I know there are some skills with pve-only versions that were buffed (or just not nerfed) for pve, but the vast majority of skills never saw any kind of pve-only buff.
I'm not asking that every skill be given a huge pve buff, because pve has been made easy enough already by the EoTN skills. What I'm asking is why haven't many skills who were designed for pvp use, and thus very limited in pve, been given some sort of attention? The majority of Mesmer skills could use some work, as well as a lot of paragon, ranger and i'd say elementalist (water magic). Is it just too much work to revise these skills, or was the point to let EoTN skills fill in the gap?
I just find it disappointing that in a game with so many different skills and possible combinations, that the actual number of good viable builds is quite low. I'm not saying you should be able to have an awesome build with 8 random skills, but I'd rather play a game where theres more variety.
Why hasn't more been done with PvE version of skills?
Back then
FoxBat
I think the older approach of some skills rule in pve/suck in pvp and vice versa made more sense. There's more than enough skills to go around to balance them this way.
Also the new management seems to be using pve/p split far more sparingly.
Also the new management seems to be using pve/p split far more sparingly.
Chocobo1
Yes, it is a huge problem. Power Creep has made it so many of the older skills are terrible compared to the newer ones. They will never do anything about this.
Zahr Dalsk
They could fix PvE spirits.
Nemesis of God
ANet is too lazy and GW is just a grind.
Wait, this was about skills?
Wait, this was about skills?
MagmaRed
Be careful what you ask for. Monsters in PvE use those skills too.
Winterclaw
Because it would take a lot of time to balance everything. There are a lot of skills that have been overnerfed or completely neglected that still need use even without the pvp/pve split.
Seraphim Angel
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Originally Posted by MagmaRed
Be careful what you ask for. Monsters in PvE use those skills too.
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Puebert
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Originally Posted by MagmaRed
Be careful what you ask for. Monsters in PvE use those skills too.
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Zodiac Meteor
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Originally Posted by MagmaRed
Be careful what you ask for. Monsters in PvE use those skills too.
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Captain Bulldozer
Maybe better to wait for some of the upcomming skill nerfs to say this... However, its well known that many skills were heavily nerfed before the PvP/PvE split, and most of these were not reset (or even close) after the split. I do think this would be a good thing to do, but it'll require a lot of time and play testing to do it well, since even a small nerf/buff to a heavily used monster skill can cause chaos. The good thing is that players can generally find ways of dealing with over-powered monsters, so maybe it's not as big an issue. I personally think its more important to recheck some of the areas that are now super difficult in HM because of various buffs and nerfs.
draxynnic
Another way of looking at those monsters that had their skills nerfed for PvP is that they're now weaker than they were originally intended to be. Reverting those skills for PvE might just be reverting them to their intended strength.
JoeKnowMo
I don't know how much they can buff w/o making things too easy. Here are my suggestions:
Paragon: All (or most) mass shouts/chants affect allies too
Ranger: Buff Pet skills
Mesmer: More skills with AoE effects. E.g., Frustration being AoE followed by CoF and CoP would be nice.
Rit: Buff spirit health (through a spawning power buff).
Necro: Nothing. SR and other skills like SS, SV, Discord, etc. are great in PvE HM as is Necrosis. Also have some decent AoE options.
Monk: Nothing. Prot is fantastic in PvE and giant heals, i.e., WoH and HB, are handy too.
Ele: A PvE armor penetration skill or glyph liked to Energy Storage. You get puny damage in HM otherwise. Maybe change Elemental Lord to +10% dmg and +20% armor penetration and let it be 75% maintainable with 13 Energy Storage.
Melee (war, derv, sin): Nothing.
Paragon: All (or most) mass shouts/chants affect allies too
Ranger: Buff Pet skills
Mesmer: More skills with AoE effects. E.g., Frustration being AoE followed by CoF and CoP would be nice.
Rit: Buff spirit health (through a spawning power buff).
Necro: Nothing. SR and other skills like SS, SV, Discord, etc. are great in PvE HM as is Necrosis. Also have some decent AoE options.
Monk: Nothing. Prot is fantastic in PvE and giant heals, i.e., WoH and HB, are handy too.
Ele: A PvE armor penetration skill or glyph liked to Energy Storage. You get puny damage in HM otherwise. Maybe change Elemental Lord to +10% dmg and +20% armor penetration and let it be 75% maintainable with 13 Energy Storage.
Melee (war, derv, sin): Nothing.
