Every time I set foot in the Central Transfer Chamber, there's at least one person spamming "Running ATFH! NM =1k, HM =2k." or something to that effect. Now, I have no problem with runners/running in general, but, in my opinion, it's deplorable that the final boss of the game can be solo'ed or nearly solo'ed. He supposed to be hard... Well, I hired a couple runners just to see how they do things.
First and foremost, being heavily enchanted seems to be popular. This extends to the point of using a monk hero who stands back in the safe area with the people being ran. The hero will use maintained enchants to buff the player, and the player then goes in and solos the Great Destroyer. So what to do about this? Well, if being heavily enchanted is important to alot of these runners, then let's take their enchantments away. The Great Destroyer has 6 skills, so that means room for 2 more. I propose Great Destroyer skill#7:
Incinerate Enchantments: -- Activation Time: 1/2 -- Skill Recharge: 14
Skill. Target foe loses all enchantments. For each enchantment lost this way, that foe suffers 30 fire damage. (Maximum 120 fire damage)
So max damage achived at 4 enchants or more removed. This would really hurt the builds of a lot of these runners, while not making the Great Destroyer too much harder for an organized, eight man party.
The second possibilty involves another type of destroyer. I don't see it as often now, but this used to be spammed alot by runners in the CTC. "Running ATFH (blah blah blah) Resign if Deeds." Oh... so the Destroyers of Deeds mess you up, do they?
Let's make sure it's imposible for them to not run into at least one Destroyer of Deeds then. This would be very easy to do. Bosses can be in a party just like anyone else. Change it so that the Great Destroyer always spawns as the leader of a three man party. Set it so that the two 'henchies' he gets have a 100% chance to be Destroyers of Deeds. Being in a party with the Great Destroyer would mean they get aggroed when he gets aggroed and vice versa. Thus it would be imposible to fight the Great Destroyer without having a couple of deeds bothering you. This wouldn't hurt an eight man party anywhere near as much as it would hurt a lone runner (all the interupt spam on one guy).
Again, I don't have anything against runners in general, but IMO you shouldn't be able to solo an end game boss. Anyone agree with me?
Buff the Great Destroyer.
Sage Tylos
Lishy
No... Just.. No...
This is an unnecessary nerf.
Shiro is solo-able. Lich is Pathetic. And Abbaddon is a big bowl of monoliths.
Why should the great destroyer be any different in terms of being pathetic?
Why not just nerf the 55 monk because I can take on an army of undead? /sarcasm
This is an unnecessary nerf.
Shiro is solo-able. Lich is Pathetic. And Abbaddon is a big bowl of monoliths.
Why should the great destroyer be any different in terms of being pathetic?
Why not just nerf the 55 monk because I can take on an army of undead? /sarcasm
Brimstonez
I really hate that word, 'nerf'.
Just because people take the time to figure something out in the game, that is not an exploit, and figure they can make money off it....others have to cry about it.
Guild Wars has been nerfed to hell over 3 years now. People complain, shit gets nerfed, people cry, other people come up with a new build, people complain, shit gets nerfed, people cry....the cycle continues.
Honestly, how about you just delete Guild Wars, snap your cd's, and give your account information to someone who will actually appreciate the game for what it is...
Just because people take the time to figure something out in the game, that is not an exploit, and figure they can make money off it....others have to cry about it.
Guild Wars has been nerfed to hell over 3 years now. People complain, shit gets nerfed, people cry, other people come up with a new build, people complain, shit gets nerfed, people cry....the cycle continues.
Honestly, how about you just delete Guild Wars, snap your cd's, and give your account information to someone who will actually appreciate the game for what it is...
Gabriel Kimura
Lol. Puff the Magic Dragon and his cousin Buff the Great Destroyer!!
^^
^^
Freke
Eh he should be buffed. "Primordus' most powerful general" can be soloed by one person doesn't say much for how powerful T3H ANCIENT DRAGON WHOS POWER RIVALS THE GODS is.
ajc2123
I say yes. I love this game to pieces, but I HATE it that all the endgame bosses are so easy! The lich's hardest part is the mission part of it, shiro is laughable along with abadon, and the great destroyer is probably easier then shiro and abby but a little harder then lich.
I would love them to be harder.
