alrighty, i'll be getting my money next week: $1000 exactly. i'm going to use this to build my new computer. (all prices are canadian btw)
as of right now, i'm going to wait for the radeon HD4xxx series (to be released in june), so the computer will not have a graphics card. i'll be using the integrated graphics for the time been.
as such, i'm pretty much dead-set on AMD's 780G chipset, paired with a high end phenom or athlon 64 x2 6400.
anyways, here's the stuff i've picked out myself:
case fan: http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applicatio...&sku=S457-1054 $12.99
wireless adaptor: http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applicatio...&sku=N100-1667 $18.99
case: http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applicatio...&sku=TC3J-4012 $48.99
CPU: http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applicatio...u=CP1-AM2-9850 $287.99
motherboard: http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applicatio...&sku=S458-1302 $91.99
RAM: http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applicatio...5&sku=C13-6076 $69.99 (also has a $25 mail in rebate)
powersupply: http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applicatio...&sku=T925-1177 $73.99
hard drive: http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applicatio...ku=TSD-160AAJS $60.99
DVD writer: http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applicatio...-GH20NS10%20CA $29.99
total: $695.91
after taxes: $786.38
if anyone can improve on this, i'm all ears. thanks in advance.
time to build my new rig
moriz
Lord Mythirion
I personally think that you should get a better mobo, one with 2 pci-e X16 slots so you can go crossfire, like this one:
http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applicatio...727&CatId=2838
and a hard drive with a 16mb cache, yours only has an 8mb cache.
http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applicatio...9070&CatId=139
otherwise it's fine. I have that PSU, and it works fine.
http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applicatio...727&CatId=2838
and a hard drive with a 16mb cache, yours only has an 8mb cache.
http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applicatio...9070&CatId=139
otherwise it's fine. I have that PSU, and it works fine.
FlamingMetroid
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by me from another thread
Motherboard: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16813136044
CPU: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16819103252 GPU: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814130318 PSU: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16817139006 RAM: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820231122 Drive: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16827129020 HDD: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16822148262 |
gonna pick up a case from a local store, just under $1k US
Lord Mythirion
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by FlamingMetroid
what I'm getting
gonna pick up a case from a local store, just under $1k US |
My friend did that before. he finished, than I was like "ok, just have to install the OS" "what OS?...@#%*@&*"
LockerLoad
Moriz, don't buy the ECS A780GM-A if you plan on using Phenom X4 9850.
The 4 phase voltage regulation is inadequate for a 125w CPU you will destroy the motherboard.
Here's an article from Anandtech that explains the incompatibility issue.
http://www.anandtech.com/mb/showdoc.aspx?i=3279&p=2
Also quad core CPUs won't improve your gaming experience. A higher clocked dual core will generate less heat than a quad while delivering more performance.
Although my gaming rig runs on an Opteron 180 I can't think of ANY reason I'd buy an AMD CPU at this time. Intels processors from last year give AMDs latest and greatest a thorough kicking.
I'd recomend an Intel e8400 it's cheaper and faster than the Phenom you're considering plus It's a 45nm CPU and should run much cooler(and use less power).
If you're determined to purchase an AMD quad core CPU with a 780g chipset then consider the DFI LP UT 790FX-M2R mobo, it has a six phase digital voltage regulator which should be more than adequate for that 125w Phenom.
I'd also recomend a different chassis. The CoolerMaster CM690 has excellent cooling options with all the possible 120mm fan locations as well as decent aesthetics. It's basically the Cosmos' little brother. http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applicatio...497&CatId=1509
The masscool fan you linked to is a sleeve bearing fan. Sleeve bearing fans should only be run in a vertical orientation or the bearing will dry up and the fan will fail. Make sure to use ball bearing or Sony FDB fans if you plan to mount them horizontally. My pick would be the Scythe S-flex: http://www.canadacomputers.com/index...0&cid=FN. 505
I just picked up a 500Gb WD HDD from Canada Computers for $80: http://www.canadacomputers.com/index...d=HD. 443.877
The rest of your component list looks fine.
The 4 phase voltage regulation is inadequate for a 125w CPU you will destroy the motherboard.
Here's an article from Anandtech that explains the incompatibility issue.
http://www.anandtech.com/mb/showdoc.aspx?i=3279&p=2
Also quad core CPUs won't improve your gaming experience. A higher clocked dual core will generate less heat than a quad while delivering more performance.
Although my gaming rig runs on an Opteron 180 I can't think of ANY reason I'd buy an AMD CPU at this time. Intels processors from last year give AMDs latest and greatest a thorough kicking.
I'd recomend an Intel e8400 it's cheaper and faster than the Phenom you're considering plus It's a 45nm CPU and should run much cooler(and use less power).
If you're determined to purchase an AMD quad core CPU with a 780g chipset then consider the DFI LP UT 790FX-M2R mobo, it has a six phase digital voltage regulator which should be more than adequate for that 125w Phenom.
