Hi all!
I want to become a legendary vanquisher, and well yes, i cán actually vanquish, done multiple hard area's already ( Eotn, desolation etc. ) But i was searching what are popular ( non gimmick like sab/discordway ) balanced builds and team setups for your heroes.
I was thinking about 1 warrior, you send him in the mob and he tanks, while i ( monk ) protect him. 1 Fast cast interrupter/hardress. And one minion master necromancer.
What do you guys use for balanced vanquishing?
Thanks,
Dae
Vanquish Balanced
Dae GW
daze
I use discordway, and i have 3 canthan areas left until legendary vanquisher. As boring as vanquishing is, i think vanquishing with the "tank and spank" team you are describing would take much longer and in turn be twice as mind numbing.
Dungeons are places for running balanced/tuned builds. Vanquishing is all gimmick time.
Dungeons are places for running balanced/tuned builds. Vanquishing is all gimmick time.
Pocketmancer
Seconding what Daze mentioned, vanquishing is pretty much just running a gimmick build if you want to make good time. There's no elixir build set up that works well everywhere no matter how balanced it is.
Though, I try to run a balanced team set up. It works a good portion of the time (so long as the areas aren't lame and require some gimmick to beat them). However, I run a build with six heroes and inactive player who just follows me around like a lost puppy. Considering I don't actually play the game as much anymore, all I do is run into enemy mobs, Alt+Tab and come back a minute later to see the enemies mostly dead. Well, here's the basis of the AFKway setup:
Player 1: Whatever you want.
- Hero 1: Motivation Paragon.
- Hero 2: Protection/Smite Monk with Signets
- Hero 3: Artificer Signet Mesmer
Player 2: Whatever you want.
- Hero 1: Minion Master.
- Hero 2: Ether Renewal Infusion Elementalist.
- Hero 3: Necro Healing Monk or Ritualist depending on the area.
It's pretty much just 6 heroes doing their thing without player characters monitoring them (or even helping out). The skills I use vary depending on the campaign and area. Rarely do I swap out the heroes, but it does happen from time to time (swapped out the minion master for another smiting Monk in the Desolation for Nightfall).
The key to successful vanquishing though, isn't really in the build, but more on aggro control and pulling. There's a lot of people who say Sabway just doesn't work for them and the like, but really, they're just players who don't think. Just analyze the game and play through your analysis. It sounds like common sense, but I honestly don't see many people practicing that.
Though, I try to run a balanced team set up. It works a good portion of the time (so long as the areas aren't lame and require some gimmick to beat them). However, I run a build with six heroes and inactive player who just follows me around like a lost puppy. Considering I don't actually play the game as much anymore, all I do is run into enemy mobs, Alt+Tab and come back a minute later to see the enemies mostly dead. Well, here's the basis of the AFKway setup:
Player 1: Whatever you want.
- Hero 1: Motivation Paragon.
- Hero 2: Protection/Smite Monk with Signets
- Hero 3: Artificer Signet Mesmer
Player 2: Whatever you want.
- Hero 1: Minion Master.
- Hero 2: Ether Renewal Infusion Elementalist.
- Hero 3: Necro Healing Monk or Ritualist depending on the area.
It's pretty much just 6 heroes doing their thing without player characters monitoring them (or even helping out). The skills I use vary depending on the campaign and area. Rarely do I swap out the heroes, but it does happen from time to time (swapped out the minion master for another smiting Monk in the Desolation for Nightfall).
The key to successful vanquishing though, isn't really in the build, but more on aggro control and pulling. There's a lot of people who say Sabway just doesn't work for them and the like, but really, they're just players who don't think. Just analyze the game and play through your analysis. It sounds like common sense, but I honestly don't see many people practicing that.
Anime Divine
so why do you want to make it hard for yourself.
define a gimmick build.
if someone finds a perfect setup for vanquish that buildsetup will become a gimmick so i dont really see why you not run sabway or discord.
when i set my goal for legendary vanquisher i did not told myself oh i dont want to bring sabway or discord cos it boring. so ill just waste my time what 2/3 hours a vanquish with my non gimmick build if i fail oh well.. NO my goal is to vanq as fast as possible. only way 3 necro/rt (NOT sabway cos there are many varients) heroes 1 mesmer hench 2 healer hench and mage hench
even better 6 necros no monks. have fun.
define a gimmick build.
if someone finds a perfect setup for vanquish that buildsetup will become a gimmick so i dont really see why you not run sabway or discord.
when i set my goal for legendary vanquisher i did not told myself oh i dont want to bring sabway or discord cos it boring. so ill just waste my time what 2/3 hours a vanquish with my non gimmick build if i fail oh well.. NO my goal is to vanq as fast as possible. only way 3 necro/rt (NOT sabway cos there are many varients) heroes 1 mesmer hench 2 healer hench and mage hench
even better 6 necros no monks. have fun.
legacyofkain85
u talk about 1 warrior as in hero warrior ,well it's simple dont use melee heroes they aren't as good as caster heroes,if u want physical dmg take paragons or rangers altho paragons could dish out more dmg.In the end if u want balanced u wuld need to have well a balance between dmg/healling -protting/support .what i would bring always is a minion bomber,its not just for dmg from [death nova] but it keeps mobs from atacking your party and atacking your minions insted.