I would love them to be harder.
Sage Tylos
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Kain Fz
No... Just.. No...
This is an unnecessary nerf. Shiro is solo-able. Lich is Pathetic. And Abbaddon is a big bowl of monoliths. Why should the great destroyer be any different in terms of being pathetic? Why not just nerf the 55 monk because I can take on an army of undead? /sarcasm |
And I don't care about an army of undead :P. I care about the end game bosses being challenging. Is it wrong for me to want the final boss to actually put up a halfways decent fight? I'm talking about runners because, by watching them, you see where the blind spots are in the boss's build. It's these blind spots I want fixed (for all end game bosses).
Vale Todo
/signed
Anything that makes this game harder by giving the enemies more coordinated strategies will get my vote.
Anything that makes this game harder by giving the enemies more coordinated strategies will get my vote.
Highlander Of Alba
well,
What does it matter ,
The answer is pure and simple ..
if you dont like runners( I have nothing against them)..seems you went with one if you were observing
Then simply dont go with one ...(I prefer to beat the game without need of runners)
You complain you want it harder?
Did you go hero/hench /pug and beat it?
Its like when when some skills were overpowered..If you dont like it then dont have it on your bar...
many people prefer an easy option if its there,
Its not doing your gameplay any harm is it> everyone has there own style
What does it matter ,
The answer is pure and simple ..
if you dont like runners( I have nothing against them)..seems you went with one if you were observing
Then simply dont go with one ...(I prefer to beat the game without need of runners)
You complain you want it harder?
Did you go hero/hench /pug and beat it?
Its like when when some skills were overpowered..If you dont like it then dont have it on your bar...
many people prefer an easy option if its there,
Its not doing your gameplay any harm is it> everyone has there own style
zelgadissan
I personally think every end game boss should have roughly a 50/50 shot to win the battle against a full party. I mean, the Great Destroyer is the greatest threat to the dwarves and he can be killed by one monk? Shiro can destroy an entire sea but one assassin can solo him?
/signed x1000. Buff them ALL. We need much, much harder endgame bosses in GW2.
Editing: maybe 60/40 in the player's favor is more realistic.
/signed x1000. Buff them ALL. We need much, much harder endgame bosses in GW2.
Editing: maybe 60/40 in the player's favor is more realistic.
-Lotus-
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Sage Tylos
bla bla bla
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Quote:
| Again, I don't have anything against runners in general, but IMO you shouldn't be able to solo an end game boss. Anyone agree with me? |
Miska Bow
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Vale Todo
/signed
Anything that makes this game harder by giving the enemies more coordinated strategies will get my vote. |
I just love getting my ass kicked when trying something for the first time. It makes me try different stuff, learn about more skills for my hroes and me and gets my nose in WIKI a bit.
I farmed EOTN rep with H/H doing heroes books; sabway, 2 monks Devona and Herta; and that was one of the mission i liked because it takes about 30 sec to take the GREAT TURKEY down. But having it to be more of a fight would be nice. Im not saying to buff it so it cant be runned, i say make it last a bit longer for our gaming pleasure.
Anyone know of a mission except for the Great Turkey, where you blink and you missed it all?
Kanyatta
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Brimstonez
(A.)I really hate that word, 'nerf'.
(B.)Just because people take the time to figure something out in the game, that is not an exploit, and figure they can make money off it....others have to cry about it. (C.)Guild Wars has been nerfed to hell over 3 years now. People complain, shit gets nerfed, people cry, other people come up with a new build, people complain, shit gets nerfed, people cry....the cycle continues. (D.)Honestly, how about you just delete Guild Wars, snap your cd's, and give your account information to someone who will actually appreciate the game for what it is... |
B. Do you honestly think when the devs were making the game, they went "Oh, so the end-game boss should be the Great Destroyer, he should be as powerful as a god, oh, and he should be able to be killed by one player with relative ease." It's basically an exploit, people are playing the game the way it's not meant to be played.
C. The reason stuff gets nerfed is because it's overpowered. If we just had one build forever that everyone used that could beat everything, wouldn't the game get stale and/or boring? Stuff gets nerfed, and then other stuff gets found out how powerful it is. It's not easy to achieve balance across the board, but by nerfing stuff, balance gets ever-closer.