I'd also recomend a different chassis. The CoolerMaster CM690 has excellent cooling options with all the possible 120mm fan locations as well as decent aesthetics. It's basically the Cosmos' little brother. http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applicatio...497&CatId=1509
The masscool fan you linked to is a sleeve bearing fan. Sleeve bearing fans should only be run in a vertical orientation or the bearing will dry up and the fan will fail. Make sure to use ball bearing or Sony FDB fans if you plan to mount them horizontally. My pick would be the Scythe S-flex: http://www.canadacomputers.com/index...0&cid=FN. 505
I just picked up a 500Gb WD HDD from Canada Computers for $80: http://www.canadacomputers.com/index...d=HD. 443.877
The rest of your component list looks fine.
Admael
Those DIMMs are crap, Corsair uses the term "low latency" pretty loosely, my PC2-8500's run at lower latencies than those. Here's something slightly better:
http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applicatio...597&CatId=2368
http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applicatio...597&CatId=2368
moriz
hmm, maybe i should go with the phenom x3 8750 then. it uses 95W, which the board should handle just fine.
the reason i'm going AMD and 780G is because of the HD3200 onboard graphics, which i'm planning to use until the HD4870 comes out in a month. i've heard NVIDIA has a board that use the geforce8200, but i don't know the prices on those things.
the reason i'm going AMD and 780G is because of the HD3200 onboard graphics, which i'm planning to use until the HD4870 comes out in a month. i've heard NVIDIA has a board that use the geforce8200, but i don't know the prices on those things.
bhavv
That CPU is crap for that much money. You would be far better off with a core 2 duo or quad setup.
moriz
yeah, and unfortunately, AMD's 780G chipset is not compatible with intel chips. until i can find nvidia's comparable chipset motherboard selling for ~$100, it's AMD for me.
P1RATE
LockerLoad
Morriz,
If you must buy a 780g board then buy a board with 5 phases or more on the voltage regulator. Any Amd CPU worth considering will consume more wattage than that ECS board is designed to handle.
Answer a few questions for me and I'll help find you the best system within your budget and locale.
1. are you capable of upgrading firmware(flash the mobo bios)?
2. do you intend or want to overclock the CPU in this system for extra performance?
3. do you absolutely need integrated graphics or is a throwaway video card equivalent to the 780g(hd2400) enough to fill the gap until the new cards come out.
If you must buy a 780g board then buy a board with 5 phases or more on the voltage regulator. Any Amd CPU worth considering will consume more wattage than that ECS board is designed to handle.
Answer a few questions for me and I'll help find you the best system within your budget and locale.
1. are you capable of upgrading firmware(flash the mobo bios)?
2. do you intend or want to overclock the CPU in this system for extra performance?
3. do you absolutely need integrated graphics or is a throwaway video card equivalent to the 780g(hd2400) enough to fill the gap until the new cards come out.
moriz
1: yes, but it's been a while since i've done it. i've last done it on my old P3's motherboard
2: maybe, but probably not
3: i think buying a "throwaway" graphics card is a waste of money, so i'd like the integrated graphics to be as powerful as possible... or at least be able to play games like guild wars, L2, shaiya, etc.
2: maybe, but probably not
3: i think buying a "throwaway" graphics card is a waste of money, so i'd like the integrated graphics to be as powerful as possible... or at least be able to play games like guild wars, L2, shaiya, etc.
LockerLoad
a point about 3. Integrated graphics sequesters a portion of system RAM for its own use. So it's either a waste of RAM or a Waste of Vid card(E-Bay perhaps?).
My picks:
Case Fan: Scythe S-flex http://www.canadacomputers.com/index...0&cid=FN. 505 $16.99
Case: CoolerMaster CM690 http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applicatio...497&CatId=1509 $97.99
CPU: Intel Core 2 Duo E8400 http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applicatio...?EdpNo=3574211 $243.99
Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-P35-DS3L http://www.canadacomputers.com/index...8&cid=MB. 157 $96.99
RAM: http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applicatio...646&CatId=2531 $74.99
or http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applicatio...597&CatId=2368 $34.99 if you're budget constrained.
PSU: Corsair CMPSU-550VX http://www.canadacomputers.com/index...1&cid=PS. 808 $77.99
HDD: WD2500AAKS http://www.canadacomputers.com/index...d=HD. 443.877 $56.99
DVD you picked will do fine.
Wireless adapter ditto.
Video card: http://www.canadacomputers.com/index...=999 .243.390 $175.99
or
HD2400pro throwaway(basically what's on a 780g mobo) http://www.canadacomputers.com/index...=999 .243.272 $32.99
If you choose the most expensive ram and vid card I mentioned you'll still be under budget.
The Zotac 8800GT is probably the best deal on a video card I've seen EVER!
If you plan to purchase one of the new DX10.1 cards this fall be prepared to spend $500 or more(and install the malware known as Vista).
If you still want a 780g AMD system I'll do up a spec for you, but it won't compare to this Intel machine.
