Question About Little Thom

From this forum, I've gotten the general impression that W/Mo = W/W (with the exceptions of monk skills that don't require attribute points). Yet on PvX and other build sites I see a lot of builds in which a warrior uses high monk attributes like healing and smiting (wammo). Are all those builds all builds "bad" or out of date? Or is it that in certain cases a wammo build will actually work? If so, what are some that will work in PvE if you only have Prophecies and EotN? Thanks in advance.

The fact that there are builds like that on PvX doesn't mean they're good. 90% of the builds there are poo.

You're a warrior. Your job is to kill stuff, not heal allies, that's what monks are for.

It's not recommended to take healing skills, because you lack energy, divine favour, casting sets etc.

Most builds on PvX are bad, mainly the PvE section. Unless you were looking in the farming builds, they were mainly build to farm with a more specialised build.

I dont know about you guys but i go 12 in healing and use a +1 healing prayers to do mending at +4 regen!!!!

But seriously How is anyone else going to know you have high points in healing/ smiting. Do whatever you want. Thats the brilliance of Pugs you can be anything.

Anybody can post a lame smiting wammo on PvXwiki.. I wouldn't really pay attention to the majority of the builds on that site. Generally there are much better option for a warrior, monk is good if you want Mending Touch for example. but for mending, bane signet or whatever.. just no. Sure a Healing Hands wammo can be tough to take down on occasion, but in the end you could be doing a hell of a lot more damage in the process which is more useful for your team.

Shock axe is useful
WoH wammo makes me LOL

I usually play casters, and just killing stuff isn't your only role. Tanking when required maybe? But yes don't start healing. Koss does that for me when I equip him! Stupid hero

² that
i used to play a mending wammo and god i'm still ashamed for that
now i play a shock axe war and it is one hell of a difference
shock axe wars do good damage
in AB i'm already putting my mouse cursor on the kick button when i take a W/Mo in my team
and when he has an elite that isn't from a war i click it
shock axe > wammo's since i've beaten a few wammo's myself in RA with my shock axe

Please don't.

Dont laugh at WoH wammos. they're as good as W/E running meteor shower.

/sacrsm off

Warriors inflict pain. Monks heal.

There are only two real cases where a wammo needs a monk attribute AT ALL.

1) If you bring along an attribute-based res like Rebirth, and you have a few spare points you can't put anywhere, put them in your res skill's attribute just to make it a bit more useful (I always manage to get Protection prayers up to 4).

2) Farming builds. In that case, expect 6-8 on a monk attribute.

But in standard play I see no reason you'd want any...unless you need to do some part time monking? No, other professions can do that better. Just focus on smashing things and you'll be fine.

Wow, thanks a lot guys for your responses. So basically, unless it's a specialized farming build or you have left over attribute points, there is absolutely no reason to put any points into monk attributes, right?

Please don't do that. That's a really bad discrimination. I'm a W/Mo, but that doesn't mean I'll try to heal other party members.


You know any good sword W/Mo builds that I can make with only Prophecies and EotN?

If you want to heal yourself, you're best going with Lion's Comfort because you're going to have points in Str anyway. Putting 8-10 points into another attribute for a bad heal (monks will do it better, seeing as they have ~6 more points in it then you), is a waste.

you are correct

I think the thing is that people generally want to feel in control. In the event of an emergency, I wouldn't want to place my life in the hands of a computer controlled hench or hero monk, I mean they can ran out of energy or something. But I guess monk healing is the most effecient way. But sometimes I just feel like I'm wasting my monk secondary. Also, once again, I only have Prophecies and EotN, so no Lion' Comfort for me

Don't bring Rebirth on a Warrior, it's almost as bad as Healing Breeze/Mending/etc.... take something that you can actually rez with and leave the Rebirthing to a Monk.

You know, if there are no enchantment strippers, healing breeze really isn't bad for PvE.

Well, he wont be doing all that much damage, but he'll be hard to kill - WoH is a self-heal in that build. Why one would want a self-healing tank with weakish damage output I do not know. Maybe RA?