D. That's one of the dumbest things I've ever heard a human being say. That's like, if you paid a housekeeper $500/week to clean your house, do your dishes, etc. then you found out she did a crappy job, and your neighbor said "Oh, well you should just continue to pay her and let her work at my house instead of yours."
(parts in quoted post that are in parentheses were added by me for clarity)
pumpkin pie
Quote:
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Originally Posted by zelgadissan
I personally think every end game boss should have roughly a 50/50 shot to win the battle against a full party. I mean, the Great Destroyer is the greatest threat to the dwarves and he can be killed by one monk? Shiro can destroy an entire sea but one assassin can solo him?
/signed x1000. Buff them ALL. We need much, much harder endgame bosses in GW2. Editing: maybe 60/40 in the player's favor is more realistic. |
Zahr Dalsk
/totally signed
Also, buff Shiro, Abaddon, and the Undead Lich. They should be impressive and deadly, hard to defeat.
Also, buff Shiro, Abaddon, and the Undead Lich. They should be impressive and deadly, hard to defeat.
zelgadissan
Quote:
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Originally Posted by pumpkin pie
well we are not dwarves .....
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Konig Des Todes
/sign for a buff to all 4 end-game bosses.
Your idea for the Great Destroyer, it will work in stopping the runners, but idk if that's a good skill to put in because it seems overpowered and might harm people fighting the mission (much like how the change to UW hurt not only the perma-SF farmers but regular groups). Although, the long recharge and targeting only one person might help balance it out. Idk, not a skills expert.
But I do think the Lich, Shiro, and Abaddon need to be a tad harder. I can solo shiro with my sin *thanks to critical defenses, critical agility, and wild blow* lich is easy except for the "having to kill him three times" part, as for Abaddon, he's too easy for a fallen god, even if he is chained up.
We may be great heroes, but these villains just don't live up to their lore standards.
There are plenty of room for additional skills on Shiro, the Lich, and Abaddon so I think they all deserve a buff.
And this is coming from a person who runs Shiro and is making a Monk for farming/running stuff.
Your idea for the Great Destroyer, it will work in stopping the runners, but idk if that's a good skill to put in because it seems overpowered and might harm people fighting the mission (much like how the change to UW hurt not only the perma-SF farmers but regular groups). Although, the long recharge and targeting only one person might help balance it out. Idk, not a skills expert.
But I do think the Lich, Shiro, and Abaddon need to be a tad harder. I can solo shiro with my sin *thanks to critical defenses, critical agility, and wild blow* lich is easy except for the "having to kill him three times" part, as for Abaddon, he's too easy for a fallen god, even if he is chained up.
We may be great heroes, but these villains just don't live up to their lore standards.
There are plenty of room for additional skills on Shiro, the Lich, and Abaddon so I think they all deserve a buff.
And this is coming from a person who runs Shiro and is making a Monk for farming/running stuff.
Fuzzie
no thanks... there annoying enough :-)
Shayne Hawke
/notsigned, because it would call for other endgame bosses to be buffed as well, since two of them are soloable and the other one is still easy.
Instead, just hope that GW2 end bosses are a little more epic and a little less soloable.
Instead, just hope that GW2 end bosses are a little more epic and a little less soloable.
pumpkin pie
Quote:
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Originally Posted by zelgadissan
Fine, the Great Destroyer is stated as a threat to all of Tyria as well. Happy now?
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shiro did not destroy the entire sea, only the jade sea and its frozen not destroy
runs very fast and very far away
Konig Des Todes
Quote:
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Originally Posted by pumpkin pie
shiro did not destroy the entire sea, only the jade sea and its frozen not destroy
runs very fast and very far away |
Also, you can run but you can't hide.
Masterful Victory
Ok guys obviously you don't understand so let me explain it to you: It's not that the endgame bosses are hard...IT'S THAT WE ARE COMPLETELY EPICLY STRONG!!! Turning a sea to jade as well as being a fallen god aren't really as hard as you think...
Jetdoc
I absolutely agree. The Great Destroyer, by far, is the easiest endgame boss to beat out of all the campaigns.