Cheers
My picks:
Case Fan: Scythe S-flex http://www.canadacomputers.com/index...0&cid=FN. 505 $16.99
Case: CoolerMaster CM690 http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applicatio...497&CatId=1509 $97.99
CPU: Intel Core 2 Duo E8400 http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applicatio...?EdpNo=3574211 $243.99
Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-P35-DS3L http://www.canadacomputers.com/index...8&cid=MB. 157 $96.99
RAM: http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applicatio...646&CatId=2531 $74.99
or http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applicatio...597&CatId=2368 $34.99 if you're budget constrained.
PSU: Corsair CMPSU-550VX http://www.canadacomputers.com/index...1&cid=PS. 808 $77.99
HDD: WD2500AAKS http://www.canadacomputers.com/index...d=HD. 443.877 $56.99
DVD you picked will do fine.
Wireless adapter ditto.
Video card: http://www.canadacomputers.com/index...=999 .243.390 $175.99
or
HD2400pro throwaway(basically what's on a 780g mobo) http://www.canadacomputers.com/index...=999 .243.272 $32.99
If you choose the most expensive ram and vid card I mentioned you'll still be under budget.
The Zotac 8800GT is probably the best deal on a video card I've seen EVER!
If you plan to purchase one of the new DX10.1 cards this fall be prepared to spend $500 or more(and install the malware known as Vista).
If you still want a 780g AMD system I'll do up a spec for you, but it won't compare to this Intel machine.
Cheers
moriz
the HD4800 series looks to be in the $200-$300 range. apparently, the HD4870 with 1gb GDDR5 will retail at $299ish. of course, this is from tom's hardware, and is definately not official.
and yeah, i'm installing the malware known as vista. vista business 32bit to be exact, which i got for free.
anyways for that integrated graphics ram part... yes, i'll be cutting into my system ram, but it should be a simple matter of setting it to 128MB and use it as usual. GW does not need more than 128MB, so the performance hit shouldn't be big. not to mention, i'll be getting it all back once i install an actual graphics card.
and yeah, i'm installing the malware known as vista. vista business 32bit to be exact, which i got for free.
anyways for that integrated graphics ram part... yes, i'll be cutting into my system ram, but it should be a simple matter of setting it to 128MB and use it as usual. GW does not need more than 128MB, so the performance hit shouldn't be big. not to mention, i'll be getting it all back once i install an actual graphics card.
Why_Me
You're price-performance ratio is far worse by getting some half-assed amd integrated amd system than getting a powerful intel base with some temporary card until the 4800s come out.
LockerLoad
Ok Moriz I'll stop trying to push Intel kit on you 
Here's a 780g mobo you can use with confidence: Sapphire PI-AM2RS780G http://www.canadacomputers.com/index...9&cid=MB. 350 $99.99
This board has five phase voltage regulation and should stand up to the 125watt processor you'll wan't to use. You will have to upgrade the firmware(flash the bios) to latest release for use with AM2+(Phenom) processors.
Here's your Quad core 9850 for cheaper: http://www.canadacomputers.com/index...&cid=CPU .907 $258.99 only $2.00 more than a x3 at TigerDirect...
Although I'd recomend this instead: http://www.canadacomputers.com/index...&cid=CPU .907 $170.99
IMHO save your money until Phenoms are available at higher clock speeds.
My other component recommendations remain unchanged excepting the video card since you'll be going with the integrated *shudder*.
Good luck with you're build I'll monitor the thread in case you have more questions. BTW I'm in Toronto so if you're local and run into a snag lemme know.
Here's a 780g mobo you can use with confidence: Sapphire PI-AM2RS780G http://www.canadacomputers.com/index...9&cid=MB. 350 $99.99
This board has five phase voltage regulation and should stand up to the 125watt processor you'll wan't to use. You will have to upgrade the firmware(flash the bios) to latest release for use with AM2+(Phenom) processors.
Here's your Quad core 9850 for cheaper: http://www.canadacomputers.com/index...&cid=CPU .907 $258.99 only $2.00 more than a x3 at TigerDirect...
Although I'd recomend this instead: http://www.canadacomputers.com/index...&cid=CPU .907 $170.99
IMHO save your money until Phenoms are available at higher clock speeds.
My other component recommendations remain unchanged excepting the video card since you'll be going with the integrated *shudder*.
Good luck with you're build I'll monitor the thread in case you have more questions. BTW I'm in Toronto so if you're local and run into a snag lemme know.
moriz
hard part with flashing bios is... i'll need an AMD processor to do the flashing. unfortunately i don't own one. if that's the case, i'll go back to my original plan of getting an athlon 64 X2 6400 black edition from tigerdirect for $165. however, at the time of writing this post, that part has disappeared from the website. damn.
anyways, the resulting system needs to beat my current POS, which is a P4 3ghz, 1gb ram (don't ask me how fast, i don't know), and geforce fx5500 PCI. that's right, PCI.
i live in ottawa, so it's too far for me to visit you in person. thanks for your help anyways, i really appreciate it.
anyways, the resulting system needs to beat my current POS, which is a P4 3ghz, 1gb ram (don't ask me how fast, i don't know), and geforce fx5500 PCI. that's right, PCI.
i live in ottawa, so it's too far for me to visit you in person. thanks for your help anyways, i really appreciate it.