Back before there were heroes and before henchman AI was upgraded, I would sometimes, when henchwaying, put points in healing prayer in order to pick up the slack when the hench monks decided that melee-wanding was their thing - but nowadays there's no reason to do so except in farming builds.


EDIT: At 270 health for 10e it's one of the more efficient heals there are - IF it doesn't get stripped AND provided the target isn't taking damage faster than 18 per second. Pretty big ifs.
Henches use Healing Breeze to counter degen, and unless one can remove the degen outright it's not a bad plan.

HB is bad. Even more on a war.

There's nothing wrong with rebirth on a warrior. Since warriors have the highest armor, chances are they will be the ones left if a team wipes. I always have rebirth on my Koss and it's been useful.

Aside from enchantment strippers, why is healing breeze bad on a warrior in PvE? It's the most energy efficient healing skill. Of course this is all hypothetical, because there are lots of enchantment strippers out there.

If your team wipes like that, you should be rethinking your team. If everyone is doing their JOB, nothing like that should be happening. If you are a warrior and are the last one left alive.... what the hell were you doing??? You obviously weren't killing anything. Leave the rezzes for the mid/backline, and go kill something.

#1. You are on the front line. If something goes wrong, you shouldn't be the first one to run; since you have the highest armor, you can survive the longest unattended. Stay back and let the back liners run away and rebirth you later.

#2. If everyone just brought a rez that is useable in a fight, and used it whenever a party member died, there wouldn't be wipes.

#3. If you're running SY! (which you should be as a Warrior unless there is a Paragon in the party) then you will be the only person who might die. And you shouldn't be dying anyway.

There are more useful skills he could bring in that skill-slot, and that those 10e would be better used on attack skills.
Warriors - unlike monks, eles, necros, ritualists - don't make good healers, because they have poor energy management. Leave the healing for those other professions.

People are wrong that warriors shouldn't bring rebirth, although it depends on the situation. I wouldn't go into FoW or UW with just three heroes without it.

Yes, it is. Let me explain why, in length.

1) It costs 10 energy. Warriors have 20 energy unless using Radiant Insignias and/or Attunement Runes. If you use half your energy for a heal, how do you use attack skills, stances, shouts, etc. Some are adrenaline, so you'd be fine, but not all are, and you have to build adrenaline before you can use those skills.

2) Attribute points. To make Healing Breeze worth using, you need to spend attribute points in Healing Prayers to increase the regen you get. You'd want at least 5 attribute points to get a regen of +6, or 8 points to get regen of +7. This means you have fewer points for your weapon, Strength, and Tactics.

3) As noted, not all areas will allow it to be useful. Shatter enemies like you to use it, as it gives them another way to hurt you. Strip enemies like you to use it because it gives them a way to heal themselves. Now you wasted attribute points and energy, and helped the enemy.

4) Regen is not healing. Although regen is useful, it relieves pressure, it does not heal. Bleeding, Poison, Disease, Burning, and various environment effects will cause degen. Breeze will help counter those, but it will NOT heal you.

Farming builds are different. They are designed to allow you to go without help from other players, heroes, or hench. Because of this, you need ways to stay alive. That is the only reason a Warrior should be using Monk spells to heal himself. If you are with a team, you take a Monk or Ritualist to heal you, and you only take a self heal for emergencies. Your self heal should be Lion's Comfort or Healing Signet, as you would already have points in those attributes, and can boost them more with a rune.

PvX has some very good builds. It also has some REALLY bad ones. If you notice, each build gets 'vetted'. Read the score the build got before deciding if it is good or not. Builds get a score between 0 and 5. Anything less than 3 isn't worth using in my opinion. Anything 3 or above needs to be reviewed for what you want to use it for, and maybe adjusted. PvX is done by ANYONE, and I know people who post joke builds there on occassion. So don't expect every build to be made by someone knowledgable, serious, or good at the game.

