Monk Or Rit?

PrimalMarc

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Aug 2008

On GW :)

Passionate Kiss Of Balthazarr : KISS

16 Aug 2008 at 19:58 - 1

Hi everyone Just a quick quistion..

Monk Or Rit?

Monks: mostly heal people even tho u can see smiter monks but mostly u see healer monks or prots. So monks are pretty basic class.

Rit: Different range of stuff including heal due to restoration and you can spirit spam and deal damage with channeling. So Very Wide advanced class that can heal like monks too....

Which Do You Prefer?

Cya..

KoKoS

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Aug 2007

aBove Empress Amarox xP

KDT

Mo/E

16 Aug 2008 at 20:11 - 2

depends what u want... if u love monking like me (

) and prefer keeping ur party alive than being on the front line get teh monk.
(with the monk though u have more chances of farming

)
if u still like monking but when u get bored of it u want to be able to fight or support u can always switch to a spirit spammer or anything else u like and kill whomever u want

Nightow

Forge Runner

Join Date: Feb 2006

Kindred Order of Souls [KOS]

16 Aug 2008 at 21:14 - 3

Please, don't look at Ritualists for spirits. Believe it or not, outside of a few ([life], [bloodsong], and [vampirism]) they are usually very fragile and require a high investment in spawning, which is generally considered a bad primary.

Instead, the ritualist is usually more of a dps booster with minor heals. They boost the effectiveness of your physical team mates with skills such as [splinter weapon] or [warmongers' weapon] while providing minor heals + condition removal. They can also go Rt/R with splinter weapon/volley/spirit's strength for high damage output.

The monk on the other hand, is pretty much all about protection and healing. Very few use smiting outside of farming or other certain circumstances.

I can't go into much detail on the monk but what I can say is that I chose to make a ritualist instead for the following reasons. They can use a variety of builds, depending on the situation. (Hybrid or Splinter volley as mentioned above, as well as a pure healing build and a few other niche builds) They also have fantastic energy management with skills such as [offering of spirit] (My favorite since it's energy on demand), [essence strike] and [soothing memories]. And my final reason was that both professions can farm in a variety of places, quite easily.

I hope this makes your decision a bit easier now.

upier

Grotto Attendant

Join Date: Mar 2006

Done.

[JUNK]

16 Aug 2008 at 21:42 - 4

Ritualists.
I am a superficial RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO and the rits look better then monkies.
Hence - they get my love.

Nightow

Forge Runner

Join Date: Feb 2006

Kindred Order of Souls [KOS]

16 Aug 2008 at 21:45 - 5

Wow, Upier talking about rits and not even mentioning [assassin's promise]?!

Hell has frozen over. xD

But yeah, rit armor >>>>> monk armor. (Even for the males!)

Marty Silverblade

Administrator

Join Date: Jun 2006

16 Aug 2008 at 23:37 - 6

The main difference is that good monk hybrids go heal/prot, and good Rit builds go Resto (healing)/Channeling. Rits are like swapping some prot ability ([[Xinrae's Weapon] is now very nice - skill icon is outdated) for some offensive support. Depends on whether you prefer a midliner or a backliner I suppose.

Zahr Dalsk

Grotto Attendant

Join Date: Aug 2007

Canada

17 Aug 2008 at 01:12 - 7

I love Ritualists but lately can't stand playing mine in PvE. Right now my Assassin is getting primary focus, due to the fact that they are the ultimate killing machines in PvE.

Schmerdro

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Apr 2006

Canada

17 Aug 2008 at 10:53 - 8

You should also keep in mind that Resto Rt's have excellent energy management (Attuned Was Songkai) and un-removable weapon spells (Weapon of Warding, Weapon of Resilience). But then again, Monk enchantments are very useful (Shield of absoption, Protective Spirit etc.) and Monks heal for more health (Word of Healing, Healer's Boon).

Spirits are cute too, but most of the time Life is only one that's practical to use.

Tyla

Emo Goth Italics

Join Date: Sep 2006

17 Aug 2008 at 14:29 - 9

Monks suck because they can't deal domage liek Rits!

