Playing your philosophy?
englitdaudelin
So, there have been a variety of threads in a variety of places in which people have expressed distaste for...PvE only skills, the weakness of HM, the overpowering of paragons and necros, the hardness of HM, the flavor of the monthway in PvP, the noobness in AB, and more, and more, ad infinitum, ad nauseaum.
So, have you, over time, developed a play "philosophy," for lack a better term, and altered your skillbar or style to fit that? If so, share away.
Obviously, the best example here is the pre-nerf Ursan--many, many people ardently disliked the skill. In your distaste, did you absolutely refuse to join any Ursan group? Did you join Ursan groups but refuse to use Ursan? Or did you suck it up and press 1-2-3-1-2-1-2?
If you feels strongly that in PvE, skill should still trump grind...do you refuse to use PvE-only skills?
If you feel that PvE, even in HM, is still too easy, do you regularly gimp your bar, and your heroes' bars, by not adding an elite, or by carrying only 7 skills? Do you refuse to use Consumeables for DP removal, armor, health, or energy? Refuse to turn on titles in EotN or NF?
In PvP, do you refuse to jump on the meta bandwagon? Experiment much with builds? (I'm not much of a PvP-er, so my knowledge of the game there is more limited...perhaps high-end (i.e. HA, GvG) PvP has narrowed to the point where only a few build WILL even work?) Do you refuse the "blank-ways" and strongly encourage, and stick to, "balanced" team play?
And what, oh, what, do you do with noobs in every part of the game? Ignore? Name-call? Teach?
Here's where I am, after 3300 hours of mostly PvE play, including plenty of afk time:
I have a distinct displeasure for the PvE-only skills that are tied to rank--especially the elite ones. I decided early that Ursan was not a playstyle I liked--but I was in a guild of friends that LOVED it. My rule: I'd go anywhere with them, as long as I was not required to be the bear. Sure, I ran it for a while, but it was far less interesting than all the other things I could do.
Now that most of them have moved on to other games, I don't touch Ursan, and have limited my PvE-only skills to ones that I judge fit the original intent of the game--for skill, build, care, and knowledge to be more useful than grind. So, with the exception of some of the farm builds that are build around multiple PvE-skills, I allow ONE PvE-only skill on my bar, as an individual or team buff. I have decided not to use the damage skills and shouts any longer. Given the construction of Nightfall, I've judged the Lightbringer's Gaze and Signet skills to be acceptable, but if I take one of those, that's it, that's my PvE skill.
I have found parts of HM hard enough that I have not gimped my bars in other ways, but I have decided that I would learn, perhaps at the expense of speed, to play HM in a "balanced" manner--so if I vanquish alone, with heroes and hench, I do not bring triple necroes or triple eles or triple smiters; I bring heroes or hench that I feel provide the an array of skills needed for an area. This means, without apology, I fail, on occasion. I failed vanquishing Ahadashim twice before finding a team that worked (darn ruby djinn). I failed at Forum Highlands. Failed Marga Coast and Jahai Bluffs and Arkjok Ward.
But after these failures, I tweaked some bars and altered some tactics and learned to succeed.
I have decided, however, that CRAFTED consumeables to buff the party alter the game in ways I, personally, don't like. So, I personally will not use Essences, Grails, Powerstones, and so on (i.e. the EotN crafted consumeables so popular with the old Ursan). Party-time dropped consumeables are fair game, as they tend only to buff me (rainbow cc's the exception, I think). I've nearly failed long vanquishes because of this; however, it seems to me that if I'm to learn, it needs to cost more than a couple of platinum's worth of materials.
This is hopefully not supercilious or arrogant; I'm genuinely curious--do you have some set of beliefs about this game (yes, yes, it's a game, I know, not serious, I should get a life, blah blah, go see the sunshine, etc etc...) that you feel strongly enough about, that have altered or governed the way you'll play? If you do--what are those attitudes? How do they affect your play?
So, have you, over time, developed a play "philosophy," for lack a better term, and altered your skillbar or style to fit that? If so, share away.
Obviously, the best example here is the pre-nerf Ursan--many, many people ardently disliked the skill. In your distaste, did you absolutely refuse to join any Ursan group? Did you join Ursan groups but refuse to use Ursan? Or did you suck it up and press 1-2-3-1-2-1-2?
If you feels strongly that in PvE, skill should still trump grind...do you refuse to use PvE-only skills?
If you feel that PvE, even in HM, is still too easy, do you regularly gimp your bar, and your heroes' bars, by not adding an elite, or by carrying only 7 skills? Do you refuse to use Consumeables for DP removal, armor, health, or energy? Refuse to turn on titles in EotN or NF?
In PvP, do you refuse to jump on the meta bandwagon? Experiment much with builds? (I'm not much of a PvP-er, so my knowledge of the game there is more limited...perhaps high-end (i.e. HA, GvG) PvP has narrowed to the point where only a few build WILL even work?) Do you refuse the "blank-ways" and strongly encourage, and stick to, "balanced" team play?
And what, oh, what, do you do with noobs in every part of the game? Ignore? Name-call? Teach?
Here's where I am, after 3300 hours of mostly PvE play, including plenty of afk time:
I have a distinct displeasure for the PvE-only skills that are tied to rank--especially the elite ones. I decided early that Ursan was not a playstyle I liked--but I was in a guild of friends that LOVED it. My rule: I'd go anywhere with them, as long as I was not required to be the bear. Sure, I ran it for a while, but it was far less interesting than all the other things I could do.
Now that most of them have moved on to other games, I don't touch Ursan, and have limited my PvE-only skills to ones that I judge fit the original intent of the game--for skill, build, care, and knowledge to be more useful than grind. So, with the exception of some of the farm builds that are build around multiple PvE-skills, I allow ONE PvE-only skill on my bar, as an individual or team buff. I have decided not to use the damage skills and shouts any longer. Given the construction of Nightfall, I've judged the Lightbringer's Gaze and Signet skills to be acceptable, but if I take one of those, that's it, that's my PvE skill.
I have found parts of HM hard enough that I have not gimped my bars in other ways, but I have decided that I would learn, perhaps at the expense of speed, to play HM in a "balanced" manner--so if I vanquish alone, with heroes and hench, I do not bring triple necroes or triple eles or triple smiters; I bring heroes or hench that I feel provide the an array of skills needed for an area. This means, without apology, I fail, on occasion. I failed vanquishing Ahadashim twice before finding a team that worked (darn ruby djinn). I failed at Forum Highlands. Failed Marga Coast and Jahai Bluffs and Arkjok Ward.