Phear Me
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| Why hasn't more been done with PvE version of skills? |
Chocobo1
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Originally Posted by JoeKnowMo
I don't know how much they can buff w/o making things too easy. Here are my suggestions:
Paragon: All (or most) mass shouts/chants affect allies too Ranger: Buff Pet skills Mesmer: More skills with AoE effects. E.g., Frustration being AoE followed by CoF and CoP would be nice. Rit: Buff spirit health (through a spawning power buff). Necro: Nothing. SR and other skills like SS, SV, Discord, etc. are great in PvE HM as is Necrosis. Also have some decent AoE options. Monk: Nothing. Prot is fantastic in PvE and giant heals, i.e., WoH and HB, are handy too. Ele: A PvE armor penetration skill or glyph liked to Energy Storage. You get puny damage in HM otherwise. Maybe change Elemental Lord to +10% dmg and +20% armor penetration and let it be 75% maintainable with 13 Energy Storage. Melee (war, derv, sin): Nothing. |
Rit: Far more is needed than just a spawning power/spirit buff (although I agree that is really vital). Can't really think of specifics, but even some dart board buffs would be so great for the Rits at this point.
Necro: Funny how you state all the skills that Necros use in HM, and yet the most common elite among HM Necros would be Assassins Promise. Some elites could use a buff, such as Cultists Fervor or Order of Undead, which are pretty useless.
War: Could use some buffs to swordsmanship, so hundred blades isn't the only decent elite. Other than that they are pretty good all rounders, excluding tactics but thats too big for me to get into at this time.
Dervs: Avatars need a buff.
Sins: Nerf Shadowform plox.
Longasc
They have trouble with their regular skill balances, the 4th anniversary update was already the pinnacle of new content according to them, they are all working on GW2 and so on... what do we expect?
I personally hope that they learned from their mistakes and do not repeat them in GW2. Diablo 3 is coming, a good reason to try harder.
I personally hope that they learned from their mistakes and do not repeat them in GW2. Diablo 3 is coming, a good reason to try harder.
Arduin
Well, the big updates are now on a 3-4 months schedule. What about next update being solely about balancing skills, both PvE and PvP?
Greedy Gus
This answer is pretty simple. The pve versions of skills are only created in almost every case because the skill needed to be nerfed, and people hate their pet skills getting nerfed in pve. Because the dev team barely spends any time skill balancing gw1, few nerfs = few pve versions.
Apollo Smile
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Originally Posted by Longasc
They have trouble with their regular skill balances, the 4th anniversary update was already the pinnacle of new content according to them, they are all working on GW2 and so on... what do we expect?
I personally hope that they learned from their mistakes and do not repeat them in GW2. Diablo 3 is coming, a good reason to try harder. |
TheodenKing
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Originally Posted by MagmaRed
Be careful what you ask for. Monsters in PvE use those skills too.
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OP: It would help if you'd offer some specific examples of what you are talking about. I have one of each profs in PvE, and I have no trouble at finding/creating effective builds with the skills available.
netniwk
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Originally Posted by Chocobo1
War: Could use some buffs to swordsmanship, so hundred blades isn't the only decent elite. Other than that they are pretty good all rounders, excluding tactics but thats too big for me to get into at this time.
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IlikeGW
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Originally Posted by Zahr Dalsk
They could fix PvE spirits.
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Wish Swiftdeath
Yeah, war could do with a PvP elite, cripslash is really as good as it gets for sword wars...
EPO Bot
I would like "Withdraw hexes" to be converted to "Extinguish" for hexes in PVE.
BadgerznPie
I was sad when I just started Solo Trapping before they nerfed Energizing Wind for PvP. Then I was upset when they didn't fix it for PvE. Oh well, not too important anyway.
byteme!
My Rit is a joke. My Para is a joke. The limited amount of decent builds these 2 classes have is not worth anymore of my precious time. They've been collecting dirt for ages now. Variety is the spice of life.
Verene
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Originally Posted by Apollo Smile
I plan on buying them both. I know, its such a strange concept.
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That's what I plan on doing, myself :P
And I think Ritualists just need to be completely redone for the most part...
Alleji
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Originally Posted by Captain Bulldozer
However, its well known that many skills were heavily nerfed before the PvP/PvE split, and most of these were not reset (or even close) after the split.
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Spiritual Pain
Searing Flames
Avatar of Grenth
Avatar of Melandru
Paragon motivation line (this should stay dead tbh)
Ritual Lord (the whole bar)
There's a lot more, but those skills were never used in PvE in the first place.
upier
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Originally Posted by Chocobo1
and yet the most common elite among HM Necros would be Assassins Promise.
