. necro bomber cannot.
zwei2stein
I use Rt/N bomber for vanquish (jagged bones or virulence elite).
Weaker minions are made up for easily by creation effects and spawning power bonuses (aoe heals, aoe condition removals, aoe damage!). They die fast, but that is what you want from bombs.
Only thing they lack is secondary flexibility, N/x bomber can bring lots of types of various utility.
Weaker minions are made up for easily by creation effects and spawning power bonuses (aoe heals, aoe condition removals, aoe damage!). They die fast, but that is what you want from bombs.
Only thing they lack is secondary flexibility, N/x bomber can bring lots of types of various utility.