But after these failures, I tweaked some bars and altered some tactics and learned to succeed.
I have decided, however, that CRAFTED consumeables to buff the party alter the game in ways I, personally, don't like. So, I personally will not use Essences, Grails, Powerstones, and so on (i.e. the EotN crafted consumeables so popular with the old Ursan). Party-time dropped consumeables are fair game, as they tend only to buff me (rainbow cc's the exception, I think). I've nearly failed long vanquishes because of this; however, it seems to me that if I'm to learn, it needs to cost more than a couple of platinum's worth of materials.
This is hopefully not supercilious or arrogant; I'm genuinely curious--do you have some set of beliefs about this game (yes, yes, it's a game, I know, not serious, I should get a life, blah blah, go see the sunshine, etc etc...) that you feel strongly enough about, that have altered or governed the way you'll play? If you do--what are those attitudes? How do they affect your play?
caballo_oscuro
It seems like you've embraced the concept of a skill-based game without overdoing it, or whining much about how others do it.
The fact that you're willing to admit defeat on occasion demonstrates this. You appear to know how to play, and enjoy spending time learning how to maximise your enjoyment by creating builds and learning how to modify and manage them to suit particular circumstances.
It's quite easy in this game to use buffs of all kinds, but true enough, it makes the game feel rather easy. While some people are quite comfortable with the quick fix and go mentality, I prefer experimenting and learning what's what.
Many players prefer not to figure out the intricacies of the game and feel that they've accomplished something by acquiring the suber-skills available in PvE-only. While they do help, they can make the game feel tiresome at times, and this probably adds to the feeling that some people express that GW is too easy.
I've always been a proponent of the school of thought that GW is a game of skill however, and one skill that long-time players tend to learn is how to bend the mechanics of the game to make it fun again.
This is why in games like this, we have things like skill balancing and nerfs, to encourage players to find new ways to do things, and to challenge themselves.
Of course, there are things we can use to cut corners, such as pvxwiki and the other official and unofficial wikis whcih contain guides to complete things, but what's the point just getting your orders and going for broke?
Well pvx et al allow casual players to utilise the same aspects that hardcore gamers use, and to experience the same things, but at the cost of losing out on enjoying the challenge of build creation and application.
Sure I've used pvxwiki and many of my own builds have been criticised by my guildies and others, but it's all part of the learning curve, ain't it?
Personally I prefer to get as much enjoyment out of the game as I can, but when time's short, I have to admit, I've cut corners too, who hasn't? I can appreciate that people who have learned the mechanics of the game better than I have will be more successful and will probably derive more enjoyment, but their experience has helped me and I'm sure many others in the community to experience the game in ways they would not have been able to figure out on their own.
This brings me to the aspect of experienced players and their relationship to new players. I think it's absolutely stupid to criticise someone for not understanding how to play a part of the game simply because they're less experienced. It drives me insane when in a pug someone leaves simply because a couple of inexperienced players die when a large mob hits. Sure it can be frustrating, but we were all new to this at one time. Usually however, I find the griefers are exactly of the same experience level as the inexperienced and simply want somebody to clean up the mess they create as they charge their unbuffed lvl20 derv into a crowd of monsters while their team is mobbed back in a cave.
So if any person wants to play in a pug, they have to understand that there are limitations, and before you rush into an instance, your team should consent to sharing builds, suggesting what skills to replace, and perhaps suggesting different weapons than they currently have, if they can bring them. Really, what's the point in sharing skillsets if your team doesn't discuss the reason for bringing a particular skill?
Ok, I've had my gripe, I'll go back to my books and get on with it... The grumpy old man has spoken...
The fact that you're willing to admit defeat on occasion demonstrates this. You appear to know how to play, and enjoy spending time learning how to maximise your enjoyment by creating builds and learning how to modify and manage them to suit particular circumstances.
It's quite easy in this game to use buffs of all kinds, but true enough, it makes the game feel rather easy. While some people are quite comfortable with the quick fix and go mentality, I prefer experimenting and learning what's what.
Many players prefer not to figure out the intricacies of the game and feel that they've accomplished something by acquiring the suber-skills available in PvE-only. While they do help, they can make the game feel tiresome at times, and this probably adds to the feeling that some people express that GW is too easy.
I've always been a proponent of the school of thought that GW is a game of skill however, and one skill that long-time players tend to learn is how to bend the mechanics of the game to make it fun again.
This is why in games like this, we have things like skill balancing and nerfs, to encourage players to find new ways to do things, and to challenge themselves.
Of course, there are things we can use to cut corners, such as pvxwiki and the other official and unofficial wikis whcih contain guides to complete things, but what's the point just getting your orders and going for broke?
Well pvx et al allow casual players to utilise the same aspects that hardcore gamers use, and to experience the same things, but at the cost of losing out on enjoying the challenge of build creation and application.
Sure I've used pvxwiki and many of my own builds have been criticised by my guildies and others, but it's all part of the learning curve, ain't it?
Personally I prefer to get as much enjoyment out of the game as I can, but when time's short, I have to admit, I've cut corners too, who hasn't? I can appreciate that people who have learned the mechanics of the game better than I have will be more successful and will probably derive more enjoyment, but their experience has helped me and I'm sure many others in the community to experience the game in ways they would not have been able to figure out on their own.
This brings me to the aspect of experienced players and their relationship to new players. I think it's absolutely stupid to criticise someone for not understanding how to play a part of the game simply because they're less experienced. It drives me insane when in a pug someone leaves simply because a couple of inexperienced players die when a large mob hits. Sure it can be frustrating, but we were all new to this at one time. Usually however, I find the griefers are exactly of the same experience level as the inexperienced and simply want somebody to clean up the mess they create as they charge their unbuffed lvl20 derv into a crowd of monsters while their team is mobbed back in a cave.
So if any person wants to play in a pug, they have to understand that there are limitations, and before you rush into an instance, your team should consent to sharing builds, suggesting what skills to replace, and perhaps suggesting different weapons than they currently have, if they can bring them. Really, what's the point in sharing skillsets if your team doesn't discuss the reason for bringing a particular skill?
Ok, I've had my gripe, I'll go back to my books and get on with it... The grumpy old man has spoken...
Improvavel
I think people should be allowed to play the game in the way they want within the game set rules.
The only thing I dislike are skills/builds that just ignore what the enemy is doing. You should have to know what the enemies use in a given area, know each ones threaten your party, which skills to interrupt, which that can be ignores, which enemies to kill first and so on.