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Unless you buff ALL skills making recharge modifying skills and energy management obsolete - AP isn't going anywhere.
If we want to start playing with different elites - AP NEEDS to die. Because only then we'll be forced to look into something else.
Lyger
I have to admit, my Mes generally uses AP in PvE these days - unless it gets nerfed, it may as well get renamed to 'PvE Easy mode button'.
Also, a fix to the mobs who use RoJ all over the place (Rragar's Menagrie Flesh Reavers in HM anyone?) needs something to happen. At least make heroes run out of that particular AoE affect. That dungeon has turned into a particularly nasty one because of the RoJ buff. Before, it wasn't too bad. Now it's an exercise in frustration.
Also, a fix to the mobs who use RoJ all over the place (Rragar's Menagrie Flesh Reavers in HM anyone?) needs something to happen. At least make heroes run out of that particular AoE affect. That dungeon has turned into a particularly nasty one because of the RoJ buff. Before, it wasn't too bad. Now it's an exercise in frustration.
Sniper22
Because the PvE split was completely pointless and unnecessary and I seriously hope they dont do the same in GW2. PvE is easy enough as it is... and what "variety" PvE are you talking about. If you are looking to do any elite mission, all you need is a tank, monks, and cryers.
Crimso
I think the Mesmer Skills that only cause E-denial or require E-Denial to activate need changing for PvE(signet of weariness,Price of Pride,Mind Wrack,Ether Phantom,Spirit Shackles).
They're pretty much all useless since enemies have higher energy regeneration, plus E-denial is pointless on enemies since you're better off killing them rather than slowly reducing their energy to prevent them using skills(But then you may as well be interupting them).
They're pretty much all useless since enemies have higher energy regeneration, plus E-denial is pointless on enemies since you're better off killing them rather than slowly reducing their energy to prevent them using skills(But then you may as well be interupting them).
Giga_Gaia
What I'd like to see for their next big update is, just a major overhaul of many of the game's useless skills and balance the Ritualist and Paragon for being viable in PvE again without having to rely on cookie cutters builds like the Imbagon all the time. Heck, I'd even settle waiting a couple months without skill updates just to get some thought out skill balances for once. And while we're at it, fix the AI issues in JQ, and rebalance FA again since those updates weren't thought out very well either.
Anon-e-mouse
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Originally Posted by Sniper22
Because the PvE split was completely pointless and unnecessary and I seriously hope they dont do the same in GW2. PvE is easy enough as it is... and what "variety" PvE are you talking about. If you are looking to do any elite mission, all you need is a tank, monks, and cryers.
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I fervently hope and pray that when GW2, comes around EACH and EVERY skill has a PvE and PvP version. That way when the PvP crowd calls for a nerf it doesn't affect the PvE'rs in any way shape or form.
I really wish people would realise that PvP is NOT PvE and vice-versa, and asking all the game players to stick to just the one set of skills is an exercise in stupidity.
DreamWind
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Originally Posted by Anon-e-mouse
PvE is easy because of the constant nerfs to most skills since the game started, all because of how they are used in PvP.
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Yichi
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Originally Posted by Anon-e-mouse
PvE is easy because of the constant nerfs to most skills since the game started, all because of how they are used in PvP.
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Hyper Cutter
I wish they'd just revert that stupid Soul Reaping timer...
Anon-e-mouse
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Originally Posted by Yichi
You honestly have no idea what you are talking about do you?
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Rits nerfed to uselessness because in PvP where they were deemed overpowered, Paragon nerfed, Sins nerfed, and then add in another 100+ skills all nerfed because they were overpowering/abused in PvP.
And the thing you really do not seem to grasp is if a skill is nerfed, it's nerfed for the PvE foes to, making PvE even easier.
Shasgaliel
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Originally Posted by Anon-e-mouse
Looks like I have a better handle on the problem than you apparently do.
Rits nerfed to uselessness because in PvP where they were deemed overpowered, Paragon nerfed, Sins nerfed, and then add in another 100+ skills all nerfed because they were overpowering/abused in PvP. And the thing you really do not seem to grasp is if a skill is nerfed, it's nerfed for the PvE foes to, making PvE even easier. |
Crimso
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Originally Posted by Yichi
You honestly have no idea what you are talking about do you?
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It's nerf way back due to Air spike teams made Mursaat elementalists a lot weaker than they were before the nerf.