Haxor
Random HM semibalance which I just made up:
Frontline:
Generic moebius blossom and erf shakur
[Earth Shaker][Crude Swing][Whirlwind Attack][FGJ]["I am the strongest"][Flail][Enraging][Death pact signet]
[Golden Fox Strike][Wild Strike][Death Blossom][Moebius Strike][Critical Agility][Critical Defenses]["I am the strongest"][Death Pact Signet]
Midline:
Generic splinterbot support, Generic minion bomber, Generic SS support + optional
[Optional][Power drain][Leech signet][Ancestor's Rage][Splinter Weapon][Life][Protective was Kaolai][Flesh of My Flesh] (Optional is either [Expel Hexes] or [Tease])
[Foul Feast][Animate Bone Minions][Jagged Bones][Death Nova][Infuse Condition][Aegis][Protective Spirit][Signet of Lost Souls]
[Spiteful Spirit][Reckless Haste][Mark of Pain][Enfeebling Blood][Order of Pain][Dark Fury][Mystic Regeneration][Signet of Lost Souls]
Optional midline:
One of the following: generic imbagon (human), generic smiter, generic broad head ranger.
[Swift Javelin]["Save Yourselves!"]["There's nothing to fear!"][Ebon Battle Standard of Honor][FGJ][Focused Anger][Aggressive Refrain][Signet of Return]
[Reversal of Damage][Smite Condition][Smite Hex][Castigation Signet][Leech Signet][Optional][Rebirth][Divine Boon] (Optional is either [Tease] or [Expel Hexes])
[Broad Head Arrow][Savage Shot][Distracting Shot][Apply Poison][Dwarven Stability][Lightning Reflexes][Epidemic][Resurrection Signet]
Backline
Generic HB and PnH.
[Patient Spirit][Dwayna's Kiss][Ethereal Light][Dismiss Condition][Cure Hex][Optional][Optional][Healer's Boon] ([GoLE] + [Heal Party] for humans, [Leech Signet] + [Power Drain] or [GoLE] + [Castigation Signet] for heroes)
[RoF][Peace and Harmony][Shield of Absorption][Protective Spirit][Spirit Bond][Aegis][Optional][Optional] ([GoLE] + [Guardian] for humans, [Leech Signet] + [Power Drain] or [GoLE] + [Castigation Signet] for heroes)
AoE hate from the frontline, defense and support from the midline, massive condition and hex removal, decent backline which should be able to keep everything up. Keep in mind this is just something I threw together on a whim, just try it if you want to see if it works - I have no idea.
Frontline:
Generic moebius blossom and erf shakur
[Earth Shaker][Crude Swing][Whirlwind Attack][FGJ]["I am the strongest"][Flail][Enraging][Death pact signet]
[Golden Fox Strike][Wild Strike][Death Blossom][Moebius Strike][Critical Agility][Critical Defenses]["I am the strongest"][Death Pact Signet]
Midline:
Generic splinterbot support, Generic minion bomber, Generic SS support + optional
[Optional][Power drain][Leech signet][Ancestor's Rage][Splinter Weapon][Life][Protective was Kaolai][Flesh of My Flesh] (Optional is either [Expel Hexes] or [Tease])
[Foul Feast][Animate Bone Minions][Jagged Bones][Death Nova][Infuse Condition][Aegis][Protective Spirit][Signet of Lost Souls]
[Spiteful Spirit][Reckless Haste][Mark of Pain][Enfeebling Blood][Order of Pain][Dark Fury][Mystic Regeneration][Signet of Lost Souls]
Optional midline:
One of the following: generic imbagon (human), generic smiter, generic broad head ranger.