So stuff like Ursan, that made all fights the same really bugged me. There was no strategy decisions (they were pre made) and very few tactical ones other than chaining the knock.
The game I enjoy is one where your decisions, in addition to your party build, change the outcome.
On the other hand, I also like the freedom to log on and just play for a bit, instead of having to spend hours forming a party (even with guildies).
I find that aspect of the game isn't good enough. Heroes, other than Necros, rangers and Paragons, are extremely bad at energy management, their commands are very limited and not only lack the tactic flexibility of a human they also lack the extra punch human players (that are supposed to be smarter/adaptable) get in PvE only skills. Also they are limited to 3 and then you need to get 4 henchman with set builds for a campaign instead of a certain area.
I hope they increase rewards for actual game play till they are about the same as farming, increase difficulty by smarter AI and better builds instead of silly 50% chance to miss area effects and give more freedom to players choose the way they want to play the game.
The only thing I dislike are skills/builds that just ignore what the enemy is doing. You should have to know what the enemies use in a given area, know each ones threaten your party, which skills to interrupt, which that can be ignores, which enemies to kill first and so on.
So stuff like Ursan, that made all fights the same really bugged me. There was no strategy decisions (they were pre made) and very few tactical ones other than chaining the knock.
The game I enjoy is one where your decisions, in addition to your party build, change the outcome.
On the other hand, I also like the freedom to log on and just play for a bit, instead of having to spend hours forming a party (even with guildies).
I find that aspect of the game isn't good enough. Heroes, other than Necros, rangers and Paragons, are extremely bad at energy management, their commands are very limited and not only lack the tactic flexibility of a human they also lack the extra punch human players (that are supposed to be smarter/adaptable) get in PvE only skills. Also they are limited to 3 and then you need to get 4 henchman with set builds for a campaign instead of a certain area.
I hope they increase rewards for actual game play till they are about the same as farming, increase difficulty by smarter AI and better builds instead of silly 50% chance to miss area effects and give more freedom to players choose the way they want to play the game.
upier
I don't use consumables. Not because I'd consider them wrong or whatever - I am just cheap. That's why I don't have issues if someone else in my party uses a party effecting one - just as long as they don't expect me to bring them also.
I don't display gameplay effecting titles. I consider that a mistake and instead of getting all worked up over it - I just ignore them. My guildies know this - and I don't bother playing with others, so it's not an issue.
I do not use CoP on my mesmer, because I feel it's a waste of the class, yet at the same time I have no issues abusing the hell out of it on my necro.
I also used Ursan just on a few occasions. I was pissed that I don't transform into a bear - so I refused to use it.
Yeah, I know. I am special. Screw it, I have my own instance to fill it up with my specialness.
I don't display gameplay effecting titles. I consider that a mistake and instead of getting all worked up over it - I just ignore them. My guildies know this - and I don't bother playing with others, so it's not an issue.
I do not use CoP on my mesmer, because I feel it's a waste of the class, yet at the same time I have no issues abusing the hell out of it on my necro.
I also used Ursan just on a few occasions. I was pissed that I don't transform into a bear - so I refused to use it.
Yeah, I know. I am special. Screw it, I have my own instance to fill it up with my specialness.
Quaker
I wouldn't say that I have a "philosophy" about Guild Wars. But I (mostly) do only do what I enjoy doing.
Like you, I did not like the mindless button mashing of Ursan - that was not the kind of play I got GW to do. I used it occasionally, but never joined an "Ursan" group. I don't use any of the various "ways" either, but not because I won't, but simply because I enjoy doing it the way I do it. I don't purposely gimp myself or my skill bar though.
Basically, I do what I enjoy doing. Questing/missions/dungeons and exploring is what I like best. Farming and standing around a town at stupid festivals is what I enjoy least. So, I mostly don't do it, but I don't concern myself with the fact that others do, either.
Like you, I did not like the mindless button mashing of Ursan - that was not the kind of play I got GW to do. I used it occasionally, but never joined an "Ursan" group. I don't use any of the various "ways" either, but not because I won't, but simply because I enjoy doing it the way I do it. I don't purposely gimp myself or my skill bar though.
Basically, I do what I enjoy doing. Questing/missions/dungeons and exploring is what I like best. Farming and standing around a town at stupid festivals is what I enjoy least. So, I mostly don't do it, but I don't concern myself with the fact that others do, either.
Samscwamch
I kind of do, I don't use consumables because i'm cheap aswell :P. But i never used Ursan, and i still won't i'm completely opposed to that skill, and if i pug with someone using it i leave. I like playing the game without all the added *glitter* to make the game easier and i play how i want. In AB i refuse to play a support role due to the many people that don't understand that capping=win.
kostolomac
The only thing I don't like about PvE skills is that I need to grind to use them at full capacity. I thought the grind was optional , but I hate that I need to grind to make pve skills more powerful. Killing mobs in hordes makes me feel good
I only have 1 max title.
I don't use cons since I'm cheap.
I used CoP until I started running discordway.
Used ursan to get to r10 norn and vanquish Plains of Jarin and got bored of using it.
The only pvp I do is RA and AB because it's easy to start playing and in the case of AB i always win something. In 99% of the cases I will use my build because I don't like the PvX ones.
I only have 1 max title.
I don't use cons since I'm cheap.
I used CoP until I started running discordway.
Used ursan to get to r10 norn and vanquish Plains of Jarin and got bored of using it.
The only pvp I do is RA and AB because it's easy to start playing and in the case of AB i always win something. In 99% of the cases I will use my build because I don't like the PvX ones.
Tyla
I have a philosiphy. "C-Space to victory!", and my build corresponds well with it.
[experts dexterity][read the wind][needling shot][asuran scan]["i am the strongest!"][air of superiority][no skill][death pact signet]
I believe the concept of the build is fairly evident. C-Space, and mash your keyboard up.
[experts dexterity][read the wind][needling shot][asuran scan]["i am the strongest!"][air of superiority][no skill][death pact signet]
I believe the concept of the build is fairly evident. C-Space, and mash your keyboard up.
Abedeus
I don't use consumables, except for some free cookies or something I find along the way during an event.
The only time I use(d) Ursan was when I had to cut the time when I was during Nightfall missions for my Mesmer. Gate of Pain/Madness + Ursan = yawn. I also stopped farming money some time ago, and I'm not spending it either. But then again, I'm busy jumping around in CoH.