Blackhearted
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by moriz
and yeah, i'm installing the malware known as vista. vista business 32bit to be exact, which i got for free.
|
LockerLoad
the other processor I linked to was a 6400+ Canada computers does mail order so you're still in business
edit: Blackhearted makes a valid point, I run xp64 to support my 4Gb ram. Vista requires way more system resources, particularily memory, consequently invest in 4GB ram even though Vista 32 will only see 3.25Gb.
edit: Blackhearted makes a valid point, I run xp64 to support my 4Gb ram. Vista requires way more system resources, particularily memory, consequently invest in 4GB ram even though Vista 32 will only see 3.25Gb.
moriz
well, i can get the 64bit for free as well. gogo university. it's just that i've already downloaded the 32bit version. the 2.54GB download will weight rather significantly into my 60GBit bandwidth. does the 32bit version include the files for the 64bit as well?
the thing is, the 32bit is bound to have better driver support, and i really don't see myself actually using 4gb of ram.
of course, i might be a little out of the loop with the ram part. is 4gb suddenly the new standard now?
the thing is, the 32bit is bound to have better driver support, and i really don't see myself actually using 4gb of ram.
of course, i might be a little out of the loop with the ram part. is 4gb suddenly the new standard now?
LockerLoad
2Gb is plenty for most people on XP. Vista however is a resource hungry OS so I'd recommend more.
Although the applications you're currently running won't use more than 2Gb of RAM the extra memory will allow for OS creep, antivirus, background services and future RAM hungry games.
You can minimize apps to desktop faster if your OS doesn't have to cache them to the HDD(more RAM means less virtual memory use), your PC will seem faster.
If you must run Vista for DX10 support you can stick with the 32bit version despite the 3.25Gb limit. I strongly recommend you purchase 4Gb of Ram as it is really cheap right now. Buy matching kits at the same time to ensure compatibility.
Although the applications you're currently running won't use more than 2Gb of RAM the extra memory will allow for OS creep, antivirus, background services and future RAM hungry games.
You can minimize apps to desktop faster if your OS doesn't have to cache them to the HDD(more RAM means less virtual memory use), your PC will seem faster.
If you must run Vista for DX10 support you can stick with the 32bit version despite the 3.25Gb limit. I strongly recommend you purchase 4Gb of Ram as it is really cheap right now. Buy matching kits at the same time to ensure compatibility.
moriz
if vista 32bit can only recognize 3.25gb, would dedicating 512mb to the integrated graphics have no effect on system ram, if i get the 4GB kit?
LockerLoad
I don't know for certain as I've never tried it but I believe that to be the case.
"Various devices in a typical computer require memory-mapped access. This is known as memory-mapped I/O (MMIO). For the MMIO space to be available to 32-bit operating systems, the MMIO space must reside within the first 4 GB of address space."
"For example, if you have a video card that has 256 MB of onboard memory, that memory must be mapped within the first 4 GB of address space. If 4 GB of system memory is already installed, part of that address space must be reserved by the graphics memory mapping. Graphics memory mapping overwrites a part of the system memory. These conditions reduce the total amount of system memory that is available to the operating system."
"The reduction in available system memory depends on the devices that are installed in the computer. However, to avoid potential driver compatibility issues, the 32-bit versions of Windows Vista limit the total available memory to 3.12 GB."
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/929605
I've determined that I was mistaken about the amount of RAM useable by Vista32 according to this document It's actually 3.12Gb
EDIT: If I interpret the Microsoft Documentation correctly the memory mapped to the video card or other devices won't impact the 3.12Gb visible to Vista as long as it doesn't exceed the balance ie. no more than 880Mb.
Try the 32bit version and see how it works for you. Since you can DL Vista64 for free you can always "upgrade" if there's a problem.
BTW I've encountered very few compatibility problems using XP64 with 32bit applications.
The only applications I've had issues with were OCCT(new version works) and a free MMORPG which was crap neway(might have been Kal online). Oddly X64 has gotten me around certain Ahem "limitations"(anti scripting code) in various games...
Is X64 worth the hassles? For me it is. You'll have to determine that for yourself.
"Various devices in a typical computer require memory-mapped access. This is known as memory-mapped I/O (MMIO). For the MMIO space to be available to 32-bit operating systems, the MMIO space must reside within the first 4 GB of address space."
"For example, if you have a video card that has 256 MB of onboard memory, that memory must be mapped within the first 4 GB of address space. If 4 GB of system memory is already installed, part of that address space must be reserved by the graphics memory mapping. Graphics memory mapping overwrites a part of the system memory. These conditions reduce the total amount of system memory that is available to the operating system."
"The reduction in available system memory depends on the devices that are installed in the computer. However, to avoid potential driver compatibility issues, the 32-bit versions of Windows Vista limit the total available memory to 3.12 GB."