[Swift Javelin]["Save Yourselves!"]["There's nothing to fear!"][Ebon Battle Standard of Honor][FGJ][Focused Anger][Aggressive Refrain][Signet of Return]
[Reversal of Damage][Smite Condition][Smite Hex][Castigation Signet][Leech Signet][Optional][Rebirth][Divine Boon] (Optional is either [Tease] or [Expel Hexes])
[Broad Head Arrow][Savage Shot][Distracting Shot][Apply Poison][Dwarven Stability][Lightning Reflexes][Epidemic][Resurrection Signet]
Backline
Generic HB and PnH.
[Patient Spirit][Dwayna's Kiss][Ethereal Light][Dismiss Condition][Cure Hex][Optional][Optional][Healer's Boon] ([GoLE] + [Heal Party] for humans, [Leech Signet] + [Power Drain] or [GoLE] + [Castigation Signet] for heroes)
[RoF][Peace and Harmony][Shield of Absorption][Protective Spirit][Spirit Bond][Aegis][Optional][Optional] ([GoLE] + [Guardian] for humans, [Leech Signet] + [Power Drain] or [GoLE] + [Castigation Signet] for heroes)
AoE hate from the frontline, defense and support from the midline, massive condition and hex removal, decent backline which should be able to keep everything up. Keep in mind this is just something I threw together on a whim, just try it if you want to see if it works - I have no idea.
zelgadissan
I ran Discordway for maybe 5% of my vanquishes on the way to Legendary Vanquisher. If I wasn't running with guildies, the team setup I almost always used was (I'm a mesmer BTW):
[Dunkoro;OwYT04nCRSjoBcTDZ4uKgoeY6DA]
[Olias;OANFQSxG21nzStKgHQDV1ORAxoB]
[Acolyte Jin;OgUSc5MTFHuSOBPGqGVgwGCA]
I know the MM bar is a giant unsynergizing mess but it works (PvE is a beauty)
Past that I mainly took a healer henchy and then as many physicals as I could find. For example in Nightfall it was Mhenlo, Devona, Gehraz, and Sogolon.
[Dunkoro;OwYT04nCRSjoBcTDZ4uKgoeY6DA]
[Olias;OANFQSxG21nzStKgHQDV1ORAxoB]
[Acolyte Jin;OgUSc5MTFHuSOBPGqGVgwGCA]
I know the MM bar is a giant unsynergizing mess but it works (PvE is a beauty)
Past that I mainly took a healer henchy and then as many physicals as I could find. For example in Nightfall it was Mhenlo, Devona, Gehraz, and Sogolon.
kostolomac
There are no balanced builds for pve , especially if you use pve skills.
OP , your build is quite slow since tanking in GW is bad , warriors can dish out insane damage or provide good support with Earth Shaker. And killing beats interrupting in pve.
OP , your build is quite slow since tanking in GW is bad , warriors can dish out insane damage or provide good support with Earth Shaker. And killing beats interrupting in pve.
Cebe
Quote:
Originally Posted by kostolomac
OP , your build is quite slow since tanking in GW is bad , warriors can dish out insane damage or provide good support with Earth Shaker.
Whilst this is sound information, it certainly applies to human played Warriors. I doubt Hero Warriors can intelligently dish out high levels of DPS or put thought into how they use skills such as Earth Shaker.
kostolomac
Sorry , didn't see OP was a monk. In that case I don't know.
gwen armor
well, if you don't want sabway or other great way...
Just study what kind of mob are in the zone.
Take a minion bomber flag it to tank, there will be a hall to protect you.
As a monk, you can take protect skill & pve skill like "ebon vanguard assassin", "you move like a dwarf", "finish him".
Then you can bring 2 more heroes, a searing flame + rodgord ele with messmer interupt for energy, and last any caster you want.
Take 4 henches, 2 monks, and 2 optionals
Just make a few fights, go back home to adjust your skill and team and go again to fight for fun ^^
Ps. sorry for my poor english, i'm foreigner...
Just study what kind of mob are in the zone.
Take a minion bomber flag it to tank, there will be a hall to protect you.
As a monk, you can take protect skill & pve skill like "ebon vanguard assassin", "you move like a dwarf", "finish him".
Then you can bring 2 more heroes, a searing flame + rodgord ele with messmer interupt for energy, and last any caster you want.
Take 4 henches, 2 monks, and 2 optionals
Just make a few fights, go back home to adjust your skill and team and go again to fight for fun ^^
Ps. sorry for my poor english, i'm foreigner...
AtomicMew
I also agree that melee heroes are a complete waste. I thought with the hundred blades and grenth buff that they could be useful... and while they do nice damage, an SS nec would probably do the same amount of damage (or more) and offer more support at the same time.
I take melee henchmen, because I think aggro seperation is useful for times when you don't have minions. Also, I think that the melee henchmen are the best of the lot; it's not like you can nerf auto-attack damage with bad skill bars, and Devona has backbreaker and is awesome under dark fury.