The only time I use(d) Ursan was when I had to cut the time when I was during Nightfall missions for my Mesmer. Gate of Pain/Madness + Ursan = yawn. I also stopped farming money some time ago, and I'm not spending it either. But then again, I'm busy jumping around in CoH.
Icy The Mage
I exploit AI by bringing Triple Necro Vanquish, DiscordWay, IV-Spam, etc...
I use consumables to do anything hard.
I always display my Game-play affecting titles.
I almost never make my own builds; excluding farming builds (PvX Farming Builds are loltastic).
I always make sure that I have 3 PvE-Only skills on my bar.
The noobs in every part of the game can go learn just like everyone else; solo play. I don't want some stupid little tard messing up my party because he claimed to be an "experienced r10 cryer" (Oh yeah, I also discriminate by rank), when he's really an r6 totally new to what we're doing.
I have no problem about people thinking what they want to think, but when they start spreading false information to the general public (lol @ Rata Sum) then it bothers me.
I use consumables to do anything hard.
I always display my Game-play affecting titles.
I almost never make my own builds; excluding farming builds (PvX Farming Builds are loltastic).
I always make sure that I have 3 PvE-Only skills on my bar.
The noobs in every part of the game can go learn just like everyone else; solo play. I don't want some stupid little tard messing up my party because he claimed to be an "experienced r10 cryer" (Oh yeah, I also discriminate by rank), when he's really an r6 totally new to what we're doing.
I have no problem about people thinking what they want to think, but when they start spreading false information to the general public (lol @ Rata Sum) then it bothers me.
Trub
Quote:
I have a philosiphy. "C-Space to victory!", and my build corresponds well with it. .
|
(On vent)
"Play the game to win.
If you face failure, fart really loud, and kill your opponent while he/she is gagging."
Or pull a Swirly...and just keep repeating 'boobies' every 30 seconds.
Lighten up guys...it's all in fun.
If yall aren't having fun anymore, take a break..and gib me all your stoof.
________________
And a Wallow shall lead them.
Nessar
I don't really have a "philosophy" for playing the game.
I just go with the flow and whatever happens, happens. I didn't like the ursan era since everyone and their blind dog was using it. Although I did max norn, not for ursan per say, but it did motivate me. I only used ursan when I was feeling lazy and wanted to buttonmash. Now there is the cry/perma era. I already maxed SS/LB so I can jump into any of these groups if I wanted to. But I havent done anything cry related except for VS farm. Is just too easy. I prefer some sort of challenge...
I'll admit I do use 3/6 necros when vanquishing, all because it just makes it easier. But its not 100% easier. There are times when we wipe over and over and over etc. Which makes it harder and I love that. Actually HM in general isn't that hard..just use a MM, Nuker, Healer and sit back while your heros do the work. Its wayyy too easy to roll through mobs :/
I don't use cons unless I'm doing something uber hard...which in pve..is a few dungeons and thats it. Otherwise, if someone wants to brings cons, go right ahead. I won't stop you. As long as we get shit done, I'm fine with it.
As for my bar, My main is an ele. So all I do is buttonmash on her xD. But its still funner then ursan and I can see moar shiny numbers across my screen x3. If I play any other prof, it isn't the typical pvx build. Its usually some build I made up. It might have pve skills, it might not. I dont care what people think or say, I'm going to use whatever skills I want. But if my build is plain retarded, then someone can say something >>;
My Play style is like...I dont know really O.o. I like to control most of what happens, which is why I dont pug. Most of the pugs in this game suck. If I do pug, I dont wanna see your build because it'll prolly make me cringe. If it works for you, go ahead and use it. I dont wanna see it. I dont think other people should dictate how people play or what skills they use. Unless its a life or death situation ingame, then leave teh nubs alone. They can figure out how to adjust their skill bars, just like me.
On the PvP side of things...I usually RA/JQ/FA. In there, I'll use whatever I feel like using that day. Whether it's a build I made or some random PvX wiki build. If the build I made works, then yay. I'm only in there to kill, piss off, or heal people anyway. If I'm invited to TA/HA, then I will not hesitate to look up a pvx build. Why? Because I dont know jack about most PvP builds and I wanna use something that'll be win. Also I can pretty much roll anything, so it's not a problem :P
Wow long post...Anyway, that was my 2 pixels worth
I just go with the flow and whatever happens, happens. I didn't like the ursan era since everyone and their blind dog was using it. Although I did max norn, not for ursan per say, but it did motivate me. I only used ursan when I was feeling lazy and wanted to buttonmash. Now there is the cry/perma era. I already maxed SS/LB so I can jump into any of these groups if I wanted to. But I havent done anything cry related except for VS farm. Is just too easy. I prefer some sort of challenge...
I'll admit I do use 3/6 necros when vanquishing, all because it just makes it easier. But its not 100% easier. There are times when we wipe over and over and over etc. Which makes it harder and I love that. Actually HM in general isn't that hard..just use a MM, Nuker, Healer and sit back while your heros do the work. Its wayyy too easy to roll through mobs :/
I don't use cons unless I'm doing something uber hard...which in pve..is a few dungeons and thats it. Otherwise, if someone wants to brings cons, go right ahead. I won't stop you. As long as we get shit done, I'm fine with it.
As for my bar, My main is an ele. So all I do is buttonmash on her xD. But its still funner then ursan and I can see moar shiny numbers across my screen x3. If I play any other prof, it isn't the typical pvx build. Its usually some build I made up. It might have pve skills, it might not. I dont care what people think or say, I'm going to use whatever skills I want. But if my build is plain retarded, then someone can say something >>;
My Play style is like...I dont know really O.o. I like to control most of what happens, which is why I dont pug. Most of the pugs in this game suck. If I do pug, I dont wanna see your build because it'll prolly make me cringe. If it works for you, go ahead and use it. I dont wanna see it. I dont think other people should dictate how people play or what skills they use. Unless its a life or death situation ingame, then leave teh nubs alone. They can figure out how to adjust their skill bars, just like me.
On the PvP side of things...I usually RA/JQ/FA. In there, I'll use whatever I feel like using that day. Whether it's a build I made or some random PvX wiki build. If the build I made works, then yay. I'm only in there to kill, piss off, or heal people anyway. If I'm invited to TA/HA, then I will not hesitate to look up a pvx build. Why? Because I dont know jack about most PvP builds and I wanna use something that'll be win. Also I can pretty much roll anything, so it's not a problem :P
Wow long post...Anyway, that was my 2 pixels worth
sph0nz
I do what I feel like doing in the game, within the limits of the game, essentially.