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/929605
I've determined that I was mistaken about the amount of RAM useable by Vista32 according to this document It's actually 3.12Gb
EDIT: If I interpret the Microsoft Documentation correctly the memory mapped to the video card or other devices won't impact the 3.12Gb visible to Vista as long as it doesn't exceed the balance ie. no more than 880Mb.
Try the 32bit version and see how it works for you. Since you can DL Vista64 for free you can always "upgrade" if there's a problem.
BTW I've encountered very few compatibility problems using XP64 with 32bit applications.
The only applications I've had issues with were OCCT(new version works) and a free MMORPG which was crap neway(might have been Kal online). Oddly X64 has gotten me around certain Ahem "limitations"(anti scripting code) in various games...
Is X64 worth the hassles? For me it is. You'll have to determine that for yourself.
Brianna
I'd honestly say go with Vista 64 bit.. I hated it at first, but now I love it, and when I first got it I swore that I'd never buy a 64 bit OS again in my life, but now I think differently. It just takes getting used to, you will notice it is worth it in the end.
I did have some software compatibilities at first, but I learned to get over them, and that a few stupid programs aren't worth dooms-daying the whole system. Unless running certain software is an absolute must (and usually it works anyway) then your best bet is in 64 bit.
I'd just say don't tie the rope around your neck, keep a copy of XP on dual boot or something in case, sometimes I do find uses for my XP still and that's why I haven't got rid of it. When my RAM died, and I was stuck with 1 gig, XP saved me.
I did have some software compatibilities at first, but I learned to get over them, and that a few stupid programs aren't worth dooms-daying the whole system. Unless running certain software is an absolute must (and usually it works anyway) then your best bet is in 64 bit.
I'd just say don't tie the rope around your neck, keep a copy of XP on dual boot or something in case, sometimes I do find uses for my XP still and that's why I haven't got rid of it. When my RAM died, and I was stuck with 1 gig, XP saved me.
moriz
alrighty, i've revised my list. i've done some browsing of local stores, and those stores will have preference since... well, they're local.
harddrive: http://www.pccyber.com/?v=product&i=HD-ST3500320AS $79.99
memory: http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applicatio...597&CatId=2368 64.99
motherboard: http://www.canadacomputers.com/index...9&cid=MB. 350 $99.99
CPU: http://www.everbest.on.ca/ver2/showProduct.php?id=2043 $175
powersupply: http://www.pccyber.com/?v=product&i=PS-ANTEC-EA500 $88
case: http://www.everbest.on.ca/ver2/showProduct.php?id=2897 $69
DVD drive: http://www.everbest.on.ca/ver2/showProduct.php?id=2503 $31
total: $607.97
after tax: $687.01
ridiculously under budget. looks like i'll be able to purchase the new HD4800 series without my next paycheck.
harddrive: http://www.pccyber.com/?v=product&i=HD-ST3500320AS $79.99
memory: http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applicatio...597&CatId=2368 64.99
motherboard: http://www.canadacomputers.com/index...9&cid=MB. 350 $99.99
CPU: http://www.everbest.on.ca/ver2/showProduct.php?id=2043 $175
powersupply: http://www.pccyber.com/?v=product&i=PS-ANTEC-EA500 $88
case: http://www.everbest.on.ca/ver2/showProduct.php?id=2897 $69
DVD drive: http://www.everbest.on.ca/ver2/showProduct.php?id=2503 $31
total: $607.97
after tax: $687.01
ridiculously under budget. looks like i'll be able to purchase the new HD4800 series without my next paycheck.
Snograt
Something bizarre about that. The site is Canadian, so presumably the prices are in $CDN, yet the mail-in rebate on the OCZ is in US$.
What's the exchange rate? Their price says 64 $CDN minus 30 $US = $34.
No big deal I guess, just odd...
What's the exchange rate? Their price says 64 $CDN minus 30 $US = $34.
No big deal I guess, just odd...
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by PC shop, eh?
* Click here to download information for:
$30 (USD) Mail In Rebate on Select OCZ Products - O261-9030-8044-2006-6046-9062-9068-9032-9028-9052-8078-8070-9006-7054-8082-2005-9024 Valid 05/17/2008 - 05/31/2008 This rebate MUST be postmarked within 30 days of purchase. This rebate is in USD currency. Notice: Limit one (1) rebate per person, address, company, or household. |
Lord Sojar
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by moriz
alrighty, i've revised my list. i've done some browsing of local stores, and those stores will have preference since... well, they're local.
harddrive: http://www.pccyber.com/?v=product&i=HD-ST3500320AS $79.99 memory: http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applicatio...597&CatId=2368 64.99 motherboard: http://www.canadacomputers.com/index...9&cid=MB. 350 $99.99 CPU: http://www.everbest.on.ca/ver2/showProduct.php?id=2043 $175 powersupply: http://www.pccyber.com/?v=product&i=PS-ANTEC-EA500 $88 case: http://www.everbest.on.ca/ver2/showProduct.php?id=2897 $69 DVD drive: http://www.everbest.on.ca/ver2/showProduct.php?id=2503 $31 total: $607.97 after tax: $687.01 ridiculously under budget. looks like i'll be able to purchase the new HD4800 series without my next paycheck. |
So yeh, go go Phenom processor, now.http://www.pccyber.com/?v=product&i=...HD9600ZWCGDBOX
That one, in particular. So worth the extra, um, what 80-90 CAD?