Rits can deal big domage AND heal AND mildly prot!

MOAR BIG DOMAGE!

Rits!!

yommi

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Jul 2006

17 Aug 2008 at 14:45 - 10

I've played both and I enjoy playing my rit more. Rits are definately more versatile in the face that you can do many more things with them besides healing. Although Monks have stronger heals (due to divine favor), Rits' restoration spells are spammable due to low cost and low recharge. A Rit's spawning line also has superb e-management.

Saraneth

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Aug 2008

Me/

18 Aug 2008 at 08:47 - 11

If I had the single slot choice between a pve monk and a pve rit, I'd probably go with the monk. Monks have better dmg reduction skills, which means that you don't have to work so hard at out healing lots of dmg. There's also the problem of hexes, which monks have more options for removing. Divine favor's a nice perk as well. However, monk enchant buffs (unlike rit wep spells) can be removed. This and the fact that monks usually have to spec into their secondary attribs for better nrg management are a bit of a downside.

Age

Hall Hero

Join Date: Jul 2005

California Canada/BC

STG Administrator

Mo/

18 Aug 2008 at 21:50 - 12

Monks can do it all.

furanshisuko

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Oct 2007

18 Aug 2008 at 22:01 - 13

monk all the way cause you can get a group in less time ,fow,uw,doa ,etc...

Nightow

Forge Runner

Join Date: Feb 2006

Kindred Order of Souls [KOS]

18 Aug 2008 at 22:09 - 14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Age

Monks can do it all.

And rits can't?

Quote:

monk all the way cause you can get a group in less time ,fow,uw,doa ,etc... I heard splinter volley was fantastic and isn't there a team build of Rits for DoA?

Elder III

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jan 2007

Ohio

I Will Never Join Your Guild (NTY)

18 Aug 2008 at 22:10 - 15

Probably my two least favorite classes to play, unless it's a 55 Monk... Rit wins out though, they are MO Sexah!

Rhamia Darigaz

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Apr 2008

19 Aug 2008 at 00:28 - 16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saraneth

monks usually have to spec into their secondary attribs for better nrg management are a bit of a downside. good monks use their spells efficiently. efficient domage mitigation is an effective form of energy management that doesn't require a skill slot or attribute points.

Nightow

Forge Runner

Join Date: Feb 2006

Kindred Order of Souls [KOS]

19 Aug 2008 at 00:59 - 17

I feel like this must be posted for great justice.

Energy management for most of the easier to play rit builds.
'Nuff said.

P.S. I wonder if the OP has decided yet or not?

Saraneth

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Aug 2008

Me/

19 Aug 2008 at 01:56 - 18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rhamia Darigaz

good monks use their spells efficiently. efficient domage mitigation is an effective form of energy management that doesn't require a skill slot or attribute points. I'v alrdy pointed out the usefulness of dmg reductions, but you're right, decent monks will be more attuned to what they're doing rather than spamming spells. Even so, there will be situations in which a monk's nrg starts to take a dive.

Steps_Descending

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Apr 2007

IN my pocket plane. Obviously!

Little Tom's Pocket Plane [THom]

Me/Mo

19 Aug 2008 at 14:41 - 19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nightow

Please, don't look at Ritualists for spirits. Believe it or not, outside of a few ([life], [bloodsong], and [vampirism]) they are usually very fragile and require a high investment in spawning, which is generally considered a bad primary. Please, take a glance at an artilery ritualist. Believe it or not, [Pain]+[bloodsong]+[anguish]+[shadowsong]+[wanderlust]/[dissonance]/[disenchantment]+[painful bond] = masive damage and disruption. They are usually very fragile but you have a party to take the damage for them. Of course I am not saying you have SplinterBarage'S AoE but if you are smart enough to pull a few mob at a time you have a killing machine. (BTW did I mention the Pull'n'Trap possibility?)

EDIT : RIt all the way for afore mentioned reasons, tought a monk is always useful to have as a secondary char.