I take melee henchmen, because I think aggro seperation is useful for times when you don't have minions. Also, I think that the melee henchmen are the best of the lot; it's not like you can nerf auto-attack damage with bad skill bars, and Devona has backbreaker and is awesome under dark fury.
-Lotus-
As a caster you really cannot run a balanced hero team. A balanced team requires a frontline, midline and backline. and the AI is incapable of playing frontline. If you had a warrior/derv/sin you might be able to run something like a blanced team (althought it would be slow. but as a caster you havve to run a gimmick build that somehow gets around the problem of not having a frontline (i.e. sabway)
Dae GW
Ok guys, i just want to clear something up:
You are talking about time, well time really dousn't matter me because i'm not going to play 24/7 vanquish. I'm doing PvP most of the time atm. And when there are just scrubs in HA or my guild dousn't do GvG i vanquish an area. And i have run sabway/discordway in Some area's already. It goes fast, but it was sooo boring, you don't have to do anything. While i just want to do stuff so i don't get bored. That's why i want a balanced build. It might be hard, but it keeps me from being bored.
Anyway
Thanks for the advices ( for some of you )
You are talking about time, well time really dousn't matter me because i'm not going to play 24/7 vanquish. I'm doing PvP most of the time atm. And when there are just scrubs in HA or my guild dousn't do GvG i vanquish an area. And i have run sabway/discordway in Some area's already. It goes fast, but it was sooo boring, you don't have to do anything. While i just want to do stuff so i don't get bored. That's why i want a balanced build. It might be hard, but it keeps me from being bored.
Anyway
Thanks for the advices ( for some of you )
Zomgyogi
I vanquished all of Cantha + Elona using sabway/discord combo and me(monk) healing/proting, which was kinda boring. Then after a few in Tyria I switched over to an Assassin's Promise build and blowing chit up is very fun 
. I am still using a sabway + discord combo heros, but with the AP build VQ is more fun and fast. Can't post the builds right now, but if you are interested I can post them tomorrow or Saturday.
. I am still using a sabway + discord combo heros, but with the AP build VQ is more fun and fast. Can't post the builds right now, but if you are interested I can post them tomorrow or Saturday.
Super Igor
Forget balanced, get three RoJ monks and win pve. Or at least make sure to have one somewhere.
-Lotus-
Super Igor
Impossible to monk in pve what are you talking about atm monks pwn d-way, sabway, racway and every other hero vanquishing build.
Frozen Was Tara
Ignore the people saying "SAB/DISCORD all the way!", they fail.
As monk:
Hero1: Mesmer ~ VoR/Tease
Hero2: AR/Splinter bot or Smiter Monk or MM
Hero3: Elementalist ~ Air/Earth/Water(/Fire) be creative!
Just remember to mod your heroes every time depending on the foes in the areas!
Fire Imps -> Tease wins Rodgort's Spam
Elementalist depending on resistances/weaknesses of the foes.
For the easy areas just do something crazy!
Just think before starting, it's all it takes! Knowledge is power!
Leave the cookiecutters for what they are, GO BEYOND!
As monk:
Hero1: Mesmer ~ VoR/Tease
Hero2: AR/Splinter bot or Smiter Monk or MM
Hero3: Elementalist ~ Air/Earth/Water(/Fire) be creative!
Just remember to mod your heroes every time depending on the foes in the areas!
Fire Imps -> Tease wins Rodgort's Spam
Elementalist depending on resistances/weaknesses of the foes.
For the easy areas just do something crazy!
Just think before starting, it's all it takes! Knowledge is power!
Leave the cookiecutters for what they are, GO BEYOND!
Spike Stritter
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frozen Was Tara
Just think before starting, it's all it takes! Knowledge is power!
Leave the cookiecutters for what they are, GO BEYOND! Agreeed.
before a VQ or dungeon i always check wiki to see what enemies there are and adjust my heroes builds accordingly.
Do that and youll be good.
Leave the cookiecutters for what they are, GO BEYOND! Agreeed.
before a VQ or dungeon i always check wiki to see what enemies there are and adjust my heroes builds accordingly.
Do that and youll be good.
daze
Quote:
Originally Posted by Super Igor
Its just a matter of time before this is called a gimmick build also.
Ive noticed that anytime someone creates a very well balanced team build that works in all areas then gives it a name (like sabway) people will start calling it a gimmick
Quote: Originally Posted by Frozen Was Tara
Ignore the people saying "SAB/DISCORD all the way!", they fail.
I lol'ed at you saying that sab/discord fails.