LockerLoad
Moriz,
Looks good to me.
The EA500 is a solid PSU but the Corsair is superior IMHO. In addition to the 120mm fan The Corsair is I believe a Private labeled Seasonic(the Cadillac of PSUs).
Either one will doubtless do the job, the Corsair will just exhaust more air from the chassis.
Looks good to me.
The EA500 is a solid PSU but the Corsair is superior IMHO. In addition to the 120mm fan The Corsair is I believe a Private labeled Seasonic(the Cadillac of PSUs).
Either one will doubtless do the job, the Corsair will just exhaust more air from the chassis.
LockerLoad
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Rahja the Thief
Ok, there was a lot of AMD hate earlier in this thread. I think AMD is great, and their prices are wonderful right now. They have a great, stable, rock solid platform with an amazing chipset to boot. HOWEVER, I must tell you that getting an Athlon X2 processor would be silly. That is antique technology. Go with an Phenom X3 or X4 CPU, because the K10 architecture, despite its flaws, is still a lot better then the K8. Not only that, but... AM2+ socket + AM2+ processor = HAX as far as FSB goes due to Hypertransport 3.0.
So yeh, go go Phenom processor, now.http://www.pccyber.com/?v=product&i=...HD9600ZWCGDBOX That one, in particular. So worth the extra, um, what 80-90 CAD? |
EDIT: I'm a card carrying AMD enthusiast My "antique" Opteron 180 runs at ~3.0ghz in a DFI NF4 Ultra-D with 4GB of 500mhz ram. It Isn't the bottleneck in my system, my GPU is. That will be the case with the AMD 6400/4800 combo as well. Still I couldn't recomend AMD CPUs over Intel right now.
Read this so as not to spread misinformation pls. http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/...rade,1928.html
AMD Phenom CPUs are overpriced compared to Intel Core2 CPUs. 3 or 4 cores net NO gain in games. Why pay for an idle core that runs 700mhz slower on a fast bus that your CPU and GPU can't utilize anyway?
If Moriz decides to buy a Phenom down the line if and when AMD offers something worth spending $250+ on, she will have the right socket for the job.
Don't go go Phenom unless you want less performance for more money.
Lord Sojar
Quote:
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Originally Posted by LockerLoad
Rhaja, There's no AMD hate here just a sincere cost benefit analysis.
EDIT: I'm a card carrying AMD enthusiast My "antique" Opteron 180 runs at ~3.0ghz in a DFI NF4 Ultra-D with 4GB of 500mhz ram. It Isn't the bottleneck in my system, my GPU is. That will be the case with the AMD 6400/4800 combo as well. Still I couldn't recomend AMD CPUs over Intel right now. Read this so as not to spread misinformation pls. http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/...rade,1928.html AMD Phenom CPUs are overpriced compared to Intel Core2 CPUs. 3 or 4 cores net NO gain in games. Why pay for an idle core that runs 700mhz slower on a fast bus that your CPU and GPU can't utilize anyway? If Moriz decides to buy a Phenom down the line if and when AMD offers something worth spending $250+ on, she will have the right socket for the job. Don't go go Phenom unless you want less performance for more money. |
That isn't true. Moriz is waiting for the 4870 AMD/ATi offerings which launch end of June or beginning of July (I have no confirmation from AMD's offices on anything right now... it was a long week)
Thus, it would be pointless to get a 90nm (NINETY!!) based fab at this point. That is so wasteful, is an energy hog, and would bottleneck the new PCIe 2.0 based 4870's. Phenom processors may have their negatives, but they are most certainly better than their Athlon counterparts. I design fabs for a living, I wouldn't give bad advice in this area. AMD has their issues, I will not argue that. Hell, I am their enemy considering my employer and my allegiance to them. I love AMD, always have, and I hope they are still here 2 years from now, hopefully turning up the heat on Intel with their upcoming parallel architecture, using subprocessors imbedded on carbon tubes. That is going to be nuts if it works out.