I find the first premise of the game as "skill>time" which applies everywhere to be kind of a joke, especially in a non-competitive environment. Further, individual player skill hardly seems to shine in matches; this is a team game after all, and it should have encouraged the entire team skill instead of the individual. After all, anybody can succeed with a blank skill bar as long as everybody else has builds (vanquishing, for example).
I rarely tank because I find it absolutely boring standing around soaking up damage; I find pve-only skills to be a nice addition, but I would prefer that they weren't tied to a title rank. I'll admit that I've used ursan before, but it was only for fun in the shadow nexus. I also find solo farming to be pretty boring, and as a result I don't have a lot of money because I spend it when I get enough to buy a set of elite armor or whatever; so I rarely have the money to purchase cons.
When it comes to PvP, I'm pretty casual too. I use whatever build since I'm usually in Fort Aspenwood. I've started using whatever builds I want in HM simply because I get bored of using earthshaker and dragonslash all the time; as if it really matters. Heroes and henchmen accompany me most of the time. I'm grinding my way to GWAMM because I see titles as goals, and I'd like to complete goals which I've set for myself.
I have one of each class, and I'll play any of them, but I feel that I'm better at some than others.
I find the first premise of the game as "skill>time" which applies everywhere to be kind of a joke, especially in a non-competitive environment. Further, individual player skill hardly seems to shine in matches; this is a team game after all, and it should have encouraged the entire team skill instead of the individual. After all, anybody can succeed with a blank skill bar as long as everybody else has builds (vanquishing, for example).
I rarely tank because I find it absolutely boring standing around soaking up damage; I find pve-only skills to be a nice addition, but I would prefer that they weren't tied to a title rank. I'll admit that I've used ursan before, but it was only for fun in the shadow nexus. I also find solo farming to be pretty boring, and as a result I don't have a lot of money because I spend it when I get enough to buy a set of elite armor or whatever; so I rarely have the money to purchase cons.
When it comes to PvP, I'm pretty casual too. I use whatever build since I'm usually in Fort Aspenwood. I've started using whatever builds I want in HM simply because I get bored of using earthshaker and dragonslash all the time; as if it really matters. Heroes and henchmen accompany me most of the time. I'm grinding my way to GWAMM because I see titles as goals, and I'd like to complete goals which I've set for myself.
I have one of each class, and I'll play any of them, but I feel that I'm better at some than others.
Rhamia Darigaz
inb4 series of unusually long posts
i play to win because if i don't david sirlin will call me a scrub.
i play to win because if i don't david sirlin will call me a scrub.
Jake_Steel
Owik Gall
The one philosophy I'm accustomed to is buffing and NERFING. I'm left with what I got due to some nerfs and buffs. Although there were some buffed skill that I sincerely enjoyed, I'm still a bit bummed at a few nerfed skills. (!![Steelfang Slash]!! Why?!?!?!?) Yes, I used to love that Steelfang Slash before the one second delay nerf because it made my PvE experience much more enjoyable. Not long after that I shrugged it off and played on with the game with what I got. I guess now that I look back on it I'm more appreciative of the nerf. KD isn't really my thing and it was the only way to curb my lust for POWER. Anyways, that's my philosophy.
pamelf
Interesting post to read. Honestly, I don't have a play philosophy so much as I'll only play to have fun. As soon as something isn't fun I don't do it. I didn't find ursan fun, nor did I find being a HB monk only in Ursan groups fun, therefore I didn't do it. I find HM and dungeons fun when I'm doing them with my friends, but I don't find PUGs fun so I generally tend to avoid them. It's not because I'm philosophically averse to them, but just because it doesn't make me feel like I'm enjoying myself. I apply that to all my playing; in fact life in general. If it feels good, do it.
A11Eur0
this is a much more in-depth version of the "what do you refuse to do" thread that is on the first page right now.
crazybanshee
I too refuse to use consumables. Not only are they overpowered, I'm too cheap. That being said, I've been in groups doing elite areas in hard mode that use them, and I pitch in my share of money without qualms. I vanquished the 3 continents without consumables, without ursan, and even without triple necros since I did it before eotn came out with overpowered pve skills and the like. I think it made me a better player. I certainly failed on occasion- I'd not been playing a year and had no candy canes or dp reducing method. That just made it sweeter when I succeeded. I did use ursan at its height for certain elite areas, since it was impossible to get into a group without it. I'm sure guilds ran without it, but for the majority of players it was ursan or don't go. Some people enjoy the epeen - some buy it off ebay, or buy fame or pvp titles or whatever. Personally, I think it's just a game, and whats the point of playing if it's too easy. I don't intentionally cripple myself by refusing to take an elite or anything, but I also don't bother giving my heroes runes or even max weapons unless I happen to get a drop when I have that hero out. Ymmv.
englitdaudelin
Ain't this all the truth. I was hoping Ursan skill would be like the Derv avatars...
Parson Brown
For me, I rather enjoy HM.
I use PvE-only skills. I figure that if an ele boss gets to be level 30, then I get to kill him with 1 cast of pain inverter!
Never liked Ursan. I ran it a few times when my guild asked, but never got into it.
I've never paid for a crafted consumable, but I used the quest rewards. I also love me some sweets!
Triple Necros are all right by me in most areas.
As for "noobs," I rarely play with others anymore, but nearly every time I do, we fail due to someone charging into 3 mobs or clicking auto attack and going to make a sandwich or something.
I rarely PvP, but I enjoy a nice Alliance Battle from time to time.
I tend to vary my activities. I feel like vanqiushing, I vanq. Feel like farming, I farm. Feel like doing missions... you get the idea.
I use PvE-only skills. I figure that if an ele boss gets to be level 30, then I get to kill him with 1 cast of pain inverter!
Never liked Ursan. I ran it a few times when my guild asked, but never got into it.
I've never paid for a crafted consumable, but I used the quest rewards. I also love me some sweets!
Triple Necros are all right by me in most areas.
As for "noobs," I rarely play with others anymore, but nearly every time I do, we fail due to someone charging into 3 mobs or clicking auto attack and going to make a sandwich or something.
I rarely PvP, but I enjoy a nice Alliance Battle from time to time.
I tend to vary my activities. I feel like vanqiushing, I vanq. Feel like farming, I farm. Feel like doing missions... you get the idea.
illidan009
Wow, I really wish I had the dedication to play more like you...Of course I still detested UB back when it was popular, but I use a lot of gimmicks pve, ie QQ, MS DB, Dslash, SY, the stuff...