To be more accurate he said people who recommend "SAB/DISCORD all the way!" fail and he did explain what he means on his next paragraph: "Just remember to mod your heroes every time depending on the foes in the areas!"
you might say gimmicky and sure it may even be gimmicky. But that word is so loosely based i could call most commonly used builds gimmicky.
And how is sabway not balanced? really? Sabway has lots of defense, it has utility, and good offensive hexes, and it synergises with everything. But maybe im missing something. You tell me how it is NOT balanced. Just because it takes advantage of the benefits of soul reaping?
Quote:
And how is sabway not balanced? really? Sabway has lots of defense, it has utility, and good offensive hexes, and it synergises with everything. But maybe im missing something. You tell me how it is NOT balanced. Just because it takes advantage of the benefits of soul reaping?
Quote:
It is hard to deny that sabway and discordway are generally effective builds but to be more effective, one should customize their heroes to the character's build and to the area. That makes sense to me.
Quote:
Quote:
I really dont want to sound pretentious or overly cocky, but i would be so bold as to say that my 6 hero 2 human discord team can be super effective in ALL areas of the game with no more than 5 skill tweaks out of the whole party. Even areas with massive hex/condition removal
Quote: Originally Posted by Daesu
A "cookie-cutter" generic heroes team build that can be effective in most places and with most characters or a more powerful heroes team build that is customized to the specific character build, maybe even certain henchies and still be as universal with minor tweaking across most areas?
And i always thought this was a good thing.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Daesu
Taking my dervish as an example, I would rather have an enchantment heavy build for free hp and energy + enchantment benefits than to bring a generic sabway along. How many enchantments does sabway have?
Meh, enchantments really arent that great. They work dont get me wrong, but most of the time they must be applied before you can use your skills and they can be [rip enchantment][rend enchantment].
But i see what you are saying though, when you play on your derv, you like lots of enchantments because you are benefited upon their application and removal. And that is a fair statement.
Daesu
Quote:
Originally Posted by daze
|
Just because a hero build works doesn't necessarily imply it is the BEST possible build for ALL character builds and in ALL areas of the game.
|
Meh, enchantments really arent that great. They work dont get me wrong, but most of the time they must be applied before you can use your skills and they can be [rip enchantment][rend enchantment]. But i see what you are saying though, when you play on your derv, you like lots of enchantments because you are benefited upon their application and removal. And that is a fair statement. Enchantment stripping is usually not a problem for an enchantment heavy team build. Besides, deep enchantment removal is rare in the game and having cheap enchantments cast on my dervish then having them removed actually helps to drive the free health and energy to my dervish. Generic builds like sabway is convenient for people who are too lazy to customize their builds and want a team build that they dont need to tweak much to work well in most areas. But they are rarely the most effective possible build since these generics attempt to cater to all characters and most areas.
Cebe
I don't think the point of Guild Wars is that there is "one build to rule them all". If there was such a build any challenge/fun left in the game would dissipate. I can't think of a team build which would not benefit from being tweaked for certain zones. This argument regarding "Discordway's" supremacy is therefore quite hypothetical and fruitless.
Eragon Zarroc
lol, gimmicks are easy to play, destroy every thing, and are fun. i don't see why people would be averse to sabway or discordway. the overall effectiveness comes from ur ability to fine-tune the builds to the certain area ur playing in anyways.
bungusmaximus
My 2 cents and balanced HM setup:
Me: [Spear of Lightning][Vicious attack][blazing spear][barbed spear]["Watch yourself!"]["To The Limit!"][Soldier's Fury][Resurrection signet] Para [Spear of Lightning][Vicious attack][blazing spear][Disrupting Throw]["Go For The Eyes!"][Power Drain][Soldier's Fury][Resurrection signet] Necro1: [Enfeebling Blood][Shadow of Fear][Lingering Curse][Ward Against Elements][Ward Against Melee][Rip Enchantment][Rigor Mortis][Resurrection Signet] Necro2 [Animate Bone Minions][Animate Bone Horror][Infuse Condition][Expel Hexes][Foul Feast][Blood of the Master][Rip enchantment][Resurrection Signet] Of course this isn't set in stone, as areas can change. I also never use pve skills, so things can be tweaked accordingly. This doesn't always work well in caster-heavy areas, but Morgahn can be swapped for a BA ranger there.
superraptors
the 3 smiter roj monk steam rolls
but i run fc roj with drain ench / p drain mm/ smiter roj with more rupts then my trustworthy alesia and lina in 6 man areas if 8 i bring along devona and stiffen the henchman ________ Pornstars Lacey Duvalle
bungusmaximus |
