Dredge

^from official wiki

I'm going to assume that they will have a Russian accent if they appear in a cutscene of gw2.

Seems like a "cold" war up there.

I was wondering what our takes on this matter were. Why have an entire war in the mountains, when the Norn can simply respect the determination of the dredge, or is Molef Stalin demanding full domination?

I think the Norn might just see the Dredge as prey, rather than as an enemy in war, like when fighting the destroyers.

The Dredge don't wage war, it's not really in their nature. For example the canthan dredge attack only those who come into their territory.

In Northern Tyria they'll help anyone who helps them escape. If anything you'll probably be neutral (if you choose human).

I think the Norn see the dredge as they see the charr.

I think it's more like a game of cat-and-mouse.

Heres my take on it.

The Dredge have worked as slaves to the Summit for years. Eventually they manage to escape slavery and get a place to call home. They are free.

Meanwhile the Norn are thrown out of their home by the Dragon of Ice and Snow. They try to find a new home and come across the dredge and their new home.

The Dredge, no doubt having not forgotton their time as slaves to the Summit become defensive. They think the Norn are trying take their home from them and who knows? they might even enslave them.

The Norn see the Dredge becoming defensive and believe the Dredge are attacking the Norn. The Norn being warriors fight back. And so it begins.

So chances are the whole Dredge vs Norn war is all about how defensive the Dredge are.

Another way to look at it is.

Put 2 on-edge dogs in a back yard. They will fight.
Put combative Norn, and nervous and quick to fight dredge in one mountain range. Talvisota

Hints that some of the Dredge went out and attacked the Kurzicks are around in the quest chain in Factions. And that some Dredge have become hostile to others, i.e., not giving other races time to enslave them again.

I figured that the Dredge, having regained their freedom and given the chance to expand onto the surface due to the lack of dwarves, feared the Norn who were coming to the Dredge's new land and thought something along the lines of "oh crap, they're bigger than us! Surely they'll enslave us! We need to fight back to make sure that doesn't happen!" etc. etc.

The Dredge fight in fear of being enslaved again, the Norn fight in lust for combat.

I wouldn't be surprised if the storyline takes us to having to bring peace between the two by settling the misconception, if there is one.

For those who've played Star Control, I suspect there's something of an Ur-Quan psychology here. Not quite to the same extreme, but a similar "never again at any cost" mentality. It explains a lot. Especially since both Norn and humans resemble taller dwarves - the Dredge may well get along better with Asura, Charr, or other less-resembling-of-humans races.

(Idly, regarding the Dredge in Echovald: It's also mentioned in the quests, IIRC, that the Dredge are being attacked by the Wardens. I wonder if that particular war actually started from the Dredge not knowing the difference between Kurzicks and Wardens and attacking the former on sight?)

On the Norn side... well, we know how belligerant they are. Most Norn will refuse to talk to anyone without fighting first, and in one of the starting cutscenes of EOTN, Ogden fully expects Jora to attack the group. Combine this with a race that's even a little bit paranoid or unforgiving... Instant tinderbox.

For the Echovald quests, I always thought that the "rebel" Dredge led by Maximillian attacked the Kurzicks, and then the Kurzicks started to attack the Dredge. Although it could be that the Wardens attacked the Dredge, then the Dredge attacked the Wardens and Kurzicks.

Moleneaux states that the Kurzicks attacked them first while the Kurzicks say the Dredge attacked their patrols first. Ether side could of been lying or it could of been a huge misunderstanding on both sides. Maximole didnt start a revolt until much later, long after the first contact between the Kurzicks and Dredge.