The way you limit your bar to only 1 PvE skill is interesting, and I think your repeated tweaking after failing at vanquish makes you a creative and skilled player
The way you limit your bar to only 1 PvE skill is interesting, and I think your repeated tweaking after failing at vanquish makes you a creative and skilled player
Cale Roughstar
I don't use consums because I am seriously cheap, I used ursan a bit in DoA when it was popular, maybe a few other places as well. I didn't use it myself since it was so boring, but for the elite areas, who cares? There is phat lewt to be had!
I use PvE skills, gameplay affecting titles (when I remember them) and use Sabway heroes.
I farm when I feel like it. (Which is pretty much limited to special event weekends, Hello pirate day!)
Basically I do whatever is fun. No point in being all high and mighty in your position if you arent having fun with it. It is just a game after all.
I use PvE skills, gameplay affecting titles (when I remember them) and use Sabway heroes.
I farm when I feel like it. (Which is pretty much limited to special event weekends, Hello pirate day!)
Basically I do whatever is fun. No point in being all high and mighty in your position if you arent having fun with it. It is just a game after all.
Lady Lozza
Wow, the first couple of posts were a great read, even if there was a whine or two
I suppose my play philosophy is incredibly simple to explain. I generally roll with whatever. Consumables, ursan, farming. None of it effects the game for me, it doesn't effect the way I play. If there are "overpowered" tools there I might use them, I might not. I play whatever and however my mood strikes me.
I game for fun. Not for min-max, not to "win", but to relax. If someone asks for help and "accepts" that help, I am happy to give it. If someone wants me to run a certain bar, I'll run it. If I don't know the area I'll chat with those in the team who do. And if someone in the team is being delibrately unpleasent I'll ask them to stop and then I'll drop. I play for fun, not so some sod on the other side of the world can show off how cool they are by using unecessary language, or ruining a casual team based experience by being a pain in the rear.
I suppose my play philosophy is incredibly simple to explain. I generally roll with whatever. Consumables, ursan, farming. None of it effects the game for me, it doesn't effect the way I play. If there are "overpowered" tools there I might use them, I might not. I play whatever and however my mood strikes me.
I game for fun. Not for min-max, not to "win", but to relax. If someone asks for help and "accepts" that help, I am happy to give it. If someone wants me to run a certain bar, I'll run it. If I don't know the area I'll chat with those in the team who do. And if someone in the team is being delibrately unpleasent I'll ask them to stop and then I'll drop. I play for fun, not so some sod on the other side of the world can show off how cool they are by using unecessary language, or ruining a casual team based experience by being a pain in the rear.
pumpkin pie
My game would be unplayabe when I have play thru all profession and am able to make build for all of them.
At this stage, 5 thousands hours spent on the game, I am spending most my time on the elementalist, I have found for her the best build (imho, there could be a better one, but I haven't found it yet) lol, which is 2 water ele + 1 nuker + wards all with monks secondary combining with henches. These do not work in all the places, I regret not keeping a journal of what build I use where with what heros. But i know Gwen and Jora comes in pretty handy in certain places and some area I use minions, even so, they are the funnest build that i've come up with, the second one would be my necromancer with 2 minion masters 1 SS + 1 monks with hench, then comes my 3x hammer warriors. with 1 mm, sometime with waters ele and nuker. however i do not have a 4 x ritualist or 4 x rangers build yet, somehow they all failed for now.
so basically, I roll them in different areas, if i don't succeed with the eles, i bring the mms if not i bring gwen + jora and one healer, these can be ele healers or n/rt or monk healers. If i still can't vanquish or get the mission done, i look at the clock and go to sleep. when all else fail, i consult guru and read the mission on wiki, and find out what skills the opponents in that area carries that i've missed, then find something to counter it, if that doesn't work, i read the Alliance Chat and jumps on any group that's doing what I needed. lol last one is the easiest.
Pve skills and consumables:
99% of the time i don't use pve skills or consumables, however when i do use them, it will most probably be the ebon assassin support, cool to have as a distraction. However I do use consumables right after festivals and those cosumables better be related to sweet tooth title.
Pug
I don't think I've ever called any players names before in the time that i've played, i do use /taunt alot in AB, because i find there's a type of AB players that if you /taunt them they are going to abandon all else and stalk your characters and goes after you whenever they see you, and its a good strategy since that will almost always break them away from their group and you know what happens when you are separated from your group in AB. you get kill by my character and the more you kill them the more they come after you, lol (disclaimer: not 100% of the time but most time, yes there are much better player then me in AB :P~)
I also like to pick up one or two players in low end mission and just rush them thru it with bonus. why not if you can make someone happy everyday, ey. (probably the most satisfy person would be me, but I do hope whoever I help feels happy too)
PvP
HA, if you need to train someone with a hammer warrior call me, standard earth shaker/knock down build don't go there much, elitism.
AB, ele, ranger, mesmer (my own build)
RA, ranger, assassin, warrior, necro, monks, mesmer, ritualist, (don't play there anymore, "until further notice")
GvG mesmer and ranger. inept, ganking don't play anymore, leave old guild now with PvE guild.
I think thats it, not so much of a philosophy just something i do to kill time...
At this stage, 5 thousands hours spent on the game, I am spending most my time on the elementalist, I have found for her the best build (imho, there could be a better one, but I haven't found it yet) lol, which is 2 water ele + 1 nuker + wards all with monks secondary combining with henches. These do not work in all the places, I regret not keeping a journal of what build I use where with what heros. But i know Gwen and Jora comes in pretty handy in certain places and some area I use minions, even so, they are the funnest build that i've come up with, the second one would be my necromancer with 2 minion masters 1 SS + 1 monks with hench, then comes my 3x hammer warriors. with 1 mm, sometime with waters ele and nuker. however i do not have a 4 x ritualist or 4 x rangers build yet, somehow they all failed for now.
so basically, I roll them in different areas, if i don't succeed with the eles, i bring the mms if not i bring gwen + jora and one healer, these can be ele healers or n/rt or monk healers. If i still can't vanquish or get the mission done, i look at the clock and go to sleep. when all else fail, i consult guru and read the mission on wiki, and find out what skills the opponents in that area carries that i've missed, then find something to counter it, if that doesn't work, i read the Alliance Chat and jumps on any group that's doing what I needed. lol last one is the easiest.
Pve skills and consumables:
99% of the time i don't use pve skills or consumables, however when i do use them, it will most probably be the ebon assassin support, cool to have as a distraction. However I do use consumables right after festivals and those cosumables better be related to sweet tooth title.
