Reworking Mysticism

Mysticism sucks as a primary attribute. Critical Strikes gives better energy management, more health, AND a real combat benefit at the same time.

Worse yet, the idea behind mysticism is terrible. It seems clear that Anet intended that a big part of the dervish's playstyle would be to rip off their own enchantments to fuel powerful skills. Unfortunately, those skills suck, so there's not much reason to do so. Furthermore, due to the low armor and attack power of the dervish (since, again, their primary attribute doesn't help them use their stuff any better), a dervish NEEDS their enchantments to function properly. An unenchanted dervish is a crappy dervish. Yet mysticism encourages them to strip away their very livelihood for a tiny bit of energy. Really, the only reason dervishes even use mysticism is because of the skills linked to it (HoF, the avatars). But since it doesn't make the dervish better at using his other abilities, other professions can use his stuff better than he can (sin, warrior).

So, I propose that mysticism be changed to do the following: For each rank of mysticism, enchantments on you last 3% longer.

At 12 mysticism, this would mean a very respectable 36% increase in the length of all enchantments on the dervish. So, a 10 second enchantment would now last 13-14 sec, and a 30 sec enchantment would now last around 40 sec.

Overnight, the dervish would become the best at using his own stuff, because no one else would be able to keep skills like AoHM up for as long as the dervish could. It would make also dervishes better tanks (a role they are clearly meant to fill, yet don't do so nearly as well as they should), because protection spells like Protective Spirit and Guardian would last longer on them. Finally, It would also double as a form of energy management, because the dervish would not have to recast his enchantments as often.

Not a bad idea
but the length of increased enchantments would be too much.
this would also kill perma sins.
but they need it anyways

...with a 20% enchanting mod AoHM is only down for a second. also, this is good, because it triggers the second 50 AoE damage for it ending.

good idea but i think 3% is to much... maybe 1% for each rank would be better... I would like to see myst changed/buffed though.

Not a bad idea, but this doesn't help too much with energy management.

also costs more energy. And lets not forget HoF and all the other enchantments dervs might have up.

I don't believe enchantments can last more than 50% longer. So, with a 20% enchanting mod under your system mysticism past level 10 would be completely useless. Also, when certain enchants end (AoHM, HoF, Zealous Renewal, etc), you gain benefits or do damage. Mysticism is fine the way it is IMO.

Patient Spirit FTL?

Dervish is my main ATM and I'd love to see a buff to Mysticism I cant help but feel underpowered when I play them knowing another class is more effective with it as /D
I've been trying to find a way to buff mysticism myself,\.

Ok if they got this buff they could maintain shadow form with deadly paradox and essence. Arenet made the skill so you could maintain it on any profession other than a sin. Also if you had the 10% offhand from the collector (now unavailable) it would be overpowered.

Because everything should be balanced around Patient Spirit.

Dervish is a pretty weak class, it would probably take more than this to make them usable.

Every time I want to make a dervish I realize that my war just does it better.

Giving dervishes adrenaline skills or an actual usable IAS, and don't try to tell me heart of fury is usable, would be a good start to making them workable.

You have a ridiculous energy-management engine designed to work with enchantments, and it does so very well, especially with a monk backline.

It should be nerfed, if anything, but there's no point.

/notsigned.

Mysticism is fine as it is end of story...

Maybe, though there are far more primary attribs that are worse of...

The only change I would do for Mysticism is to work with another type of skill, like shouts or stances, since warriors, paragons and rangers have no enchantments, and I strongly think that every single primary attribute should work with some of the skills of every profession.

I respectfully disagree. Critical Strikes gives even better energy management than mysticism, while giving a real combat benefit that mysticism does not. The only way mysticism could possibly not be underpowered is if Critical Strikes is overpowered (which it may well be, but even then you have to face the fact that warriors can use a dervish's skills better than dervish despite their crappy energy regen). No matter how you slice it, dervishes are not going to be the best at using their own stuff unless their primary attribute gets a buff. That's the definition of an underpowered primary attribute.

You're not-so respectfully wrong.

There's a reason bars like the D/N orders support character exist. There's a reason that the D/E Wounding Strike could spam all day.

A dervish has massive damage from a scythe, and a primary attribute with innate energy management. Every aegis that ends on them, every patient spirit, every rof, every bloody enchantment gives them energy.

There's a reason that a Dervish can become a support character while all an assassin can be is a one-stop gimmick.

Stop this terrible mindset. The pve community is full of morons and it's showing. Stop buffing shit - you all complain that the game is too easy and that there's nothing to do...well if Anet didn't keep buffing shit because you children didn't know what you want then things wouldn't be like this.