Nightow

Forge Runner

Join Date: Feb 2006

Kindred Order of Souls [KOS]

19 Aug 2008 at 15:01 - 20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steps_Descending

Please, take a glance at an artilery ritualist. Believe it or not, [Pain]+[bloodsong]+[anguish]+[shadowsong]+[wanderlust]/[dissonance]/[disenchantment]+[painful bond] = masive damage and disruption. They are usually very fragile but you have a party to take the damage for them. Of course I am not saying you have SplinterBarage'S AoE but if you are smart enough to pull a few mob at a time you have a killing machine. (BTW did I mention the Pull'n'Trap possibility?)

EDIT : RIt all the way for afore mentioned reasons, tought a monk is always useful to have as a secondary char. All I can say is, enjoy your three or five second casting times, the buggy AI of spirits and your army of glass cannons. Sure, you can pull off a semi-decent Spirit army with [Assassin's promise] but you're still dealing with those crrrraaazy cast times there.

I'd just rather [spirit's [email protected]]/[splinter [email protected]]/[[email protected]] for big domage.

Zahr Dalsk

Grotto Attendant

Join Date: Aug 2007

Canada

19 Aug 2008 at 16:25 - 21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steps_Descending

Trylo

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Jan 2006

[Here] | CKOD

E/R

19 Aug 2008 at 16:42 - 22

rits are midline.

monks are backline.

rits are far more similar to elementalists. if you are backlining as a rit youre not getting the full potential of the profession.

Steps_Descending

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Apr 2007

IN my pocket plane. Obviously!

Little Tom's Pocket Plane [THom]

Me/Mo

19 Aug 2008 at 17:35 - 23

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zahr Dalsk
They'll die nearly instantly, and a Moebius Blossom Assassin will still kill things more quickly. With better survivability, and still room for utility.

Originally Posted by Nightow

All I can say is, enjoy your three or five second casting times, the buggy AI of spirits and your army of glass cannons. Sure, you can pull off a semi-decent Spirit army with [Assassin's promise] but you're still dealing with those crrrraaazy cast times there.

I'd just rather [spirit's [email protected]]/[splinter [email protected]]/[[email protected]] for big domage.

Big damage sais ye? Maybe my Splinter build is wrong, I found I fare better with spirit than Bow, maybe it's just me.

Well Pain and Blood generally last 2-3 fights (thk to summon spirit), Shadow is only usefull to take out attackers (begining of the fight vs melees and late vs the last ranged), and anguish is only 3 sec. That gives a 7-11 sec preparation every medium/big fights which can alway be cast at the beginning of the fight. I'm fine with that.
Crazzy cast time? 3 sec? Not even 4 sec on average?Crazy?(sorry for that, just sprang to mind)

Maybe it's my playstyle but they are only rarely attacked, did you tried using SUmmon Spirit to take them out of harm's way.
And buggy AI? generally they attack the first mob to enter range (which I'd kill anyway) and attack the Painful Bonded target... Maybe I'm just too patient notice they're innefficient.

EDIT : small typo

Tyla

Emo Goth Italics

Join Date: Sep 2006

19 Aug 2008 at 18:33 - 24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steps_Descending

Probably, but I don't like spamming 2 skills every seconds. That's player taste here. Beside, it looks like we are arguing about which build is the best dmg dealer. In wich case, either you are right and there is no room for a dmg rit (making the class pointless), or it's the other way around (making mentioning the assassin pointless). If you're a Ritualist? Buffing your melee with Splinter Weapon, and even Ancestor's Rage would yield greater damage while only taking up two slots. The rest of the slots can go to /Mo buffs (Looking at the Rt/Mo superbuffer here), Weapon of Warding, Protective Was Kaolai... You get it all.

Offensive Spirit Spamming isn't strong because it's single-target and the spirits can die near insantly because of several nerfs to it.

But whatever, run what you want because it's PvE and PvE is a place where anything works.