Pug
I don't think I've ever called any players names before in the time that i've played, i do use /taunt alot in AB, because i find there's a type of AB players that if you /taunt them they are going to abandon all else and stalk your characters and goes after you whenever they see you, and its a good strategy since that will almost always break them away from their group and you know what happens when you are separated from your group in AB. you get kill by my character and the more you kill them the more they come after you, lol (disclaimer: not 100% of the time but most time, yes there are much better player then me in AB :P~)
I also like to pick up one or two players in low end mission and just rush them thru it with bonus. why not if you can make someone happy everyday, ey. (probably the most satisfy person would be me, but I do hope whoever I help feels happy too)
PvP
HA, if you need to train someone with a hammer warrior call me, standard earth shaker/knock down build don't go there much, elitism.
AB, ele, ranger, mesmer (my own build)
RA, ranger, assassin, warrior, necro, monks, mesmer, ritualist, (don't play there anymore, "until further notice")
GvG mesmer and ranger. inept, ganking don't play anymore, leave old guild now with PvE guild.
I think thats it, not so much of a philosophy just something i do to kill time...
Lyynyyrd
I sign on, leave town, yell LOLGW and alt+f4.
Awsum philosophy.
Awsum philosophy.
Jaran Cell
I have the most fun in this game and irl when I'm being as effective as I possibly can.
If you see me enter a PvE area you can bet on the fact that my build, my heroes builds and my hench selection is customade for the specific area.
Checking beforehand what skills are going to be used against me and tailoring my teambuild to counter them is as fun as eventually putting it to use.
I use whatever tool/skill will be the most effective to reaching my current goal and I never limit the power of my builds in the slightest.
In PvP I prefer to play rather balanced builds since I can't really tailor them to anything else than the objectives in the specific PvP mode in wich I'm playing.
I love adding some twists to it though, solving problems in new ways and always experimenting with more effective and ofc different alternatives buildwise.
I very seldom play with new players but I'm very happy to provide help when they ask for it.
If you see me enter a PvE area you can bet on the fact that my build, my heroes builds and my hench selection is customade for the specific area.
Checking beforehand what skills are going to be used against me and tailoring my teambuild to counter them is as fun as eventually putting it to use.
I use whatever tool/skill will be the most effective to reaching my current goal and I never limit the power of my builds in the slightest.
In PvP I prefer to play rather balanced builds since I can't really tailor them to anything else than the objectives in the specific PvP mode in wich I'm playing.
I love adding some twists to it though, solving problems in new ways and always experimenting with more effective and ofc different alternatives buildwise.
I very seldom play with new players but I'm very happy to provide help when they ask for it.
FlamingMetroid
cataphract
Quote:
So, have you, over time, developed a play "philosophy," for lack a better term, and altered your skillbar or style to fit that? If so, share away.
|
Won't be using any of those with my necro, either.
zwei2stein
My philosophy:
Consumables are never worth it.
It is simple logic, really:
If I use consumables and fail, consumables would be pointlessly wasted.
So I should only use consumables when I can guarantee success without them.
But if I can suceed without them, any consumable use would be pointless waste.
So I should not use consumables when I can guarantee success without them.
Hence, I should never use consumables. And I never do.
Consumables are never worth it.
It is simple logic, really:
If I use consumables and fail, consumables would be pointlessly wasted.
So I should only use consumables when I can guarantee success without them.
But if I can suceed without them, any consumable use would be pointless waste.
So I should not use consumables when I can guarantee success without them.
Hence, I should never use consumables. And I never do.
jaximus
when i first began playing this game, 2 1/2 some years ago, i found myself feeling fortunate because i had friends that were established in the community of gw and helped me out in the early days. i was given top of the line gear and helped through the more difficult areas. so in no time i had a max level well equipped character. little did i know this crippled me a bit for a while. i was in over my head. i had the mentality of a good player and the skill bar/equipment to go with, but i didnt have the knowledge base i should have. i didnt spend those days tinkering in the ascalonian hills figuring things out for myself. i was told this is how it was, this is what you do and when you do it. i grew to love the game more and spent time playing when my guildies and friends werent around. this is when i first began to learn the real game. you learn the little things, the details while playing with the henchmen because they arent very good so its easy to get wiped and be in over your head. but i digress
PUGs...
i believe that PUGs are an essential learning tool for the gw player. back when i began my gw career, this is where you learned how to deal with people. the glory days of FoW 3-4x per night. the experienced players actually helped the ones that didnt know as much. they explained the theories of 'tank n spank' and how aggro, aoe, and hexes hurt and helped the teams. they helped you tweak skill bars and explained the skill usages. rapidly i learned and became one of these players that was willing to help out. to this day i feel its my responsibility to continue this learning. i PUG whenever i can (usually as a monk so i can keep an inexperienced team going). plus with PUGs, i prolly wont end up seeing some of the people again, many friends list me to help them later, so i dont really expect much. when a group does well i feel i have accomplished my goal.
classes...
i feel that a good gw player must play many classes. my early days were spent sniping on a ranger. barrage + a couple ints and a pet. the basics. i figured rangers were for damage... /sigh. over time i learned my role in the group was shutdown first, pretty yellow numbers second. i learned that elementalists didnt harm me overly much due to my resistance and i learned that mesmer/necro hexes were my enemy. (learned fast when you barrage with ss/empathy ;D) so i started a necro. i familiarized myself with them about as much as i had with ranger. so i picked up a mesmer cuz i hated being interrupted. i learned tendencies of interruption and skill casting. next came monk, then ele, war, ritualist, sin, derv, and para. now i have one of every class and ive played them all and feel comfortable with them. this is where the true guild wars learning happens. when you pick a 'primary character' i believe that it is best to first play that char till you reach a comfort level with it. then, play the nemesis of that char to learn how they operate. (monks -> mesmers, wars -> necros, etc.)
cons and pve skills...
the replay value in gw comes from pvp. i spent much of my early time fiddling in pve learning the skills and basics. but i knew eventually i would venture into the realm of pvp. so i played in a manner to suit this transition. i dont like cons, i hate pve only skills. the occasional candy apple/pie/choco bunny i dont mind just for the silly effects, but in the long run, i play even minor situations with the best of my ability so that im comfortable with the needs for pvp. (wep swaps, kiting, positioning, not spamming, etc.) due to this, i use only skills that are available in pvp.
character remakes...
i believe this is one of most important and under utilized aspects of guild wars. i had 10 chars, one of each class, pve only with pretty much every skill, fancy armor, and all the appropriate wep sets. i believed i was very knowledgeable about each class and was able to play any class competitively in pvp or pve. so then i got to tinkering, my monk (main i guess you could say) was a male, and i liked the female version better for armor/aesthetic reasons. so i made another. i equipped her right away, all wep sets and such and played her. being a low level makes you work in ways you dont need to as a lvl 20. i had to really focus on pre prot/'spike' catching and swap weps and such. this really helped me increase my skills in the game. i found it to be one of the best experiences ive had. so those of you have have done everything and have a GWAMM primary character, i suggest you make another one of the same class, and play it through the game again. just to relearn the basics.
sorry for being long winded...