The only alternative to getting a runner for A Time for Heroes is to either (1) hero/hench it or (2) beg some guild/alliance mates to help you. PuGs are almost non-existent in the Central Transfer Chamber for ATFH, due to the runners and the ease of it with heroes and henchmen. Your best bet to PuG it is to do Destruction's Depths and ask your group to finish ATFH afterwards (which is kinda silly, but meh...)
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Highlander Of Alba
Did you go hero/hench /pug and beat it?
Its not doing your gameplay any harm is it> everyone has there own style |
ShadowsRequiem
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Freke
Eh he should be buffed. "Primordus' most powerful general" can be soloed by one person doesn't say much for how powerful T3H ANCIENT DRAGON WHOS POWER RIVALS THE GODS is.
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that method of thinking fails.
Kung Foo Man Choo
I have beaten all the games. For the most part the first few times I tried killing the end game bosses, I failed. I had no experience in how to beat them or a strategy to kill them. After failing NUMEROUS times, I watched their skills, saw what they did and how they killed things. Then I go in ready to defeat them after learing what they do and how to kill them. Sure I beat them with some ease, AFTER I learned their skills and failed at killing them numerous times. Just because someone sat down and figured out a build to solo an end game boss doesnt neccessarily make the boss a push over with no power.
Hell lets buff up every single monster in this game because they are all SOLOABLE!
Hell lets buff up every single monster in this game because they are all SOLOABLE!
Tender Wolf
No no no, let's not make the game harder. If it's too easy, then go to HM. I think the difficulty level is fine the way it is. Some people prefer to get the mission done quickly and get ran through it so let's not take that way from them, and that includes in Guild Wars 2.
DarkGanni
CoF can be ran, Shards of orr can be ran, Ooze pit can be ran, kathandrax can be run....All of tyria can be ran by a perma SF sin. You get the point.
/notsigned kthxbai.
Useless ideas everyday on guru *sigh*
/notsigned kthxbai.
Useless ideas everyday on guru *sigh*
Axel Zinfandel
/Signed, only if all end game bosses are buffed to prevent -any- rushing. Not QQing rushers by any means, but they are END GAME bosses. Rushers can rush something else for all I care. I don't care if the rest of the game can or can't be run. The end of a campaign should simply be harder then that, by any means.
upier
It's GWEN we are talking about.
I took my ritualist through it once and I will never take another character though it again - nor will I take my ritu to fight that guy again.
The crap is too boring to waste my time on it.
So - I don't care what you do with it.
Make him hit 10times harder, make him hit 10 time weaker, make him spawn 10 times more foes, make him shit rainbows and daisies, ... I don't plan on visiting him again.
Well ... if he was shitting rainbows and daisies ... I'd be tempted to see that ...
/totally don't care
I took my ritualist through it once and I will never take another character though it again - nor will I take my ritu to fight that guy again.
The crap is too boring to waste my time on it.
So - I don't care what you do with it.
Make him hit 10times harder, make him hit 10 time weaker, make him spawn 10 times more foes, make him shit rainbows and daisies, ... I don't plan on visiting him again.
Well ... if he was shitting rainbows and daisies ... I'd be tempted to see that ...
/totally don't care
theblackmage
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Kung Foo Man Choo
I have beaten all the games. For the most part the first few times I tried killing the end game bosses, I failed. I had no experience in how to beat them or a strategy to kill them. After failing NUMEROUS times, I watched their skills, saw what they did and how they killed things. Then I go in ready to defeat them after learing what they do and how to kill them. Sure I beat them with some ease, AFTER I learned their skills and failed at killing them numerous times. Just because someone sat down and figured out a build to solo an end game boss doesnt neccessarily make the boss a push over with no power.
Hell lets buff up every single monster in this game because they are all SOLOABLE! |
I may suck at end-game boss fights, but pretty much every time I do any of them (Lich excluded), I end up wiping. Repeatedly. After I already cleared the mission on several other characters. Just 'cause someone found a way to take advantage of game mechanics to make something faster/easier does not mean that mechanics/enemy skills need to be changed.
Take any form of invinci-monk for example. Did Anet INTEND for them to work like that? While I can't say for sure, I think the safe bet here is "no." That goes for just about any build, Great Destroyer solo-stomp included. The game is about using skills in combination with each other for synergy, no?