PS: I don't need to read articles on Tom's. Anandtech is a better site anyways, Anand is an amazing guy, had the privilege of meeting him at last developers conference. I am a bit above those platform tests they perform, as I perform about 20x more tests in a months time then they probably do in 3 months (which is by no means fun, in any sense of the word or the letters, F U N. I would rather suck on a cyanide Popsicle)
moriz
on the CPU front, i'm essentially split between the athlon X2 6400 and the phenom X3 8750. according to tom's hardware, the two performs within 2.4% of each other overall, with the phenom beating the athlon on 3D rendering tasks.
phenom is only $40 more expensive. however, with the motherboard recommended to me by Lockerload, i MIGHT have to flash the motherboard BIOs, which is impossible without another AMD processor handy.
i'm definately not getting a quad core. i don't need it, and i probably won't need it in the forseeable future. it will probably come down to whether the motherboard can support the phenom out of the box or not. phenom or athlon... maybe i should just flip a coin :S
phenom is only $40 more expensive. however, with the motherboard recommended to me by Lockerload, i MIGHT have to flash the motherboard BIOs, which is impossible without another AMD processor handy.
i'm definately not getting a quad core. i don't need it, and i probably won't need it in the forseeable future. it will probably come down to whether the motherboard can support the phenom out of the box or not. phenom or athlon... maybe i should just flip a coin :S
Lord Sojar
Quote:
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Originally Posted by moriz
on the CPU front, i'm essentially split between the athlon X2 6400 and the phenom X3 8750. according to tom's hardware, the two performs within 2.4% of each other overall, with the phenom beating the athlon on 3D rendering tasks.
phenom is only $40 more expensive. however, with the motherboard recommended to me by Lockerload, i MIGHT have to flash the motherboard BIOs, which is impossible without another AMD processor handy. i'm definately not getting a quad core. i don't need it, and i probably won't need it in the forseeable future. it will probably come down to whether the motherboard can support the phenom out of the box or not. phenom or athlon... maybe i should just flip a coin :S |
moriz
i've read that the phenoms have power management problems while idle. in fact, it apparently draws more power idle than an idling 6400. or at least, that's what it said on tom's hardware.
zamial
Im gonna break this down, not just for moriz but for anyone reading this. I too WAS an AMD fan but the times have changed.
FACTS: AMD chips draw more power and run hotter than the intel counterparts.
Intel gave up that architecture for those reasons. This also answers the question of what happened to the P4 series.
The ugly truth no one wants you to know. The Hardware in computers are moving to platform based.
Intel = Nvidia - SLI platform
AMD = radeon - Spider platform
Yes you can still mix and match BUT each platform can "sense" its components and gives a performance boost when using the same platform components.
Yes you can mix and match BUT you loose the above mentioned "built in" performance boost.
I ran AMD when they were the best but unfortunately they no longer are AT THE MOMENT.
I also am going to add in here that, from what I have learned is, math errors. The more cores you stack on top of each other the more math errors in the chip there are. This is getting better.
AMD is going to get its teeth kicked in. When they launch the new and better than intel's chips that are 45nm(which AMD has been struggling with) Intel is gonna launch the 32nm.GG.KTHXBYE.
BTW I am everyones double agent and will always go with who is the best.
FACTS: AMD chips draw more power and run hotter than the intel counterparts.
Intel gave up that architecture for those reasons. This also answers the question of what happened to the P4 series.
The ugly truth no one wants you to know. The Hardware in computers are moving to platform based.
Intel = Nvidia - SLI platform
AMD = radeon - Spider platform
Yes you can still mix and match BUT each platform can "sense" its components and gives a performance boost when using the same platform components.
Yes you can mix and match BUT you loose the above mentioned "built in" performance boost.
I ran AMD when they were the best but unfortunately they no longer are AT THE MOMENT.
I also am going to add in here that, from what I have learned is, math errors. The more cores you stack on top of each other the more math errors in the chip there are. This is getting better.
AMD is going to get its teeth kicked in. When they launch the new and better than intel's chips that are 45nm(which AMD has been struggling with) Intel is gonna launch the 32nm.GG.KTHXBYE.
BTW I am everyones double agent and will always go with who is the best.
Brianna
I heard that AMD ran much hotter and drew more power, yeah. More watts drawn = more heat to the processor? 125watt Phenom = Ouch? (Not sure).
I have been using AMD processors since I can remember, but unless (and even then I doubt) they beat Intel in the next 1-2 years, I will be switching to Intel.
And as usual, I am a die hard Nvidia fan, so I will never give up my GeForce's unless ATI seriously makes some good video cards that don't have a lot of problems (e.g messing up games and crashing the computer all the damn time, at least in my experience with a lot of ATI cards).
Now I am not saying that ATI cards aren't good, but I have dealt with them in my laptop (tons of errors and crashes) and my friend's PC's have all had tons of crashes and game errors too, I am not buying an ATI card, definitely not jumping off the cliff again like I see everyone continually doing with ATI, I'm never buying a laptop with an ATI card again either. It's just a stupid move for me to go buy something that I know I'm going to have problems with just like I have seen over the past years and experienced as well, so.. I'm definitely not switching, but I'm happy for the people who have had success with ATI cards, I just wasn't one of them.
I have been using AMD processors since I can remember, but unless (and even then I doubt) they beat Intel in the next 1-2 years, I will be switching to Intel.
And as usual, I am a die hard Nvidia fan, so I will never give up my GeForce's unless ATI seriously makes some good video cards that don't have a lot of problems (e.g messing up games and crashing the computer all the damn time, at least in my experience with a lot of ATI cards).