Warriors can no-longer use Dervish skills well, at least not in PvP. They are the best at using their forms, and it being enchantment powered-support engines.

Warriors have a pretty shit attribute, but it's balanced because they are such a powerful class. Dervishes have great damage, great skills, and a decent primary attribute.

You're wrong. So go back to playing with a class that should have never been introduced.

Wow, glad to see I stumbled upon someone normal for a change.

But seriously that is a point, too much complaining and analyzing and not enough enjoying. I have a Dervish and I'm enjoying playing it very much, I don't have any complaints about it, at least not anymore, I used to think they should have a bit more energy but that would make Mysticism kind of useless, so it's fine as it is. If you think Dervishes can't cut it PvE wise then you're doing it wrong.

Stop it Bunny, you are scaring children!

OP: It is true that anets original vision of "fuel powerful skills with enchants" failed. But for different reasons than mysticism sucking:

No cas'n'strip enchant is really any good, having at best mediocre effect for its cost (especially casting time & aftercast time cost, but since they usually cost 10 energy, mysticism will not return much of that), range (BPAOE) and recharge. Not to mention skill slot. Skill fueled by this would better have to be pretty awesome.

If they actually get useful effect, they create too good spike combo with likes of Pious Assault and would have to end up being nerfed anyway.

Personally, I don't see a problem with scythewars and scythesins and scythehoppers being effective.

Consider the idea behind the Dervish - it's essentially the PBAOE/earthtank elementalist formalised into a profession. You use enchantments to defend yourself where the Warrior uses natural heavy armour, you use PBAOE attacks disguised as enchantments to deal damage and apply conditions, and your weapon happens to strike multiple targets. Mysticism does its job - it gives you energy right when you need it (when you need to renew an enchantment) and also rewards you for using lots of enchantments with health.

But if you're not using those enchantments, what are you really? A warrior or an assassin or maybe a ranger who happens to use a scythe. Nothing wrong with that.

The real problem, if there is one, is more as zwei2stan says - a lot of the skills that are supposed to have been the basis of the Dervish's playstyle just aren't really up to scratch. Primary attributes get a lot of attention, but Earth and especially Wind Prayers are much more needing of help.

Probably doesn't help that they only have one campaign's worth of skills, too...

Improve Mysticism, find another way to do it.

I smell a new perma with this mysticism you propose lol.

You might be right about PvP, but warriors certainly still can in PvE, and unfortunately, that's where most of the player base is. 3/5 of the avatars are crap, and the other 2 are only good in certain circumstances. Add that to the WS/RS build (which on it's own still isn't viable because a sin can do it better; you need to throw in SY! to make that one work), and the suboptimal but workable gimmick builds, and you have everything that the dervish can do. Big whoop.

It doesn't matter if dervishes have great skills, because most of them can be used by other classes better than they can be by the dervish. The warrior primary attribute is at least linked to great skills like power attack. And no, the dervish does not have great damage. Play a sin or warrior and you'll learn what great damage is.

The point is, dervishes suck. Compare them to scythe sins and scythe warriors and you'll see. The only way dervishes can compete is with gimmick builds. That is NOT balance.

When another class can use your skills better than you can, then you need a buff (or they need a nerf). Sorry, but that's the definition of underpowered. And the easiest way to do that is to change the primary attribute. If you have a better suggestion, I'm all ears.

then Dwanas Kiss ftw

Your proposed rebalancing would only perpetuate their existence as a gimmick character.

GUESS THAT WENT RIGHT OVER HEAD, YEAH BOY?

Make wind prayers useful first. Mysticism is fine as it is. I am not sure if I understood you correctly but you want to make a support class something like a warrior? What for?

What?

Mysticism is fine as is. Yeah, I never bother with enchantment stripping, it's just a waste and rarely do I ever need the boost. But considering that the bonus from Mysticism triggers off of every enchant on you, instead of just ones you cast...Monks tend to be heavy on enchantment's and it's not unusual for me to have 7-8 active at once, only half of which are actually mine.

Also, I'm confused on the "Dervishes suck and do crap damage" opinion, and especially those who say that Assassins are better. I have a Dervish and an Assassin. Only one of them can solo areas without a finicky, specialized build, and it's certainly not the Assassin.

/facepalm . . just stop talking.

anyway, this class is attractive to play but lacks oomph. I would agree that earth/wind prayers need help instead of mysticism. then perhaps the derv would feel more well rounded.

and there are a few skills that work better on warriors/sins that should be best on a derv. so, that is a problem.

Every profession has a few skills that are better used by some other profession. This is part of what the secondary profession system is all about.