PUGs...
i believe that PUGs are an essential learning tool for the gw player. back when i began my gw career, this is where you learned how to deal with people. the glory days of FoW 3-4x per night. the experienced players actually helped the ones that didnt know as much. they explained the theories of 'tank n spank' and how aggro, aoe, and hexes hurt and helped the teams. they helped you tweak skill bars and explained the skill usages. rapidly i learned and became one of these players that was willing to help out. to this day i feel its my responsibility to continue this learning. i PUG whenever i can (usually as a monk so i can keep an inexperienced team going). plus with PUGs, i prolly wont end up seeing some of the people again, many friends list me to help them later, so i dont really expect much. when a group does well i feel i have accomplished my goal.
classes...
i feel that a good gw player must play many classes. my early days were spent sniping on a ranger. barrage + a couple ints and a pet. the basics. i figured rangers were for damage... /sigh. over time i learned my role in the group was shutdown first, pretty yellow numbers second. i learned that elementalists didnt harm me overly much due to my resistance and i learned that mesmer/necro hexes were my enemy. (learned fast when you barrage with ss/empathy ;D) so i started a necro. i familiarized myself with them about as much as i had with ranger. so i picked up a mesmer cuz i hated being interrupted. i learned tendencies of interruption and skill casting. next came monk, then ele, war, ritualist, sin, derv, and para. now i have one of every class and ive played them all and feel comfortable with them. this is where the true guild wars learning happens. when you pick a 'primary character' i believe that it is best to first play that char till you reach a comfort level with it. then, play the nemesis of that char to learn how they operate. (monks -> mesmers, wars -> necros, etc.)
cons and pve skills...
the replay value in gw comes from pvp. i spent much of my early time fiddling in pve learning the skills and basics. but i knew eventually i would venture into the realm of pvp. so i played in a manner to suit this transition. i dont like cons, i hate pve only skills. the occasional candy apple/pie/choco bunny i dont mind just for the silly effects, but in the long run, i play even minor situations with the best of my ability so that im comfortable with the needs for pvp. (wep swaps, kiting, positioning, not spamming, etc.) due to this, i use only skills that are available in pvp.
character remakes...
i believe this is one of most important and under utilized aspects of guild wars. i had 10 chars, one of each class, pve only with pretty much every skill, fancy armor, and all the appropriate wep sets. i believed i was very knowledgeable about each class and was able to play any class competitively in pvp or pve. so then i got to tinkering, my monk (main i guess you could say) was a male, and i liked the female version better for armor/aesthetic reasons. so i made another. i equipped her right away, all wep sets and such and played her. being a low level makes you work in ways you dont need to as a lvl 20. i had to really focus on pre prot/'spike' catching and swap weps and such. this really helped me increase my skills in the game. i found it to be one of the best experiences ive had. so those of you have have done everything and have a GWAMM primary character, i suggest you make another one of the same class, and play it through the game again. just to relearn the basics.
sorry for being long winded...
glacialphoenix
Consumables are purely for when I want to rampage through something. I prefer to do my vanquishes, etc. without consumables.
Ursan Blessing: As a monk, I hated it. If I had to PUG, I used it, because I needed to get things done, but I left if asked to Ursan. I tried it a couple of times, decided I still hated it, and stopped using UB. I still don't have any respect for Ursan whatsoever.
PvE skills: I'm OK with them. I rarely pack PvE skills myself, but I'm not going to make others gimp themselves.
I prefer to play through the missions and such with my friends, mostly because this means that if we fail, we can sit down, discuss problems, and restart. The likelihood of this drops dramatically with a PUG, since people are more inclined to dismiss a group of strangers who couldn't make it as noobs. We have screwed up before, but going back and tweaking things until you succeed is a good deal more satisfying.
PvP wise, my only experience with PvP is AB, which I know a lot of people don't take seriously. I do think that it isn't an excuse to decide you shouldn't improve just because it isn't "serious" enough. One of my best friends is in HA, and she's been lovely enough to tell me how it works. If I see something I think I could learn from, I try to implement it. Not being a RA/TA/HA/GVG player doesn't mean you don't improve, and it doesn't mean you can't learn things from people who play it. Same applies to PvE.
PUGs: I enjoyed them until UB came out. I learnt how to monk from PUGs. The leeroys? Annoying, but then you learnt how to deal with them. Long battle because eles can't kill well? You learn how to manage your energy so you CAN last. Playing with good players doesn't give you the same stress.
Ursan Blessing: As a monk, I hated it. If I had to PUG, I used it, because I needed to get things done, but I left if asked to Ursan. I tried it a couple of times, decided I still hated it, and stopped using UB. I still don't have any respect for Ursan whatsoever.
PvE skills: I'm OK with them. I rarely pack PvE skills myself, but I'm not going to make others gimp themselves.
I prefer to play through the missions and such with my friends, mostly because this means that if we fail, we can sit down, discuss problems, and restart. The likelihood of this drops dramatically with a PUG, since people are more inclined to dismiss a group of strangers who couldn't make it as noobs. We have screwed up before, but going back and tweaking things until you succeed is a good deal more satisfying.
PvP wise, my only experience with PvP is AB, which I know a lot of people don't take seriously. I do think that it isn't an excuse to decide you shouldn't improve just because it isn't "serious" enough. One of my best friends is in HA, and she's been lovely enough to tell me how it works. If I see something I think I could learn from, I try to implement it. Not being a RA/TA/HA/GVG player doesn't mean you don't improve, and it doesn't mean you can't learn things from people who play it. Same applies to PvE.
PUGs: I enjoyed them until UB came out. I learnt how to monk from PUGs. The leeroys? Annoying, but then you learnt how to deal with them. Long battle because eles can't kill well? You learn how to manage your energy so you CAN last. Playing with good players doesn't give you the same stress.