Not to mention, isn't a good portion of an elementalist's e-management in enchantments? Specifically of the 45sec cooldown variety? There's only so much GoLE can do for you w/o an attunement up. Your proposed change to the GD's skills = no more ele's for balance groups.
RedStar
I don't care how you buff him as long as you don't put him in a group...
Arduin
Sure, just merge the two last missions (Depths of Destruction and A Time for Heroes). Just as you needed to go through all Hell's Precipice before you encounter the Lich.
Tender Wolf
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Arduinna
Sure, just merge the two last missions (Depths of Destruction and A Time for Heroes). Just as you needed to go through all Hell's Precipice before you encounter the Lich.
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Barrett
the end boss isnt actually meant to be difficult
Because hes just the last boss u see in game
its not like a single player game where the last boss has to be there hardest
the real bosses are ones like
mallyx
kanaxai
Urgoz
and few other
just because its the last missions main enemy doesnt mean has to be strongest of all
and why should they spend time nerfing petty builds or buffing things not needed
when they could be spending time working on GW2
dont like the game dont play it!
Because hes just the last boss u see in game
its not like a single player game where the last boss has to be there hardest
the real bosses are ones like
mallyx
kanaxai
Urgoz
and few other
just because its the last missions main enemy doesnt mean has to be strongest of all
and why should they spend time nerfing petty builds or buffing things not needed
when they could be spending time working on GW2
dont like the game dont play it!
Numa Pompilius
The only reason the Great Destroyer is easy is:
1) No enchant removal
2) Can be pulled to within the range of spirits placed on solid ground.
Could be pretty easily fixed if it was a problem. Which it isn't; the Great Destroyer isn't easy unless you research your build before meeting him, meaning you've got no-one to blame for your ruined gaming experience but yourself.
Spoiling the content for yourself leads to diminished enjoyment - deal with it.
1) No enchant removal
2) Can be pulled to within the range of spirits placed on solid ground.
Could be pretty easily fixed if it was a problem. Which it isn't; the Great Destroyer isn't easy unless you research your build before meeting him, meaning you've got no-one to blame for your ruined gaming experience but yourself.
Spoiling the content for yourself leads to diminished enjoyment - deal with it.
Age
No.No and No agian stop coming up with all these bad ideas if you don't like the runs then don't get ran do the mission.Incinerate Enchantments bad idea for skill suggestion.
JupiterStarWarrior
I agree with the addition of the skill to the Great Destroyer, except a few things:
5
1/2 
30 
Skill. Removes all enchantments from target foe. For each enchantment removed this way, each of the target's allies in earshot takes 100 damage, spread out evenly, with a maximum damage of 800.
Or something like that. This way, each ally within earshot will be dealt at minimum 100 damage if there are 8 or more enchantments removed in this way. That way, if a 55 monk goes in on his or her little ol' lonesome, that monk will take a whopping 800 damage if there are no allies in earshot if that monk has 8 enchants up. In this way, the Great Destroyer gets a little bit tougher, but not impossible to defeat.
Plus, this damage is armor ignoring, BUT is susceptible to skills like Pain Inverter. ^_^
5
1/2 30 Skill. Removes all enchantments from target foe. For each enchantment removed this way, each of the target's allies in earshot takes 100 damage, spread out evenly, with a maximum damage of 800.
Or something like that. This way, each ally within earshot will be dealt at minimum 100 damage if there are 8 or more enchantments removed in this way. That way, if a 55 monk goes in on his or her little ol' lonesome, that monk will take a whopping 800 damage if there are no allies in earshot if that monk has 8 enchants up. In this way, the Great Destroyer gets a little bit tougher, but not impossible to defeat.
Plus, this damage is armor ignoring, BUT is susceptible to skills like Pain Inverter. ^_^
Xebedinct
Quote:
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Originally Posted by JupiterStarWarrior
5
1/4 15 Skill. Removes all enchantments from target foe. For each enchantment removed this way one hex is removed, and each of the target's allies in earshot takes 100 damage, spread out evenly, with a maximum damage of 800. |
Dr.Jones
all i have to say is alll of the end game bosses are easy. and thats only because people have thought of a way to counter it.
Sage Tylos
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Highlander Of Alba
Did you go hero/hench /pug and beat it?
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