Nightow

Forge Runner

Join Date: Feb 2006

Kindred Order of Souls [KOS]

19 Aug 2008 at 19:04 - 25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steps_Descending

I enjoy heroes as much as some other people on here but please get your facts straight.

Quote: [Pain]+[bloodsong]+[anguish]+[shadowsong]+[wanderlust]/[dissonance]/[disenchantment]+[painful bond] = masive damage and disruption. Half of those are 5 second casts. Sure, you can have all the prep time you want when in most PvE situations with H/H but why bother when you can use the same combo I mentioned with above with better results. Or, just do as Tyla said with even greater results.

Quote:

Maybe it's my playstyle but they are only rarely attacked, did you tried using SUmmon Spirit to take them out of harm's way. [Summon Spirits] is a bit of a waste if you ask me but then again, having more than 1-2 spirits on your bar is already a waste.

Quote: Can I just say that my spirit build got me some vanquish (HM) where I failed/barely made it in NM (you read well!) with some bow builds. Can you teach me how to play???

Quote:

And buggy AI? generally they attack the first mob to enter range (which I'd kill anyway) and attack the Painful Bonded target... Maybe I'm just too patient notice they're innefficient. I've seen plenty of times where spirits just float there and not do a single thing. Other times, they'd wait for a minute before attacking and then sometimes, sometimes they do exactly as you say. But still, relying on spirits just seems, well... unreliable.

P.S. - There's a reason why the last big update took two elite skills AWAY from communing.

P.S.2 - OP, where art thou? If he/she replied already with what they picked, we could just end this discussion...

Tyla

Emo Goth Italics

Join Date: Sep 2006

20 Aug 2008 at 02:18 - 26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nightow

I've seen plenty of times where spirits just float there and not do a single thing. Other times, they'd wait for a minute before attacking and then sometimes, sometimes they do exactly as you say. But still, relying on spirits just seems, well... unreliable.

That's usually when they've been left alone with nothing there for about 30 seconds. I know they stop engaging completely at a certain point, but I'm not certain on the requirement that needs to be met.

Magikarp

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Nov 2007

[HAWK]

20 Aug 2008 at 02:29 - 27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nightow

And rits can't?

no... they cant. sure, rits can pull a lot of great moves out there on the field, but as far as actual healing/protting, monks have nearly infinite utility as opposed to the rits WoW, and a few blind moves. Not to mention, WoW is more or less their only form of "prot", whereas a monk has a whole line devoted to it. Smiting is very meta atm, and offers a very powerful array of support damage paired with equal utility in the form of prots and heals, where as channeling is great for support damage, it has very little actual support utility outside of Splinter and WW (which are good, im not downing these).

in therms of versatility, its nearly a 50/50 split, in terms of practicality and usability, the monk takes the cake with a landslide.

Nightow

Forge Runner

Join Date: Feb 2006

Kindred Order of Souls [KOS]

20 Aug 2008 at 02:59 - 28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Magikarp

no... they cant. sure, rits can pull a lot of great moves out there on the field, but as far as actual healing/protting, monks have nearly infinite utility as opposed to the rits WoW, and a few blind moves. Not to mention, WoW is more or less their only form of "prot", whereas a monk has a whole line devoted to it. Smiting is very meta atm, and offers a very powerful array of support damage paired with equal utility in the form of prots and heals, where as channeling is great for support damage, it has very little actual support utility outside of Splinter and WW (which are good, im not downing these).

in therms of versatility, its nearly a 50/50 split, in terms of practicality and usability, the monk takes the cake with a landslide. Ok, yes we all know rits can't prot cause anet decided to nerf on spirits. I admit I was wrong on that part. (Seesh, gotta think about every little thing you say nowadays.

)

But you did miss a few skills... [Ancestors' Rage], [Nightmare Weapon], [Warmonger's Weapon].

credit

Banned

Join Date: Jan 2008

Team Apathy [aFk]

W/P

20 Aug 2008 at 03:09 - 29

Monks for outright prot/heals, rits for more party support.