I rather not have a monk rebirthing cause he should be healing, that skill slot is better used with another prot. When the team wipes and the monk is the last one alive, he ran way too fast and allowed his teammates to die...hmm...irony...

Wow, thanx. Is healing breeze good on a monk though? I mean it is the most energy efficient heal out there isn't it?

Healing breeze is useless for anything but farming. If you realy need such a big heal you need it right away, not over 15 seconds.

Well, isn't restore life so much better in combat rez? It rez with the highest health and energy and has the shortest casting time. Yeah, I know the touch range is bad, but what other alternatives are there in the underworld? Rez signet won't get recharged for a long period of time.

What if you don't need a big heal and by the time you need one, other people in the party also need healing? Wouldn't healing breeze relieve a lot of pressure and save a lot of energy? Especially since warriors don't take that much damage, so the healing over time will get used to its full potential.

death pact sig, res sig, sig of return, flesh of my flesh and res chant on a mes are the best combat resses.

That makes no sense. If someone else in the party is being hit then prot them, heal the guy in need then return to the protted member. With decent use of prot you should rarely need a big heal and when you do WoH is there.

Healing breeze isn't that useful, because if you cast it when someone doesn't need a heal, it gets wasted. You don't need it when you're at 100% health. When someone does need healing, healing breeze won't be able to heal for enough in time.

what do you guys think of mending touch on a warrior then? 5 energy cost, 3/4 sec cast and i think and 8 sec recharge and it removes 2 conditions from target touched ally. good to counter conditions like blind and weakness.

Mending touch is excellent on a warrior. It doesn't require a high monk attribute and will remove 2 conditions.

Mend touch is one of the best utility slot skills for martial classes to take.

It's 6 sec recharge actually. And regardless, a warrior can almost always use their secondary better (or not at all). In a 4 person party pve area this might not be a bad idea to relieve pressure on your monk, but in 6 or 8 person parties I don't see the point. Mending touch is great for people not in range of support - pvp rangers, gvg flag runners, pve runners and farm builds - but otherwise it's pretty useless. Concentrate on killing stuff.

*sigh* i've been restraining myself for too long from posting on this thread. but, sir tidus.... you are really hopeless.

healing breeze = bad! stop trying to find ways around this, it is bad, always was bad, and always will be bad! it serves no purpose what-so-ever in general play ("general play" meaning you are not farming. farming is an act you perform to kill a certain small area to make loot/gold. also, i would like to emphasize SMALL AREA). healing breeze is NOT a heal, healing breeze is NOT a pressure reliever, and in conclusion, and also hpw every single person above me has said, healing breeze is NOT worth taking.

and you mentioned warriors can't do much damage.... are you kidding?? warriors are by far one of the best dmg dealing proffessions out there (besides eles, naturally).

~LeNa~

Monks shouldn't have Res.
They should have a bar looking a bit like this:

Energy management / Defensive stance/shadowstep
Condition Removal
Hex Removal
Elite
Prot
Prot
Prot
Second heal (GoH or another Prot if using RC)

Some people could be surprised by what a war using a defensive monk elite can do (mark of protection is a favorite of mine).Even with out elite there are some pretty good spike chains not relying on elites.

But then again I use it in ab... where you have to be ready to play solo for a while and survive long enough to get near some shrine (elem).

Too much healing breeze hate...High armor + Regen is pretty good defense
Run
12(Sword/axe/hammer)
10Strength
8Healing

Oh well, you waste 37 attribute points... sure you could put 2 more in strength for a little bit higher chance to crit. Or even point 8 in tactics which is just bad overall now because its just shouts and stances, and almost all warriors stances will be IAS related which isn't in the tactics line.

I also believe its better then mending touch because they can point poison and bleeding on you and Healing breeze will nullify it for 15 seconds. Whereas mending touch will cancel it but then it will probably be immediately put back on.

Sure 10 energy is a lot for a warrior but if you're really having energy problems then get a zealous sword.

Sure it will get shattered but no one targets warriors first (talking about pvp).

It also relieves pressure on the monks where they can heal themselves and/or other softies.