Now I am not saying that ATI cards aren't good, but I have dealt with them in my laptop (tons of errors and crashes) and my friend's PC's have all had tons of crashes and game errors too, I am not buying an ATI card, definitely not jumping off the cliff again like I see everyone continually doing with ATI, I'm never buying a laptop with an ATI card again either. It's just a stupid move for me to go buy something that I know I'm going to have problems with just like I have seen over the past years and experienced as well, so.. I'm definitely not switching, but I'm happy for the people who have had success with ATI cards, I just wasn't one of them.
Blackhearted
heh. Geforce 8(and apprently 9, too) cards didn't mess up games, they just messed up entire game engines. (see unreal engine 2 for an example)
Cyb3r
well no comment on Nvidia's driver quality for their older cards -_- don't know about the 9xxx series of Nvidia but their older cards have the worst driver support you can imagine atm (heck my very old P1 200mhz has an ati Pci card (use is as an old backup server and for teamspeak when holding lan's at my home which is does rather decent for it's age))
And that card is from the days ati had problems with their drivers heck i've hadn't had to switch drivers so many times as on this pc lately cause of Nvidia's bad drivers (oblivion is allready a pain to run but together with a crappy nvidia driver i think you can guess the pain -_-) another example Hellgate london and Guildwars (don't ever run GW on the 16X.XX drivers xD)
The only driver i run my dual GT's on atm is the 171.16 beta (yes i know it's dated by now, but i still have to run into problems in any of the games i play atm and that includes a wide variety ranging from RTS, RPG to FPS)
And i agree with blackhearted the Nvnews forums are swarming with posts about Geforce 8/9 series messing up whole games, some older games needed a patch specially for the G8/9 series and other games either refuse to run at all or run very choppy (got to check which game it was that ran at 10fps on a G8800 GTX and about 120 fps on a 7800 gtx if i'm correct) got to check the post but i'll check later since i got to get up early in the morning i'm affraid (paperwork, not making me happy -_-)
And that card is from the days ati had problems with their drivers heck i've hadn't had to switch drivers so many times as on this pc lately cause of Nvidia's bad drivers (oblivion is allready a pain to run but together with a crappy nvidia driver i think you can guess the pain -_-) another example Hellgate london and Guildwars (don't ever run GW on the 16X.XX drivers xD)
The only driver i run my dual GT's on atm is the 171.16 beta (yes i know it's dated by now, but i still have to run into problems in any of the games i play atm and that includes a wide variety ranging from RTS, RPG to FPS)
And i agree with blackhearted the Nvnews forums are swarming with posts about Geforce 8/9 series messing up whole games, some older games needed a patch specially for the G8/9 series and other games either refuse to run at all or run very choppy (got to check which game it was that ran at 10fps on a G8800 GTX and about 120 fps on a 7800 gtx if i'm correct) got to check the post but i'll check later since i got to get up early in the morning i'm affraid (paperwork, not making me happy -_-)
moriz
hmm, lockerload's motherboard suggestion won't work, since the part is listed as "walk-in purchase only", and i am definately not walking all the way to downtown toronto (from ottawa) to get it
anyways, the only part that i can find is this one: http://www.ncix.com/products/index.p...cture=Gigabyte
it apparently officially supports a phenom X4 9750, but not the 9850. since both chips (as well as the athlon 64 X2 6400) are 125W chips, i'm guessing that it will support all three... but i am really not sure.
anyways, the only part that i can find is this one: http://www.ncix.com/products/index.p...cture=Gigabyte
it apparently officially supports a phenom X4 9750, but not the 9850. since both chips (as well as the athlon 64 X2 6400) are 125W chips, i'm guessing that it will support all three... but i am really not sure.
Brianna
It's better that you go with a Full-ATX board anyway, don't bother with Micro-ATX.
Blackhearted
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Cyb3r
And i agree with blackhearted the Nvnews forums are swarming with posts about Geforce 8/9 series messing up whole games, some older games needed a patch specially for the G8/9 series and other games either refuse to run at all or run very choppy (got to check which game it was that ran at 10fps on a G8800 GTX and about 120 fps on a 7800 gtx if i'm correct) got to check the post but i'll check later since i got to get up early in the morning i'm affraid (paperwork, not making me happy -_-)
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Notice the huge fps dip there that happens many, many times per second on maps that do that. The normal framerate, in this case, should be about 200-300fps. The stutter caused by that makes some maps pretty much unplayable.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Cyb3r
And that card is from the days ati had problems with their drivers heck i've hadn't had to switch drivers so many times as on this pc lately cause of Nvidia's bad drivers (oblivion is allready a pain to run but together with a crappy nvidia driver i think you can guess the pain -_-) another example Hellgate london and Guildwars (don't ever run GW on the 16X.XX drivers xD)
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Myself i'm waiting for the 177.xx drivers to come out(beta or otherwise) before going through the hassle of changing video drivers(hassle cause the uninstaller removes my mobo drivers too... /sigh). Cause it's claimed that those will finally bring a long awaited stutter fix for us XP users.
And moriz, A few customer reviews says it does work with the 9850. If you want to have faith in customer reviews is up to you.