Magikarp

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Nov 2007

[HAWK]

20 Aug 2008 at 04:24 - 30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nightow

Ok, yes we all know rits can't prot cause anet decided to nerf on spirits. I admit I was wrong on that part. (Seesh, gotta think about every little thing you say nowadays.

)

But you did miss a few skills... [Ancestors' Rage], [Nightmare Weapon], [Warmonger's Weapon].

i didnt miss anything. i said Warmongers weapon (WW), and Rage is a damage skill.. not really a support skill..

as for NW.. meh.

Tyla

Emo Goth Italics

Join Date: Sep 2006

20 Aug 2008 at 05:19 - 31

If Rage isn't a support skill then what is Splinter Weapon?

Nightow

Forge Runner

Join Date: Feb 2006

Kindred Order of Souls [KOS]

20 Aug 2008 at 12:21 - 32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Magikarp

i didnt miss anything. i said Warmongers weapon (WW), and Rage is a damage skill.. not really a support skill..

as for NW.. meh. Sorry, missed that.

Can we just close this thread already? I think the OP has MORE than enough answers.

Magikarp

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Nov 2007

[HAWK]

20 Aug 2008 at 16:27 - 33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyla

If Rage isn't a support skill then what is Splinter Weapon?

its a matter of opinion i suppose. the way i see it, rage was more of a secondary damage tool used to defend the actual rit or spirits. rage didnt get really popular till a little before NF. but yeah, i see your point in the idea that it "supports" spikes etc.

on the other hand, splinter weapon is directly linked to damage dealing in the first place, and is obviously a support skill.

upier

Grotto Attendant

Join Date: Mar 2006

Done.

[JUNK]

20 Aug 2008 at 16:44 - 34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nightow

Can we just close this thread already? I think the OP has MORE than enough answers. I doubt the OP is asking for advice.
I think he's just asking which option we prefer.

Steps_Descending

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Apr 2007

IN my pocket plane. Obviously!

Little Tom's Pocket Plane [THom]

Me/Mo

20 Aug 2008 at 17:20 - 35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nightow

I enjoy heroes as much as some other people on here but please get your facts straight.

Half of those are 5 second casts. Sure, you can have all the prep time you want when in most PvE situations with H/H but why bother when you can use the same combo I mentioned with above with better results. Or, just do as Tyla said with even greater results. Let's see... Pain, BloodS,Anguish = 3 sec (stable on my bar)
Shadow song = 5 sec (Always there too)
Wanderlust OR Dissonance OR ... = 5 sec ( only have 1 of them at a time, they're expensive enough as it is)
Average : 3sec, 3sec, 3sec, 5sec, 5sec = under 4 sec on average for a given bar. 10 sec max before a fight.

Did I forget to mention it wasn't AoE. That means in area where massive pulls are needed you're screwed, if you're taken by surprise it takes some time (5-6 sec) to lay the basic spirits and there are chances they won't focus fire. I can't really deny that. Is it really that hard to avoid a surprise attack?

BTW Tyla, out of curiosity (no saracasm here, it really IS only curiosity), do you still log on?

Chucky333

Academy Page

Join Date: Aug 2008

Mo/

24 Aug 2008 at 09:33 - 36

When it comes to healing and protting, monks, hands down.
The rits strength is their verstality and the multiple roles you can take in the team, which monks dont have at all (Theyre role is always the healing\prot, and no i dont share any love for smiting).
This versatilty is also their biggest weakness.
Resto rits are not as effective as monks, channeling rits not as effective as eles, spirit spamming rits not as effective as most other support builds out there (namely, imbagons ^^).
Personally i have both (monk is my main) and i find that rits also has the biggest potential for damage\support hybrid builds.
I dont think any other proffesion can combine damage with support as well as rits can, and thats what i like the most about them.
In the end of the day it comes down to wether you're gonna enjoy healing\protting alone without the need for other options, in which case youre better off with monks, or if you like more verstality.
Just my 2 cents

Tyla

Emo Goth Italics

Join Date: Sep 2006

24 Aug 2008 at 14:39 - 37

^
Splinter Weapon > Ele damage.